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The other day, I was reading a thread and these cats were talking about Trump got elected because he hosted a TV game show or something like that. I never watched the show, but I disagreed and said that I doubted Trump being on a TV show was why he won the election.

I proposed an alternative explanation in which I talked about how the Democratic party has been ignoring the white middle class who work for a living and even going as far to ask them to pay for even more than they already do.

I received a couple of hostile responses from two posters w/the usual labeling included and told my ideas were nonsense.

Well, not all Dems and Progressives agree w/the extremists and some are thinking more along the lines that I have been for quite some time.

It's about damn time.


Quote:

Progressives lay out racial justice strategy to win over working-class whites


Jon Ward Fri, Jul 19 5:00 AM EDT

A few days before President Trump’s Twitter rant against four congresswomen of color, a few thousand progressives gathered in Philadelphia to hear speakers exhort them to make race a central issue in the 2020 election.

“We’ve got to center racial justice,” Rashad Robinson, the executive director of Color of Change, told the Netroots Nation conference. Robinson told the audience that “racial justice is a strategy for gaining power and winning power.”

Robinson represents a left wing of the party that wants to confront Trump’s demagoguery on race and identity head on, not shying away from the topic.

“Democrats for years tried to both mobilize and engage black voters and voters of color and tried to avoid conversations around race with white folks, and it just didn’t work,” he told Yahoo News in an interview a few days after his Netroots speech.

“Democrats not talking about race doesn’t mean race is not going to be talked about,” Robinson said.

But can Democratic politicians do that in a way that wins new converts, particularly among the white working class whose votes might decide the 2020 election in the key battleground states of Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania? Is there a way for Democrats to talk about systemic racism in a way that actually wins over white voters rather than alienating them? Robinson was clear-eyed about the challenge. “People could come to hate Trump and not love our side in return,” he said.


Robinson and other progressive leaders who spoke to Yahoo News echoed a consistent message. The way to make racial justice a political winner, they said, is to combine it with a populist message aimed at convincing working-class whites that they’ve been distracted by the politics of race while wealthy elites take advantage of middle class and poor people of all races and ethnicities.

The Rev. Greg Holston, the leader of the Philadelphia interfaith group Power, spoke at Netroots after Robinson and denounced what he called an “unholy alliance between the white elite and the white working class.”

“We cannot win … unless we build a real black and Latino and working-class white-folk coalition that can stand together,” he said.


The Rev. William Barber, a North Carolina minister who was central to a series of protests against the Republican state legislature in 2013, has said much the same thing. “The persons who get elected by what some courts have now called surgical racism, once in office they vote to deny health care, living wages, cut public education, deny women’s rights, consumer rights, LGBTQ rights in ways that hurt — in raw numbers — more rural white people,” he told former Vice President Joe Biden at the event.

Barber’s Poor People’s Campaign hosted nine Democratic presidential candidates in Washington, D.C., in mid-June. And during that daylong event, he repeatedly came back to the same theme, that issues like voter suppression and gerrymandering — often interpreted solely as something done by white politicians to hurt black communities — does just as much to hurt poor whites.


Biden appeared to be in agreement to a certain degree. “The charlatans have been able to pit black folks against white folks against Latino” by telling “poor folks” that they are poor “because of all those immigrants, all those Muslims, all those African-Americans,” Biden said.

Sen. Bernie Sanders, I-Vt., was even more pointed in his remarks at the Poor People’s Campaign event. “We say to those white workers, ‘You think African-Americans and immigrants are your enemies? Why don’t you take a look at Wall Street?’” Sanders said.

Robinson said calling out specific “villains” like Sanders did — and Biden didn’t — is crucial because it’s the “full story.”

“If we are not willing to name the villains and the profiteers, the corporations and other businesses and the way the rules have been set up, if we’re not able to explain that and walk people through that because we are too afraid of losing corporate support or corporate dollars, then we don’t have a compelling story for people about exactly why it’s happening, and Donald Trump’s story will be compelling for people.”

Immigration offers one example. The progressive message is that the business community pushed the U.S. government to take a lax enforcement approach to border security for decades because it provided them with cheap labor from South and Central America. Immigrants had no leverage to organize themselves to demand higher wages or better working conditions.

