The Scientists and Doctors said we would have 1.2 million dead in the first wave unless Trump intervened.
Trump did and we are no where near that number.
trump did squat. WE THE PEOPLE STAYED HOME! Saving millions of lives. trump did squat. Then trump demanded. WE THE PEOPLE TO GO BACK TO WORK! Even before states met government guidelines and y’all support it...helping to kill off thousands more. Pfffft trump and his supporters.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson.
Yo, the new eastern Bloc is nuts. Trump would fit right in with the trash leadership in Eastern Europe.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
Essentially the Political re-manifestation of the Baker discussions in football talk - virtually any aspect of the team's performance was dragged back to Baker. Virtually any discussion on PP is being directed to gang violence and black on black crime.
If someone was interested in that specific topic it would make a good thread unto itself . . . add to that Swish actually addressed that topic in a thread a while ago and answered it very specifically.
More lies. No wonder you and Pit are attracted to one another.
No, Trump has not killed anyone. At least that we know of. You say that for political reasons. You can say it all you want and I can correct you all I want. He has not killed anyone.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
No, Trump has not killed anyone. At least that we know of. You say that for political reasons. You can say it all you want and I can correct you all I want. He has not killed anyone.
trump actions / inaction's as killed US Citizens = trump has killed US Citizens.
If you have a bunch of people locked in your basement and you dont feed them. Did they just die? Or did you kill them?
Trump's leadership through Covid19 has been very poor. If you believe in top down leadership it's likely highly plausible that better leading by example would have lead to better behavior by Americans which would have lead to less cases and less deaths.
It is also highly plausible that had he done those things he would have been accused of being a dictator who is trying to control the American people and this would have been used as the ultimate example of that. You would have had a faction of people refusing to wear masks for this reason alone. And you wouldn't see nearly the articles you see every day reporting on the virus. Instead of the daily CNN article chronicling the healthy 35 year old who almost died from Covid, you'd be getting a daily article on the 100 year old man who got it and recovered in 2 days.
These are the times we are living in.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
I think Bad is using killed and responsible for the deaths of as interchangeable and you are using the terms in their strict sense
I think that Bad is making those comments due to political persuasion. I think you are defending him for the same reason.
I do not like Trump, but I feel that these false claims are out of hand and will only result in driving away the very folks we wish to convert.
Spreading a message is good. But, one must do so honestly and responsibly. If one can't do that, he loses his integrity and therefore will ultimately lose the battle he is engaging in.
Win w/intelligence and character. Not by hate and deceit.
Anyway, I will try and give my opinion on this mess from a political perspective. Or, maybe I will just make some off-the-cuff comments.
--I do not think Trump has done a good job at handling how our country has dealt w/the virus. I even started a thread in this very forum about it.
--I think people are putting too much--or not enough--blame on him due to their political preferences.
--I think that the results would not have been much different had Hilary been in office.
--I think that the economic concerns of the country have influenced on how we have dealt w/the situation.
--I put most of the blame on the selfish citizens who ignored all the warnings and decided to act in their best interests instead of the best interests of the US population.
--Lastly, I think this is a very complex subject because none of us have lived through anything remotely close to it. Opinions can change daily as new information is provided. Even the experts are unsure of how to proceed and what is coming in the future.
Thus, I think that instead of playing the blame game and trying to divide the country, those of us w/some sense of reason and possessing intelligence, should try to find ways to work together to combat the effects of this virus and the social unrest this country is facing. Some will say that attitude makes me a hateful soul, but I believe in the power of unity. I do not support the divide and conquer mentality, at all.
"I put most of the blame on the selfish citizens who ignored all the warnings and decided to act in their best interests instead of the best interests of the US population."
because trump encouraged it and did the same. It is that simple.
"I put most of the blame on the selfish citizens who ignored all the warnings and decided to act in their best interests instead of the best interests of the US population."
because trump encouraged it and did the same. It is that simple.
Sweden sees coronavirus cases drop, after controversially avoiding lockdowns
Its actions give credence to the freedom championed by conservatives rather than the safety defended by liberals
Giving credence to the freedom championed by conservatives rather than the safety defended by liberals globally, Sweden continues a downward trend of COVID-19 cases after a much-debated approach kept large parts of society open during the coronavirus pandemic.
“The curves go down, and the curves over the seriously ill begin to be very close to zero. As a whole, it is very positive," Sweden’s chief epidemiologist Anders Tegnell said.
While coronavirus cases increase in Europe, Sweden, which had called for its people to take personal responsibility instead of ordering government-mandated lockdowns, on Tuesday reported just two new deaths, bringing the confirmed toll to 5,702.
“With numbers diminishing very quickly in Sweden, we see no point in wearing a face mask in Sweden, not even on public transport,” Tegnell said.
