DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Worldwide Climate Change Strike

No earlier in this thread I said I WAS AGAINST US SENDING TROOPS to die over oil. Since then you have wanted to make everything about your opinion. You have tried your best to make everything fit into your opinion. Even when your opinion is wrong. Open your mind and look at the total truth bro.

can you atleast agree we need a global campaign to clean up all the trash and plastics around the world?

I can.

You might be too young to remember but when I was a kid, we would go on vacation or a road trip somewhere and the roads would be littered with crap. Fast food bags, old tires, all kinds of garbage people had just tossed along the side of the road.. it was on the back roads and the major roads and the interstates..

We largely fixed that problem with 3 steps.

1. Public campaign to create awareness and to basically shame people to stop trashing their state.
2. We create much more hefty fines for littering and we enforced them.
3. Programs like "adopt a highway" to mobilize citizens to go out and show some civic pride and clean up the few things that did end up on the side of the road

No idea how you apply that on a global scale to something as popular as plastic.. but as we wean ourselves off of plastic, the least we can do is not let the plastic we do use end up in the ocean.

I did. I won't say I was being altruistic about it, but earning $50 a week for me and my brother to split was pretty sweet when I was 14.

Ignore him.

100 percent yes I can.

Around here we fix the road trash problem by putting the local inmates on trash duty. They get out of their cell and get some exercise,and our roads get cleaned. Good solution for all.

But I have more fun poking him.

And what if I want to keep going? NON STOP to LA? You can't do that with an electric car. Takes too long, just saying.

I just don't see the benefit to ever getting an electric car. No offense to those that do, I just don't get it.

My wife is wanting to purchase a Tesla. I was against it, but I was asked to research the car and compare it w/other models. I love researching and even my kids ask me to research products for them. I find it very interesting to garner as much information as possible.

Anyway, somewhat to my dismay........the Tesla sounds like a great car. Their quick. They handle well. They require far less maintenance. They should last longer. Etc.

you cant do anything non stop.

A stop at gas station to fill up. ~7 minutes

For an EV car batter recharge? 30 minutes to 12 hours. If you can even find an EV recharging station.

EV is not a practical solution for anything beyond local driving right now.

We have that around here as well.

When my daughter was younger, we'd take the golf cart and pick up our road twice a year. She loved it - til she got older.

We also have many churches and businesses that 'sponsor' a 2-3 mile stretch of local roads - picking up trash at least twice a year. The last time I/we did our church's 2 mile stretch, I ended up with 6 ticks on me. None of the other 3 got any.

again, its developing tech.

TB is acting like because its not perfect NOW, then we should not invest into it.

im sure people like him also made the same claim about cars when they first came out. yall basically out here making the same argument the horse and buggy industry did.

Too late.

Stop.

The US average stop time on a road trip is 45 min every 4 hours.

Ok bro. Will do. Won’t change the fact.

Go on a road trip with me.

We stop when we need gas, and when we get gas, we get food. Wash, rinse, and repeat.

10 minutes for gas. 10 minutes for food, as when we are traveling, we eat in the vehicle.

We easily drive 6-7 hours without a stop.

Screw that noise.

Ever notice how people speak about having multiple vehicles yet claim they need every vehicle they have to be able to go across the country non stop as some excuse why electric vehicles won't work?

It's laughable. Most people have a vehicle they use locally for work and errands. An electric vehicle would be the perfect solution for that. But they would rather come up with the most far fetched reasons why it could never work.

I'm rather surprised you won't actually answer my questions but would rather resort to this. Let me try this again.....

How many more soldiers have to die over oil until you think the cost is too high?

Now you don't need to go off on some tangent how most of our oil doesn't come from the middle east. We just sent 200 troops and missiles to protect Saudi oil fields.

So will you answer the questions rather than try to make this about me?

You said you were waiting for the price of alternative energy sources to come down. So I asked if you considered the cost of war in the middle east as a part of the cost of oil? I asked if the death of our troops was a part of the cost of oil?

I asked you how much cheaper do you think alternative energy has to be to offset the cost of war and the death of out troops?

Yeah, I guess I can see why you would rather avoid answering the questions and try to derail our conversation at this point. I never expected you to play the politician and cop out on the discussion like this though.

