DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns shopping running back Duke Johnson, sources say

Whoever Kitchens wants. In a different post I argued in favor of keeping Duke.. but I see the other side as well. It depends on what value Duke could bring. Right now the fans are going bat-crap crazy about winning RIGHT NOW and wondering what our RB depth looks like if Chubb goes down.. I get it. But if Duke could be traded for a player/pick who could help us not only next year but for years into the future, that has to be considered.. Duke is gone after next year any way..

Maybe this is why we had Draft prospect RB Devin Singletary work out as a WR.

j/c:

We are in new territory here. When you have a roster currently with the TALENT we do now, you will have to make decisions to let good football players walk or trade them as they become expandable.

Duke can play in the league, but he is not an every down back, and we have backs on this team that can produce the production he gives us - and going forward his role will become only smaller.

Duke is a role player, you are not going to build a team around him, and role players are able to be replaced and interchangeable, and constantly are.

We were just so devoid of talent, that we put some of these mediocre players on pedestals, because ...well....that's all we had.

Hilliard can catch the ball.
He is our KR too. He isn't going to be cut.

So if Duke where traded, we could simply bring in another until we activate Hunt.

I understand what you and others are saying but I think we should consider something here.

We had Duke when the Crow was here. We had Duke when we added Hyde. Now I think we can all agree that neither of those two were dynamic RB's. They were just on the level of serviceable at best. Yet while both of them were here, Duke still didn't see much action as far as "actually being a RB" is concerned. This year after only three games we put the rookie Chubb in while his blocking still seemed quite suspect at the time.

From the evidence above it seems abundantly clear that none of our HC's actually see Duke as an every down RB. With that said, why would anyone believe that if Chubb went down due to injury that they would suddenly see Duke as the option of our every down RB to take over for Chubb? Duke has always been nothing more than a situational RB even when our RB situation was relatively weak.

So I don't see Duke as even being on the depth chart in terms of being our every down back if Chubb goes down. Nothing in the past indicates that Freddie or any other coach has seen him in that role.

It's my contention that they see Hilliard in that role over Duke.

You make a good argument there, although it's been already established by most of us that Duke isn't an every down back. I think he'll probably get traded, but I don't think we should be in a hurry to do so.

Edit: unless we get a great offer.

We can trade Duke (hopefully as some state for a 3rd or a 4th...and that can be used hopefully to fill a spot...LB/FS/SS etc) we can easily let's say grab TJ Yeldon (who is a receiver running back...but much better inside runner than Duke, also has a big frame) you can ink a back up RB for cheap...Or draft a RB threat later in the draft...And let the best man make it

Good point, and welcome aboard. The guy was unhappay. He just didn't spout of to the press. He did it the right way and expressed his opinions to his position coach...who was Freddie .

As You said, there is no way he is going to get used more than last year, and he is not a happy camper being some other players insurance policy.

I wonder if some GM's might be afraid to trade with the guy? LOL

Oh don't misunderstand me, I don't think he is an every down back (in fairness, he's never really been given that opportunity over any stretch of time)

I have a feeling he's better than "just" a third down/change of pace back, but probably not your lead guy. He's not Chubb.. that's for sure. Few are!

Probably the best thing we could do for Duke is to trade him. Let him get hooked up with a team that has an opportunity to use him more.

With OBJ, Landry, Njoku, Calloway and Chubb and later Hunt, there just isn't enough to go around. Throw in Higgins and wow, nothing left for Duke.

Good for us, bad for Duke.. Too bad, he's a class act and a good guy. No trouble,, just goes out and plays ball..

Teams are selfish. We wouldn't do this if we didn't feel that Hilliard couldn't fill the role. We may also have a back we are targeting in the draft.

Oh, no doubt about it. That is 100% true.

On the draft thread, there is a post about Devin Singletary. I know nothing about him other than what was in the article. Interesting guy, listed as a RB, but the Browns have apparently shown interest in him as a Slot receiver.

Check out that thread..

Already commented.

I am sure that Dorsey and Depo have talked about player valuation and projected returns.

Duke has high value but probably has a expected low return, making him a prime candidate to be traded. Dorsey is looking for the best deal he can find.

This is one of those deals where we may have to go in to camp, or even towards the trade deadline to find that deal. Sorry to say, it may take a team to lose a back to injury to get it done.

Agreed.... When is the trade deadline?

I think it's mid or late, October.

I think Duke would be an ideal pickup for the Panthers...You know how much they utilize Christian McCaffrey (as a receiver and as a runner) And they already noted they'd like to scale him back some...Duke would be ideal if anything was to happen to CMC, and would be ideal to spell him at times.

I think Philly would be an ideal location for Duke if Sproles retires. He's contemplating it.

Dallas is another possible team that can use him. The Cowboys are overusing Zeke. Rod Smith is a FA. Duke could spell Zeke.

I don't think we would make this trade, but he would be good in Pittsburgh to be the change of pace back behind Connor.

Ironically, he would be a good fit in KC as a change of pace back.

The Vikings lost Latavius Murray to the Saints. Duke could be the second back there.

I would prefer to hold him until October. If a RB gets injured on a quality (hopefully NFC) team, we may command more in return value anyway and it would keep us complete until Hunt's return.

I have no problem keeping him but I'll refer back to my previous point. At no time has this team ever seen Duke as a feature back. In 2018 he had 40 touches in rushing attempts. Even with an average at best Crow he wasn't used a lot for rushes. When Crow left we immediately signed Hyde who was barely serviceable rather than to turn to Duke to carry the load.

