DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Duke Johnson asks to be traded

At that point the price would go to us releasing him.

You can't think of Duke as a guy we are going to get a pick straight up….he will be the sweetener in a deal.


As I have said many times, we don't need more picks unless they are future picks.. We need to trade some to get a couple of better picks.

It wouldn't bother me a bit if we ended up drafting only 3-4 players.

We are at the point where everybody we draft isn't going to make the team.

From a financial perspective, Johnson has a salary cap hit of $3.05 million and a dead cap hit of $4.05 million. It would actually cost Cleveland more to trade him than to keep him. If Cleveland wants to part with him, it would make more sense next season.

https://247sports.com/nfl/cleveland-browns/Article/Cleveland-Browns-Duke-Johnson-trade--130838367/

Again, people keep forgetting that Duke requested a trade. How many guys do that? Think about what happened w/AB in Pittsburgh. Do you think they really would have traded him for a 3rd and a 5th if AB wasn't causing problems? LOL

Duke went public. People can't see the forest for the trees.

AB is a top WR in this league. Duke isn't a top RB. It's similar but not the same. But I think we'll draft a back and trade Duke for depth.

I wasn't comparing Duke to AB talent wise. I was talking about that when a player is quoted in the media as wanting to be traded, he isn't negotiating in good faith.

Bury your head in the sand. We'll see what happens.

Duke just wants more touches and a chance to get paid bigger money. He'll settle down when he's part of a team heading to the playoffs.

I agree with Vers. If you want more touches, you go to the coach. I am sure he did and didn't like the answer.

Once guys start talking in public about wanting to be traded and skip workouts as a statement, it's time to move on.

I doubt he will be with the team much longer.

For what it's worth, Vers, this is not a complicated point you are trying to deliver. You've explained it well.

Duke went public wanting a trade, and that changes things. It is that simple.

I am torn. Hope you are right because I like him a bunch. What you state is feasible. I just don't think he will see it here. He burned this bridge wanting more in media. Possibly Dorsey's positive talklately is spin to calm the situation. Afraid he will be gone if we can get several teams interested although that may be later.

Go, Browns, whoever ends up here.

Show me a deep WR that gets as many touches as a RB and you will have made a point in your comparison. But there isn't one and you didn't.

You seem to be saying that when you use a player far less and his production decreases greatly, he holds the same value to a team. That makes no sense.

yeah, I was just simply trying to point out that his value has diminished even more.

Sorry, I forgot to put "j/c."

What is it with you and straw man arguments?

I didn't argue either of those things.

If you focused on comprehension instead of trying to "win" an argument when I'm just trying to have a discussion, I think we'd both get a lot less irritated.

I wasn't "comparing" RBs and WRs. I used a WR to illustrate the varying context of player value and how it wasn't necessarily production dependent.

I actually said Duke's value to us may have diminished. His "inherent" value hadn't changed. We might not have as much need for what he is good at. He's still good at it, though. There's no reason to give him away for pennies on the dollar.


Does anyone know the actual context of Duke asking for a trade? There was a report that it was so, but who leaked it and how was the request expressed? Was it of the "will you let us explore trade possibilities" variety or the "get me the @#$* out of here" variety?

So you are saying even if you don't really plan to use a player much, having him take up a roster spot is better than trading him for a player you would use more?

And I'm the one making a straw man argument?

You apparently don't understand what the straw man fallacy is.

And you just made another one.



Link

After reading that link, I'm tempted to start calling you Aunt Sally. I'll try to refrain, though.


I'm fine with trading him for a player we would use more. I'm less fine with trading him for a pick that would net us a player that we would probably use less.

Asking to be traded and the kicking, screaming, and throwing of feces that AB did are two different things.

If all I'm risking is a 6th or 7th round pick by holding Duke till the trade deadline, then I'll take the risk and cut him later if I have to.

Hunt is still going to be missing half of the season and what Duke can do while he is out is worth more than a 6th or 7th rounder.

He'll be increasing his trade value at the same time.

Strawman?

On Dawgtalkers??

So what you're saying is we're terrible posters and know nothing about football. Ridiculous!

