No matter who it is, they will be called incompetent by someone eventually, it's what Browns fans do. If we don't become the Patriots in one year people will complain.
I'm not wishing for the Patriots .. just the 8 - 8 season I was called stupid for predicting this year. Then 10 - 6 the year after...
The Cleveland Browns - WE KNOW QUARTERBACKS ( Look at how many we've had ... )
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
Man I wish there was a Mr Hero nearby. I could go for a Romanburger.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
If they don't get it right this time people will be looking back and wondering why we got rid of a man that brought that much talent here and hired someone to tear everything apart again. It runs in cycles.
His talent evaluation AND acquisition results are much overrated on the interwebs and especially by the talking heads who only saw OBJ/Hunt. The inability/unwillingness of supporters to detail out exactly who represents "that much talent" is rather telling.
Considering the talent he dismissed along with the ammo he had to work with in both draft capital and cap space, it's no wonder he's gone.
I also wonder what our team would look like if we’d have kept FK and JD at this point next year... maybe a COMPLETE disaster
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Jeudy is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Tillman is flanked out wide to the right. Judkins and Ford are split in the backfield as Flacco takes the snap ... Here we go."
PFF not so high on the Browns' overall roster in their rankings
There might be reason for Browns fans to maybe scale back the expectations for the 2019 season a bit. After all, the team has not won a division title in 30 years and has a ton of volatile parts coming together. But there is no denying the abundance of high-end talent all over the Browns roster.
Fans who are more on the skeptical side will appreciate Pro Football Focus and their thoughts on the Browns overall roster. In PFF’s ranking of the 32 NFL rosters, Cleveland comes in at a seemingly low No. 18.
How could a team with Myles Garrett, Baker Mayfield, Odell Beckham Jr., Nick Chubb, Denzel Ward, Joel Bitonio, Olivier Vernon, Damarious Randall, David Njoku, Joe Schobert and more be in the bottom half of the league rankings? I don’t buy it either, so I’ll let them explain.
The Browns’ glaring weakness was their inability to tackle last season. The team ended the 2018 campaign ranked dead last with a team tackling grade at 34.7, and they collectively missed a whopping 194 tackles over the course of the regular season — 23 more than the next-closest team. Now that they have all the pieces in place on defense, improving on this fundamental aspect is a must.
There are some nits to pick with their projections. PFF lists Austin Corbett, Greedy Williams, Genard Avery and Antonio Callaway as starters (in packages). They’re also taking just a one-year view on both Christian Kirksey and Joe Schobert, both of whom played hurt and struggled as a result last season. Interestingly, they also do not factor in specialists, though that might not help the Browns with their ongoing kicking and special teams coverage woes.
It’s also fascinating that PFF ranks the Steelers in the top 10 when even most Pittsburgh fans will admit this is not close to their best team in recent years. New England tops the list, with the Arizona Cardinals bringing up the rear.
I don't think anyone will question why we got rid of Dorsey.
He brought a couple pieces here, but he was downright awful as GM and he was destroying this franchise.
One would have to wonder with everything Dorsey had to work with, when was he going to bring us those "real players."
I have a bad feeling that the inevitable stories of JD's antics - as well as FK's - will be rather embarrassing and telling.
We're still waiting for the complete Hue/Sashi and Hue/Haley stories. Actually, I'm still hoping to see Kyle Shanahan's exit interview powerpoint.
We did hear that Hue told Dorsey to get the fancy out of his office after telling him he was gone...then the worldwide under-the-buss-tossing tour Hue went on. Sashi did send a nice letter to Cleveland fans.
I imagine FK will get exposed for his stubbornness and lack of organization and that Dorsey will be exposed for repeating the same mistakes that got him fired in KC...autonomous player moves...salary butchering (Hubbard/Carrie)...and just being too sneaky.
His talent evaluation AND acquisition results are much overrated on the interwebs and especially by the talking heads who only saw OBJ/Hunt. The inability/unwillingness of supporters to detail out exactly who represents "that much talent" is rather telling.
It's because when dealing with people like you it's a waste of time and energy.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Maybe, A hands off organizational head, responsible for installing and nurturing a group: with specified roles and responsibilies; whose main focus would be keeping the group working together as "one" to get results.
A Gameplanning person, who's responsible for 365 days a year, planning for upcoming games, building a recipe for a win, but having little imput on gamedays, except for advice and adjustments.
A Game day manager: AKA, the Head Coach, which implements game day decisions, prepares the individuals, (players) to perform, prior to the games and during them, and also, gets all the positional coaches' groups to work together as a group.
I have to stop, I cant' even go on because this seems so...
Is this really this Hard? To figure out?
I think, they should have kept the GM, or the HC, or something, they wouldn't have to get rid of everything and start from scratch, again,
Quite frankly, I think our best bet is to get another convo going with Trent W, sign him then draft the best OT available, plug Trent in at LT, put the rook at RT, then when Trent is done (2 eh 1/2) years move him to LT
Quite frankly, I think our best bet is to get another convo going with Trent W, sign him then draft the best OT available, plug Trent in at LT, put the rook at RT, then when Trent is done (2 eh 1/2) years move him to left T
It'll be interesting to see what happens with Trent Williams now that Bruce Allen and the training staff have been fired. I wouldn't mind Jason Peters as a stop gap.
