DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Minnesota Pt.2

First off, a protest is not a riot and a riot is not a protest. I know that trying to label it as a "symptom" is a method of trying to diminish it, but the problem with that is both sides have to take responsibilities for their wrongs.

Stealing big screens TV's and a new pair of Nikes has nothing to do with George Floyd or is a symptom of it.

We must understand the difference between "day shift" and "night shift."

A protest by day becomes a riot by night because two different types of people occupy the same streets.

Looting is always, to some extent, going to occur in conjunction with mass expressions - and some people are always going to take advantage of chaos to make a few dollars.

What is important is that the protests are necessary and meaningful in this country. If the price we have to pay is a few windows being destroyed, and a few TVs being stolen -- the end goal of achieving a national reckoning with our horrendous past on race relations is more than worth it.

There wasn't a person on here arguing that the Cavs Championship wasn't worth it because a bunch of looting and vandalism occurred in the hours after the win. It's amazing (not actually amazing -- just horrendous political whataboutism) to pretend that looting is the most important story when our nation tries to address it's ugly past.

J/C

Still no Christians want to explain how Trump was acting godly after he cleared out peaceful protestors for a photo op?

When I was being raised in the church, there was a hymn we’d sing in school that talked about people would know you are Christian by your love. It talked a lot about showing your faith with humility and acting humble.

Maybe I’m totally off base here, but the stunt last night did not seem like a Christ like act.

Where in the Bible did Jesus use the Roman police to clear out a temple so he could snap a few pictures awkwardly holding a Torah?

Can the Christians on this board provide some insight on how what he did was Christ like?

Or are we going to keep being radio silent since he made his speech yesterday?

At least I show up to answer criticism of any liberal cause. Stand and be counted.

Agree, 100 percent...all the so called groups have their agendas, looters want to steal stuff they want AND know most cops won't stop them because they're all racists if they do...press wave their credentials and expect they can do what they want because the FREE press deserve the story....not following cop instructions is their right and then reporting brutality.

EVERYONE wants their agenda covered....including our current President....sad the two choices we have coming in NOV...God help us.

That is why I'm trying to draw such a contrast between the two. The vast majority of them aren't even the same people. They are two separate things with two separate sets of people who have two totally different sets of agendas.

They burned the Church of the Presidents. That is not peaceful. They damaged the Lincoln Memorial and the Vietnam Wall that is not peaceful. When cowardly acts like that take place you lose the right to say there was just peaceful protests taken place. We have all watched the TV the past few nights. There is nothing peaceful going on. As far as being a Christian. Jesus says render to Caesar what is Caesar's. When criminals start to act the way they are acting they are not rendering to Caesar. The vandalism is the reason the police were more aggressive yesterday and they will be justified if/when they need to get even more aggressive.

We disagree on a lot of what you posted. I don't feel the vast majority of Americans would consider any cop a racist for stopping or arresting someone who is rioting.

I don't actually believe the vast majority of the protestors support those who are rioting.

And lastly, I, much like yourself am not thrilled with our choices to lead this nation in November. But there is one truth I know. One will act to divide, blame and conquer in a time of crisis. One will work to unite in a time of crisis. One is willing to be held accountable. One is not.

As much as I may not be thrilled with the choices, to me the answer is obvious.

Looting isn't even close to the most important part of the story and the majority of looting isn't being started by legitimate protestors, it's being started by imported agitators who don't want peace or solutions, they thrive on the anarchy of hatred between white/black/police/government... They don't give a damn about George Floyd, they don't give a damn about social injustice, and they don't give a damn about your city or your local businesses because they ain't from there.

They are there solely to provide the distraction and fuel the counter argument.. and sadly a lot of people fall for it. If each one of these sad incidences and the aftermath is taking 2 giant steps forward in progress, these people show up to make sure it takes one big step back.

There is a reason that on the heirarchy of civil rights leadership, you have MLK... maybe Malcolm X as a distant second... and then everybody else. MLK fought hard against the distractions, he preached to not let the distractions happen, he KNEW the distraction would become the story that overshadowed the message...

I take it you and your family came out of everything safe? I was hoping that it was all a false rumor.

We all assumed it was and tried to convince my wife as much but it's 2020... so you never know.

Whether you look at the protesters or the rioters ... they are still the symptom. You don't have either without causation.

Focusing on the rioters simple removes the spotlight from the issue of endemic racism. That is the root cause. That is what needs fixing. Is the rioting good? No. Should it be acceptable? No. Should it take the light off the root cause? No.

Opportunists and delinquents who break the law because they are presented with a chance to steal, vandalize with a low probability of being held accountable have nothing to do with the protesters or George Floyd.

According to all four gospels, Jesus encountered many situations that could've turned violent or did turn violent.

Never did he disperse a crowd. The most he did was flip tables in the temple where followers of God were cherry-picking, much like you're doing, the very message they said they preached.

I've been away from Christianity and organized religion for 16 years now, and it's sad that I have retained more than you and you're still active in the church.

I have a feeling your wife and Eve and a lot of other conservatives were manipulated by the words of Trump and actions of white supremacists...

White nationalist group posing as antifa called for violence on Twitter

https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/security/tw...havior-n1221456

I wonder if arch will count this as me predicting something right? He counts everything else.