Usually when someone goes down the personal road without addressing the points posed to them, it speaks volumes.

So let's try this again and maybe you'll actually answer this time. But I doubt it.

You say Duke's role has been diminished. That being the case, are you saying it's a wiser move to take a roster spot on a player seldom used or make a trade to acquire a player the team would use more?

Try to stay on topic this time.

https://923thefan.radio.com/articles/scott-petrak-i-doubt-duke-johnson-will-be-cleveland-brown-week


Scott Petrak: I doubt Duke Johnson will be a Brown in a week
He guesses something like a 5th-round pick will be the return

BASKIN & PHELPS
APRIL 22, 2019 - 11:30 AM

© Scott R. Galvin-USA TODAY Sports

CATEGORIES: NFL Heard On Browns
Scott Petrak joined Andy and Jeff to preview the NFL draft and discuss the probability of Duke Johnson being traded, what kind of return they may pull off and how likely the Browns trading into the first round may be. He said Johnson would likely only bring a 5th rounder in return and he guesses there's a 25-30% chance they trade into the first round.

Freddie Kitchens throws water on Duke Johnson trade request, Odell Beckham Jr.'s absence from voluntary camp

http://www.espn.com/blog/cleveland/post/...-voluntary-camp

Something new that Freddie Kitchens will deal with in his first season as head coach are the little brushfires – real and imagined – that may spring up.

Well, he fire-hosed two of them in his final media appearance of the three-day draft.

Kitchens was asked about running back Duke Johnson’s reported request to be traded and the continual absence of high-profile, new receiver Odell Beckham Jr. from the recently concluded voluntary minicamp.

Kitchens promptly shot down both topics.

On Johnson:

“Duke’s under contract. I’ve said this for a month now, I don’t know where all this trade talk started happening. People just assumed we would trade him because we signed another good football player [Kareem Hunt]. I like good football players, and I like as many as I can get.

“It’s our job to get him the ball and enable him in whatever role that is. Duke Johnson is on this football team and will have a vital role on this team and will help us win football games. Am I surprised he’s still here? No, not one bit. I have never said anything different than that.

On mending the fences possibly kicked down in a trade request:

“I don’t know the answer to that. I just shoot him straight and tell him what his role is and show him when he gets here. All the rest of that is up to him. My decision is not based on how he feels. My decision is based on what’s best for the Cleveland Browns and this organization.

“At this point in time, him asking for a trade doesn’t matter to me. He’s a Cleveland Brown. Duke’s the type of the guy who’s going to show up and he’s going to do his job and he’s going do his job well. That’s all I can ask for as a coach. His demands, I’m not impacted by that one bit.”

On Beckham, who has missed all the voluntary portion of the offseason program since reporting on April 1 and then departing:

“No [I’m not disappointed]. Of course, I’d rather him be here than not here, but I understand why. I talk to Odell every day. He knows what we’re doing offensively every day.

“Did you know, the defensive players of the year the past two years sat out all of training camp? Khalil Mack and Aaron Donald. No offseason program at all. Now, it’s better for us to have him here, us being a new staff, but if we can’t have them ready to play, they need to find a new head coach.

“He will be ready to play. Don’t you worry about that. I’m sure you are.”

When it was suggested that Beckham’s example is different because he’s joining a new team with new coaches and new teammates, and a new offense, Kitchens went into Bill Parcells anti-media mode.

“I’ll tell you this about Odell Beckham and Baker Mayfield, I think they have a pretty good relationship, they’ve formed a pretty good camaraderie. They’ve worked together for two summers in a row in California. I don’t see their camaraderie being a problem.

“I understand [the situation is new to him]. I also understand you guys are always trying to define and draw lines in the stand between coaches and players and players and players. That’s not happening here.

“There’s no problem Odell not being here. I’d rather he be here. He’s not here. It’s voluntary. Under no circumstance am I gonna say I’m pissed off at Odell for him not being here. He’ll be ready to play, I promise you.”

