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hahahaha the theme here was about OBJ being coachable due to his BS ... glomming VG in with OBJ when it comes to being coachable in that regard is a crock on a good day ... I said I knew what you were saying  was just adding to it 
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While OBJ didn't perform at a level we expected last year because of injury, clearly not knowing the play book and a number of other factors - I wouldn't give up on the trade just yet. If he doesn't want to be coached and ply his craft .... sure 100% .... but when healthy and focused he is an elite WR. I liked Higgins very much when he was actually playing and being solid - but he will never ever do for an offense what OBJ has the ability to do. You don't give up on that sort of talent so quickly and with so many variables that may have impacted his performance. jmo All good points. You might be right. I am beginning to wonder if he is worth having despite the talent.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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While OBJ didn't perform at a level we expected last year because of injury, clearly not knowing the play book and a number of other factors - I wouldn't give up on the trade just yet. If he doesn't want to be coached and ply his craft .... sure 100% .... but when healthy and focused he is an elite WR. I liked Higgins very much when he was actually playing and being solid - but he will never ever do for an offense what OBJ has the ability to do. You don't give up on that sort of talent so quickly and with so many variables that may have impacted his performance. jmo All good points. You might be right. I am beginning to wonder if he is worth having despite the talent. I think before we can answer that, we should take a long, hard look at what we want to be on the offensive side of the ball, and make an informed decision on that.... and THEN we can move forward in getting pieces to get us there. I think we severely shorcutted that first step last offseason. If we want to be a pass-happy offense, then we should definitely retain our elite WRs, but need to do some work at Oline. If we want to change to a run-heavy O, I think OBJ can be used land some more draft ammo to make that happen. A clear offensive identity should be agreed upon (and ideally that identity should be attainable), and then we can go to work.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
-PrplPplEater
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It's easy to pass judgement on a player who worked through an injury all year and still exceeded over 1000 yards receiving isn't it? Yeah, Higgins and Ratley should fill in nicely for him.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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***Hot take alert***
Is OBJ really injured?
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***Hot take alert***
Is OBJ really injured? That is sooooooo two months ago.
At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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***Hot take alert***
Is OBJ really injured? That is sooooooo two months ago. Lol. ***Lukewarm to cold take alert***
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***Hot take alert***
Is OBJ really injured? JC... I'm never sure of anything with OBJ...Does anyone know about Landrys injury...if he needed the surgery or not? I recall him stating he was going to see a specialist on the Friday after the season ended....then never saw anything ever after that.
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***Hot take alert***
Is OBJ really injured? Naaaaaa, he was faking ... the fact he created more separation on one play while in NY than he did all year here doesn’t really mean much ... prolly just lost a step ...  ...
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Al Holcomb was our linebacker coach in 2019 (and a close bud of Steve Wilks).
Holcomb was also in Arizona with Wilks and Carolina prior to that.
I would guess that this means that Steve Wilks is gone soon too.
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j/c: every time I see Jake Trotter's profile picture in a tweet, my brain shouts "but wait, there's more!"
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
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j/c: every time I see Jake Trotter's profile picture in a tweet, my brain shouts "but wait, there's more!"
I think he looks a lot like our new head coach.
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At DT, context and meaning are a scarecrow kicking at moving goalposts.
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It's easy to pass judgement on a player who worked through an injury all year and still exceeded over 1000 yards receiving isn't it? Yeah, Higgins and Ratley should fill in nicely for him. Imagine the yards he could have gotten if he used BOTH hands to catch the ball...or lined up without being told repeatedly...or ran routes like an elite WR. Baker should get an award for getting that mess to 1,000 yards. Higgins + Perriman was much more productive...and didn't cost 20 million either.
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or a first, third, and productive young player..