And now those same business leaders are backing Republican candidates like Trump, who pass huge tax cuts for corporations while demonizing immigrants. Meanwhile, working-class whites were also victimized by globalization and outsourcing. “The injustice of companies moving their businesses overseas, not paying taxes, and depriving the white working class of benefits and income is also an unrighteous and unjust act,” Holston, the Philadelphia preacher, told Yahoo News.

“We should be lifting up justice for everyone,” he said.

At the Netroots conference, Alicia Garza, one of three women credited with starting the Black Lives Matter conference, was asked what her message would be to people who aren’t black.

“Black people’s issues are your issues too,” she said.

*****

One potential obstacle to a populist approach to race is language. A voter recently questioned presidential candidate Kirsten Gillibrand in Youngstown, Ohio, about how she and other Democrats can speak of “white privilege” to whites in the Rust Belt, where an entire way of life has been uprooted by globalization and outsourcing, creating desolate wastelands where joblessness and a loss of hope have led to epidemics of drug addiction and suicide.

“I hear you saying there is a lot of divisive language coming from Republicans, coming from Trump and that we are looking for ways to blame each other. But the Democratic Party loves to throw around terms like ‘white privilege,’” the woman, who was unidentified in news reports, asked Gillibrand, a Democratic senator from New York. “Now this is an area that across all demographics has been depressed because of the loss of its industry and the opioids crisis. So what do you have to say to people in this area about so-called white privilege?”

Gillibrand talked at length about her recognition “that families in this community are suffering deeply.”

“That is devastating when you’ve lost your job, you’ve lost your ability to provide for your kids, that when you put 20, 30 years into a company that all of a sudden doesn’t care about you or won’t call you back and gives you a day to move. That is not acceptable and not OK. So no one in that circumstance is privileged on any level, but that’s not what that conversation is about,” Gillibrand said.

Yet, she continued, “institutional racism is real. It doesn’t take away your pain or suffering. It’s just a different issue. Your suffering is just as important as a black or brown person’s suffering, but to fix the problems that are happening in a black community you need far more transformational efforts that are targeted for real racism that exists every day.”

Gillibrand did not make the explicit linkage that leaders like Barber, Robinson and Holston have called for — between racial justice and an economic populism that extends a hand to white working-class workers.

That, however, is exactly the message that Sanders and Sen. Elizabeth Warren, D-Mass., are taking on the campaign trail.

“The rules are rigged because the rich and powerful have bought and paid for too many politicians. And if we dare to ask questions, they will try to divide us: pit white working people against black and brown working people so they won’t band together and demand real change,” Warren said in a commencement speech last December at Morgan State, a historically black university.


Sen. Kamala Harris, D-Calif., meanwhile, is taking more of a generalist approach, with some elements of the Warren and Sanders populism on big issues like health care combined with a self-proclaimed “joyful warrior” image, as she is often introduced at her campaign events. She wants to be known as a politician who speaks tough truths about racism, but who ultimately seeks to unite the country rather than divide it.


“I think that the American people want a leader who speaks truth, even when sometimes it might make people uncomfortable,” Harris said Sunday while campaigning in New Hampshire.

She said racial justice wasn’t the only hard truth that needed attention, mentioning economic inequality and climate change as other examples. But, she said, “we need to speak the truth that we have had racism and racist policies in our country, and we need to address those.”

“Sometimes it might make us uncomfortable to deal with America's history on race, but these are truths that must be spoken so we can deal with them,” she said. “And I do believe the vast majority of Americans want … a system in our country that treats people equally and gives people equal dignity and respect.”

Robinson, the leader of Color of Change, spoke to Yahoo News the day after Trump’s Twitter assault on four black and brown women in Congress. He said he was “less interested in politicians calling Trump a racist.”

“The path forward is not about whether or not Trump is a racist. He got elected, and we already knew all that,” Robinson said. “The question for Democrats is what is the path forward and how is the story different and is it plausible?”

https://www.yahoo.com/news/progressives-...-090000240.html


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Is Elizabeth Warren considered to be a Progressive?

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I'm not too interested in the "labels," but rather how the left can connect w/the white working middle class like they did back in the day.

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Progressive policies yield conservative ideological results.


