You know, people keep parroting what makes these mass shootings happen. Yet they refuse to look at the facts which certainly disprove their claims. Let's look at "excuse #1.
It's a mental illness issue.
Is mental illness a contributing factor in "some" mass shootings? Yes, it is. But let's look at the facts of just how big of a factor it is.
Quote:
US and international to date research suggests that individuals with schizophrenia and bipolar disorder are responsible for approximately 10% of all homicides in the United States. For mass killings, the percentage is approximately 33% (see “Serious Mental Illness and Mass Homicide”). One study reported that homicide rates are higher in states with stricter commitment laws, thus making it more difficult to treat mentally ill individuals who are in need of treatment.
One study concluded that only about 22 percent of those who commit mass murders suffer from serious mental illnesses; the vast majority, or 78 percent, do not. A 2016 research study concluded that the large majority of people with mental disorders do not engage in violence against others, and that most violent behavior is due to factors other than mental illness. As one researcher stated: "If you focus on mental illness, all you get is a huge number of false positives."
Mental health professionals have an entirely separate system of assessing risk of violence, which has nothing to do with evaluating mental illness. If mental illness were a major cause of either individual or mass murders, then the nations of Western Europe should have the same murder rates we do. After all, their rates of mental illness are essentially the same as ours. But our individual murder rates are often 5 to 10 times higher than those in the European countries, and our rates of mass murder are astronomically higher.
You see, it takes a seriously mentally ill person to commit a mass shooting because of that illness. Now everyone can try to make excuses that even depression is a mental illness. The same could be said for anxiety. And while these things can be devastating, they are certainly not mental illnesses that can be Yet are those ailments a cause to commit mass murder?
No. Not by any legal standard. Trying to support the fact that a mental illness is directly responsible for the act of a violent crime is a very high bar to reach. And by far and away the verdict is in. In the vast majority of cases, mental illness is not the cause of mass shootings.
The term "hate crime" is there for a reason. If the "usual excuse" of mental illness were the main cause, it would be called a "mental illness crime".
It's time to admit that many of these mass shootings are centered around hate and not mental illness.
It's these awful video games! It's terrible parenting!
These I see all the time on social media. People refusing to admit that the division being perpetrated on our society to divide the races has little to nothing to do with these mass shootings but instead trying to find some boogeyman to explain it.
Let's look at murder in America.
In 1981 the murder rate was 6.6 per 100,000 people. By 2010 it had dropped to 3.6 per 100,000. The rate went up slightly in 2016 but dropped yet again in both 2017 and 2018. Now if parenting and video games were the root cause, the overall murder rate wouldn't be close to half of what it was almost four decades ago.
There are several sources that show no evidence has indicated that video games are in any way a part of this situation. This is imply a fallacy that has been perpetuated to absolve people from looking at actual causes and possible solutions.
Now before people start going off the deep end here, it would be wonderful to help solve the connection that actually exists between mass shootings and mental health. Any way you can find to decrease mass shootings is most certainly a wonderful thing to do.
But let's quit pretending that's the primary reason behind mass shootings, because it's not. Let's stop blaming video games and poor parenting because violent crime and murder has been greatly reduced since the 1980's.
Included in this is that we should not lump all mass shootings as something that can be blamed on white supremacy either. It, much like mental health is only responsible for a portion of mass shootings. But let's be very clear here, racially motivated hate crimes are an even greater problem than the mental health aspect.
Quote:
"Since October, the F.B.I. has made 90 arrests in domestic terrorism cases. Domestic terrorism includes violence by Americans who belong to anti-government militias, white supremacist groups or individuals who ascribe to similar ideologies not connected to Islamic extremism. In fact, the F.B.I. says that of its 850 pending domestic terror investigations, about 40 percent involve racially motivated extremism. In 2017 and 2018, the F.B.I. made more arrests connected to domestic terror than to international terrorism, which includes groups like Al Qaeda and the Islamic State and their lone-wolf recruits.
