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I know the other thread ran over and was closed but one thing that we really havent talked about is could Phil bring in a competent head coach like Cowher or Marty. Remember Phil did the hiring with much of Romeo's staff. His comments about what players would start and when they wouldnt play couldnt sit well with an established coach. Also that final say over the roster would be something you would also have to get around.
So my question is. If Romeo does bit the bullet this year, will Phil have to before we could get an experienced coach in here or do we have to settle for a first time that is just happy to take the job?
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Who the heck knows...
But I'm guessing that if we dump RAC after this year, then you can count on an extended version of the rebuilding plan.. Cause you will most likely see wholesale changes in staff and players AGAIN,,
SO I for one, am hopeing we don't have to find out.
Besides, we lost ONE GAME and already, I'm getting sick of all the "what if" questions....
#GMSTRONG
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"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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If Romeo goes, the only "big name" cuts I could see would be Washington and McGinest.
If Savage goes, perhaps Baxter too.
Otherwise, I don't see us going through another tear down and rebuild phase. Just keep building on the core. New coach doesn't always mean wholesale changes...see Dallas and San Diego, although they're both established teams.
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Quote:
New coach doesn't always mean wholesale changes...see Dallas and San Diego, although they're both established teams.
In Romeos words ,...I think the new guy will have "a leg up" 
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1st String
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Quote:
If Romeo goes, the only "big name" cuts I could see would be Washington and McGinest.
If Savage goes, perhaps Baxter too.
Otherwise, I don't see us going through another tear down and rebuild phase. Just keep building on the core. Quote:
New coach doesn't always mean wholesale changes...see Dallas and San Diego, although they're both established teams.
If you recall, San Diego was the laughing stock of the league just a handful of years ago. Marty ball got em to 14-2
I would love to have Marty back in Ohio
And you're right... we don't need wholesale changes... We've got the talent...
Now we need someone that knows what to do with it.
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Poser
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You do realize that in Dallas, the owner hired the assistants and had to find a coach that would accept that, right? You do realize that San Diego lost most of their assistants BEFORE Marty was let go, right? 
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Chud, if indeed a Savage hire would be the heir apparent. Grantham a possibility for continuity sake. There is no way Savage would scrap the investment into players of the 3-4 defense and the personnel he has acquired from FA and the draft. Hiring a guy from outside the organization regardless of experience would have to buy off on what is currently in place.
My guess is it would Chud.
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If Phil stays, he will bring in someone who is willing to work under his plan....and that is him having roster control.
That was the reason I said Romeo needs to go soon...to see if Savages players respond to a different coach....if not...the answer is pretty clear the Savage plan isn't exactly the model we need to follow.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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Could be Peen. I haven't sailed into these treacherous waters yet, but here's my $.02. I honestly hope we don't have to go through another coaching change, but one thing stands to reason: Head coaches are evaluated by wins and losses. In the end, it doesn't matter if some fans think Romeo's too vanilla, or others think he's in over his head. It's all about W's. I those have been sorely lacking. Did Romeo start with a bare cupboard and a fanbase starving for a winner...yes. Does he deserve more time...maybe. I think he would've gotten that time if it looked like progress was being made. But that opener against Pitt revoked any further grace period. Sort of an MBNA universal default clause on the coaches contract.  It made the organization and the FO look lost and a mess. But frankly, I don't care how things look or what other teams or fans or the media think. I just want the W's. Some this year and more next year. If putting in Grantham as interim HC at the bye week, and searching for a new HC for next year will do that, then so be it.
Brown's fan since 2004...the tradition continues. ![[Linked Image from i21.photobucket.com]](http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b272/presto247365/IMG_2561-1-1.jpg)
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What makes me most nervous about the future is how our leaders seem to have sold it for a prospect. While I have no choice as a fan to support the decisions made by the coaching staff and FO thus far this year, I am in complete disagreement. The whole point of putting this coaching staff and front office staff together was the three year plan. First year was decent at 6-10. Second year was chalked up pretty much due to the injury bug. But, as much as I hate to say this, I fear that this year will be remembered for sheer stupidity. Why? It started off well with the signing of Jamal Lewis and drafting of Joe Thomas. But why oh why do we sell the future if we are not going to try and win now. I know that people are ecstatic about the drafting of BQ but we gave up entirely too much to get him. If he were game ready and we could plug him in and win some games right away then I'd say we're alright. But all signs point to him being a few weeks away from seeing real game action. What scares me more is Phil was instrumental in making a similar decision to draft Kyle Boller when he was in Baltimore. After drafting Boller, the Ravens went from playoff team to 9-7 in 04 and 6-10 in 05. And what they were lacking was offensive production, which they couldn't fix because they gave up TOO much to get Boller.
Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice yada yada yada right? Well, with Phil not learning from past mistakes and RAC seemingly unable to make a decision on ANYTHING (1 or 2 ply paper? I think I'll flip a coin) then I think we all know where the future lies. The only way it will be different is if we win now. Then it'll cancel out the Dallas pick, and we'll actually feel good as a franchise. Unfortunately, history most often repeats itself and Phil's actions remind me all too much of the Boller fiasco.
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We need to keep this current regime in place for at least another year.
I wish to wash my Irish wristwatch......
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Excuse me while I vomit ! 
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I agree, Crennel and his staff need to be given until at least January of 2008! 
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"...Crennel and his staff need to be given until at least January of 2008!"
BS....Wanna tell us again what RAC's strong points are? please convince me.
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, .
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Legend
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Quote:
I know the other thread ran over and was closed but one thing that we really havent talked about is could Phil bring in a competent head coach like Cowher or Marty. Remember Phil did the hiring with much of Romeo's staff. His comments about what players would start and when they wouldnt play couldnt sit well with an established coach. Also that final say over the roster would be something you would also have to get around.
Well,you must remember,RAC was not a hire Phil made. He "inherrited" RAC. And I think likewise,when Phil came here,he decided to build the team "Phil wanted". I'd bet it was Phil's call to hire Chud. You see,IMO,Phil has understood for a while now,that so goes Frye,so goes RAC. If Savage had faith in RAC from the beginning,why was Phil so intrucive in hiring RAC's staff? From the looks of it,Phil hasn't really trusted RAC's abilities from day 1. Or else he would have trusted RAC to hire his own staff. Don't you think?
So IMO,Phil has "set things up" in a manner to bring a guy like Marty in. Does Phil feel he would need to get so involved and question every move with a head coach he could truely trust at the healm? I don't think so. He just had to build an environment that would have the right personnel and talent to attract a guy like Marty in the first place. I feel he's accomplished that.
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So my question is. If Romeo does bit the bullet this year, will Phil have to before we could get an experienced coach in here or do we have to settle for a first time that is just happy to take the job?
I think the stage is pretty well set for Marty. Maybe not for Cowher. These "experienced coaches" can see the talent that Phil has brought in. They can see the potential is here for success. It's not as "challenging" as many posters would like to make it "sound" just because RAC is unable to make the most out of the talent that's here IMO
Chud worked with Marty in San Diego and has a similar system already being instaled to Martys. So there would be little to no change necassary on that side of the ball.
They key players and ingrediants are there on O for the most part. Great OL talent,talented rookie QB,KW2. And let's face it,how many veterans would LOVE to come here and play for Marty verses RAC? So it may also increase our probability of acquiring a veteran WR during the off season.
The D? Well,other than a little DL help and possibly one more veteran CB (depending on how this year goes) we have a great LB core and Marty also likes the 3/4 that we run.
I see it as a very possible scenario. And with Chud already here,I think Marty might see it as the "best fit" for him to come here. Time will tell,but it almost looks as if this would be the perfect scenario for everyone concerned. Us included.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I see us winnowing-- grain from chaff. If Romeo has something to show, it better happen sooner. I suspect, JMO, that a plan is in place for his stay or exit. Suspect it may be something like BQ +2 or 3. Once Quinn goes in, he will have tangible quality wins or close ones or be done. I don't think it is a matter of another losing season of heinous pigskin without bringing in a known. Savage may stay, but the body count, especially among the aged and infirm could be horrific as listed earlier. May the Elf be with us! 
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
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I see it as a very possible scenario. And with Chud already here,I think Marty might see it as the "best fit" for him to come here. Time will tell,but it almost looks as if this would be the perfect scenario for everyone concerned. Us included.
WTF would u want a HC that can light it up in the regular season yet be 5-13 when it counts???
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Go Browns!!!
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Quote:
I see it as a very possible scenario. And with Chud already here,I think Marty might see it as the "best fit" for him to come here. Time will tell,but it almost looks as if this would be the perfect scenario for everyone concerned. Us included.
WTF would u want a HC that can light it up in the regular season yet be 5-13 when it counts???
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Agreed. We need to forget about the past and look to the future of this organization.
