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Romeo needs to be dumped fairly early in this season for a reason.
Lerner needs to see if a change of direction on the field has any impact on the attitude, play of Savages players.
Romeo isn't the only one under Lerners microscope here.
If a change in field operations doesn't show some improvement in the lethargic attitude many of these guys exhibit, Lerner then has the information needed to make his off season decision on who to bring in.
His choice of coaches will change drastically if he keeps Savage, the man with roster control, and if he doesn't.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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this is premature... if our team shows no competitiveness in the next 5 weeks, then i will bless such a decision...  
Browns fans are born with it...
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I disagree that RAC must go. In my mind, he's on a darn short leash, and how the team responds against Cincy and the next few weeks will be very telling for me.
If the team comes out flat and uninspired after a drubbing like that, then I'll probably start leaning toward getting someone in that can really fire guys up.
If the team comes out mad as hell and starts punishing teams, then I'm going to say on the "RAC stays" side of the fence.
JMHO
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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It shouldn't take 3 years of ass kickings to finally get inspired.
JMO
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Whoa there! Let's fire the quarterback first. Then we can gang up on our new "punter". Just how much turmoil can a fan take in one week? There's plenty of time to engage in a healthy dose of fear and loathing later in the season when, or if, we are really in the dumpster.
Misery is a season-long thing for a Browns fan. There's no sense for us to load up on it in the first week.
J.
"Let people think this is a dumpster fire," - Mike Pettine
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I agree Ballpeen
we need somone with "fire" to take over
I think GRantham could get more out of this team...he has that fire like Cowher...he will ge ton these players....he had our D playing well, but being backed up inside our own 20 so many times, there isn't much he could do
Our D is "Always" ready to play, and fired up...because of Grantham...our O on the other hand...blah
i say yank RAC and see what Grantham can do
i remember the Browns pulled a simlair move with Sam Rutigliano and promoted a man named Marty Schotenheimer...and Marty did quite well...i could see something simlair happening with Grantham...this kid is a "young" Bill Cowher...give him a shot...i bet our team plays much better and with a much higher energy level
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Another factor.....dumping a coach at game 10 is indeed giving up on the season.
I don't see it that way doing so early in the process. I see it as trying to salvage something.
This isn't knee jerk or premature. This is simply a continuation of the last couple of seasons. The slate doesn't get wiped clean for a coach every year....just the record.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Peen,,, respectfully, I totally and completely disagree with you,,,
Yours is just another in a long line of Knee Jerk reactions..
And all the ass kickings in the world will not substitute for quality players, which until this year, I don't think RAC had enough of...
Now, this year, I see that he does... I think so anyway... SO this is the year.,.
But the WHOLE YEAR, not one freaking game,,.,, Too soon...
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
Another factor.....dumping a coach at game 10 is indeed giving up on the season.
I don't see it that way doing so early in the process.
Dumping a coach after ONE game IS giving up,,,, TOTALLY Giving up...
Listen Peen,,, RAC needs this year with decent players to show his ability to coach., If he can't get it done,, if he doesn't show MAJOR improvement in this team (nothing like sunday),, then I'll be right there with you holding the rail that we can ride him out of town on,,'
I just happen to think it's too early!
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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...peen,....let's give the OL a game or 2 to see where we are,... and we have yet to see BQ as well.
Outside of the QB debacle we seem to be OK as a team,...the players are more confident and feel they are a GOOD team this year. Pulling the rug from underneath RAC is kinda doing it to the players also.
It's been 1 game,.....1 REALLY bad game.
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Quote:
It shouldn't take 3 years of ass kickings to finally get inspired.
That would be true for the "next" coach.
For one, I love when having played only 1 game of the third year folks talk like there's been 3 years of ass kickings. So many people make the 3 years arguement when in fact there's only been 2 years and 1 game.
Even Pat McManamon, in his most recent article references the Saints as one example of a team who "turned it around" in one season. What he, and many others fail to realize is that the Saints did not blow-up their roster. They were starting that "one year turnaround" with a healthy core of talented players.
Anyone who doesn't recognize that this team's roster was blowup and started nearly from scratch also isn't going to recognize that it takes time to not only rebuild the roster, but also for those young, drafted players to gain enough experience to learn how to play in this league.