Duke has been nothing more than a complimentary RB his entire career. His main job has been as a receiver. If Chubb goes down it will not be Duke that steps into the role of starting RB.

He is a weapon as a receiver and works well in space. But that has been and will be his role with or without Chubb.

Dallas is interesting. Especially after losing Beasley to Buffalo. They did bring back Tavon Austin, though.

...Saquon could use a backup

It might be more accurate to preface these statements above with something like, "His role for the Browns..."

By that I mean this is the role he's been confined to on this team. I've witnessed multiple plays where Duke has run effectively inside for this team. Do I think he can be a featured back with consistent reps between the tackles? No, but he can and should have been utilized more in this capacity within the various offenses run here in Cleveland. The fact that he has not is more a failing on the part of people designing offenses for the Browns during his tenure. not so much as an indictment of his abilities.

On a team like the Steelers, Duke would be a star. That is my only fear of losing him. Given some space Duke can get some yardage, and he is good at making people miss in the open field.

He is my favorite player on this team, but with Hunt in the fold, he is expendable. As much as I like him, Hunt is the better player.

I hope they keep him, along with Chubb and Hunt, but I feel like he could be a more prominent player on another roster. I would also have to believe he would be happier.

I've heard this same thing repeated several times from different posters.

Yet he never has. Not by any coach, any OC and when Freddie took over his touches went down, not up.

You'll have to forgive me if I trust Freddie and professional OC's over some guys on a message board.

I'm really not trying to put down your opinion. I'm simply looking at whose opinion is by far the most qualified to pay attention to. And basing my opinion upon that alone, I'm going to have to trust the professionals on this one.

I don't think Duke Johnson has the physicality to be an every down RB. I see him as more of a change-of-pace RB & 3rd down specialist, kind of like Greg Pruitt later in his career. He's a weapon, to be sure, but IMO really shouldn't be part of the discussion regarding the presence or absence of Kareem Hunt as it pertains to our starting RB position.

i think duke would be a star with the Pats

Absolutely

I think many times people over evaluate players when they put on a Browns uniform.

Except they already have James White (and Sony now).

I think Duke's issue is that every time we've tried to start feeding him the ball, he seems to get some minor ding which looks worse than it is. He has a long run, but he gets up shaking his arm. He's "fine", but we feel obliged to check him out.

He's never been seriously injured, but he often looks like he's been "hurt." That makes it hard to keep feeding him the ball.

I have noticed this myself over the years.

IN YOU'RE OPINION.

Cause I disagree immensely.

Johnson isn't a feature back. Never was. He's not a WR either Eotab.

He's exactly what he's been in Cleveland. A mediocre, change of pace, option out of the backfield RB.

That's it.

This Kat and fans remind me of Corey Fuller and White.

PIt

I can certainly forgive your trust of Freddie and other professionals over placing trust in me. What I find it hard to forgive is your disregard that I said explicitly that I am not claiming he is an every-down-between-the-tackles-feature back.



Essentially you are countering an argument I didn't make. What I said was more nuanced than you choose to acknowledge. This will be my only response on the matter because I'm not interested in chasing this down a rabbit hole that happens so often here. Because tone is often hard if not impossible to interpret here, there is no anger on my part. We disagree and I take that in stride.

Kwip


Please read what I've written above. But beyond that, I offer you the case of one Jarvis Landry. Prior to coming to the Browns he was relegated to a role of slot receiver. He was perceived to be incapable of performing in any other role. NO, I"M NOT SAYING HE'S A NUMBER 1 RECIEVER. But he can and does make plays when lined up elsewhere. This was the point I was making about Duke. Put him in another offense and I'm confident you would see his role expand beyond what he's been allowed to do here. Logic says to me if we as fans or the organization believe he's marketable as a trade assett then he should be viewed as worth more than the meager touches and the limited role he's getting here. I understand the business of football. Although I like the player I don't have to talk myself into undervaluing him to accept trading him. As a matter of fact, it's in the best interest of the organization to recognize the full potential of the player when considering moving him.

I agree with Guard Dawg.

Duke is a good player, the Browns should keep him.

guard, the only thing I will counter is that Duke was used a lot when Hue was calling the plays.

I posted the stats of carries and receptions of him and similar backs two or three times. I even predicted that Haley would cut Duke's role, which he certainly did. Freddie started off using him, but that dried up rather quickly.

I think Duke would be good for a team that used him like Hue used him.

I agree. It's about chances. If we aren't going to give him the chance, we might as well trade him for somebody we are going to give chances.

Trading Johnson would be assine.

He is an ELITE receiving running back. He averages nearly 10 yards a catch and had 74 catches in 2017 and would have had more in 2018 but Haley wouldn't play him.

Since we don't have an elite Tight End(Johnson is a better receiver than Njoku) He really should be the guy getting the ball on 3rd and 5, 3rd and 6, etc....

Johnson is a guy that with our luck he will go to New England and Bellichik will laugh at us while Johnson hauls in 100 receptions on their path to their next Super Bowl.

We are NOT talented enough nor have we won enough to be discarding good players...Johnson is a guy that can help us far more then a LB, S, or DL could.

Now if we have a winning season this year then yeah maybe i'd be interested in moving Johnson. However, we only ahve Hunt on a 1 year deal, and there is no guarantee Hunt won't be a knucklehead and get himself into to trouble again...

nope Johnson is our insurance policy in the face of an uncertain situation with Hunt, if we trade Johnson were foolish.

This guys said to say "hello."