His talent evaluation AND acquisition results are much overrated on the interwebs and especially by the talking heads who only saw OBJ/Hunt. The inability/unwillingness of supporters to detail out exactly who represents "that much talent" is rather telling.
It's because when dealing with people like you it's a waste of time and energy.
As usual, when confronted with the actual facts you crumble...you have no credible response. I question whether you even know who he brought in coupled with who he let go...not to mention what contracts he doled out to marginal/bad free agents. Don't fret though, I'll enlighten you in the Roster thread in the near future..
You question everything that goes against your agenda. When it's explained to you, you would call blue, green and red, orange. That's why it's a waste of time.
You would dismiss the good things and players he brought in as though it were bad and give no credit where credit is due. You will take young players who may very well develop and judge them based on very little existing evidence.
Drafted and signed players need three years in the league before you see how they're going to mature and develop. You on the other hand will talk about what poor moves were made based on far less experience.
I've followed this team, the players that come and gp and their contracts as closely as anyone. Probably since before you were even born. Your BS doesn't really impress anyone but your assassin gang that works very hard to undermine the accomplishments made and the real players and talent that have been brought to this team.
If we hire a new coach that takes this same basic team to the playoffs, I'll be looking forward to the new load of BS you spread to explain it. Every player and former coach around the league knew the talent was here and predicted great things would happen. Of course some of the self appointed mensas such as yourself claim you know better than experts of the game. Get that weak crap out of here.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
There's a huge difference. I understand that Dorsey wasn't perfect and made his share of mistakes. But not bringing a far more talented roster the the Browns wasn't one of those mistakes.
And the vast majority of posters on this board, former players, former coaches and former NFL GM's agree.
The fact that a few stubborn people that think they know more than actual NFL experts on the game doesn't change that.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Quite frankly, I think our best bet is to get another convo going with Trent W, sign him then draft the best OT available, plug Trent in at LT, put the rook at RT, then when Trent is done (2 eh 1/2) years move him to LT
Agree with this.
We may be able to get Williams for a 3rd, we have an extra one. Might take more. Hopefully not.
A lot of mocks show good OTs available at 10. Like Saint says, we trade for Williams and draft an OT that can play RT out of the gate (there are a few said to be day 1 starters) then this OL is light years better.
There's a huge difference. I understand that Dorsey wasn't perfect and made his share of mistakes. But not bringing a far more talented roster the the Browns wasn't one of those mistakes.
And the vast majority of posters on this board, former players, former coaches and former NFL GM's agree.
The fact that a few stubborn people that think they know more than actual NFL experts on the game doesn't change that.
I agree, but not as much as some think. There is a lot still to be seen. Take OBJ as an example. On paper it looks good, but how much did he really help? One could even argue the guy hurt the team in some ways. JMO but if I could get a 1st rounder or trade him for a solid O-lineman, I would make the deal tomorrow. Hopefully the new coaches can crack the code and make him a star. Vernon, he can be a good player, but the history over the past few years is the guy is going to miss large chunks of the season due to injury. Is that going to change this year? I am hopeful it changes, but something tells me it isn't.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
Agreed. I don't know if we would have won any more games but we would be a better team moving forward with Zeitler and Peppers and kept some of the players we let go. JMO
Just knocking out Robinson's flags would move us forward. We have some immediate fix needs for FA and LT is one. Simple triage where you need to decide which ones can be saved first, then which ones to save. I am concerned we may behind on contract matters with Dorsey leaving and also what it means for scouting evals.
Look at what crippled us and cost us games. Get rid of that, not as scapegoats, because the losses remain. But stop the bleeding where we lose the same way repeatedly. Flag magnets change or go. We were better on paper than we played. Going forward isn't always good. We seem to have abandoned some of the old-fashioned success things winning teams harp on.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
regardless of what you think others thought, you still dismissed the good Sashi did and good players he brought in as though it were bad and give no credit where credit is due. That's the ironic part.
Dorsey did a good job and did add some talent but we also let go of some talent and some decent role players - Ogbah, Peppers, Duke, Fells, Nassib - they would all have been guys that would have really helped us this season. Richardson spent time at DE IIRC, which speaks of the depth we had. You can't obviously foresee losing both starting book ends but failing to prepare is preparing to fail. We also seemed to rotate OL in after trading Zeitler - and I think we committed one of the cardinal sins of not looking after the trenches adequately.
Perriman has done pretty decently at Tampa - 645 yards, 6 TDs - I think we should have done more to keep him. OBJ is a generational talent but I think if I had a re-do, I'd keep Zeitler, the 1st and Peppers and resign Perriman and find out what on earth happened to Higgins.
All's good with 20/20 and I appreciate that. I wish Dorsey well in his future endeavours. I simply hope we pull a San Fran and have GM, FO and Coach all on the same page for the foreseeable.
EDIT: When you look at the Titans last night, that's what I'd like to see. A tough, honest, hard nosed team who play old fashioned style but also can make plays passing. Vrabel has done amazingly well there, kudos to him.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