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It's easy to pass judgement on a player who worked through an injury all year and still exceeded over 1000 yards receiving isn't it? Yeah, Higgins and Ratley should fill in nicely for him. Imagine the yards he could have gotten if he used BOTH hands to catch the ball...or lined up without being told repeatedly...or ran routes like an elite WR. Baker should get an award for getting that mess to 1,000 yards. Higgins + Perriman was much more productive...and didn't cost 20 million either. And maybe baker shouldn’t had been so trash this season either.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Well didn't you know that being injured all season shouldn't mean anything? At least according to some people. And he still got over 1000 yards.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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I just hilarious how we had two injured WRs play the entire season, and yet one of them is the problem.
Everybody on the team could’ve played better, but it’s funny how the one guy who most people assumed would be he trouble maker didn’t do anything all season, but the fat QB who had crap mechanics and wouldn’t stop running his mouth seems to catch less heat.
The way people talk about OBJ, you’d think he was the quarterback of the football team. Oh wait, the actual leader seems to dodge heat despite being having the BIGGEST Regression of anyone on offense.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Monken is free from here ... talk about a weird year
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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I just hilarious how we had two injured WRs play the entire season, and yet one of them is the problem.
Everybody on the team could’ve played better, but it’s funny how the one guy who most people assumed would be he trouble maker didn’t do anything all season, but the fat QB who had crap mechanics and wouldn’t stop running his mouth seems to catch less heat.
The way people talk about OBJ, you’d think he was the quarterback of the football team. Oh wait, the actual leader seems to dodge heat despite being having the BIGGEST Regression of anyone on offense. Baker seemed to do just fine (heck he was a top 10 QB in the league in his rookie year) before OBJ showed up. Yeah it's true, Baker has plenty of work to do. Improve mechanics, get in better shape, learn a new offense (again). OBJ hasn't done him any favors though. I can't imagine being a professional football player and not even knowing where to line up at the end of the season. That is shameful and embarrassing. A million dollars a game, can't even get lined up by himself.
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? He was also better before Freddie kitchens got the HC job.
Obj not lining up properly is true and sad. You know what also is true and sad? A professional QB who doesn’t know where to throw the ball.
Such a shame. A franchise QB, can’t even stay in shape.
By the way, Haus, since OBJ has a warrant out, can you tell the entire board who also has been arrested on offense, complete with a police video and all?
And then, along with Calloway, can you explain to the board who was responsible for bringing those players on this team?
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Well now you know the facts Swish. Baker was fine............... until OBJ showed up.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Its funny watching people argue who sucked more. (funny and yet sad) Baker sucked Odell Sucked You both lose.
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Yet one was injured all season and one wasn't. Hmmmmm....
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
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Yet one was injured all season and one wasn't. Hmmmmm.... Hogwash. If your on the field your healthy. No excuse. I don't think the Hernia was causing him to drop balls that hit him right in his hands, no more or less than any excuse baker guys gave for him overthrowing guys with no pressure around him at times. Both players were not what they should have been. No excuses for either.
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Right? Having one of the best WR in the game is something no QB wants. Ever. Tom Brady HATED playing with Randy moss, amirite?
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Oh yea, we all lose. Finished 3rd in the division back to back.
And with Big Ben coming back next season, might happen again.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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? He was also better before Freddie kitchens got the HC job.
Obj not lining up properly is true and sad. You know what also is true and sad? A professional QB who doesn’t know where to throw the ball.
Such a shame. A franchise QB, can’t even stay in shape.
By the way, Haus, since OBJ has a warrant out, can you tell the entire board who also has been arrested on offense, complete with a police video and all?
And then, along with Calloway, can you explain to the board who was responsible for bringing those players on this team? Hmmm. I think you're getting at Baker getting arrested in college for running from the cops. Details are a bit shaky on that one. How about we agree that neither are ideal, and us Browns fans deserve better than this kind of drama. Put together a professional football team, in every sense of the word.
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Oh yea, we all lose. Finished 3rd in the division back to back.
And with Big Ben coming back next season, might happen again. Agreed. Wasn't taking a shot at you either, just trying to point out that every player had issues last year sucking - it wasn't beholden to OBJ, Baker, or anyone in particular. Tired over bickering about a lost season. I want to put last year as far behind us as possible.
