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I posted this as a response in the Frye traded thread ... this puts things in perspective and is a spin on things the upset dawgs need to consider .. and its getting buried in that thread ... so i figured i'd post it in a thread of its own so the upset dawgs could read it and it may calm them down some ...
We need to see how this plays out ... U can't judge a book by its cover P ... I hear where your coming from .. those thinking this is just a knee jerk are gonna say were PANICKING because thats what this looks like .. my VIEW of this is as follows ...
1. We been trying to trade either DA or Frye for a while now ... we couldn't get DIDDLY for them so we kept them both and cut Dorsey ...
2. Eli goes down for at least a month (the giants are denying this to help their TRADE situation) ...
3. Harrington proves to Petrino hes a BUM ...... and correct me if Im wrong Mourg cause i ain't sure but I believe that frye would be a nice fit in his system????
4. Two situations all of a sudden become VERY VIABLE TRADE scenarios ...
I think this actually broke MUCH BETTER than the FO could have imagined .... now if its a knee jerk (sumptin i HIGHLY DOUBT) then were DUMB AS HELL and in deep trouble ....
I BELIEVE things just happend to break to make it look like a KNEE JERK thing ... ANOTHERWORDS even if Frye LIT PITT UP we would still be trying to trade him today ... cause my guess is that DA has ZERO VALUE anywhere in the NFL ... so all Frye's game against Pitt did was hurt us in our trade attempts ...
so U can RELAX BRO .... its not as dire or KNEE JERK as most think and the MEDIA IS GOING TO POTRAY IT ...
--------------------
"My whole goal is not really worrying about where I'm at," he said. "It's setting my eyes on where I'm going."
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Quote:
1. We been trying to trade either DA or Frye for a while now ... we couldn't get DIDDLY for them so we kept them both and cut Dorsey ...
And as I told you on that thread. JAX tried to trade for Frye on draft day, but Savage wouldn't trade him, he said he was too valuable.
Savage doesn't have a clue of what he's doing. Oz ran the show in BAL.
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I'll preface this by saying I don't know if I've seen enough to confirm if these rumors are true in my own mind. Given the clamoring about the Frye situation, this could simply be another Savage/Collins type media circus.
It might be, but on the other hand, naming a QB a starter who you are desperately trying to trade (you've acknowledged that DA has no trade value, so they've really only been trying to trade Frye) shows one of two things:
1.) The team has considered this a rebuilding year from the get go. You would never name a starting QB that you were trying to trade, if you thought you might be a contender.
2.) The team is schizophrenic or there is a power struggle as to what should be going on.
It simply makes no sense to trade Frye if we had any plans to contend this season. Frye is better than DA, and will be better than DA, this game aside (DA will never be valuable, because his inaccuracy problems are uncorrectable.) He had an awful game against Pittsburgh I agree, but casting him aside after 4 series is laughable.
It seems this team is in full freak-out mode presently. Successful teams have been blown out in week 1 before, but a strong and committed front office and coaching staff don't go insane like we seem to be seeing this team doing. (You don't see the Jets doing this after being killed by a division rival. You don't see New Orleans freaking out, nor did you see New England freak out in 2003 when they went on to win the Super Bowl after losing 31-0 to Buffalo in week 1.)
This shows a team that lacks leadership, especially on the highest levels. And may be another indication of the front office mess that was displayed in the Collins/Savage debacle.
~Lyuokdea
~Lyuokdea
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And I should add, Savage is the one that keeps telling us how much better the team is, and keeps blaming Butch for the losses. Savage is a joke.
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I read it. I just haven't responded yet because I'm too busy being pissed. First RAC flat out lied to the media about the Hamilton situation and now this fiasco.
They may have had a plan but this just looks so bad to everyone. Getting rid of Anderson or Frye was the right thing to do IMO but their timing looks bad. I can't believe Seattle wouldn't have been willing to trade before the opener considering they have a starter that is healthy.
#gmstrong
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I agree with you on this. Now, I still hope they hold Quinn out until he is ready. I hope they don't cave to the short-sighted "fans". Too bad no one in the league wants Frye and he wouldn't be on any roster in the NFL 
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As I told you on that thread, I think you make a good point......twice.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Quote:
1. We been trying to trade either DA or Frye for a while now ... we couldn't get DIDDLY for them so we kept them both and cut Dorsey ...
And Sunday's 'performance' made it easier to trade him????
...always have been, always will be...
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No, but some injuries around the league did.
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...always have been, always will be...
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I think we should all just listen to Mensa, he always knows the answers.  He must be a joy to be around. Mensa, Do you ever have a positive outlook on anything, or a nice thing to say about anyone? I don't think i have heard you say one positive thing in any post, and I don't mean just about the team, I mean in general, you never have anything but extreme negatives, is that your outlook on life?
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Quote:
1. We been trying to trade either DA or Frye for a while now ... we couldn't get DIDDLY for them so we kept them both and cut Dorsey ...
I completely agree with you ... especially this point. They cut Dorsey knowing full well that teams would less likely pick him up than they would Frye or DA. They retained a small amount of trade value for the two of them and held them for a week when they knew QB would get injured and somebody would need one.
