DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum A look at the roster

Quoting this because I don't think it got the notice it deserves.

Excellent work Dawgs4Life. I laughed out loud for real.

Haha

Awe. How sweet! I'm living in your mind rent free!

Why didn’t we grab Minkah Fitzpatrick when Miami let him go?

well, Pittsburgh traded a 1st rounder for him

https://dailysnark.com/cleveland-browns-...ell-beckham-jr/


Anyone know anything about this?

I read from our beat writers that this was unequivocally false, but who knows

It probably is false, but I would not rely on our beat writers telling us it is false.

I hope it's true.

I was excited when we got OBJ but it is looking like subtraction by addition. In a few weeks we get Hunt back. How are we going use all of these guys.

Maybe get a qb who can actually get all our weapons the ball?

j/c:

Why Rashard ‘Hollywood’ Higgins is Baker Mayfield’s missing link

If and when Rashard Higgins makes it back, take it to the bank Baker Mayfield will be humming hooray for Hollywood.

No one fully understands why Mayfield, the toast of the NFL last December, has been someone else this fall. At minimum, the absence of Higgins is a hidden factor.

Or, one might fairly observe that news Higgins practiced on a “full-go” basis Wednesday flashed like a neon sign.

Mayfield’s first two throws of his second season, against the Titans, were to Higgins. The second netted 11 yards and got the chains moving. Late in the same series, Mayfield went over the middle to Higgins for 35 yards to the 4. The Browns scored on the next play.

Higgins didn’t make it to the next game, leaving the opener with a knee issue. His has missed all four games since, including the disaster at San Francisco.

Mayfield and Higgins began bonding in the spring and summer of 2018, when Mayfield was relegated to working with backups because veteran Tyrod Taylor was the No. 1 quarterback, getting reps with starters.

Higgins, a backup, was trying to make himself more relevant after delivering less than 400 combined receiving yards in his two other seasons since arriving as the last of three wideouts the Browns drafted in 2016.

Mayfield began 2018 on the bench. Higgins carved out a role behind Jarvis Landry, Josh Gordon and Antonio Callaway. Through two full games and one half of Game 3, Higgins totaled 85 receiving yards. Starting with the second half of Game 3, when Mayfield replaced Taylor, through the next two games, Higgins racked up 158 yards and scored the Browns’ lone TD in a 12-9 overtime win over Baltimore. The team record was 2-1.

Higgins missed the next three games with a knee issue. Mayfield struggled, and the team went 0-3. Higgins returned for a 5-1 hot streak triggered by a win over the Falcons in which he made a 28-yard touchdown catch.

In the final two games, against the Bengals and Ravens, he was Mayfield’s top target, making 10 catches.

During this year’s training camp, Mayfield smiled about “the connection.”

“It goes back to last year and getting reps with him with the second team,” Mayfield said. “We built chemistry. I talked to him all the time.

“You knew exactly what you were going to get out of him on every play.”

Then came the preseason opener, in which Mayfield played just one series against Washington. What a series, and what a finish ... a 24-yard touchdown strike to Higgins.

The theory heading into the season suggested Higgins could do serious damage while defenses devoted coverage to Odell Beckham Jr. and Jarvis Landry. Nick Chubb understood.


Chubb, like Mayfield, spent months with the backups, including Higgins, before the 2018 season.

“I talk to ‘Higs’ all the time,” Chubb said. “I know the chemistry is there. Him and ‘Bake’ are always on the same page.

“When he was in, he always made big plays for us. He’s a big asset to our team.”

Higgins’ return could work two ways. Beckham and Landry siphon coverage away from him, but if he starts making plays, coverages must pay less attention to “the big two.”

Beckham is coming off the least productive two games of his career.

“It’s frustrating when teams take (Beckham) out of the game,” Mayfield said Wednesday, “but it’s also an opportunity for other guys to make plays.”

Higgins practiced on a limited basis last week but did play against the 49ers. The way a 31-3 loss played out made it evident they could use him when Seattle comes to Cleveland on Sunday.


The Browns have been without some players whose absence is more conspicuous than that of Higgins.

Cornerbacks Denzel Ward, the No. 4 overall pick of the 2018 draft, and Greedy Williams, the team’s top draft pick this year, both have missed the last three games with hamstring issues. Captain Christian Kirksey, a sixth-year linebacker, is on injured reserve.

Tight end David Njoku, a Round 1 pick in 2017, broke a wrist in Game 2 and is on injured reserve.