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

- Theodore Roosevelt
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Pit's dad preached this.
My Dad preached this.
My Great uncle, Giles Johnson preached this from his pulpit.
And so did his friend, MLK.

It's not a coincidence that MKL was assassinated only after he migrated his message from racial justice to economic justice (see: Poor People's Campaign). As long as he was the leader of The Coloreds, he was manageable. When he started gathering in poor Whites to his cause, he became a legitimate threat to the status quo.


Greater minds than mine have already seen this and shown us this.

I have to imagine that some people in Youngstown and some people in Delta are feeling a little let down these days. They were promised that things would get better, but Elizabeth Warren was still being asked the same questions that were being asked in 2015- an indication that things for them haven't improved at all. Same questions- 4 years later.

On the other hand, suit-wearing folks in air conditioned offices have done pretty well. Tax cuts, relaxed regs, and a figurehead potus who keeps the masses stirred up and looking elsewhere. Perfect for them... and nobody needs to be assassinated.


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I've been hearing for about, emm, well up to 15 years now, from some people who are probably African American and on the Left politically,

I've been hearing some idea I don't agree with, this idea that there are tons of "non violent" people locked up, people of color, and it's a problem

I disagree because ya know, I abhor some things like, Car theft, Burglarly, bank robbery, (all of which I figure would/could fall into a "non violent" category, and I don't think people who do these things to people who were minding their own business anyways, should get out of jail.

One of the things Trump was saying in 2016 before the election, among all the other nonsense, ... he was saying ( I dunno) " blah blah blah, politicans don't do anything... blah blah blah, they should have done something for the 13 years they "WERE" a politician"

Well allz I know is Trump is president, and someone somewhere reported TODAY that 3000 prisoners were going to be let out of prison,

for something along the lines of being non violent drug offenders;:
Which is what I've been hearing from some folks that lean otherwise politically like I said in the top line of this post ^^^^

So Trump let them out, but that's not the answer to your question...

The question of How can the left connect with the white working class like they did back in the day.

Well I guess the answer lies somewhere in the fact, I didn't hear anyone pre-empting the message of letting 3000 people out of jail, with first calling them by their identity politics grouping of either
Gender group
Racial group
Sexuality group
Class group

climate group, electric car group, recycle group, tell you not to use plastic straws group, force you to buy solar panels or you'll lose your house group, (all new houses in California),

He, (or somebody), Just Did something, in a Way that didn't interfere with the average persons' attmempt to continue the struggle of life in America,

And He wasn't motivated by an all out Power Grab that leads to totalitarian control of all thought an action to whatever the democrats tell you you are supposed to think.

Another answer to your queston, Another thing the Left could do, (but they aren't doing)

If you want to connect with the white working class is stop ignoring them altogether. Also stop marginalizing them,

Look at the suggested solution from the long article, it would insult their intelligience I would think if it were to suggest that the answer to connect with the white working class is

1. Combine the "racial justice" message, (which helps everyone except them), combine that with a populist message

"Aimed at convincing folks they've been distracted by the racial politics while wealthy elites take advantage of the middle class and poor of all races and ethnicities.

( So let me get this straight?)

1. Not even listen to the white person, but tell them they are distracted by all this racial stuff, (which is only the focus of every news story 24-7), but they should ignore their own thoughts, because the democrats tell them they are distracted,
followed up by they should hate the wealthy elites for taking advantage of them.

Do you think this message is going to connect? I don't think you could get 5 year old children to fall for it.

How Progressives Can Win the Election

They don't have to, they usually just come up with tons of votes after the re-counts start like how Al Franken got his senate seat.

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My family was just having this discussion ... most agreed it will be very difficult for them to win at this point. Too much division and not strong enough candidates.


"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Quote:
It's not a coincidence that MKL was assassinated only after he migrated his message from racial justice to economic justice (see: Poor People's Campaign). As long as he was the leader of The Coloreds, he was manageable. When he started gathering in poor Whites to his cause, he became a legitimate threat to the status quo.


This is important. Much like the anecdote I related in the Education thread about how a white man could be jailed and a black man publicly whipped if the white man tried to educate the black man, those in charge know the best way to control the masses is by keeping them ignorant and fighting against each other.

