DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Kitchen's not worried about job security.

If a potential candidate (should Freddie even be fired, which I'm betting he won't be unless Dorsey feels the need to cave to public pressure) can't see that this is a roster worth coaching, then he isn't a very realistic or qualified candidate in any way. We don't have to sell this job.

Interviews mean something when you are trying to convince people you know what the heck you are doing. I’ve always appreciated how intelligently GW speaks about player development and it’s clear he’s a true student of concepts of Leadership.

Eh, I think it was more of the players wanting to pee on Hue than what Gregg did, JMO.

Hes been in the league how many years, and has been fired from everywhere he has gone. Sean Payton called him a "rogue coach" and said there is no place in the league for him.

Hes a POC that will never get a HC gig the rest of his career. And probably this will be his last go around when he fails miserably in NY, as he already has.

Oh, he also has a total winning percentage of .393 as a HC.

He might be better than Freddie, but that aint sayin much.

Talented and worth coaching are two different things.

Not many people want to put up with some of the antics and headaches. And they are growing with each loss.

Gregg Williams wasn't the answer either... He turned down 7 head coaching jobs to be the Browns DC a couple years ago. And he obviously turned them all down this year to be with the Jets.


The real answer lies with the owner... imagine if Dorsey got to choose his own coach last year before being forced to use Hue after an 0-16 season. That's all on Haslam. Remember, the fans also wanted Hue "with real talent." Yeesh... And I suppose had that happened, no one would even know who Freddie Kitchens is today... He'd probably be the QB coach in Tampa.

Well, we're all just looking at the first box in the flowchart... "Fire Freddie". The most important is the next box... "Hire XXX". Firing Freddie accomplishes nothing but to create a vacancy, but if you know Freddie is a goner, why wait til the bitter end?

To me, Freddie's shelf life is about 4 weeks. If you haven't seen a turnaround by then - it's time to go. That wouldn't really be a "reward" to a coordinator, it would be more of a challenge... Just like last year, unfortunately, we screwed the pooch when making the decision. Gregg Williams offered much more continuity, and discipline, to a young team, but we were worried that Freddie would be such a hot commodity that we would lose him after a year. "Smartest guy in the room" thinking that failed again.

Think about it -- the only reason Freddie is our HC is because it was assumed that he was the reason for Baker's meteoric rise, and that rise would continue as long as Freddie was in charge. Since that assumption was terribly misguided, what are his real qualifications to be a HC? Freddie admitted that he basically let the players pick the plays and we all acted as if it was some "kumbaya moment". Isn't the coach supposed to know his teams strengths and weaknesses instead of saying "Shucks guys, what do you think we'll be good at?" Now, I'll admit, quick success to a long suffering franchise looked pretty appealing, but it still doesn't negate the fact that Freddie had no documented qualifications to even sniff a HC gig.

I said it til I was red in the face over the past decade. Quit waiting til the end of the season to jump on the coaching carousel. I don't want to compete with five other teams and play "duck, duck, goose" with the eight available prospects. They all sit across from the table with their cards hidden and play "what can you do for me".

If Freddie's not the guy, you need to put the league on notice before "Black Monday", or whatever it's called. It gives the real candidates more time to ponder the possibilities of coaching a young team, with a lot of talent, and a young QB that can still be carved into "the franchise".

It wasn't the right call... It was a full yard + and to design it so Baker goes all the way to the tackle gap? Really?

In the end, the reason Baker didn't make it was because his feet got tripped up by the WR/TE whoever it was that was blocking on the edge and Baker lost momentum and was easily pushed backwards as he fell... but you run exactly the same play only having handed it to Chubb and it's very easily a 1st down.

I don't think it was designed to go that way.

The problem was, when Chubb came off the field, everyone and their mother knew it was going to be a sneak. Especially the defense. They pinched the DL to the middle, and stacked the box.

Actually, it was one of the few heads up plays on baker to try taking it out that wide, because the middle was stuffed. He went wide to try to get it. It was the only chance at getting it.

Wasn't a bad call, but a bad schematic of the play by taking Chubb off the field.

I think we have abandoned BM's legs. The bootleg or naked reverse with a QB can be devastating. I had hoped he would keep going outside. Enough stupid to go around there. Freedy fooled nobody.

Baker isn't all that fast, and he looks to be 10 lbs of flab heavier than last year.

J/C

If the offense doesn't pick it up soon, I could see Monken getting fired. I'm not saying he should be, but I could see it being a step taken to shake things up.

I’ve been wondering if this may be an issue ... whether with his mobility and maneuverability in the pocket or just mental

I don't know what Kitchen is like with his team.
But IF he's a leader of men and that whether this rough patch he should stay and get more time.
IF he's not a leader of men then they should cut sling load.

