I can't say that we should get rid of this player or that player. Baker played like crap to be sure, but how much of that is squarely on him, how much is it on his teammates, how much is on the play design, the play call, the coaching staff . . . on and on
Baker was mugged all game long. Chubb couldn't get a block at all. Our dline couldn't plug a gap. This isn't a loss on one player. This is a team loss, from staff on down.
It's possible that Freddie is a terrible coach (he is) Our OLine is garbage (it is - thanks Lord Dorsey) Our offensive weapons are self-serving divas (they are) Our defense might be worst in the NFL (they were after Garrett went down, and will finish close to dead last in rushing defense)
AND
Baker Mayfield can still be a bad/below average QB who isn't the answer.
Pointing out the last point does not mean "it's all Baker's fault". It just means he isn't very good - and he's not.
We have a good running game, so the OL can't be that bad. Also our QB can't read D's and adjust to save his life. Baker simply has no clue.
Landry and OBJ can be divas, they are both great players. And to my recollection none has ever been involved in anything problematic.
Our D is not that good, I'll give you that.
Also just take into consideration what the good players in the team must be thinking when they see the rookie QB take all the credit for last year and choose the HC...
It all starts with Baker and this idea that he was the franchise QB that could turn the team around...
In a normal organization Baker would have been benched 10 games ago.
Its also very possible that both the D and teh QB really sucked...
It's entirely possible the QB has been bad most of the year. And it's entirely possible that it's a combination of things that are the root cause. And it's entirely possible that the collegiate career of accuracy and his rookie year of accuracy are more indicative of Baker's arm talent compared to the one season under an inadequate rookie HC whose play calling and play design was as anything I can remember in the last 20 years. We'll know this time next year. Anyone declaring Baker as never going to be a franchise QB is talking out of their rear end. . . just like anyone who wants to anoint him a FQB at this time!
The more things change the more they stay the same.
Talk about a trainwreck of a season. Yes, I’m pessimistic by nature when it comes to the Browns, but even this season was worse than I envisioned.
IMO, you have to get rid of FK and seriously question Baker’s methodology and approach going into next year
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
Its also very possible that both the D and teh QB really sucked...
It's entirely possible the QB has been bad most of the year. And it's entirely possible that it's a combination of things that are the root cause. And it's entirely possible that the collegiate career of accuracy and his rookie year of accuracy are more indicative of Baker's arm talent compared to the one season under an inadequate rookie HC whose play calling and play design was as anything I can remember in the last 20 years. We'll know this time next year. Anyone declaring Baker as never going to be a franchise QB is talking out of their rear end. . . just like anyone who wants to anoint him a FQB at this time!
I completely agree, but anyone who watched this season knows it starts in Baker and the idea he was the chosen one...
The whole team was built for Baker, so its time for some accountability.
The question is if it can be reverted and Baker can accept a minor role and just be one of the guys...
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
We have a good running game, so the OL can't be that bad.
You clearly don't watch the games to say our running game is good. . . . Which is not true. If our running game was good, first and goal at the 5 yard line, we would run it in. That's what good running teams do. . . . What the Browns have is an exceptional, top 3 RB in the entire NFL. Chubb makes the plays - normally about 3 or 4 a game when he makes something amazing happen, the rest of the time he is trying to avoid not being tackled at the LOS or behind it.
Originally Posted By: rastanplan
Landry and OBJ can be divas, they are both great players. And to my recollection none has ever been involved in anything problematic.
Again - if you watched the games you'd see that OBJ has not been good this year and has dropped a ton of balls and consistently lined up in the wrong place. He also ran the wrong routes several times early in the season .... telling that OBJ gets a pass on reputation only but you want to hang Baker.
The more things change the more they stay the same.
Baker is dressed like he’s going to an AA meeting.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Yep baker has to accept coaching/mentor ship the next 6 months from a viable source
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
Perhaps Baker is better off going to another franchise so we can watch him excel while we continue the revolving door of quarterbacks. Some Browns fans may not deserve a franchise quarterback.
Perhaps Baker is better off going to another franchise so we can watch him excel while we continue the revolving door of quarterbacks. Some Browns fans may not deserve a franchise quarterback.
Amazing.... so you are saying that Baker is being miss treated here?
He would have been benched in any other franchise. This game was simply awful, to bad to be true.
The Ints were bad The screen pass to Hunt was bad He just can't read D's and adjust HE does not recognize the pressure
Landry and OBJ were balling today.
And from his press conference, he for sure isn't a franchise QB, he is completely delusional...
Coaching was the biggest reason the Browns had a disappointing season. Dorsey needs to make a change. Baker suffered through a sophomore slump, should bounce back next season. Too early in Baker's career to give up on him. We are pretty set at the skilled positions, now need to build up the lines. If Dorsey fires Kitchens and hires the right coach, Browns should make the playoffs next season.
Coaching was the biggest reason the Browns had a disappointing season. Dorsey needs to make a change. Baker suffered through a sophomore slump, should bounce back next season. Too early in Baker's career to give up on him. We are pretty set at the skilled positions, now need to build up the lines. If Dorsey fires Kitchens and hires the right coach, Browns should make the playoffs next season.
what sophomore slump, he played at Kizer level this year.
He showed no improvement, he stopped throwing Ints because they dumbed the game down for him.
Today was awful, you don't end a season like this and keep your job.
Reading between the lines with Baker's presser....it sure does sound like they are aware of players, coaches etc. who are not committed. I think Oline is an obvious weakness, but defensive side of the ball really looks like players are not trying. When we got within 7 in the 4th quarter I jokingly said to a friend that the defense probably said to each other they need to allow Cincy to score again to not allow the offense to come back and force OT or win it. Pretty sure the defense want Wilks and Freddie gone.
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