You know this, Clem. When does significant change occur? Does it happen just because a minority group is being exploited? Or does it occur when members of the class that is in power become incensed enough to demand change?

Child Labor? How did those laws get changed? We both know that there novels, poems, articles, photographs, speeches, protests, etc of white middle class people speaking out in rage at such cruel practices.

Same thing went for safety conditions in our factories, sweat shops, mills, etc. Remember the fire where all the ladies burned to death in a sewing sweat shop because the building did not even have a fire escape? People were horrified. Upton Sinclair wrote The Jungle and described the working conditions in those places. The momentum grew as others joined in the crusade.

Same thing w/the Civil Rights movement. You provided an example of just went on there.

We have seen similar changes occur throughout history. Yet, many don't want to recognize how change occurs. It boggles one's mind.

If we truly want change, we must beat them w/intelligence, cooperation, using morality as a tool, and determination. We are not going to invoke change by alienating those we want help from.

And I am not just speaking about the poorest white folks. I am also speaking about winning over the white working-middle class. There are a ton of votes there.

One last thing for now. Folks are all over the place about immigration. Most people understand the problems that come w/illegal immigration. Some use that knowledge to paint all immigrants or people who look like they may be from Central and S. America w/a broad brush and those folks receive harsh treatment. However, w/the first-hand accounts of what is going on in some of these camps, especially in regards to the children, more and more people are speaking out about such inhumane practices. Thus, there is a growing amount of support, compassion, and even acceptance for those folks. Furthermore, members of ICE have been exposed for some of their disgusting biases that only serves to bring more concern for the immigrants who are being mistreated. Change will be coming to those camps because of exposure.

We can win by finding common ground and using intelligence, cooperation and determination to win. I do not think we can win by alienating a group of folks who make-up such a large portion of the voting base.

Think about you and I. We have been friends for years. We disagree on some issues, but we don't focus on those issues. Instead, we turn our attention to what we do have in common. Sports, music, art, ethics, morality, fairness, helping others, etc. And I won't speak for you, but I know that I will certainly listen to your perspective on something we don't quite see the same way as instead of a person who is constantly alienating me.

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Sorry my friend but that ship has sailed and it’s not coming back in our lifetime. The Trump era has us all in shackles and the the GOP lead senate continues to double down on his deplorable policies.


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Quote:
And I am not just speaking about the poorest white folks. I am also speaking about winning over the white working-middle class. There are a ton of votes there.


How about one who worries about the middle class and couldn't give a rats ass what color, nationality, or race they are.


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Originally Posted By: Clemdawg


It's not a coincidence that MKL was assassinated only after he migrated his message from racial justice to economic justice (see: Poor People's Campaign). As long as he was the leader of The Coloreds, he was manageable. When he started gathering in poor Whites to his cause, he became a legitimate threat to the status quo.



^^^^ THIS!

Clem is spot on. The Oakland Police didn't really care about the Black Panthers as long as they were kept to their corner of Oakland. However, once Huey and Bobby started getting the white middle class counter culture kids from UC Berkeley riled up and interested in their message THAT'S when the police and FBI got worried and labeled them "the biggest threat to America" and "Terrorists".

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
[quote]
And I am not just speaking about the poorest white folks. I am also speaking about winning over the white working-middle class. There are a ton of votes there.



The candidate HAS to speak to brown and black voters too. Our nation is/has become more beige, especially our cities, but even rural areas. The future of America is even more diverse than it currently is so any candidate who speaks only to one group simply won't win. It may have worked this time, but it won't in the future. These changing demographics will turn Texas blue in our lifetime.

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Originally Posted By: GMdawg
Quote:
And I am not just speaking about the poorest white folks. I am also speaking about winning over the white working-middle class. There are a ton of votes there.


How about one who worries about the middle class and couldn't give a rats ass what color, nationality, or race they are.


Everytime I hear someone, (usually a democrat politician), mention the middle class, I laugh.

There's no such thing as a/(the) middle class anymore.

I'd probably be right in the middle/(bottom middle) of it, close to 3 sides of it, from what would be considered the poorer end, to what would be considerd the wealthier end

If there was a middle class, as people refer to, it's not as large of a group as people want to think, for one,
and 2nd it's probably the richest people I know, and those people don't realize
at the same time they are richer than the multitudes, and are not in control because they're so tied to the ideas of the super rich.