Has had some openings. Part of taking what they give you. I agree about his speed and weight. But design some plan for it. Holding it too long with these guys hasn't worked. Just not a threat as a statue. High throws hurting us as well.

Pick your poison.

[img]https://img.discogs.com/Q1ARpqwtzO3n20ex8xCVV_GbSW4=/600x593/smart/filters:strip_icc():format(jpeg):mode_rgb():quality(90)/di



BR 549 was a hot Nashville band in the past....really good. The house band at Roberts....GOOD STUFF

IIRC, Hilliard was on thr field for both 3rd and 4th downs...

I ran across them looking for the pic. I'll have to take a listen.

If you watch the play again I believe Baker would have had no problem picking up the first down if he had gone straight up the middle.

We need a guy with credibility ... a proven voice and leader. Even if that guy hands over play calling to a young OC. We have too much youth, talent, and personality IMO .. FK is in over his head and he’s lost this team

I really really want Freddie to pull his head out of his butt and give just enough of a compelling reason to hang onto him through another season. I absolutely hate changing over coaching staffs.

Trouble is, as hard as I search for a reason to hang onto him... namely, an indication that he's going to adapt and improve... I'm not seeing it. He makes dumb decisions, and then doubles down on said dumb decisions in press conferences. That's an indicator of a guy who can't acknowledge his mistakes in order to correct them... and that just simply can't be tolerated of a rookie head coach with the limited resume like Freddie.


I really hope that Freddie starts to get his arms around this offense, and is able to right the ship through this season and through this coming offseason. Many of the problems that he and Baker introduced can't be fixed until the season is over.

I actually disagree with this. I think that he states things decently, but either gets taken wrong or out of context - frequently.

For anyone actually paying attention, he is getting things improved - it just isn't translating into Wins, yet.

This will be shouted down, and I don't care; and he will almost certainly be fired at the end of the season and whomever we hire will be the next greatest thing. Yada, yada, yada...

Can we just let monken call plays first before we fire him?

Like...can we try that first? Maybe Freddie is a decent HC with just far too much on his plate.

That might end up being the make-or-break ultimatum if things get any worse...

Man this would have fit perfectly in the existing thread.

Y'know, I watched the play from the perspective of where Baker went and not where he didn't go.. but you are right. The center and LG absolutely blew their guys 2-3 yards off the LOS.. if Baker tucks in behind them, looks like an easy first down.

I think Kitchen is a good play caller and deserves the right to sink or swim running the offense the way he wants.
I don't like the idea of forcing a HC to do something. The HC is the leader and taking playcalling away or forcing any other decision undermines his authority.

If people liked his playcalling last year then they should let him work his way through the struggles this year. Being a HC is a much bigger and different job then merely being a playcaller. And I think his playcalling will improve once/IF he gets a handle on leading the entire team (to include coaches, staff and players).

Becoming a good franchise requires stability....its not an overnight job.

I think he is safe unless we lose a bunch of the 5 games left to play. First year growing pains will be the reasoning. Baker turning around the last three games probably saved him.

Safe in his case ought to include some work on his weaknesses and a candid chat about expectations for next year. Not sure he is safe as he might lead you to believe.

What was it that John Dorsey said before the first game of the season?....

Quote:
Dorsey knows the schedule is demanding, especially the first eight games. He also knows he’s added a lot of new players and coaches.

It takes some time for it to blend together.“I ask the fans to exercise a degree of patience,” he said. “We are building this thing to last 10 years, not just have one good year.”


I'm not trying to predict what potential changes might be in store for the franchise but looking at Dorsey's comments before the season started...I would say that Dorsey nailed it.

The team struggled early in the season due to the schedule and the time needed for the team to gel. Hopefully the offense will continue to improve as the coaching staff and players settle in.

So far, the season has gone as Dorsey predicted.

I expect Freddie to be here next year, and the rest of the coaches, too.

I think we're just getting this thing started.

That line is SO OLD!!!

Team hasn't done anything in 25 years except make the steelers and ravens look good and talk about 5 year plans, and tell me which year was the "one good year",

Better off, just say "no comment", just say "it's a work in progress." or "next question."...

What coach has had 3-5 years to build something?

If Freddie can win at least 7-8 games he should be safe IMO

I will admit he has done some dumb things this year, and im not really a fan, but we have to be fair and give him a chance. one year isn't a chance. I do think he needs to grow a spine and be more disciplinarian towards the team and not let these guys get out of control. this is his first year as a HC, I hopeful he will learn.