DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Ohio bill orders doctors to ‘reimplant ectopic pregnancy’ or face 'abortion murder' charges

So now living a decent life in America has a prerequisite of making 100% wise choices in your life. I'd like to hold all GOPers to that.

I follow the thread. that takes reading it and replying as thread evolves. I mean I understand how evolution is a strange concept to you, but threade do evolve. Keep up

e·volve
/ēˈvälv/
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verb
verb: evolve; 3rd person present: evolves; past tense: evolved; past participle: evolved; gerund or present participle: evolving

1.
develop gradually, especially from a simple to a more complex form.

Hope that helps you.

Yes, I am changing the discussion from... How can the government pay for the fact that over 30% of the nations kids don't live in a 2 parent home.... to.... how can we get back to kids living in a 2 parent home, which is the single biggest key indicator of future success.

17.2 million (23% of all kids under 18) live with just a mother
2.8 million (4%) live with just a father
3 million (4%) live without either, living with grandparents, aunts/uncles, older siblings, etc

23 million kids, immediately put at a significantly higher risk of failure, not because of the government or their own fault...

And you can talk about people developing mental illness or whatever.. but we both know, most of those kids NEVER had a chance at a stable two parent home.. not from day 1.

Full circle... this is also why abortion should continue to be a choice. One that’s none of anyone else’s business.

So how does any of that change or impact wage disparity and those at the bottom rung of income?

I mean I understand your point, but that has zero to do with the fact I could afford to live on a low wage job 40 years ago and people can't do that now.

It doesn't change the fact that those on the bottom end of wages are worse off now than they were 40 years ago. I mean we can keep evolving the topic or we can face up to the fact that things are getting worse for low wage workers and not better.

They always seem to try and make excuses even when DC points out the problems associated with forced births. Unless they plan on standing in line at adoption agencies, they should just mind their own business.

I know that. You know that. Everybody knows that. Evidently it's unrealistic for kids to know that and stop having kids.

Forced births from unforced pregnancies.

LMAO they still make phones that use a landline for a lot less than you get charged for a cell phone. Get with the times bro LOL

Maybe you need a tad more, but 32 years ago I was raising a family of four with two kids in diapers at the same time on 10,000 per year. It was tough but it was also the best few years of my life.

People don't get it. They want it all, now.

Talking to myself here.

I can't believe the USA has raised so many wimps in my life time. You do what you have to to survive. Single, married, one kid, five kids it doesn't matter. You do what you have to if you want to get by. You work 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, or 100 hours per week. Trust me I worked a MIN of 60 hours a week for 33 years years. I also worked 110 hours per week some years.

Wimps?

Snowflakes.

Oh really ? So I guess you want to adopt all the kids aged 1 day old to 10 years old who are killed by their parents. I mean unless your ready to do that then you should shut up about those of who oppose abortion. If you blame them for not adopting babies then you should blame yourself for not adopting babies who are already born and who are abused, or killed.

Leave me out of this LOL

And it seems you don't understand just how much more spending power that gave you decades ago. That's the entire point.

Well DC, we all know kids always do the responsible thing.

Doesn’t sound like much of a life.
I’m glad I don’t have to give 110 hours of my week away to anyone. I don’t care the money. My life is far more valuable than that.
To each their own.

That's about $40 K in today's dollars.

I worked crazy hours like that too. Then some fat cats crashed the economy and I lost pretty much everything I worked for... but I still have the health problems that come with that workaholic lifestyle bodily abuse. Does that make me a wimp?

Since when was making enough to live considered, "wanting it all"?

Almost half of all Americans work in low-wage jobs

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/minimum-wage-2019-almost-half-of-all-americans-work-in-low-wage-jobs/

A minimum-wage worker needs 2.5 full-time jobs to afford a one-bedroom apartment in most of the US

https://www.businessinsider.com/minimum-wage-worker-cant-afford-one-bedroom-rent-us-2018-6

And you don't seem to remember what it was like to struggle. I know you did. I know you did what you had to do to raise your family and pay your bills. You have always been a hard working and caring man bro. Min wage was never ever intended to support a family of four, and it never will. Hell it never ever has. Quit making excuses for the lazy SOB's now.