It doesn't matter if someone wants their contractor to make their house (win) and make it now. If the materials are not there then it just ain't going to happen. And if the materials can only be brought in a little bit each year, then it's going to take considerable time.
Every Cleveland coach who was given his 5 years has made the playoffs.
The only thing bringing in a new coach does is raise the hope of the fans. And that is a big problem in Cleveland. Every few years hope abounds... but the wins never come.
Sooner or later the owner of the Browns must see that you have to give the coach a chance to build his team. Teams aren't built from scratch in two years and that's all they've had so far.
We've already been told that we're not going to win this season when Savage said this is a year for growth. Of course, he added to that that he believes we have a roster of talented players for the first time since he's been here. And he didn't fail to mention either, that these talented players are young and inexperienced as this is the year for their growth.
Too many people plant corn and when it's "knee high" they sit by the young stalk with their butter and salt licking their chops. Sorry farmer, it just ain't ready yet. Let it grow.
Or, if you prefer, you can chop down the corn stalk and plant again in hopes of having a corn roast sooner.
#gmstrong
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don't be too quick to make a knee jerk reaction....
new offense.
rookie qb learning the offense- and once he is in there will be making the rookie mistakes.
young db's- will make mistakes.
old defensive line.
new blood on the o-line takes time to gel ( and the preseason did not help because of injuries)
did you seriously think we would be better then 2-4 by the bye week?????
this week will tell us alot. But watching last nights ravens/bengals game- it looks like the bengals have been ordained by the NFL this year. Man they got some nice calls go their way. The int hit the ground. PI on the tight end taking away a TD??? And Deltha Oneal? mugging many guys without a flag (i thought they were going to be watching that arm in the back this year- only he is pushing down on the helmet)........... so all that means don't expect a win this week either.
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I don't know, Tomlin looked awful calm and peaceful on his sideline. So does the coaches on-field demeanor really mean that much?
My wife complains that there are times when I show no emotion, and it's usually when I'm in the zone, really concentrating on something, that I look like a zombie. Maybe RAC is just that way, during game day he is so focused on what's going on, he doesn't show emotion, good or bad.
Not everyone is a screaming ball of fanaticism, during a game. I very seldom express much other than an "aww", or "alright!" while watching games, while most of my family, is jumping and screaming, and getting pissed off at bad plays. I'm focused watching events all over the TV, no time for emotions. Emotions cause irrational decisions.
Last edited by FloridaFan; 09/11/07 08:55 AM.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Quote:
Another factor.....dumping a coach at game 10 is indeed giving up on the season.
I don't see it that way doing so early in the process. I see it as trying to salvage something.
This isn't knee jerk or premature. This is simply a continuation of the last couple of seasons. The slate doesn't get wiped clean for a coach every year....just the record.
I see your point. I don't agree but I see your point. My problem with doing it now is the logistical hurdles we face bringing in new leadership at a time when there is a game to play every week. Crennell can face up to his success or failure at the end of the season. My bet is he's finished as a head coach after this season.
Switching coaches in mid-season is usually considered a sign of failure on a grand scale. We've only stunk up the place one time so far this year. If we're a six or eight win team, then who knows? Maybe we'll have a few more stinkers before the season is over. Maybe the team will rally and use this thumping as a battle cry. Besides, if we hire a guy now, what is he going to think about his long-term prospects when everyone starts playing "Bill Cowher Derby"?
We bought the ticket and now we're taking the ride.
J.
"Let people think this is a dumpster fire," - Mike Pettine
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Actually after watching most the games this weekend, it seems most every QB had opening day jitters except Peyton and Tom Brady. 
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Quote:
Our D is "Always" ready to play, and fired up...because of Grantham.
While I do think fire like Grantham's is needed, I would say the D's effort in the second half against Pittsburgh didn't reflect a coach who always has his team ready.
As for getting rid of Crennell. I wouldn't wait too long. As Peen said, doing it early, does say, "Hey we want to turn this around now." I just hope that we're not in for another one of those 3-5 year plans if Savage goes as well.
There may be people who have more talent than you, but there's no excuse for anyone to work harder than you do.
-Derek Jeter
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j/c
Derek Anderson in week 1
13 of 28 for 184 yards, 1 TD, 1 INT
Matt Leinart in week 1
14 of 28 for 102 yards, 1 TD, 2 INT's
This is why the Browns are a joke around the NFL. We make knee jerk reactions. Leinart was just as bad as our QB's in week 1, are they going to now go out and sign Tim Couch to replace him? Steve McNair turned the ball over 4 times in his first game, are they going to now put in Troy Smith?