OK, so, I'd concede there are like 7 levels of middle class, 3/4 of which don't even qualify, economically for what the polliticans would consider as middle class,
because polliticans probably don't understand, they live in a sealed off world.

When I hear a politician speak of the middle class, I think two things.
1. It's a buzz word
2. The politician is clueless.

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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
I am also speaking about winning over the white working-middle class.


There's a large subset of white voters in this country who believe they are victims of due oppression due to "the other", they believe they are repressed because of "the other" taking their jobs, receiving more support, etc.

It'll be hard to get those voters, a large portion of Trump's base, to recognize it's not because of "the other" they are getting put down. This is where Bernie struggles in getting minority support. He struggles at linking his economic policy with systemic racism.

How do you convince someone who is prejudiced towards minorities that systemic racism exists? It's easy to pull out facts, but the GOP prioritizes feelings over facts. Newt Gingrich even admitted this strategy at the last convention when they selected Trump.

I find the people who explore outside their bubble tend to be more elastic in their thought. How do you convince someone who is stuck in their ways?

The economic system in our country and race and linked; it's been designed to stay this way. I understand you don't want to divide, but there will be some people you just won't ever reach.

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I am not searching for Utopia. I know that we can't get everyone to agree. I know there will be extremists on both sides.

I think there are more reasonable, open-minded folks out there than not.

I'm also getting the feeling that a some folks who responded didn't actually read the article very closely.

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Originally Posted By: GMdawg
Quote:
And I am not just speaking about the poorest white folks. I am also speaking about winning over the white working-middle class. There are a ton of votes there.


How about one who worries about the middle class and couldn't give a rats ass what color, nationality, or race they are.


jfan liked that post, but it makes no sense in regards to what I was saying. I didn't say anything about whether the white middle working class putting undo emphasis on race and nationality.

I was speaking about Democrats to stop ignoring and even alienating that particular group of people. I was talking about trying to target them as a group who can help you win elections and get things changed.

No plan is full-proof and there are no easy answers, but working w/as many folks as possible for a greater good is not a bad thing and it has gotten things changed in the past.

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First I'll address the "business" portion of the article. Every business is far from the same. Let's face it, many businesses are hiring these illegals to save huge amounts of money on labor. It's in their best interest to keep the illegal immigrant source running smoothly. And let's face it, if it weren't for them hiring those people, the illegal immigration problem wouldn't be that much of a problem.

Other businesses however are either extremely wealthy or simply save more from tax cuts than they may lose in paying labor more. I mean if you own a high tech business or other business that uses zero illegal immigrants, your only upside is the tax cuts. So who business supports is far more about cutting regulations and their bottom line than it is about anything else. And as we all know, the businesses with the biggest wallets hold the most control.

As Clem mentioned, I was raised and taught the very thing you are speaking of here. How if the bottom half of wage earners and wealth holders could only stick together and vote as one, they could control this country. They could help the interests of all working class Americans and make this nation better for those who actually build it.

But that was at a time we only needed to concern ourselves with some of the people in the Republican party. I mean it wasn't the Democrats feeding money to the KKK and White Supremacists. It wasn't the Democrats using their buzz words and saying that there's "good people" on their side. It still isn't.

What has changed IMO is that the Democratic party for the most part seems to be helping them out these days. They are ignoring the very people and causes that brought them to prominence in the first place. They could take a lesson from history. And that history points out another point that Clem was making.

JFK and RFK were in large part responsible for civil rights. They actually worked with MLK to make civil rights a popular idea among white working class Americans. It wasn't until LBJ became president that it actually passed, and he had to work his ass off to get it passed, but without the power from white, Democratic politicians it may have taken decades longer to ever come to pass.

That's not an attempt to take credit away from all of the black leaders and black Americans who paid a horrible price in the fight for equality. It's to point out how people like Kennedy could get the message out to both working Americans and the black community. A politician who could walk and chew gum at the same time. A president who could further the progress of the working people and minorities.