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Browns offseasons suck because the DT community, 92.3 the fan viewers and everyone else is always at each other throats over this god forsaken team.
We went an entire decade without a winning record. The only team to do so. I’m just pissed off.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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I agree man. I mean damn we can’t even be optimistic about a new HC, because why should we?
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Right? Having one of the best WR in the game is something no QB wants. Ever. Tom Brady HATED playing with Randy moss, amirite? Tom Brady won six Super Bowls. Randy Moss didn't win a single one. Close, but no cigar. Owens? Nope Chad Johnson/Ochocinco? (who joined the Pats near the end of his career), Nope Antonio Brown? Nope Odell Beckham? Nope Need I go on? The funny thing is, the Patriots, Eagles, Steelers, and Giants have all won Super Bowls in recent memory. NONE of them did it with the above-mentioned diva wide receivers... wonder why? Football is a team game and you have to account for team building in the process, not just how big and fast a receiver is, or how much separation he can get from a DB. It's the NFL, receivers get open and offenses work best when the QB trusts his receivers and just throws to the open guy.. not the one who is screaming at the QB and offensive coordinator to get him the ball. Show me ONE team that has won a Super Bowl in the last generation with a diva wide receiver on the team (loosely defined here as 'in the locker room')... I'll wait. Jerry Rice won three, but nobody would dare call that guy a diva.
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Browns offseasons suck because the DT community, 92.3 the fan viewers and everyone else is always at each other throats over this god forsaken team.
We went an entire decade without a winning record. The only team to do so. I’m just pissed off. If I were running the team, we wouldn't have had ten twelve losing seasons in a row, I can guarantee you that. Ten winning seasons-- maybe, but that's tough to do. But yeah, I feel ya.
Last edited by Haus; 01/17/20 12:18 PM. Reason: 10, 12, who's even counting anymore
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I agree man. I mean damn we can’t even be optimistic about a new HC, because why should we? yeah, I actually really want to be too about the guy. Some took my discord after the hiring as a shot against Stefanski because I favored McDaniels - but they didn't understand what I was p'ed off about. I didn't really care about the HC hire, I cared about the way we are keeping the structure of the team. I wanted McDaniels because I knew they would have to structure and reorganize the team and it would have forced Jimmy out of the equation to an extent. If we had a normal structure I would be excited about him, Selah, JM, anyone. But we are stuck with this endless idiotic chain of command that will always fail.
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You just completely moved the goal post. We’ve gone from the one of the best to now talking about the ‘divas’?
And 2 of Brady’s six wins, a WR won super bowl MVP.
And santonio Holmes was a diva, and so was plexico Buress for the giants.
But since we want to move goal post now, can you tell me when’s the last time an unathletic fat QB barely 6 feet tall with a police video has won a super bowl?
I’ll wait.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
- Theodore Roosevelt
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Right? Having one of the best WR in the game is something no QB wants. Ever. Tom Brady HATED playing with Randy moss, amirite? Tom Brady won six Super Bowls. Randy Moss didn't win a single one. Close, but no cigar. Owens? Nope Chad Johnson/Ochocinco? (who joined the Pats near the end of his career), Nope Antonio Brown? Nope Odell Beckham? Nope Need I go on? The funny thing is, the Patriots, Eagles, Steelers, and Giants have all won Super Bowls in recent memory. NONE of them did it with the above-mentioned diva wide receivers... wonder why? Football is a team game and you have to account for team building in the process, not just how big and fast a receiver is, or how much separation he can get from a DB. It's the NFL, receivers get open and offenses work best when the QB trusts his receivers and just throws to the open guy.. not the one who is screaming at the QB and offensive coordinator to get him the ball. Show me ONE team that has won a Super Bowl in the last generation with a diva wide receiver on the team (loosely defined here as 'in the locker room')... I'll wait. Jerry Rice won three, but nobody would dare call that guy a diva. Wines Hard not only won a SB, but was MVP of said one. Very much a ME guy off the field - although he was a great TEAM guy on the field.