Low and behold, they get three trade partners, and are still able to bring in Dorsey to help mentor Quinn.
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Not as much as a supply and demand kind of thing....the more teams needing a QB, the better position those with one are in.
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Quote:
No, but some injuries around the league did.
We don't know for a fact that anyone else was interested in him.
He is going to a good situation. He gets a chance to catch his breathe and relax because he has no pressure on him now. He can learn without having to try and carry a team. If he ever gets a chance to get back into the lineup he will have had time to learn. I think he will make a good backup and spot starter. I wish him well.
What I can't understand is all the hate for him. He has done nothing wrong other than not being a good starter. He didn't rape anyone, sit on his lazy ass, get drunk and busted, etc..
#gmstrong
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So you get a 6th rounder after the start of the season and that is a success!! Man, you all give Opie way to much credit! Sorry, I have been patient with the Browns but this is a front office blunder!!
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Well, what we do know is that there were 5 teams reportedly interested in him. We don't know that as "fact", but you never do in these situations.
I don't understand the hate either. The kid was everything you'd want a person representing your team, community, etc to be. Don't worry, it won't be long until the same people turn on the next QB that struggles for more than a quarter.
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I couldn't stand the way he played QB ........ That's why I'm glad he's gone.
Rumors do not lend to valid discussion and will be removed when seen by a moderator.
Last edited by Referee6; 09/11/07 07:18 PM.
...always have been, always will be...
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I don't know where you heard these stories, but I can tell you that Frye is a class guy and has never been in any sort of trouble. I know this first hand, not just from "stories" (not ripping you, just saying I don't know of anything about him that is "revolting"). Yes, I'm biased because I coached him in an All Star game and he played his college ball for my high school coach, but that doesn't mean I would say glowing things about him without knowing it was true.
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I did a little knee-jerking of my own in another thread when I blasted the FO for looking like baffoons in all this mess, but you make a lot of sense with your post. hey at least I admit it when I talk when I should be listening.  As for CF, I wish him well, I like him as a person but he was doomed here as a starter when we drafted BQ. I don't think he's been happy since that day.
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
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Quote:
Mensa,
Do you ever have a positive outlook on anything, or a nice thing to say about anyone?
I don't think i have heard you say one positive thing in any post, and I don't mean just about the team, I mean in general, you never have anything but extreme negatives, is that your outlook on life?
I wonder the same thing.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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Quote:
I think we should all just listen to Mensa, he always knows the answers.
He must be a joy to be around.
Mensa,
Do you ever have a positive outlook on anything, or a nice thing to say about anyone?
I don't think i have heard you say one positive thing in any post, and I don't mean just about the team, I mean in general, you never have anything but extreme negatives, is that your outlook on life?
I've been down on this team for the past month plus. I've heard what's been going on within this organization lately. It's a complete disaster.
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I trust you have your reasons, and I respect your side, but with us both growing up in the same small town, everytime I go back to willard, everything I hear and see is first class from charlie, my mother has had a few run in's with Charlie and has commented on what a fine young man he is, My uncle is Chalries mom's cousin, and coming form a small town thats close enough to be relation and to my understanding coming from him, there was never any cover up of stories coming from family reuinions...LOL
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If all we got is a 6th rounder, it tends to say that your scenario isn't all that happened Diam. You don't go around trying to trade your starting QB because you're looking to accumulate 6th rounders.
You decide that you need to get rid of your starting QB, and then realize that getting a 6th rounder out of it is better than nothing.
Players that a team wants aren't traded for a 6th rounder, players that a team wants to get rid of are.
~Lyuokdea
Last edited by Lyuokdea; 09/11/07 01:38 PM.
~Lyuokdea
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You don't go around trying to trade your starting QB because you're looking to accumulate 6th rounders.
I think you have STARTER and Quality confused..
Teams give you what they think is the value of the traded player..
You decide that you need to get rid of your starting QB, and then realize that getting a 6th rounder out of it is better than nothing.
And that's the business..U get what you can for a player..
Don't tell me you thought they'd get a first day pick?
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My thoughts on the situation are this:
I think after last year Phil and Romeo both knew that neither Frye nor Anderson were the QB of the future for this team, thus the reason for drafting Quinn. But i also think they hoped that at least one of the two could develop into a respectable enough QB that they could keep us in games with having revamped the Oline and a new RB, but realized with the QB play in training camp and the performance in the first game that that wasn't going to happen and decided to go ahead and cut ties now and move forward. Now they can give Quinn more snaps in practice and accelerate his learning process.
#gmstrong
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It is also cheaper many times to take on the existing contract than start bidding with other folks.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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Quote:
So you get a 6th rounder after the start of the season and that is a success!! Man, you all give Opie way to much credit! Sorry, I have been patient with the Browns but this is a front office blunder!!
A 6th rounder is a heck of a lot better than the NOTHING we would of received if we just cut him in the preseason. And the end result is still the same here ... we have one QB keeping the seat warm until Quinn is ready to go in ... except now we have an extra draft pick.
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j/k
Getting rid of Frye over Anderson makes sense because DA is a pocket passer - a terrible one - but a pocket passer nonetheless.
