DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Where Romeo Needs To Improve To Stay In Cleveland

Happy Birthday Charger and I hope it is a the best ever!

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What Romeo needs to do is let chud handle the O and do something about the D.

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I could'nt agree more.

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How could Savage, who certainly has Lerner's ear, keep a coach who is that stupid? How can he do that and still claim he wants to win? How could Lerner stand by and watch such things play out between his General Manager and Head Coach and not fire them both?

And how could RAC, if he's any kind of man at all, stand pat while his authority is undermined so many times and simply play it off?

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To the first question...that is the kind of coach Savage wants...everything I have read shows he has roster control. That doesn't mean he won't yield to Romeos wish...there is a concept of working together...

To the second question...I can't answer that, you would have to ask Romeo.

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For a General Manager of a football team to have roster control, with input from his head coach, is not out of the ordinary at all.


To the second question, anybody should be able to answer that.

He couldn't.

The kind of man, as you try to portray him, could never have lasted 26 years in the NFL.

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What Romeo needs to do is let chud handle the O and do something about the D.

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I kinda have the feeling that is exactly what took place last sunday.....


Oh, and Happy Birthday Charger

So are you saying is just made the move out of a whim? We don't know all the facts
The facts have been posted and we heard the facts..
I just don't get how U guys see the stuff posted then say they made the move out of a whim...I don't get that..

to think that these issues are between Phil and Romeo are not far fetched, Looks to me like Phil had to fix an issue the HC couldn't do
How was Rac going to fix it?
Make the trade himself?
U still never answered my question..Who pulled Frye from the game?
Who allowed the QB comp anyway?


It's not far fetched if U just stop following Peens hang Rac agenda and JUST LOOK at how things played out.

it was a decision Savage wanted to make earlier, but he yielded to RAC's wishes and kept Chuck around.

Thats so far off base it's pitiful..
How was Phil yelding to Rac, when he wanted to see Frye perform with the new weapons around him?

After the pleasant conversation that must have occurred in that box during Charlies play on the field, as the fans were leaving in droves, Savage at that point knew he blew it ever listening to RAC.



It's sad U can't see anything because of your disdain for Rac..
Phil knew after that performance that it was time to do something , and since it probably seemed like Fry's confidence was gone, he knew what he had to do..make the move .
I doubt Savage ever seriously listens to RAC again on matters of players.

He'll listen more to Rac than I will to your off the chart theories

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PEEN SAID: it was a decision Savage wanted to make earlier, but he yielded to RAC's wishes and kept Chuck around.

ATTACK RESPONDED: Thats so far off base it's pitiful..

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Ok,, I don't agree with Peen in this instance, but frankly Attack, you don't know if it's off base or not.

WHile I don't agree with Peens assessement of the situation, I can't deny that they are possible.

You saying his conclusions or scenario is " Off Base" doesn't have any more merit than his comments.. after all, it's all just opinion! Right?

Man, we all need to step back and take a look at what we write (me too)..

Too often we see something and perhaps our prejudices make us view it one way, when it fact, it could be something else.

I think RAC hasn't had the talent till now, so an attack on RAC isn't going to go over well with me.. Peen thinks RAC isn't a good Head Coach (for reasons he's explained) so any shred of info that he hears is gonna taint his view.

Somewhere in there is the truth,,, and I don't care how much inside info some have, we'll never really know what that truth is.

Point being, none of us are wrong and none of us are right,,, not so anyone will be able to tell anyway. SO insistence that one thing is fact and the other is fiction is nonsense! Worst part about it, we are ALL guilty to one degree or the other... Protest if you wish!

NOTE: Peen, sorry man, just using you as an example! I meant no harm or foul and Attack,, again, as an example.. I respect both of you too much to indicate that you are the only ones doing these,, but you both were handy. Please accept this in the spirit with which it was intended

Ok,, I don't agree with Peen in this instance, but frankly Attack, you don't know if it's off base or not.

So U also choose to ignore whats been posted about Phil/Rac/Frye?

Peen IS off base whether U or anyone else wants to see it...he 's WRONG..

U can try and cover and say no one is right no one is wrong but guess what? Doesn't work that way..
There is always a RIGHT and a WRONG...regardless ..

Plain and simple Daman..Peen accuses Rac of pushing Frye as the starter ..and Savage steps in and corrects Rac's mistake.

Phil drafted Frye..Phil wanted to upgrade the units to see if Frye's play would improve this season, while in fact BOTH QB's were being shopped as Phil admitted..Phil was supporting Frye as much as he could ..

Frye and DA compete in camp for the job..DA doesn't beat out Frye so who should be named the starter Daman??
How come no one can answer that?