"Last weekend, a young man with a rifle took the lives of three people and injured at least a dozen others at the annual Gilroy Garlic Festival in California. Preliminary reports indicated that among the gunman’s social media postings was an exhortation to read the obscure 1890 novel 'Might Is Right,' which justifies racism and asserts that people of color are biologically inferior."
People need to stop pretending that when the leader of the free world is calling people "invaders" and "animals" it doesn't fuel the fire of the actions we are seeing. When that same leader replies to someone saying "Shoot them!" by saying, "You can only do that in the panhandle", that the things he says does and will embolden people with that type of belief system.
Let's look at one easy way to help curb this. And that would be to quit fanning the flames of those who may act on such comments. Whether they are mentally ill or not. Because on one hand people claim these people are not mentally stable. While on the other hand claiming you can say things to incite such people and it has no impact. That is what a lot of people consider fuzzy math.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
It's time to admit that many of these mass shootings are centered around hate and not mental illness.
People need to stop pretending that when the leader of the free world is calling people "invaders" and "animals" it doesn't fuel the fire of the actions we are seeing. When that same leader replies to someone saying "Shoot them!" by saying, "You can only do that in the panhandle", that the things he says does and will embolden people with that type of belief system.
You fail to mention the hate surrounding those who have called that very same leader of the free world a traitor, Hitler, Putin's stooge and more.
You fail to mention the hate surrounding those who have called the leader of the free world's followers, those who voted for him, Deplorables, Idiots, Nazi's, KKK and more.
You failed to mention the hate involved in Main Stream Media reporting 97+ percent negative news on our President while completely ignoring the good things accomplished.
You failed to mention the hate surrounding the pushing of false conspiracy accusations against our President. The accusations of Racism against him and his supporters who point out anything negative about conditions in a minority run district.
You also failed to mention the assault of words perpetrated on our Christian communities for standing by their beliefs in the face of political correctness.
You fail to mention a lot that is not on your personal agenda.
40 just told the board what the typical MO is for white domestic terrorist.
Sorry but this looks like the crap Muslim extremist whine about, all you did was swap the religion and skin tone.
The American taliban. Absolutely has a home right here in America.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
It's time to admit that many of these mass shootings are centered around hate and not mental illness.
People need to stop pretending that when the leader of the free world is calling people "invaders" and "animals" it doesn't fuel the fire of the actions we are seeing. When that same leader replies to someone saying "Shoot them!" by saying, "You can only do that in the panhandle", that the things he says does and will embolden people with that type of belief system.
You fail to mention the hate surrounding those who have called that very same leader of the free world a traitor, Hitler, Putin's stooge and more.
You fail to mention the hate surrounding those who have called the leader of the free world's followers, those who voted for him, Deplorables, Idiots, Nazi's, KKK and more.
You failed to mention the hate involved in Main Stream Media reporting 97+ percent negative news on our President while completely ignoring the good things accomplished.
You failed to mention the hate surrounding the pushing of false conspiracy accusations against our President. The accusations of Racism against him and his supporters who point out anything negative about conditions in a minority run district.
You also failed to mention the assault of words perpetrated on our Christian communities for standing by their beliefs in the face of political correctness.
You fail to mention a lot that is not on your personal agenda.
Hate has no home here!
Ayyyyy, how many mass shootings in America have had ANY connection to ANY of those things you mentioned?
People call out this President because he has, over the first three years of his presidency, been the biggest proponent of hate, bigotry, and ignorance that I have seen in my lifetime, and has been hands down the most embarrassing leader of our country I've seen. Yes, a few things have been good under President Trump (the economy HAS been good regardless of whether or not it is just a continuation of President Obama--even though it looks like we are on a brink of a recession).
But did either of the mass shootings this weekend deal with President Trump being a racist or not 'demeaning' racist organizations like that [censored] that happened down in South Carolina? I mean, this guy has literally laughed off 'SEND THEM HOME THEY AREN'T AMERICAN' like comments from his crowds and, other than today, he has refused to renounce white supremacy organizations.
It's just mind baffling to me. Through college, even though I supported President Obama (who was pretty moderate if anyone actually looks at what he did), I was never really a solid D or R. I was honestly just looking for someone I could relate to and felt like I could trust.