Knee jerk reactions is why this team is where it is right now.
Palmer made a knee jerk reaction after the 1st game of 1999 to start Couch
Butch made a knee jerk reaction on draft day to take Warren.
RAC's about to make a knee jerk reaction after the 1st game of 2007 to put this team back another 8 years.
Let Quinn sit the WHOLE year. No need to ruin another QB.
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Mensa...who says this will ruin Quinn?
for every QB you say gets ruined by starting them their rookie year, i can name you 1 who succeeded
Phil Simms-Simms won his first five starts of his rookie year. He led the team to a 6–4 record as a starter
Troy Aikman went 0-11(cowboys 0-15 that year) Aikman turned out just fine
Peyton Manning
Ben Rothlisberger
my point is quit babying Quinn...he is a big boy, he can handle it
if he knows the playbook he should play, he is the best QB we have
do you really wanna just "give" the Dallas Cowboys the 1st overall pick next year?
sheesh...i want that pick to be as low as possible..and quinn giuves us the best chance of it being so
The QB sitting for a whole year argument is hogwash
either you have what it takes to be an NFL qb or you don't, and sitting isn't gonna change that...
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I think RAC is simply overwhelmed. Some guys just aren't meant to be head coaches.
For those of you who say it's only 1 game...I say it was regular season game #33 for RAC.
The biggest problem is not wins and losses - although it SHOULD be. The biggest problem is that our team was not prepared for the Steelers...PERIOD.
Make excuses all you want...but they weren't prepared...AGAIN.
I've said it before and, unfortunately, I have to say it again:
Since our return, we have not had a HC who has been a HC previously in the NFL. Every guy we've hired has been learning on the fly...and it STILL hasn't worked.
We can bring in a new guy without gutting the roster...the roster is young but in good shape.
RAC was not the guy...is not the guy...and will not be the guy. Not here anyway. The sooner the FO realizes this, the better.
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Quote:
Peen,,, respectfully, I totally and completely disagree with you,,,
Of course you do..
Sorry.....and sorry DDub..this has gone on for 2 years and 1 game.
We will see how it plays out and will then see who is right or wrong.
My opinion isn't going to change unless something really changes....and I doubt that is going to happen as long as Romeo is here. Again...that is just my opinion
But you are right, it is probably a good thing I don't make the decisions.
If I did, I would have made a knee jerk reaction and had security remove Romeo from the field in the middle of the 3rd qtr and told him to have his crap out of his office by midnight.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I think the Browns deserved to lose this past week...
It lets them know that its more than just doing well in preseason, and training camp... They need to do good come game day...
Now they should play w/ a chip on their shoulder... The Bengals are next, and normally they clobber us as well, hopefully this year won't be the case.
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I agree.
The slate isn't cleared on a coach with each new season. His track record remains...and this is simply continuing the same old same old.
If some people have to be kicked in the face repeated times, I can't help that.
After a while, I get the message.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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General reply
There is no reason whatsoever to keep RAC as head coach. Sunday was just another example of why this team will never see success with RAC at the helm. He isnt a leader he supports QBs that lack leadership ability. He keeps players that do not contribute other than being his buddy.
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Three superbowls wins as a head coach,,,, other wins as a Defensive Coordinator,,, and I've yet to see Belichick get excited on the sidelines,,
Yet, you and a few others think that if a coach gets fired up on the sidelines, that's all it will take,,,, sheesh!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
Now they should play w/ a chip on their shoulder..
That chip you speak of should have already been there.
The only chip we now have is chips in our teeth after have been kicked in the mouth time and time again.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Not you too Mour,,, Holy cow,,,
Let the Knee jerk reactions continue!
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
It shouldn't take 3 years of ass kickings to finally get inspired.
JMO
Exactly, look I don't chime in much on getting rid of coaches and replacing QB's, but I see other teams hire a coach and such coach turns around the organization. It does not take a half decade to get it done. If the team is unprepared and unispired that is on teh coach. How many times have we seen this team look unprepared and unispiredin the last three years? Too much for me. Get somebody in here with a 3-4 background and some stones. JMHO
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Quote:
Not you too Mour,,, Holy cow,,,
Let the Knee jerk reactions continue!