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WTF would u want a HC that can light it up in the regular season yet be 5-13 when it counts???
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
ummmm... I would take that chance ANY DAY!!!
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i agree. i think that we have a perfect scenario for marty to come back here. will it happen probably not, but i do see the possibilty
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Quote:
Quote:
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I see it as a very possible scenario. And with Chud already here,I think Marty might see it as the "best fit" for him to come here. Time will tell,but it almost looks as if this would be the perfect scenario for everyone concerned. Us included.
WTF would u want a HC that can light it up in the regular season yet be 5-13 when it counts???
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Agreed. We need to forget about the past and look to the future of this organization.
but, he could continue to prepare the team to win again, then find the guy to take it all the way to the superbowl ???
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Well,you must remember,RAC was not a hire Phil made. He "inherrited" RAC.
Are you saying that because Phil didn't actually interview RAC,,, that John Collins and Randy Lerner did,,,
True enough, but I have to believe that if Phil had a problem with RAC, he would have voiced it and maybe killed the deal.,,.,
Are you sure that Phil didn't get to talk with RAC...I thought there was a window of opportunity after Phil got hired..
Besides that, it may not be within rules, but you can't tell me that at least a Phone call couldn't have taken place
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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I'm saying RAC was NOT Phils first choice. And that two businessmen with little to no football experience made the hire. Not the best way to select a head coach huh?
And it looks as if Phil has had to force RAC's hand more than once. (See the Mo situation) And that Phil has hired much of the staff,not Romeo.
And I'd say if Phil truely trusted RAC's judgement and respected his judgement,Phil would have had no need to interfere in these things.
That's what I'm saying. That more and more it appears that Phil lacks confidence in RAC's judgement and abilities.
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I'm sure Phil's first choice was not available... Romeo was one of the best qualified for the job.
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and one must wonder, if in this "rumor mill" situation (pun intended) if rac wasn't the first choice, who, then was? ferentz, saban, or others (someone from phil's early days)...if only to be a fly on the wall behind closed doors
guess we'll find out more after this season unfolds
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Quote:
If Romeo does bit the bullet this year, will Phil have to before we could get an experienced coach in here or do we have to settle for a first time that is just happy to take the job?
Remember when players came to Cleveland because Crennel was the new coach? same with Savage as GM...McGinest, Bentley, several others. What will they think now?
I have wanted Marty since he has a way of inspiring a team and relates well to the fans but will he say yes? How far away are we and how long will we give the next coach? I say if we get a decent RB and WR along with a DT we should be much better but that will be three drafts...we gave away our number one. Will we allow a coach to have 6-8 wins for three more years?
I would like to see a winning team first Crennel can't do that and he is suposed to know something. I think this team needs a shot of confidence and some unity. Are we really a team? Tomlin seemed to make his debut smoothly and take a new team to an opening win. When was the last time we had an opening win? Lewis improved the Bengals with no more talent he just got a real QB.
Leaders inspire greatness and create hope. Crennel just looks on from the sidelines.
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and one must wonder, if in this "rumor mill" situation (pun intended) if rac wasn't the first choice, who, then was? ferentz, saban, or others (someone from phil's early days)...if only to be a fly on the wall behind closed doors
guess we'll find out more after this season unfolds
It was probably an Oklahoma coach... 
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I'm saying RAC was NOT Phils first choice. And that two businessmen with little to no football experience made the hire. Not the best way to select a head coach huh?
I don't know that Phil wasn't talked to about RAC,,neither do you, but I guess I believe that Kirk Ferentz was probably his first choice...........I would think that Nolan or Lewis would be more his type of guy had they not already been coaching...
Again, I can't prove it,, and I'm certainly not sure it happened, but given they way these guys work,,,I would NOT be surprised to hear that a phone call between RAC and Phil took place.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Phil - Fine he isn't going anywhere next year and thats a good thing, GM is the main position where continuity is key, and so far Phil is staying right on his gameplan, this is a key to rebuilding, he's bringing in NFL caliber talent, can't do it all at once folks, and he is staying in good cap shape. Remember when he got here the whole team was in beyond bad shape, and since he's made strides I don't see Mr. Lerner giving him the axe Just yet.
Crennel - he made a tough situation worse, with his handling of Frye and Anderson, plus he doesn't seem to have "it", his demeanor, gameplanning just haven't progressed since he's been here and just isn't getting it done.
What do we bring in? Whoever listens to what Phil wants. Name don't matter to me, wins do.
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