My wife doesn't like Trump, nor does she find his words credible, so I seriously doubt that was it. My wife has generalized anxiety anyway.. it doesn't take much to push her over the edge with stuff like this... she also isn't quite as tech savvy in how easy it is to manipulate social media to appear to be somebody you're not.

It doesn't surprise me at all that white nationalists are trying to manipulate people into blaming antifa for some of it... but despite the fact that "I KNOW NOTHING".. I'm still really sure that antifa was present and agitating... take that however you want.

j/c...

Sorry to hear that about your wife. This must all be really stressful for her then.

And you know a lot, you're one of the smarter posters on here. I'm just trying to make a point that until facts come out or are verified, don't jump to the ANTIFA conclusion so quickly. If this were a clan or white supremacists march I would be the first to say Antifa was behind some or all of the violence. But destroying neighborhoods and looting is just not their MO.

Glad to see you are coming around to the good side..a POTUS that respects the Constitution and puts America first. And all Americans. It's a good decision to stay away from the guy who just told African-Americans that they aren't (ain't...actually) black if they don't follow guys like him who have been in politics for 50 years and not done a darn thing to help the issue.

A dramatic improvement from the previous guy who saw everything through the eyes of race. The guy who proclaimed that "people" are inherently racist. A guy who ridiculed those who "cling to their bibles and their guns". Such wonderful words of healing.

If only we had a POTUS who created a business atmosphere so people could get jobs...all people. A POTUS who pre-COVID saw the lowest black unemployment rates in history.

If only we had a POTUS who saw the the Clinton-era crime effort created a disproportionate system of penalizing African-Americans. He could call it the FIRST STEP ACT...or something like that that would put more sense and compassion to those imprisoned for actions that don't equate to their punishment.

If only we had a POTUS who recognized that disadvantaged-communities won't be able to generate economic growth if the dollars aren't incentivized to be put into those economies. He could call eligible areas "Opportunity Zones". Money will flow into these disadvantaged-communities where people in those communities can have access to jobs, services and amenities.

If only we had a POTUS who recognized how important education is to economic prosperity and freedom. Put some serious $$$ where the mouth is and steer hundreds of millions of $$$ to HBCUs...make a statement...steer more there than any other POTUS in history.

If only...we had a POTUS who did this through his actions:
https://www.delgazette.com/opinion/80155/trump-helping-black-communities-thrive

As opposed to one who did this through his words:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/...ontroversy.html

Imagine the growth, opportunity and healing.

Would you argue the POTUS is a Christ like Christian?

I don't know anyone who is a Christ-like Christian. What are you asking me?

Real examples of things that really happened...vs...nothing but a meme. So typical.

Do you condone the actions of using The Bible as a prop for a photo shoot after non-violent protestors were cleared out in an unlawful way?

I'm not surprised you would try and turn something of great social importance into a Trump rally. It's like, what you guys do.

If Trump displayed any amount of common sense and an attempt at unity, you would have a point. He doesn't, so you don't.

You were the one to bring up who you were voting for POTUS...and why.

I do not condone that act. I do not see what Trump did in the same way that you did.

So you agree that what he did was something a Christian shouldn't do?

I didn't say who I was voting for. I never mentioned a name. That would be you.

And I commended you for choosing the guy who accomplished the things I said should be accomplished.

No, just no. Our nation is more divided than ever and he used his voice like pouring gasoline on a fire to make that happen.

He is a cancer and your posts are a symptom.

I don't see what he did as necessarily being non-Christian.

I don't try and judge how another person expresses their faith. (Not saying that you are doing that.)

We will have to agree-to-disagree whether that act was Christian-like or not.

j/c

Birmingham taking down Confederate monument

https://www.al.com/news/2020/06/watch-live-birmingham-taking-down-confederate-monument.html

As I grew up in a LCMS (Luthern Church Missouri Synod) congregation and school from preK-8th grade, we were taught to have conversations about our faith and the actions of others if need be.

I'm agnostic now, yet I saw what occurred last night and it went against all that I was raised with. At my ore I still hold many of these values yet I've evolved on some farther from just dogma.

What happened last night wasn't an act of love for God's creation in the Christian sense.

I get not wanting to judge and everything, but isn't there a time to take a stand?

Good. Put it in a museum dedicated to losers with immoral views.

Using the image of a Church and a Bible to threaten using our military against our citizens isn't really up for debate.

The head of the churches faith even denounced it.

Would sure be nice to see all Christians on this board stand in solidarity together on this.

This is disingenuous. You're asking Christians to defend him because you know it's wrong.

President Trump signed an executive order on religious freedom today.

it is meant to protect people of faith around the world.

“This executive order fully integrates the president’s vision – a vigorous defense of international religious freedom rights for all – into key aspects of United States foreign policy,” the official said. “Yet again, President Trump is taking a decisive action to keep his promise to people of faith around the world.”

That's never going to happen. It is odd he chose to do this in front of an Episcopal Church. They are a more open and welcoming group that one would know wouldn't accept or promote his behavior. But being respectful has never been on Trump's priority list.

It didn't prevent the Episcopal Church from being used like a dog by Trump yesterday. Maybe that's why he waited until today to sign the order?