A life for who YOU or your KIDS? My kids were worth way more than 168 hours per week. You feel like your would be kids are not. It just makes us disagree on this subject and nothing more bro. But to me everything, and everything is worth my kids life. You however feel that your life is more important than the life of any kids you might have had. I am jot saying I or you are right. I am just saying that I am happy with my choice. As you may also be with yours.

Maybe for you and where you chose to live. Around here life is much cheaper. I once posted that I lived in a 280,000 house. I was proud of that about 3 percent of the people around here owned houses that cost that much. I was attacked by some posters on this board who said I must live in a crap hole. Just because they lived in an area of the country that cost 5 times more than things do around here. They still do the same thing today.

No I meant the 10K you earned 32 years ago is about 40K in modern dollars buying power wise. hell 32 years ago you could rent a decent 3 bedroom home for like $250 a month. Hamburger was under $1 a pound, probably closer to 50 cents. Gas was under a buck too.

I hearby dup thee Pee Wee Herman

I do the math. Inflation verses the current wages. Math doesn't lie. Yes I did struggle. But I can do the math and see that I could never make it today on wages just above minimum wage. I could do it when I was young.

It's easy to say we both did it if we refuse to look at the facts that it's not the same today.

To live like I did in 1977 I'd have to be making way over minimum wage.

I didn't need to work two and a half full time jobs to do it.

The economics have changed. And it's the people that refuse to see it and blame low wage workers for it that are a big part of the problem.

?

I'm just saying all things do not compare so easily and all problems are not the same for everyone. I am where I am, you are where you are... You can't tell me working like that doesn't take its toll and that if you could have a few hundred of those healthier hours back to enjoy life you wouldn't take them.

I also believed I was doing it for my kids, giving them all I could would be an advantage... Turns out it wasn't an advantage at all. They would have rather had me more involved in the day to day.

It's a balance many wish they had the ability to afford.

In my area 8 bucks an hour is 17,800 per year. Does it buy you as much as it did 36 year ago... NO but it gets you close to what Me and my family lived on. Which in my area of the country could get you way more than a one bedroom apartment bro.

We can agree 110 percent on that part. I hated working those hours and missing out on family time. However I don't regret it at all. My kids had everything the needed (not wanted) growing up. Would I like some of those hours back for me.... you bet your ass I do. Do I want them back for my kids.... NO. My kids are happy and well adjusted. They have their own families, and they both are happy kids (yes for us old folks people in their 30's are still kids)



But I was involved with my kids. I ran on about 2 hours of sleep 6 days a week. Did it affect my life.... I guess with my health problems I would have to say yes, BUT I don't know for sure.

It's not. Go get a better paying job or don't have a family.


Yes, I know that is easy to say. Sometimes things change. Families have to be prepared to make changes. There are a LOT of 2 year degrees that give you the opportunity to make better than pretty good money. You just have to be willing to suck it up for a few years and get it done.

As for the abortion question... if we discovered life on some moon of Saturn and brought it back, it would become the most protected life form on earth, yet we toss our own lifeforms down the drain.

Hard to figure.

You make assumptions that just aren't true.

First, you assume people start off in minimum wage jobs. I can list, at least around here, 20 companies if not more that DON'T start you off at minimum wage. Full time jobs, with benefits.

You also assume that a minimum wage job means you stay at minimum wage. Full time jobs just don't do that, as long as you show up for work, work, and can pass a drug test.

And as I alluded to, n.w. ohio doesn't have the cost of living of cities.

I've stated many times, I can walk out my door and look left, at my pastor, or right, at my neighbor. Both smoke me in income and benefits. And I can choose to envy them and pity me.

Or I can choose to not. I can see many, many friends making 2, even 3 plus times as much as me. And not 1 bit happier.