And yes, once it was seen that both JFK and RFK as well as MLK could work together to help all of working class people and minorities, once it was proven they could make those with less hold more power than those who had more, they were all assassinated. This just goes to show how far those who hold the power will go to keep it.

If and when the Democratic party can learn to walk and chew gum at the same time like JFK did, they can once more actually effect change that can help almost everyone. As of now the Democrats can't seem to figure out they are helping Trump more than hurting him. While they don't use the vocal vitriol and a direct message of division, they alienate the very same voters that created their ascension in the first place. The message of us and them should be changed to us and include everyone in their message. For those that have to fight day in and day out to live, those who work their asses off to try to achieve the American dream, we have much more in common when the only real difference is the color of our skin.


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Quote:
What has changed IMO is that the Democratic party for the most part seems to be helping them out these days. They are ignoring the very people and causes that brought them to prominence in the first place. They could take a lesson from history. And that history points out another point that Clem was making.


Occupy Wallstreet looked at this very thing. They got written off as a bunch of cooky college kids or bums.

Quote:
JFK and RFK were in large part responsible for civil rights.


All of them, all of them, begrudgingly worked with Dr. King. If they truly would've liked him, Hoover wouldn't have a crazy long file on him. They allowed Hoover to do the ridiculous things he did towards the Civil Rights movement.

Quote:
They are ignoring the very people and causes that brought them to prominence in the first place. They could take a lesson from history. And that history points out another point that Clem was making.


They've played plenty of lip-service to social causes, but walked backwards on economic policy. You can thank Bill Clinton for this; it's called neoliberalism.

Quote:
but without the power from white


I'd argue more power came from Dr. King, Malcolm X, and many of the other unsung heroes. They were going to keep going, and the democrats did it to try and stop the social unrest. If the Dems truly cared, they would've gone further than they did. Many championed The Civil Rights Act of 1965 as the defeat of racism, and many still believe this today.

Quote:
The message of us and them should be changed to us and include everyone in their message


I mean the 99% was a wonderful rallying call, wasn't it?

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Yeah, MLK voted it into law. Get real man. MLK brought it the forefront. MLK paid the price in the streets. MLK paid the price with his life. But how many black lawmakers were involved in voting it into law?

It's okay man. You can admit that whites and blacks played a role in making things better for black Americans. You can admit that the Kennedy's helped make it more popular with white Americans.

You can admit that the type of things you said in your last post are exactly the type of responses that cause division and not help in working together. Sometimes people just refuse to learn from history.


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Originally Posted By: Versatile Dog
The other day, I was reading a thread and these cats were talking about Trump got elected because he hosted a TV game show or something like that. I never watched the show, but I disagreed and said that I doubted Trump being on a TV show was why he won the election.


I think I know these cats you spoke of! tongue

I'm reminded of Ice-T's heavy metal project Body Count and the song "No Lives Matter." Skin color is a convenient way to classify economic standing for those in power who wish to exploit poor people.


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Originally Posted By: PitDAWG
Yeah, MLK voted it into law. Get real man. MLK brought it the forefront. MLK paid the price in the streets. MLK paid the price with his life. But how many black lawmakers were involved in voting it into law?

It's okay man. You can admit that whites and blacks played a role in making things better for black Americans. You can admit that the Kennedy's helped make it more popular with white Americans.

You can admit that the type of things you said in your last post are exactly the type of responses that cause division and not help in working together. Sometimes people just refuse to learn from history.


Basically, pits message throughout these threads is people who look like me need to suck up to white people or continue to be second class citizens in this country.

Despite this country being built off the backs of my ancestors, pit is saying that we should still show gratitude to whites and still somehow prove that we’re worthy of being in alliance with whites.

Since we weren’t even ALLOWED to have black lawmakers in this first place, it still doesn’t change the fact that yet again, we have to suck the toes of whites people in order to gain equality.

Pit thinks some token white people who helped us meant that the majority of whites were on our side, despite segregation still being popular amongst the majority of whites when the equal rights bill was passed.

This is why I have little hope that anything will change as far as the mindset of white Americans. If us blacks and Latinos aren’t preaching the greatness of our white allies, nothing will change.

White people have the power to change laws all on their own with no help from minorities.