Meanwhile, the return of Higgins could wind up looking more conspicuous than one might think.

https://www.ohio.com/sports/20191009/why-rashard-hollywood-higgins-is-baker-mayfields-missing-link

Yeah...like that guy we had last year...#6...that guy.

Well said, both of you. And I mean that sincerely.


I hope this isn't true. I would hope that Dorsey isn't pushing the panic button 1/4 into the season. This offense would've needed a bit of time to gel even if we came out the gates with a playbook that made sense. We didn't, which means more time as we adapt.

But I'd almost feel dishonest if I didn't say that OBJ's talent is kinda wasted on this team, as it is. The offense that we should be really isn't going to take full advantage of his talents, and if nothing else, the Baker to OBJ backyard ball offense that we were looking forward to is a VERY long way off, if it even does come to fruition. That, to me, would be the most palatable reason for trading him.
If we did make this move, we better be getting a player of the same caliber as OBJ (top of their position, entering their prime). I honestly don't want a pick. Teams looking to give away a top pick for a WR like him won't be picking in the top half of the draft, and I want guaranteed (as much as can be expected) talent. I would want a top flight TE or offensive lineman.

Actually, I was thinking of someone who...

...did not lead the league in interceptions

...does not have twice as many picks as TDs

...is completing more than 56 percent of his passes

--can see the field

--doesn't play hero ball

--has a QBR better than the 31st ranked qb w/a rating of 33.4

Considering our qb is playing w/the best offensive talent in the entire league, I don't think it is much of a stretch to expect a bit more from him.

There's been speculation on local sports talk shows about the Pats trading for OBJ as well as AJ Green and Julio Jones. As far as OBJ I haven't heard what they might want to offer. Personally I would like to keep him. He is a very good weapon whether he catches the ball or draws attention away from our other players. We just need to find a way to utilize him better with our other guys but we all know that already.

I mean maybe if Washington offered a 1st and Trent Williams

I rather trade baker than OBJ. OBJ isn't the problem...This years version of #6 is the problem

He did all the things we needed from a FQB last year. What changed? The coaching has been atrocious as has the OL.

It must be terrible to hate players on your own team...especially those where a pre-draft evaluation was so poor.

When the schedule softens up and he has success in this cluster of an O, I'm sure you'll be here to talk about the competition...while conveniently forgetting the competition to date.

theres been tons of film showing him simply not making the right read or having his eyes in the wrong place. Theres a lack of confidence in this offense for sure. He doesn't trust his reads or he simply misses them all together.. Perfect example of not trusting so he could throw with anticipation was actually a completed pass to OBJ. It was a simple out route that had the ball been there when OBJ made his break he turns it upfield and gets YAC, but because he was late with the ball, OBJ could only catch and run out of bounds

There is no question he is struggling. He doesn't trust the playcall OR the OL and he's too green to be the guy to overcome poor OL play and plays that we can't run effectively.

Let's be honest...it's 80% Baker, 20% everything else. He has slow eyes, has no idea what's going on after the snap, and is making the players around him so much worse than they are...to the point people are making up rumors about OBJ. If Dorsey and Co. were to pull a stunt like that, trade OBJ, I'd be crushed. It would mean they are dumb.

I don't know if it's been posted here but Jake Burns at the OBR did an article breaking down about dozen Baker plays from the last 5 weeks. Very believable and revealing. Many bad or negative plays show protection is fine and guys were wide open. Mayfield's eyes are slow. He discusses what's different than last year. He starts with Mayfield being more calm last year even with pressure. While he still had slow eyes his calmness eventually let him get to more than his first read. But because he's become so skittish, the lack of calmness makes the game appear much faster than it is to him and he ends up panicking.

Probably one of the best football articles I've ever read...other than it's a bit melodramatic in spots.

It had this weird effect on me. It was calming in the one sense that you have a really thorough explanation of what's going on. I always find it easier to digest your situation when you understand it better. But it also made me very concerned that this can't be fixed in season. Baker, first and foremost, has to stop panicking. Then he has to get his slow eyes to speed up. After reading the article this doesn't sound like something that is easy to overcome.

I am firmly in Mayfield's corner and want him to work through this, to get better, and be the franchise QB of the Browns. This is not a post to trash the kid like some do because they don't like him personally. This is to simply state what is actually happening.

I truly believe at the bye they should get rid of Lindley and get a legit QB coach in here..I believe Lindley is a huge part of the problem

burns writes good articles, rishuz. Obvious question is did baker’s eyes slow down since last year because he did not seem to miss open receivers last year??