I can look just a bit further and see the family of 5, dad works in a factory making maybe $18 an hour after 20 some years..........and they are doing just fine.

I sometimes lay in bed, as I did last night, and think of my friends: CFO's, CEO, sales rep traversing the entire U.S. making what I consider HUGE sums of money. And I can be envious/jealous, or I can choose to not be envious/jealous.

Decent paying jobs are out there, for anyone that desires them. Hell, even mechanics, plumbers, builders, etc.


What you make is only a small part of what makes you happy.

I have millionaire relatives that........just want more. More money, more stuff. For what?

If you compare food prices from 1987 to 2019 it would cost you $45.48 to buy the same food that you paid $20 bucks for in 1987 so that 10,000 would be equivalent to $22,740 not 40K

https://www.in2013dollars.com/Food/price-inflation/1987

Also if you use the AIER COLA Calculator what you bought in 1987 for $100 would cost you 224.80 today which would be $22,480 per year. not 40K

https://www.aier.org/cost-of-living-calculator/

So a person making 11 bucks an hour and working only 40 hours a week has about the same spending power as I did back then. I person working 60 hours a week at $7.30 per hour would also have the same spending power even without getting time and a half for the overtime.

See my post right above this one bro

get real for once please....these scenarios you guys spew are ridiculously stupid. And besides climate change and global warming is slowly killing off all life forms on earth. So if you guys think you are saving life and humanity by stopping legal abortions you’re barking up the wrong tree.

So your $10 hr wage is equivalent to $22.65 hr today. Yep, those entry level $22.65 hr jobs are just all over the place... Give it a rest, life is harder for those starting out today.

I don't believe it is any harder today than it was 20, 40, or even 100 years ago.

J/C

Getting back to the topic I actually think this sounds a little to radical but its not as crazy and heartless as the nutbags on the lefts Planned Parenthood inner city slaughterhouses that sells baby parts for sportscars. Fighting fire with fire is probably the thinking from the cons. IMO

That depends on how you define "hard." Many tasks may be easier due to technology, but other problems have arisen.

In an increasingly "independent" society, we've really become more dependent.

Most jobs require your own transportation now, a vehicle requires payments for both itself and insurance. You can argue that mass transportation exists, but outside of big cities it generally isn't convenient in location or frequency and housing generally costs more in cities.

People don't grow their own food or have the land to do so, so they generally have to pay for minimally nutritious, highly preserved foods. Healthy, fresh foods are more expensive and go bad relatively quickly. You can mention refrigeration, but that requires electricity which is another bill.

Most jobs require phone and/or email, which is another bill or two.

If the single mother is working, she'd have to find and/or pay for childcare.

She's also likely paying rent.

If she's having the baby she's probably going to have it in a hospital, which means medical bills and probably health insurance payments.

She probably can't afford all these things on a single income, so probably will take on debt, which will have an interest rate which will balloon. Her credit rating will probably suffer as she can't afford increasing payments, which most likely adversely affect her ability to get a better job.

Broken families that are similarly poor are rather "normal," so parental support is not a given and often unlikely.


Despite all this, I still think abortion is morally wrong. There are circumstances where it is the lesser evil.

However, many (not all) circumstances are avoidable.

We should put more emphasis on avoiding unwanted pregnancy, so abortion doesn't become the question.

Sex sells is a common advertising cliché. And, while using sex to sell other things, we are also effectively selling the idea of sex.

Using sex to get what you want (and that sex is something you should want) is an unspoken message that nonetheless gets transmitted, often to vulnerable people (children) that aren't fully equipped to deal with all the ramifications.

A girl using sex to "sell herself" to a boy she likes is a common byproduct of our societal selling practices.

The pervasiveness of sex often leads boys to the expectation of it.

Basically, I wonder if we worry to much about the expression of the problem (abortion) rather than the underlying factors that make it such an issue.

There's nothing inherently wrong with sex. However, the when's and why's and reasons and how's and alternatives might deserve more attention.