President Donald Trump is the least likable, despicable, and almost certainly the worst person that has been in a position of power in our country in my lifetime.
Get real man. And I'm not even a huge dem...i just think President Trump is a hypocrite and an embarrassment to the USA.
Wise words spoken by sages From SkyTel to BlackBerry pagers
Don’t forget about the time trump said that the 2nd amendment people can stop Hillary.
And we all know he wasn’t talking about voting.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
EDIT: Original reply deleted because, as predicted, it's just going around and around in circles. Very few in this country want to discuss, debate or have dialogue...they just want to talk over each other.
President Donald Trump is the least likable, despicable, and almost certainly the worst person that has been in a position of power in our country in my lifetime.
Get real man. And I'm not even a huge dem...i just think President Trump is a hypocrite and an embarrassment to the USA.
I think that goes for a great many on here. Heck - former Republicans who question Trump get labelled Socialists and Haters ... Hell - a Pro Trump supporter wrote somewhere on these boards that the "Left" was happy about the market tanking and these mass shootings because it put Trump in a bad light .... no-one said or thought that, but a Trump supporter thought fit o write suggest it or state it as fact. Smh .... the truth and reality is that Trump is a giant stain on US history.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
40 just told the board what the typical MO is for white domestic terrorist.
Sorry but this looks like the crap Muslim extremist whine about, all you did was swap the religion and skin tone.
The American taliban. Absolutely has a home right here in America.
I've basically agreed with you on most of the points you make (I usually just read the board, and think that you are probably more left wing and more un-realistic than I am),but god damn---you are absolutely correct that most of the white ring nuts are essentially the same thing as the taliban and the 'have you seen the sharia law?' type people. It's unreal and seriously blows my mind that people like 40 don't see it. Maybe it's just me, but I honestly feel like there is a "right" way and a "wrong" way to exist as a human and I think most of society would agree with (aka--don't hate someone before you know what their disposition is or wha they truly stand for, expect the best of everyone (regardless of race, gender, or education)... ...I meant honestly, I feel like being and OK dude and expecting other people to be OK dudes would set so much of this country on the right path (as opposed to viewing any one else, especially people of color), to be dangerous or whatever (even though I KNOW that a lot of crimes in the areas these people are arrested are in predominately minority areas).
I just don't know. I'm a little drunk. But I have been able to get along with so many different types of people in my life because I basically treat every single person I have been around the same (unless I know before hand that that person was an abuser or anything of the type). The town i grew up in had 1 stop light, was 98% white families (the one black family in the town grew up across the street from me), and, despite how embarrassing it is to talk about, I was constantly told and lectured to about the difference between n*****s and "black people".
And I'm just going to say now--anyone who grew up in a town like mine is lying if they didn't experience this.
This entire thing is such a cultural thing and, while I think President Trump is doing OK with the economy, he has just perpetuated hate and discordance between groups of people. Blows my mind how people respect this guy.
Sorry. I may or may not have been drinking today.
Swish--I don't agree with you on some on your gun ban supportive stances, and I don't agree with you that
Wise words spoken by sages From SkyTel to BlackBerry pagers
I agree with the video game aspect. that's a bs argument and has no reliable source of information to prove that its true.
Quote:
It's time to admit that many of these mass shootings are centered around hate and not mental illness.
I think a lot of mass shootings are around "breaks" Lets look at most SCHOOL shootings (they do not account for all mass shootings - but a good portion). Typically, the shooters are people that have been bullied and ridiculed to the extent they have a break. They are not "mentally ill" per say, but you don't have to have a mental illness to suffer a break. It can happen to anyone. So I don't know if you stats take that into account or not, or those professionals are counting those as mentally ill or not, but I don't think they are.
I also think, after putting together a nice post, with links and stats, you then try to throw it on a person you hate. Which is all cool, but lets be serious. In 2015, it was dubbed "The year of mass shootings" was trump to blame for that? PBS - Year of Mass Shootings
I don't think any politician or anyone else is responsible other than the person that pulls the trigger or helps plan one.