Frye gets yanked after a bad performance and traded..but the fact remains he was being shopped in preseason..well actually a bit after the draft..

I've posted that.. a few others posted on it..it was documented..Phil admitted that both were on the market..
He said the deal with Seattle was there for weeks..but he didn't want to act on it..he said had DA beat out Frye they would have pulled the trigger earlier..

Now how is ALL of this just OPINION?


Now where I draw the line is when things are posted and they are fact and several people CHOOSE to ignore it while drumming up theories not supported by anything that transpires..I am not going to ignore that.

But I'm supposed to yeld to a poster who has a agenda AND NO FACTS to support his theories?
My comments aren't based on opinion..they're based on fact..

U can take the easy way and not want to rock the boat or discredit him, but thats where we differ..I ain't afraid to call someone out especially when they don't have a leg to stand on..
Dude is wrong..he doesn't want Rac here and he's trying to railroad the guy with Frye...
Now if U or Peen or anyone can show one tidbit of fact to support his pointless accusations bring it on and we'll debate facts..

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So U also choose to ignore whats been posted about Phil/Rac/Frye?

Peen IS off base whether U or anyone else wants to see it...he 's WRONG..

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Well I tried,, but I guess you didn't take the post as it was intended,,,, again, sorry you have misread my intentions,,,

Tried what?
U want me to cut the dude some slack...WHY?

You have no idea what I was trying to get across do you.. you didn't take the time to think about it., you just attacked,,, ok,, your name fits you correctly...

No I actually thought about it ...for bout a minute ..and U kinda bounced around ..I know what you're trying to do..but it doesn't really fit when people ignore facts..

If all of this was opinion..it might look different ..but even with opinions you still need to use logic and common sense.

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I know what you're trying to do..but it doesn't really fit when people ignore facts..

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Pot meet kettle. Your ignoring facts as well, and they have been pointed out, your choosing to ignore them and yet you accuse others of doing what your doing as well, makes no sense. I think if anyone could be accused of picking and choosing on what they want to believe I would say thats you, but I don't look at it like that, it's your opinion, but if you take the time instead of attacking others opinions you might realize were not as far off base as you think we are.

Oh....what facts did I ignore?
Point it out to me instead of saying I ignore facts..
Don't come back with ''Peen said this" or Daman said that"..those aren't facts..those are just overreactive opinions
This I gotta see..: ..well I'll wait to see..

Why was Seattle interested in Kevin Dorsey in the first place? I already answered this.

Phil and every other GM catch wind of this and Phil simplifies a situation the HC couldn't in trading Frye, who he knew Seattle was interested in since Frye was drafted. Romeo made a simple situation tough for no reason, because in the long run we all know who the starter will be. When the GM steps in and trades the starting QB the way he did, it's obvious as the nose on my face there are tensions between the HC and GM, to think otherwise is just fooling yourself.

Why was Seattle interested in Kevin Dorsey in the first place? I already answered this.
First it was already noted about them needing another QB..so that was nothing new..you didn't shed any new light on this

Phil and every other GM catch wind of this and Phil simplifies a situation the HC couldn't in trading Frye, who he knew Seattle was interested in since Frye was drafted.
Thats OPINION not fact..the only fact in your sentence is the part about Seattle being interested in Frye..otherwise you're implying the same thing Peen is , that Rac wanted to keep Frye in place ..thats how U see it ..not what made the trade work..
U know I could say you're right about one thing..RAC couldn't initiate the trade..thats Phils job ..he handles personnel moves not Rac
So U lost that one too..

Fact..Phil wanted to bring Dorsey back even after he was released ..Seattle jumped on the chance to get a QB to be a backup....Phil decided to further Quinn's developement Dorsey was more valuable to the Browns than Frye..so he made the deal..Seattle forced the issue but the trade was already on the table so he took advantage of it.

Fact..Rac pulled Frye from the Pitt game and put Anderson in..
If Rac was a Frye homer he wouldn't have yanked him but let him play out the game..
If Rac were a Frye homer he would have never mentioned or allowed a QB competition in TC..
Fact-Anderson didn't beat Frye out for the starting job..so Frye was the incumbant starter.

Fact -Phil said if DA had beat him out they would have traded him sooner..

When the GM steps in and trades the starting QB the way he did, it's obvious as the nose on my face there are tensions between the HC and GM, to think otherwise is just fooling yourself.


Your nose must be real small ..that doesn't prove there was any tension between the two..it's just these overactive imaginations trying to find something hidden..
Frye's confidence was shaken ...he was finished here.


So tell me again what facts U have that proves that Phil and Rac were having tensions about Frye..only thing I see are pure speculations and guesswork..
Any inside sources or quotes or articles that back that up?