But then you never know how someone will react when they're cornered.

serious question...Whats your opinion on natural gas cause I think its a better alternate to oil, because its cleaner, cheaper and safer to use ,and the conversion to it seems to be a lot easier than anything else and by the way its very abundant espiacally in the U.S.

exactly. people acting like they wont make it from home to their local walmart in an electric car. makes no sense.

im all for natural gas until the other green tech becomes more sustainable.

im all for that pipeline. im not for a pipeline going through religious/cultural land and/or burial grounds, regardless of if its christian, native american, or whatever it is we describe it as.

spend more money to make the pipeline go around it. not that difficult.

Good points and I agree with you but this may not be the end all be all for the environmental problems we are facing but it just may be a good start.

I think it too has its draw backs but I certainly agree it's a far cleaner fuel source than coal or oil. It has become so abundant that it has become cheaper than coal and that's the driving force why coal prices have dropped. New energy plants are by and large now natural gas and yes, it's a far better road to travel.

I'm a huge proponent of green energy because it's a never ending source of energy that we have been blessed with but thus far have not tapped into. No drilling or pipelines required. But I'm not naive enough to believe that will happen overnight. As such natural gas is a far better alternative to what we have been using in the past and certainly a step in the right direction.

Thanks its really cool that we can agree on some things that would benefit all of us, its called progress ,now the real trick is to get the people in Washington and I mean BOTH parties to get this stuff done and that would be real progress IMO

I've always been one who believes that progress is a slow thing. Change takes time. So if we could just start with the things we agree on and work from there, progress begins.

It’s not renewable. Eventually you’ll run out. But not until we fracked the crap out of our bed rock and poisoned our aquifers.

the market has made its decision. let the market decide, remember? thoughts and prayers

U.S. Coal Giant That Pressed for Trump Bailout Faces Default

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/u-coal-giant-pressed-trump-225307053.html

(Bloomberg) -- Murray Energy Corp., the U.S. coal giant that had pressed the Trump administration for help averting bankruptcy, may be headed toward default.

The largest closely held coal miner in America failed to make multiple payments to lenders this week, the company said in a statement on Wednesday. Creditors have agreed not to take legal action until Oct. 14, buying Murray some time to figure out how to shore up its balance sheet, the St. Clairsville, Ohio-based company said.

Murray Energy is struggling to stay afloat, along with the rest of America’s coal miners, as cheap natural gas and renewable energy resources cut into coal’s share of the U.S. power market. At least four miners including Cloud Peak Energy Inc. and Blackjewel LLC have gone bankrupt this year, laying bare the decline of a fuel that once accounted for more than half of all U.S. power generation. Today it’s less than 25%.

Prices for thermal coal -- the kind burned by power plants -- have slumped, which may have left Murray short on cash, said Lucas Pipes, a coal analyst with B Riley FBR Inc. “You can’t make payments out of thin air if the money isn’t in the bank,” he said.

Murray’s potential default comes more than a year after the Trump administration’s efforts to subsidize struggling nuclear and coal-fired power plants -- particularly ones that Murray supplies -- failed, shot down by President Donald Trump’s own appointed energy regulators. Murray Chief Executive Officer Bob Murray, an early Trump supporter and a big donor to his campaign, was instrumental in setting his energy agenda and has hosted multiple fundraisers for him.

The White House didn’t immediately respond to a request for comment. The administration considered a proposal that would’ve had the Energy Department using its emergency authority to order grid operators to buy power from coal-fired plants. But U.S. Energy Secretary Rick Perry said in June that there had been no movement on the plan.

The company’s 2024 notes with about $500 million outstanding traded at 1 cent on the dollar last month, down from above 60 cents late last year, according to Trace price data.

On Tuesday, U.S. coal miner Foresight Energy LP failed to make its own interest payment, invoking a 30-day grace period to evaluate options. The shares slid 26% on the news to a record low. Murray and Foresight are inextricably linked: Murray bought a controlling stake in the St. Louis, Missouri-based company that hasn’t posted an annual profit since 2014.

While America’s biggest publicly traded coal miners, including Peabody Energy Corp., filed for bankrupty in recent years, Murray chose to avoid that route. It has left the company at a potential disadvantage as it wrestles with how to manage its debt as opposed to investing money in its business, according to credit raters.

Secular Decline

Murray’s forbearance agreements are with lenders holding more than 50% of Murray’s loans under a credit and guaranty agreement and those holding more than half of loans under ABL and FILO credit facilities, according to the company’s statement.