Sorry...you have to come up with something better than that, especially since these mass shootings have been happening at alarming rates since before trump.
So what your saying is that the mass shooting in Dallas where police officers were ambushed were Obamas fault for drumming up rhetoric against the police? Nah, it wasn't.
There's sick people out there - some have breaks in reality (not a mental illness) that they snap. Some are just hateful people that are going to shoot up a church. Some are just gang members that are shooting up rival gang members. Some are bullied kids seeking retribution, some are mentally ill.
You seem to want to throw away all these different reasons and lay it at the feet of Trump, which is well......ridiculous.
While we agree to a point our opinions are quite a bit different. I'd say the difference between myself and many who would look at your views is that I certainly understand your viewpoint. I know why you see things that way and really won't argue against your point of view.
Maybe some of the difference is that I try to look at things the way they are and try and keep my expectations more in line with the situation we find ourselves in. We have as many guns in our nation as we have people. I feel it would be impossible to put that ship back in the bottle. I feel we would have an all out civil war if we tried to take those guns away from our citizens. We're at a point you simply can't undo all that's been done. As a citizen myself, I would fight to keep my guns as well.
But let's look at a few common sense things that we do have in common. First off, anyone who says that our forefathers could see into the future and comprehend that we would have semi automatic weapons with the capacity to fire thirty, fifty and even one hundred rounds without reloading is either fooling themselves or just flat out lying about that. There's no way they could have foreseen that.
So while I would have to carefully look over any legislation proposed, my mind is certainly open to the possibility of limiting that capacity. Yet once again, with 300,000,000 millions guns on the street and millions of these types of magazines currently in our nation, what good will that actually do over the next 50 years or so? So while I understand that the long game can be one way to look at it, in the short term I don't see it changing much if anything.
And yes, the arguments will continue, but they're getting harder and harder to make. Especially with things like national background checks. Some people are still fooled that the NRA is about representing gun owners. But as time goes on, it's becoming increasingly clear they work for the gun lobby.
Quote:
A Monmouth University poll released Thursday finds that 69 percent of NRA members support comprehensive background checks. Among gun owners not in the organization, 78 percent support requiring background checks for all firearm purchases.
But let's look at a few common sense things that we do have in common. First off, anyone who says that our forefathers could see into the future and comprehend that we would have semi automatic weapons with the capacity to fire thirty, fifty and even one hundred rounds without reloading is either fooling themselves or just flat out lying about that. There's no way they could have foreseen that.
I always chuckle about this. The 2nd amendment is not about rifles, or AR's, or handguns, or muskets, or magazines.
Its about restricting the governments ability to impose or take away.
There will always be someone fighting to take away the rights that are supposed to be protected by government. Government didn’t “give” these rights to Americans; they are only tasked to protect these rights.
No I most certainly do not blame Trump for all mass shootings. But even though some wish to deny it, you can't promote violence and feed into division and hate than claim your words have no impact. Especially when you are the leader of the free world.
Let me ask you, when one of his supporters yells "Shoot them!" in response to him talking about stopping illegals, and his response is "You can only do that in the panhandle", are you trying to say that has zero impact on someone thinking that killing immigrants is the answer? Are you seriously trying to say that when the president is sowing division among the races that it doesn't impact those who are on the fringe or may be slightly unstable?
The point I'm making is let's take what are very obvious steps to help prevent these shootings anywhere we can. And one of those ways is to stop sewing hate and division which certainly leads to them.
And you might want to take a look at what I'm actually talking about here. White supremacist violence is on the rise. I have posted statistics on the board proving it. There's a reason why that is happening. And if you don't think spreading the hate they thrive on is a part of it, I can't help you.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Why don't we discuss how the laws in Texas and Ohio are pretty easy when it comes to carrying a weapon yet no one shot back at the madmen during the attacks.
Why? Because both establishments were "No Gun Zones" which left the law abiding with their guns in their cars, their lives in the hands of the madmen.