One thing you can say about Freddie - he doesn't mince words. I love it.

yeah, freddie tells it like it is, which in general is the way to go

I don't know, bro. Consider this quote from Freddie:



I think it came from Duke asking for a trade. Hell, Freddie even talked about that later in the interview.

Sounds like double-speak to me.

But, don't worry. I will defend him when others turn on him. LOL

I don't get the "double speak", he just made a statement.

He said he didn't get where all the talk started. It started because Duke requested a trade. He even said that Duke, requested a trade later on in the interview.

What don't you get?

It started months before Duke said a word. It started with fans and media. After a while it was assumed the FO wanted to trade him when they never said anything of the sort.

I guess when the conversation comes back around to what Duke said, he and Dorsey could say "yeah, well screw Duke, he's under contract", but generally coaches and GMs just state the obvious canned phrase along the lines of "____ is a good football player, he is in our plans for next season and under contract with our team". It's general etiquette, not unlike your (correct, in my opinion) assessment of Baker's comments about Hue being fake being generally frowned upon.

Maybe I'm just dumb. Don't see any mixed message or double speak.

We disagree. He contradicted himself in my opinion.

But, just remember...........when the majority is ripping on Freddie, I will be the one defending him. This ain't my first rodeo.

His roster spot is at RB. The reason he wants out is not that we are short of talent in that area. No matter who we put in that roster spot they probably won't be playing much. Barring injury of course. Duke isn't "taking up a roster spot" of someone that would play more. Until week 9 we will be short in the RB room. Duke will be needed. For those 8 weeks he will be one injury away from being the starter... Also, we have no real idea what our offense might look like next year. Coach put his together last year on the fly. Duke might get 10 touches a game in our offense. We won't know until we see it. Neither will Duke.

I don't like a player demanding a trade. We have paid him good money and I am fine with keeping him. Unless he starts acting out and causing problems... then I ship him to the worst team I can make a trade with regardless of compensation.

After Hunt and now Hill, I could see Duke ending up in KC at some point next season....

We have always signed or drafted someone to play ahead of Duke. Always. The Crow, Hyde and Chubb. Duke has never been seen a s a starting RB here. I don't see why people suddenly believe that's all changed.

And that's why I like Duke. He did his thing and never complained.

Oh I certainly like Duke. But in saying that, I always keep in mind that football is a business.

Understood

I was really hoping this was true and glad Freddie stated as much. I do have a feeling that Duke will quietly do his job like the pro I believe he is.

What I get from this thread and others, is that many feel Duke wasn't treated right by the team. I disagree. He has been praised by most of the coaches that have been here. He also is paid very well for his limited use. I can understand him wanting a bigger role, but to suggest he was slighted or something by the Browns, is something I can't agree with.

I am not being argumentative, but I'm curious. What makes you say that the essence of this thread is that Duke hasn't been treated fairly by the team?

I guess some confuse playing time with not being treated right.

I hope it is so with Duke. He has been a solid performer. Hope he will do his job well here.

But it is a business being a fan as well. My bottom line doesn'tcare who wins us games. My best to Duke however this plays out.

Stop the BS about Duke Johnson and look at what he's done and expected to do. Here's the bottom line, Duke is scheduled to be the 20th rated cap hit in 2019 at RB. His cost per touch is projected to be $35,057 if and that's a huge if he gets the same amount of touches in 2019 as 2018. To put it into perspective, the second highest cap hit at RB in 2019 is Todd Gurley and his cost per touch if he meets 2018 touches is $29,206. In this comparison, the Browns are projected to pay Duke Johnson $5,851 more for every touch in 2019 than Todd Gurley! REALLY?

The reason Duke wasn't traded during the draft is because no team wants that contract. Highest paid RB per touch in the NFL? You have got to be kidding me. That's the sole reason Kitchens is making the statements he's making. He either embraces Duke or stays silent until the Browns cut him for being disruptive and eat the dead cap money they'll have to absorb.

I get it, Browns fans like Duke. But come on, here's a guy making more money than Gurley per touch and he's demanding a trade? A certain 3rd stringer used mostly on 3rd down and the Browns are paying him more than Gurley per touch? Time to cut bait...…………………………….he's not worth the trouble.