I've always stated that my opinion is speculation, I base it on facts and opinion, thats why I've called it a logical theory, never once used the word fact, now go back and show me were I state anything I said as fact, then you have an argument, but I am just giving my opinion just as you are , can you show me proof there are no tensions between Romeo and Phil, see you can't. The only fact is I'm giving an opinion.

We will all find out at the end of the year, until then all anyone of us can do is just speculate.

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but it doesn't really fit when people ignore facts..

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One persons fact is anothers fiction.. That's not saying that either party is intentionally saying anything wrong, it's just how they see it.

Example... There is another thread on here and you and Peen are having a discussion.. Peen is insisting that Tucker is a versatile player.. he's basing that on the FACT that Tucker played RG during the preseason before he had to serve his suspension. It's a fact that he played RG,, Hard to dispute that.

And of course you know that Tucker has played RT forever in the league.. so it's quite possible that he is versatile.. Point is, you can't say he isn't,,

But you tried,,, You wanted to know if Tucker was better than McKinny,,,,, what the hell does that have to do with whether or not Tucker is Versatile.

See what I'm saying now.. That's just an example of how things get twisted all out of shape..

No no no..U said I was ignoring some facts ..so what are those facts ?

You have some facts that show Rac and Phil had tensions about Frye or as Peen and U have put it ..that Rac complicated this situation and Phil stepped in?
First tell me how he complicated this situation?
Rac was the one who yanked him from the game , why didn't he allow him to finish it??

can you show me proof there are no tensions between Romeo and Phil, see you can't
Well if all of Phil's quotes are lies then there are tensions..right now I take what he said as fact..so there's the proof.

Phil himself said they gave Frye the opportunity to prove himself..so tell me how this falls on Rac?

That disproves Peens conspiracy theory right there and yours also..
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U guys simply cannot ignore the entire process and then say there was a rift between the two and Phil pulled rank on Rac when it didn't go down that way....
Plain and simple Peen is Rac-hunting and it looks like he has some company..

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Well if all of Phil's quotes are lies then there are tensions..right now I take what he said as fact..so there's the proof.

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LMAO proof? Did you get these quotes personally? or are you going by articles, another persons opinion, because if you ain't in the room you can't say there's your proof. It's still just an opinion.

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Phil himself said they gave Frye the opportunity to prove himself..so tell me how this falls on Rac?

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Thats called a company line, it's used in business all the time, what is he supposed to come out and say my HC is a moron because he can't decide on a starting QB?

We can agree to disagree and like I said we will all know more at the end of the year.

Did you get these quotes personally? or are you going by articles, another persons opinion, because if you ain't in the room you can't say there's your proof. It's still just an opinion.


NAW ..Phil didn't email the quotes to me...actually it's this little thing called RADIO..U know like interviews..
And stuff like this...

Savage said the team has explored trades involving Frye or Anderson throughout most of the offseason.

"From the moment we drafted Brady Quinn and (since), I have stayed in contact with a number of teams who have expressed interest in either Charlie or Derek," Savage said. "I have kept them abreast to the situation, feeling at some point we'd move one of those two players."

Dorsey was largely considered the veteran tutor of Frye and Anderson in ‘06 and mentored Frye, Anderson, and Quinn during the '07 offseason.

"If we were going to make a move I felt like now was the time to do it," Savage said. "Ken Dorsey hadn't signed with anyone else and it seemed like if we could get Ken back and if we could have the possibility of moving Charlie, we should do it.

"Yesterday we fielded some calls and (made the deal)."



http://www.clevelandbrowns.com/article.php?id=7293#


And in case U didn't read it..I said they had been shopping then both..
CoachB talked to Frye himself and told the other half of it.
Which isn't much more than whats been said..what was later said by Phil on WTAM was that Seattle was the enity that tried to sign Dorsey first..
So there's your facts..nothing different than what I said..
Has little to do with Rac..

Thats also a company line statement. Do you think everything is made public? Again you missed my point. I'm not going to type the same thing over and over with you, this question will be answered at the end of the year.

Well since you apparently want to go with the conspiracy theory , feel free to join Peen's hang Rac club..oh wait U already have

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Well since you apparently want to go with the conspiracy theory

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Again your opinion.

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feel free to join Peen's hang Rac club..oh wait U already have

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That sounds like something a 5 year old would say, a very lonely 5 year old.

That sounds like something a 5 year old would say, a very lonely 5 year old.

That the best U got?
A five year old doesn't know about agendas and biases..he woulda just kicked you in the knee and ran off

You can’t get blood out of a rock Attack…

It's a long, hard road trying to have a meaningful, factual, logical, accurate discussion with people who resort really only conjecture and personal opinion based upon what and their imagination will allow...

Nice try though... Take care, hang in and enjoy!