No I most certainly do not blame Trump for all mass shootings. But even though some wish to deny it, you can't promote violence and feed into division and hate than claim your words have no impact. Especially when you are the leader of the free world.
Please show then when you had the same feelings before Trump was in office, because you never spoke of it.
I asked if you thought the Dallas mass shooting on police officers was Obama's fault, you still haven't answered.
What about the shooting at the republican softball game, was due to Maxine's comments about trump supporters? Was she to blame?
But let's look at a few common sense things that we do have in common. First off, anyone who says that our forefathers could see into the future and comprehend that we would have semi automatic weapons with the capacity to fire thirty, fifty and even one hundred rounds without reloading is either fooling themselves or just flat out lying about that. There's no way they could have foreseen that.
I always chuckle about this. The 2nd amendment is not about rifles, or AR's, or handguns, or muskets, or magazines.
Its about restricting the governments ability to impose or take away.
There will always be someone fighting to take away the rights that are supposed to be protected by government. Government didn’t “give” these rights to Americans; they are only tasked to protect these rights.
As long as you're willing to accept the consequences that's fine. The consequences is the blood at the mall, in the theater and when you take your family out to dinner. Next it may be at your child's school. The reality is, those that think they should have the right to have a 100 round magazine are few, and if those same people don't find some way to compromise, they're going to lose a lot more than they can imagine.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Why don't we discuss how the laws in Texas and Ohio are pretty easy when it comes to carrying a weapon yet no one shot back at the madmen during the attacks.
Why? Because both establishments were "No Gun Zones" which left the law abiding with their guns in their cars, their lives in the hands of the madmen.
I carry in Walmart all the time. I don't think its a no gun zone.
Why don't we discuss how the laws in Texas and Ohio are pretty easy when it comes to carrying a weapon yet no one shot back at the madmen during the attacks.
Why? Because both establishments were "No Gun Zones" which left the law abiding with their guns in their cars, their lives in the hands of the madmen.
I carry in Walmart all the time. I don't think its a no gun zone.
If they have the "No Gun Zone" sign on the doors, you are breaking the law.
I asked if you thought the Dallas mass shooting on police officers was Obama's fault, you still haven't answered.
What about the shooting at the republican softball game, was due to Maxine's comments about trump supporters? Was she to blame?
Ill hold the call and wait for your answer. . . .
That's a pretty easy one. So easy actually I thought you were joking.
Did Obama call for violence against his detractors like the videos I have shown of trump? Did he offer to pay his supporters legal bills if they would assault people?
Did Obama point out a geographic location where you could kill cops like Trump did when one of his supporters yelled "shoot them" by pointing out you can do that to immigrants in the panhandle?
I'll pose the same question about Maxine waters.
Somehow you seem confused about Trump actually promoting and even calling for violence.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Why don't we discuss how the laws in Texas and Ohio are pretty easy when it comes to carrying a weapon yet no one shot back at the madmen during the attacks.
Why? Because both establishments were "No Gun Zones" which left the law abiding with their guns in their cars, their lives in the hands of the madmen.
I carry in Walmart all the time. I don't think its a no gun zone.
If they have the "No Gun Zone" sign on the doors, you are breaking the law.
Walmarts policy is that legal permit holders can carry in their store, so regardless of what a manager post, customers are allowed to carry in that store.
Employees and vendors are not allowed as that is against walmarts policy.
I asked if you thought the Dallas mass shooting on police officers was Obama's fault, you still haven't answered.
What about the shooting at the republican softball game, was due to Maxine's comments about trump supporters? Was she to blame?
Ill hold the call and wait for your answer. . . .
That's a pretty easy one. So easy actually I thought you were joking.
Did Obama call for violence against his detractors like the videos I have shown of trump? Did he offer to pay his supporters legal bills if they would assault people?
Did Obama point out a geographic location where you could kill cops like Trump did when one of his supporters yelled "shoot them" by pointing out you can do that to immigrants in the panhandle?
I'll pose the same question about Maxine waters.
Somehow you seem confused about Trump actually promoting and even calling for violence.