Murray’s efforts to improve its liquidity will prove challenging as it runs up against a heavy debt load and an industry in secular decline, according to Moody’s Investors Service. U.S. power plants are turning away from coal and toward cleaner and cheaper alternatives and export markets are also under pressure, Moody’s said.

The company has tried to ease the strain before through deals with creditors, including a 2018 debt swap that gave holders 74 cents on the dollar and extended the due date by a year on some term loans. Moody’s labeled that agreement a default.

(Michael R. Bloomberg, the founder and majority stakeholder of Bloomberg LP, the parent company of Bloomberg News, has committed $500 million to launch Beyond Carbon, a campaign aimed at closing the remaining coal-powered plants in the U.S. by 2030 and slowing the construction of new gas plants.)

Lol .. facts and the truth are ignored by the deniers when it comes to the environment around here bro.

"How Dairy You"


News October 01, 2019

Farmers — tired of being blamed for climate change — drive tractor convoy to The Hague, causing record-breaking rush hour in the Netherlands

A plow on the front of one tractor was spray-painted with the words, 'How dairy you'

Breck Dumas



Reuters reported that the agriculture activists caused "the worst morning commute in Dutch history."
What are the details?

In the midst of the country's efforts to curb carbon emissions to meet the government's goals, members of the ruling party have floated a mandate for reducing the number of livestock farmers are allowed to raise — even suggesting cutting herds by 50 percent. Producers aren't having it.

Fences and other barriers were toppled as the protestors made their way to their destination. While the vast majority of the caravan's participants were peaceful — only three were arrested — the congregation took its time to be sure their presence was known by city-slickers. NPR reported that "more than 700 miles of traffic jams [were recorded] at the peak of rush hour, mostly due to the protest."

"Suddenly, everyone is worried. We're getting blamed and badly represented in the media, everyone is blaming us for climate change but planes are worse than farmers and no-one is talking about them," a dairy farmer named Vincent told the BBC.

A plow on the front of one tractor read, "How dairy you."


Ten thousand farmers were expected to gather in protest at The Hague, NPR further reported, "to argue they are unfairly being blamed after a court ruling found the country is violating European emission rules." Liberal politicians in the country are blaming livestock producers for pushing emissions over the edge.
How did it work out?

During the rally at the center of The Hague, Agriculture Minister Carola Schouten promised, "As long as I am minister, there will be no halving of the herd. Dutch farming is developing and you do it differently than your parents. Your children will do things differently again. That is the strength of our agriculture."

Law enforcement offered a statement saying, "The police respect that farmers are standing up for their interest and we're trying to facilitate this demonstration with hundreds of tractors as well as possible.

Amusing photo's at the link:

https://www.theblaze.com/news/farmers-ti...the-netherlands

According to the agriculture sec., the small one's will be going out of business anyway.

#MAGA

I don't understand what your comment has to do with the article I posted.

Agriculture Minister Carola Schouten said that?

Wait you never answered my question about climate change I asked a few times in this thread, but you want to grille me about a question you asked and I answered already. As you yourself quoted from my post " I WAS AGAINST US SENDING TROOPS to die over oil"



No I never once considered the cost of war into oil prices paid in the USA. Maybe you can enlighten me and tell me how much that has driven up the price of gas, and home heating oil per gallon?

So as long as your price for oil/gas doesn’t go up the cost of soldiers lives is inconsequential?

Yep, and as long as women have control of their own reproduction choices, it’s war against all women, all liberals, or conservatives who disagree. He’s a trump supporter. That’s what they do.

Women have complete control over their REPRODUCTION choices...once pregnant, the REPRODUCTION choice has already been made. This liberal nonsense of equating reproduction choices to abortion is so typical of the ideology. It's the same book, but wildly different chapters.

You want to legally be allowed to kill a baby in the womb - or recently out of the womb? Then call it that and move on. This nonsense of equating abortion to reproductive choices is complete BS.

Libs.

https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2019/10/03/aoc-dumbfounded-town-hall-must-eat-babies-save-planet/
Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY) responded to a woman at her town hall who proclaimed that we must “eat the babies” to save the world from climate change, and she urged everyone to “treat the situation compassionately.”
A clip emerged Thursday evening of Ocasio-Cortez’s town hall at the Queens Public Library, featuring a flustered woman who proclaimed that we need to “eat the babies” in order to save the planet from climate change.