Neither are starter quality guys but at least they are now in systems that fit their style.
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Excel,
You get a 6th rounder with a pack of gum usually! So you trade a so called starting QB for a 6th rounder?? Come on, they were OFFERED a 6th rounder and the Browns took it! So a QB we drafted a couple of years ago and devalued down to a 6th rounder and this was your starting QB. That means you did not have one!!
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Quote:
And that's the business..U get what you can for a player..
Don't tell me you thought they'd get a first day pick?
Not at all. I'm saying that there decision to trade him for a 6th rounder means that we would have cut him when all was said and done. The sixth rounder is a nice added bonus, but it's not at all like we've spent the last 3 months looking for this sixth rounder and have just now found it. Instead we decided to get rid of Frye today (regardless of what we would get) and just happened to pull a 6th rounder out of the deal.
~Lyuokdea
~Lyuokdea
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sorry Coach and Clay, I didn't want to just leave that hanging. None of the stuff I heard was legal trouble or even being close to it, ............... I might be more sensitive than others but I have standards ...................
Rumors do not lend to valid discussion and will be removed when seen by a moderator.
Last edited by Referee6; 09/11/07 07:19 PM.
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Quote:
So a QB we drafted a couple of years ago and devalued down to a 6th rounder and this was your starting QB. That means you did not have one!!
We did have one, but he got to camp 11 days late... what happened between draft day and the day Quinn takes the field was all just filler anyway...
yebat' Putin
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getting a 6th rnd pick for a 3rd round QB who hasn't played well in his 3 years is decent return versus cutting him.
You buy a cheap[ radio for $10, 3 years from now it's beat up, and barely works, and someone offers you $5 for it. Do you take it, or just throw the radio away?
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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Quote:
Excel,
You get a 6th rounder with a pack of gum usually! So you trade a so called starting QB for a 6th rounder??
No he was a backup ... like DC said, he's filler until Quinn is ready. So is DA. We got a 6th rounder for a backup QB. Still much better than nothing, and like I've been saying ... we're still in the exact same position we would of been if we cut one of the two in training camp, but now with an extra pick.
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Come on, they were OFFERED a 6th rounder and the Browns took it! So a QB we drafted a couple of years ago and devalued down to a 6th rounder and this was your starting QB. That means you did not have one!!
Yeah, I think everyone knew that Quinn would be the starter around here. Frye was a STOPGAP until Quinn was ready. We're not going to get many great QBs willing to come in as free agents to be a stopgap. We had two guys that everyone had chalked up as future backups, and we got a draft pick for one of them. We then brought back the guy best suited to mentor Quinn. What exactly would you have prefered?
I also love how everyone acted like Savage totally BLEW IT because he drafted a QB in the third round that didn't pan out to be a starter. As if every GM drafts QBs in the third round or later that turn into pro-bowl gun-slingers. Probably 95% of QBs drafted after the middle of the 2nd round don't amount to much in their careers. They're all hit or miss. The fact that we didn't get a starting QB out of a third rounder is pretty much par for the course.
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OK.. Mr.Filler.. .I would rather BQ learn a bit more before he gets onto the field.
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Quote:
getting a 6th rnd pick for a 3rd round QB who hasn't played well in his 3 years is decent return versus cutting him.
Not when you already played your first game and named that guy as your starter! Again, if this is done in preseason, I would not have one complaint because both guys were not playing well at all.
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Quote:
OK.. Mr.Filler.. .I would rather BQ learn a bit more before he gets onto the field.
So do we ... which is what DA is for. He's not going to be any better or worse than Frye, so I'm not sure why you're up in arms about getting a draft pick for Frye. And it's not like we are going to convince Byron Leftwhich to come here for the league minimum and start as a stopgap for 5 weeks.
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Excel, Quote:
Yeah, I think everyone knew that Quinn would be the starter around here. Frye was a STOPGAP until Quinn was ready. We're not going to get many great QBs willing to come in as free agents to be a stopgap. We had two guys that everyone had chalked up as future backups, and we got a draft pick for one of them. We then brought back the guy best suited to mentor Quinn. What exactly would you have prefered?
Yes, everyone did know that BQ was going to start eventually. But everyone also knew that the best thing for BQ was to sit and learn for atleast 8 games or more. Now that has been rushed again. Also, we have spent how many hours/practices..etc with 2 qbs and after the first game you want to throw away your starter, and then the guy who lost the competition, well now he is the starter until we can train up BQ. And what if he gets hurt??
This was not Opie's shining moment and yes, the way this was handled was bush league and stupid. If you do not have a starting qb, get one at the START of the training camp, not after your first game. If you pick up a starting QB then, you can keep either Frye or DA and let BQ learn the system. As far as Dorsey, yes he knows the system but cannot PLAY in it!
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Quote:
You buy a cheap[ radio for $10, 3 years from now it's beat up, and barely works, and someone offers you $5 for it. Do you take it, or just throw the radio away?
In retrospect,I'd say you learn to invest in a better radio!
And take what you can gert for the old one.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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In retrospect,I'd say you learn to invest in a better radio!
We did ... this year 
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And take what you can gert for the old one.
... we did.
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