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Head coach/play caller - Freddie Kitchens
Associate head coach/offensive line – James Campen
Special assistant to head coach – Jody Wright
Offensive coordinator – Todd Monken
Quarterbacks – Ryan Lindley
Run game coordinator/running backs – Stump Mitchell
Wide receivers – Adam Henry
Tight ends – John Lilly
Assistant offensive line – Jeff Blasko
Offensive quality control – Jim Dray
Offensive quality control – Tyler Tettleton
Defensive coordinator – Steve Wilks
Defensive line – Tosh Lupoi
Assistant defensive line – John Parrella
Run game coordinator/linebackers – Al Holcomb
Pass game coordinator/secondary – Joe Whitt Jr.
Defensive backs – DeWayne Walker
Senior defensive assistant – Chris Jones
Defensive quality control – Deuce Schwartz
Defensive quality control – Alonso Escalante
Special teams coordinator – Mike Priefer
Assistant special teams – Doug Colman
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Right? Having one of the best WR in the game is something no QB wants. Ever. Tom Brady HATED playing with Randy moss, amirite? Tom Brady won six Super Bowls. Randy Moss didn't win a single one. Close, but no cigar. Owens? Nope Chad Johnson/Ochocinco? (who joined the Pats near the end of his career), Nope Antonio Brown? Nope Odell Beckham? Nope Need I go on? The funny thing is, the Patriots, Eagles, Steelers, and Giants have all won Super Bowls in recent memory. NONE of them did it with the above-mentioned diva wide receivers... wonder why? Football is a team game and you have to account for team building in the process, not just how big and fast a receiver is, or how much separation he can get from a DB. It's the NFL, receivers get open and offenses work best when the QB trusts his receivers and just throws to the open guy.. not the one who is screaming at the QB and offensive coordinator to get him the ball. Show me ONE team that has won a Super Bowl in the last generation with a diva wide receiver on the team (loosely defined here as 'in the locker room')... I'll wait. Jerry Rice won three, but nobody would dare call that guy a diva. Wines Hard not only won a SB, but was MVP of said one. Very much a ME guy off the field - although he was a great TEAM guy on the field. The guy that played tough, physical football, had a great feel for the game, and blocked like a tight end? I feel like that is proving my point more than it is refuting it.. I don't really remember all of Wines Hines Ward's publicity stunts, but it's been a while so maybe memory is getting the best of me.
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Right? Having one of the best WR in the game is something no QB wants. Ever. Tom Brady HATED playing with Randy moss, amirite? Tom Brady won six Super Bowls. Randy Moss didn't win a single one. Close, but no cigar. Owens? Nope Chad Johnson/Ochocinco? (who joined the Pats near the end of his career), Nope Antonio Brown? Nope Odell Beckham? Nope Need I go on? The funny thing is, the Patriots, Eagles, Steelers, and Giants have all won Super Bowls in recent memory. NONE of them did it with the above-mentioned diva wide receivers... wonder why? Football is a team game and you have to account for team building in the process, not just how big and fast a receiver is, or how much separation he can get from a DB. It's the NFL, receivers get open and offenses work best when the QB trusts his receivers and just throws to the open guy.. not the one who is screaming at the QB and offensive coordinator to get him the ball. Show me ONE team that has won a Super Bowl in the last generation with a diva wide receiver on the team (loosely defined here as 'in the locker room')... I'll wait. Jerry Rice won three, but nobody would dare call that guy a diva. Wines Hard not only won a SB, but was MVP of said one. Very much a ME guy off the field - although he was a great TEAM guy on the field. The guy that played tough, physical football, had a great feel for the game, and blocked like a tight end? I feel like that is proving my point more than it is refuting it.. I don't really remember all of Wines Hines Ward's publicity stunts, but it's been a while so maybe memory is getting the best of me.
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