Again..they aren't knee jerk.....they are a continuation from last season....you know...our coach...Romeo??
We aren't talking about Bill Belicheck as you have.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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j/c
Not a knee jerk reaction.
How do you NOT get so fired up and prepared for your arch rival who EMBARASSED you in the previous meeting?
Lack of talent or not, you should be able to keep this game close. Senior year of high school we played Akron Garfield with Chris Wells in their backfield...we had lost both our starting QB's due to injury. We had a sophomore QB and a senior WR who mainly ran the option playing QB. We were overmatched on both sides of the ball.
It was still a 1 TD game cuz we got up for it knowing we were gonna play Wells. We had talented players too but not nearly as talented as Wells or their overall team.
I'm pretty sure that in the NFL the talent gap between the worst and best teams is MUCH narrower than that.
It just doesn't make much sense to me how Botch could take a lesser talented team and at least keep us in the games at the end, even though I've given my reasons why I think that may be the case.
I gotta run, won't be able to reply for awhile unless I can find a library computer.
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Hot B made the comment that we need a guy that has some fire,, I was making a point that Belichick clearly doesn't have much fire on the sidelines and he's won,, Come on peen,,, keep up 
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Quote:
Three superbowls wins as a head coach,,,, other wins as a Defensive Coordinator,,, and I've yet to see Belichick get excited on the sidelines,,
Yet, you and a few others think that if a coach gets fired up on the sidelines, that's all it will take,,,, sheesh!
i have seen Bellichik get jacked many times on the sidelines, he also works the refs,
Romeo shows "zero" emotion, he never works the refs, and his replay challengles are just downright awful
the man should not be allowed to even challenge any plays, that should be up to savage or someone else im sure could do a much better job
its obvious RAc isn't the answer here, he just don't have it
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I'm starting to join up with the "Romeo isn't head coaching material" crowd - and it isn't just because of the debacle on Sunday. Too many in-game decisions that leave me scratching my head. In hindsight, the QB competition doesn't seem wise. Should have picked a starter earlier than he did.
Bad instant replay challenges, punting on 4th and 3 at midfield or whatever when we still had a (slim) chance Sunday, down 24-7 IIRC.
Having said that, now isn't the time to axe him unless he completely loses the team.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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Quote:
Three superbowls wins as a head coach,,,, other wins as a Defensive Coordinator,,, and I've yet to see Belichick get excited on the sidelines,,
Yet, you and a few others think that if a coach gets fired up on the sidelines, that's all it will take,,,, sheesh!
Yeah Deman but Bellichick is a cold, cold man. You know if you screwup enough with him , you are outta here.
I'm starting to agree with Peen but not yet. The idea of bringing in a new coach scares me. What if he wants to switch back to a 4-3. Our personel would be all wrong. That said, Have you ever seen a more illprepared team take the field. I know our team is young but other teams start young players. I would give RAC a little more time but he should diffently be on the clock.
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Quote:
The idea of bringing in a new coach scares me. What if he wants to switch back to a 4-3. Our personel would be all wrong.
Just think what that would do to Chaun Thompson?
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Romeo isn't going anywhere...
Calm down kimosabee..
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IMO Savage would bring in a new HC whose philosophy is close to Romeo's (schematic wise). Too many years building the 3-4. It might even be Grantham.
gmstrong -----------------
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Quote:
Hot B made the comment that we need a guy that has some fire,,
I was making a point that Belichick clearly doesn't have much fire on the sidelines and he's won,,
Come on peen,,, keep up
I don't care much if a coach has some fire to him on the sidelines or not.
I care if he can use that style to get his team fired up on the field. Take Mike Nolan last night... he's on the sidelines, in his suit, calm as can be. But his team was JACKED.
Game 2 isn't time for a new coach, but I'd honestly be shocked if RAC was still here in '08.
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Things arent rosey for RAC in berea. there was a meeting yesterday and you heard RAC say he wasnt there. That isnt the best sign for RAC's future and I can tell you this flat out RAndy Lerner is fed up.
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It is past the point of Romeo having any say so on what happens on this team.
Another reason we need to get rid of the guy.
The last decision he made was starting Charlie..the rest of his tenure will be spent being told what to do by Savage and Lerner.
Romeos assistant coaches have more say so than does Romeo.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Why Romeo needs to go soon.
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