I heard you pull that muscle from here with that stretchhhhhhhhh
Maxine absolutely called violence against trump supporters - and then members of congress were gunned down. I see you simply ignore that fact.
FYI, its not obamas fault, or maxines, its the shooters.
Don't you find it odd that in an open carry state, that not one good guy with a gun could stop a bad guy with a gun in a store where you're allowed to carry?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Why don't we discuss how the laws in Texas and Ohio are pretty easy when it comes to carrying a weapon yet no one shot back at the madmen during the attacks.
Why? Because both establishments were "No Gun Zones" which left the law abiding with their guns in their cars, their lives in the hands of the madmen.
I carry in Walmart all the time. I don't think its a no gun zone.
If they have the "No Gun Zone" sign on the doors, you are breaking the law.
Walmarts policy is that legal permit holders can carry in their store, so regardless of what a manager post, customers are allowed to carry in that store.
Employees and vendors are not allowed as that is against walmarts policy.
Some states allow private businesses to post a specific sign prohibiting concealed carry within their premises. The exact language and format of such a sign varies by state. By posting the signs, businesses create areas where it is illegal to carry a concealed handgun; similar to regulations concerning schools, hospitals, and public gatherings.
Violation of such a sign, in some of these states, is grounds for revocation of the offender's concealed carry permit and criminal prosecution. Other states, such as Virginia, enforce only trespassing laws when a person violates a "Gun Free Zone" sign. In some jurisdictions trespass by a person carrying a firearm may have more severe penalties than "simple" trespass, while in other jurisdictions, penalties are lower than for trespass.[91]
There is considerable dispute over the effectiveness of such "gun-free zones". Opponents of such measures, such as OpenCarry.org, state that, much like other malum prohibitum laws banning gun-related practices, only law-abiding individuals will heed the signage and disarm. Individuals or groups intent on committing far more serious crimes, such as armed robbery or murder, will not be deterred by signage prohibiting weapons. Further, the reasoning follows that those wishing to commit mass murder might intentionally choose gun-free venues like shopping malls, schools and churches (where weapons carry is generally prohibited by statute or signage) because the population inside is disarmed and thus less able to stop them.
Why don't we discuss how the laws in Texas and Ohio are pretty easy when it comes to carrying a weapon yet no one shot back at the madmen during the attacks.
Why? Because both establishments were "No Gun Zones" which left the law abiding with their guns in their cars, their lives in the hands of the madmen.
I carry in Walmart all the time. I don't think its a no gun zone.
If they have the "No Gun Zone" sign on the doors, you are breaking the law.
Walmarts policy is that legal permit holders can carry in their store, so regardless of what a manager post, customers are allowed to carry in that store.
Employees and vendors are not allowed as that is against walmarts policy.
Some states allow private businesses to post a specific sign prohibiting concealed carry within their premises. The exact language and format of such a sign varies by state. By posting the signs, businesses create areas where it is illegal to carry a concealed handgun; similar to regulations concerning schools, hospitals, and public gatherings.
Violation of such a sign, in some of these states, is grounds for revocation of the offender's concealed carry permit and criminal prosecution. Other states, such as Virginia, enforce only trespassing laws when a person violates a "Gun Free Zone" sign. In some jurisdictions trespass by a person carrying a firearm may have more severe penalties than "simple" trespass, while in other jurisdictions, penalties are lower than for trespass.[91]
There is considerable dispute over the effectiveness of such "gun-free zones". Opponents of such measures, such as OpenCarry.org, state that, much like other malum prohibitum laws banning gun-related practices, only law-abiding individuals will heed the signage and disarm. Individuals or groups intent on committing far more serious crimes, such as armed robbery or murder, will not be deterred by signage prohibiting weapons. Further, the reasoning follows that those wishing to commit mass murder might intentionally choose gun-free venues like shopping malls, schools and churches (where weapons carry is generally prohibited by statute or signage) because the population inside is disarmed and thus less able to stop them.
Yes, they can. Walmarts policy is to allow its customers to carry, in all their stores. a local manager cannot change walmarts policy to the company, as they do not own that private business.