Minorities are forever at the mercy of white people in this country. So sing their praises or nothing will change for my people.

Awesome message pit. Thanks.


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

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I wondered if it would come off like that to you or any other minority. It's how it came off to me.

Pit, I don't think you truly mean "white people need to be the ones to make things better", but Swish is right in his critique. I got the same feel as he did.

White people need to stop trying to fix minority problems. We need to step out of the way.

This is why I love The Squad!

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whats crazy is that pit and i has had this convo before, and yet here he goes with it again.

the message a lot of guys think they're sending is not the message being received.

groveling to white moderates is not the solution to this whatsoever.

because thats essentially enforcing the notion that whites are superior.


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

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Because your butthurt angry black man toxic attitude is so much better and so much more productive?

Youre a part of the problem and not the solution.

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look in the mirror. atleast i dont vote against my own interest.

lol i mean who votes for a guy who wanted to take away your healthcare coverage, then start whining when they try to do exactly that?

you're one of the biggest hypocrites on this board. you're self righteous white woman attitude certainly is just as big of a problem as mine, if not more.

you voted to have your life potentially taken away. thats about as stupid a decision as one can get.


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

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Originally Posted By: Swish
look in the mirror. atleast i dont vote against my own interest.

lol i mean who votes for a guy who wanted to take away your healthcare coverage, then start whining when they try to do exactly that?

you're one of the biggest hypocrites on this board. you're self righteous white woman attitude certainly is just as big of a problem as mine, if not more.

you voted to have your life potentially taken away. thats about as stupid a decision as one can get.


I'm not part of any problem. My life is great, thanks for your concern.

Your attitude is so toxic that nobody can take you seriously other than self loathing white socialists. Thats all you got in your corner.

You wonder why people vote against liberals, its because of people like you.

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lol right. they voted against liberals because one some random dude on dawgtalkers?

nah, they voted for trump because of people like you: clueless and gullible.

i rather have the self loathing white socialist on my side than the klan and nazis, which you most certainly seem to be fine with.

lol, yea, would MUCH rather have the white guys in america who are on my side than alex jones, roy moore and david duke.

*weirdo pedo white guy starts following around eve in the mall*

eve: yea, thats the kind of people i want to vote for!


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

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Youre not understanding, the unhinged liberal lunacy is what makes people vote against you.

The toxic angry black man attitude combined with unhinged tds makes your credibility circle the bowl.

Nobody can take you seriously. Other than the self loathers.

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what was that? sorry, i dont understand the terminally ill. somebody translate the hospice language for me.


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

- Theodore Roosevelt
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Originally Posted By: Swish
what was that? sorry, i dont understand the terminally ill. somebody translate the hospice language for me.


Whatever youre on, I suggest you not buy that strain again.

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lol wow that was pathetically lame. go to bed.

Last edited by Swish; 07/21/19 05:07 PM.

“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

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No. I'm watching the AU Game. After that I have chores.

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any good? im too bust getting wrecked in call of duty by some 10 year olds.


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

- Theodore Roosevelt
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Its only good if youre a soccer fan. Because both teams are good, but neither has scored yet and its after halftime. So, the casual fan would be bored.

Its on ESPN if you need a break from COD and 10 year olds lol.

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This is such a jarring exchange to read.

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yea im bout to turn it on cause this kid just claimed he banged my mom and im legit upset. burns a lot more than any racist statement made to me in life.


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

- Theodore Roosevelt
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these are our normal exchanges.

trash talk followed by "yo whats up"


“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”

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Keep an eye on that kid around your wife lol.

I have to tell you, I hit metal debris in the road on Friday, and it trashed my tire and my wheel. I have donut now. I was pissed.

But I guess its a blessing in disguise because the dealership has to replace it all for free. And my wheel already had curb rash. So, I cant complain about getting a new one.

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Originally Posted By: RocketOptimist


White people need to stop trying to fix minority problems. We need to step out of the way.



Not just step out of the way...we need to let POC, women and LGBTQ+ communities speak AND we need to listen. White people (in particular, white cis men) have done the talking for far too long. It's now time to listen to others.

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Both of you speed demons should go drive in Lima, Peru.

Lanes and turn signals are just a suggestion not a requirement. Also, they love the horn down here.

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