Huh? They didn't let him go. They traded him for a first round pick. Also, where would he play? The one thing this team definitely has is depth in the secondary.

He often misses an out route like a progression he didn't get to. Many of his passes seem to be into multiple coverage. Passes are high or late or both much too often. But he can do it.

Make a QB busy. Give him immediate things to do, like roll out (he does it anyway). Our deep routes cannot be this deep it appears. I am very frustrated watching this train wreck of our offense waddle along. We need a tackle on BM's left. And maybe vary the play palette more.

This is typical of our conversations. I did not insult you. I did not mention your name. I didn't throw any shade at you. I have not once resorted to posting some of your comments where you have been trashing me about Baker.

Yet, you take a post where I post stats and make this debate about me. And then on another thread, you will talk about how I start fights by making fun of others.

I have tried this before and I will try again. I know you don't like me. I think most people get it by now. I don't like you, either. However, I do not follow you around and criticize your takes daily. I would be thrilled if you and I never had another discussion. Most posters don't enjoy this. So, how about we just ignore one another and tolerate our different opinions?

I can't understand why the need to post this, this way. Same thing for the guy talking about trading Baker.

Baker isn't going anywhere. Not this year. Not next year.

Those who don't like him, might as well accept that.

It'd make more sense saying that we need our QB to start getting the ball to all his weapons.

That's the reality. Not get a new QB. Because, that simply won't happen. Baker is here this year and next. I predict far longer than that. But that's a minimum right there.

He's a number 1 pick. He had a great rookie year. No matter how bad this year goes, he will still be our starter next year. That's just the reality of the matter.

Even thinking about a different QB is pointless IMO

.

#logic

j/c:

There has been a lot of talk about trading for an OT on this board. I have said that I thought it would be too expensive to get an upgrade over the two that we have.

As many of you probably know, SF has lost both their starting offensive tackles. Shanny was asked about trading for one. Here is what he said:



I am in favor of upgrading the OL, but I think it would be wise to wait until free agency and/or the draft.

Agreed. Why mortgage the future for a player that might be a stopgap or a little older then we would like. We have to go with what we have and hope they play better. Address the problem on the o-line next offseason in FA or the draft. Let's work on fixing the problems we have this year and get things right. Some posters on here felt this wouldn't be the year anyway because of all the changes. 2020 season would be the year we would be solid contenders.

I can only speak for myself, but I'm not advocating to run out and force a trade now. I just think that if a unique opportunity presents itself, we should be aggressive (but not overpay). I think what Pittsburgh did with Minkah was smart (first rounder and all). If a similar situation comes up with a tackle (unlikely as it may be) I would hope Dorsey would be on it.

The longer the Trent Williams saga continues, the more likely his acquisition price goes down. Especially now that Gruden is out, and they may be looking to conjure up extra draft ammo. If his price drops to a pick outside of the first round, I hope Dorsey would at least be in on that. With where we are now talent-wise, it makes more sense to give picks for proven talent. Trent Williams might be too old and broken down to even warrant a 2nd rounder, but his situation is the closest I have to an example of good talent in a unique situation to make him available.

Honestly,I don't think that if he keeps playing like this Dorsey is going to keep him up for much longer.

I rather lose Baker than Dorsey, by the way, hope we can pull our act together and hope we keep both.

I trust Dorsey, and will give him the time he needs to do his magic,no matter what the cost is. Hope Haslam thinks the same

Finally!

That’s a strange signing lol

If Baker continues to play like this maybe we should sit him down to give him a break and see what we have with Gilbert. Bigger QB with a stronger arm. I'm not saying give up on Baker but he may need to step back look at things and take a break.

j/c

I think it would be foolish with a capital "F" to not inquire about Trent Williams. Of course the price matters...but if he gave us 1.5 good years, it would be worth quite a bit to me.

Play this year and give the 2020 rookie LT someone to learn behind.

I don't see how that accomplishes a thing, at this point. Gilbert is going to be even further behind Mayfield in all the things that Baker is struggling with right now, and Mayfield isn't going to get better at the things he needs to get better at by sitting on the bench. Unless Baker's play REALLY falls off a cliff, or he slows down to the point that he's working on getting himself killed out there, we ride it out with him.

He'll figure it out.

J/c

My only thought also was that Gilbert got dinged up and we need someone to take more scout team stuff