Don't you find it odd that in an open carry state, that not one good guy with a gun could stop a bad guy with a gun in a store where you're allowed to carry?
Not at all. I don't know the context of the shooting, who was carrying around the shooter, if they had a line of sight or not to the shooter, or what type of weapon they had compared to the shooter on them.
Context is key. Isnt it odd, that your point is that "people that carry cant stop mass shootings" yet they have been stopped before by people with guns - multiple times. Carry on with the agenda.
Why don't we discuss how the laws in Texas and Ohio are pretty easy when it comes to carrying a weapon yet no one shot back at the madmen during the attacks.
Why? Because both establishments were "No Gun Zones" which left the law abiding with their guns in their cars, their lives in the hands of the madmen.
I carry in Walmart all the time. I don't think its a no gun zone.
If they have the "No Gun Zone" sign on the doors, you are breaking the law.
Walmarts policy is that legal permit holders can carry in their store, so regardless of what a manager post, customers are allowed to carry in that store.
Employees and vendors are not allowed as that is against walmarts policy.
Some states allow private businesses to post a specific sign prohibiting concealed carry within their premises. The exact language and format of such a sign varies by state. By posting the signs, businesses create areas where it is illegal to carry a concealed handgun; similar to regulations concerning schools, hospitals, and public gatherings.
Violation of such a sign, in some of these states, is grounds for revocation of the offender's concealed carry permit and criminal prosecution. Other states, such as Virginia, enforce only trespassing laws when a person violates a "Gun Free Zone" sign. In some jurisdictions trespass by a person carrying a firearm may have more severe penalties than "simple" trespass, while in other jurisdictions, penalties are lower than for trespass.[91]
There is considerable dispute over the effectiveness of such "gun-free zones". Opponents of such measures, such as OpenCarry.org, state that, much like other malum prohibitum laws banning gun-related practices, only law-abiding individuals will heed the signage and disarm. Individuals or groups intent on committing far more serious crimes, such as armed robbery or murder, will not be deterred by signage prohibiting weapons. Further, the reasoning follows that those wishing to commit mass murder might intentionally choose gun-free venues like shopping malls, schools and churches (where weapons carry is generally prohibited by statute or signage) because the population inside is disarmed and thus less able to stop them.
Yes, they can. Walmarts policy is to allow its customers to carry, in all their stores. a local manager cannot change walmarts policy to the company, as they do not own that private business.
I have been looking into it online and you are correct with Walmarts. This is good to know.
However, a friend of mine was escorted out of our Walmart for open carry, he was simply asked to leave the gun in the car for safeties sake.
A walmart near me tried to post no guns awhile back, and I remember seeing a local article about how they could not do that, as Walmarts policy was ok to carry. Now, walmart can change that policy and put up signs and you would not be able too. But they have to decide that as a corporation as a whole.
It's not really an agenda and you pretty much made the point that I was trying to make. Let me tell you an actual agenda. That's the agenda that keeps repeating that, "A good guy with a gun will stop a bad guy with a gun".
While it can and does happen, you pointed out the variables they refuse to talk about when they say that. I think it's far better to have "good guys with guns" around in the cases it can be prevented. But as you pointed out so well, often that's certainly not the case.
You seemed to miss the entire part where I said I was a gun owner and would fight before giving up my guns. Like you said, it's all about context.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
I think another facet of the problem is that as a society we can be pretty lousy about dealing with emotions. The idea that men should be tough and not show emotions is still pretty prevalent. Holding in/burying emotions can lead to emotional explosions.
Maybe we need to start holding more emotional education courses. Healthy ways to deal with feelings, etc.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I actually though of that aspect. But it kind of flies in the face of some facts.
The murder rate and violent crime rate has dropped significantly since the 1980's. So from an overall perspective we are on the right course.
I still think you have a point but it seems from that statistic the issue is getting better, not worse.
I know it was certainly that way when I was growing up. That and the "walk it off" thing. Hell, my thumb was broken in seven places and it was over week before I even asked to get an x ray.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/fkjZc8B/Bull-Dawg-Sig-smaller.jpg)