Swedish officials declined to implement strict lockdown measures widely adopted in Europe. Large gatherings were banned, but restaurants and schools for young children have stayed open. The Swedish government has urged social distancing, and citizens have largely complied.
"We've actually seen a clearly declining trend in the number of patients in intensive care and also in the number of deaths since the middle of April," said Anna Mia Ekström, clinical professor of global infectious disease epidemiology at Stockholm’s Karolinksa Institute.
There have been nearly 80,000 cases in the country of 10 million people.
"Now we see one or two deaths a day and very few persons admitted to ICU (intensive care units)," added Jan Albert, a professor of infectious disease control at the Karolinska Institute.
"We are much better off now than we were in April," he told Euronews.
Albert acknowledged that medical professionals are working in uncharted territory with the virus.
He concluded: "We know that we've had more cases in Sweden than for instance in Norway and Denmark and Finland, our neighboring countries, many more. But whether that means that we are on our way to herd immunity is a big unknown."
Maybe this video will help, maybe not. I think there's some really good points in here.
Dr. Drew touts himself as an independent. He bashes all of our political leaders in the video, not just one side. I believe we're going to need to find a way to live with this virus.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Oh jeez, they covered so many things. I know it's a long video, but it's worth a listen. I don't think I'd do a very good job of transcribing it.
I think we all need to step away from worrying about what Trump said or didn't say months ago, we need to start listening to doctors. The ones that have experience in these things.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Oh jeez, they covered so many things. I know it's a long video, but it's worth a listen. I don't think I'd do a very good job of transcribing it.
I think we all need to step away from worrying about what Trump said or didn't say months ago, we need to start listening to doctors. The ones that have experience in these things.
I have no idea who you're talking about. I'm not interested in cancelling a doctor because they said something. We should listen to all the doctors and decide from there. Sometimes they don't agree, sometimes they make mistakes, but they're generally right. They're doctors, they handle the sick every day, they've practiced medicine through past outbreaks. I'm getting sick of hearing politicians or newspapers talk about what we need to do.
I hear a lot of people falling into the Dunning–Kruger effect. We read a few headlines, read a few tweets, catch a soundbite and then think we know the best way to treat a disease or pandemic. Anyone advocating for a full lockdown doesn't understand all the ramifications and conversely, anyone advocating this is nothing more than a little flubug is full of crap. The truth is in the middle and I'm hoping to share a bit of grey with the video (it's not perfect, but there's good info and it's cool to hear some seasoned doctors talk unfiltered about how we've handled X, why we need to worry about Y and why Z isn't a worry).
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Oh jeez, they covered so many things. I know it's a long video, but it's worth a listen. I don't think I'd do a very good job of transcribing it.
I think we all need to step away from worrying about what Trump said or didn't say months ago, we need to start listening to doctors. The ones that have experience in these things.
Bro, I have been listening to the experts since the very first time I considered this virus as a real threat. The posts are still on here. I was one of the first to start threads and talk about the dangers of this virus.
I do not rely on the advice of politicians. I don't trust any of them. I do my own research and there was a ton a ton of information out there on what to do and what not to do. People blaming politicians are only doing so in order to further their own political beliefs. That doesn't help us at all.
There's a reason I've been away from these threads, it's the same argument from many that I could copy and paste from early April. And I'm not bashing just one side.
Listening to Dr. Drew has helped me stay "calm" during the past 4 months. I stay away from Trump, I stay away from people reacting to Trump and listen to doctors. They'll get us through this.
There's a bit of everything in there. He hosts a call almost every day, sometimes 30 minutes with no guest where he's just taking questions from the stream, sometimes it's a celebrity but most of the times it's a doctor that doesn't always agree with Drew. I seem to get the most out of those sessions. This doc agreed with Drew a lot, but not on vaccines. She thinks we won't find a vaccine or if we do, it won't be nearly as effective as some are hoping. And if its not, how steadfast will some school boards in Cali stick to their mandate that they won't open schools until nobody in their county does from covid for 14 straight days. Newsflash, your schools won't be open for the next 2-3 years then. I don't think that's realistic.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
I try to be cool to everyone on here. I can only remember 1-2 times I've gotten upset (or someone was upset at me). I preach to my daughter to find the grey, the middle, because that's where the truth sits. I know people roll their eyes when I say I'm apolitical or always land in the middle of every political quiz, but it's true. I try to see each persons side during an argument and then strip away their emotions or bias. Sometimes it's not too easy.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Reading your post made me think of something I read today about kids. As of last weekend in one state (Florida), there have been over 31,000 kids under 17 that tested positive for covid, over 300 hospitalized and a handful of deaths.
Reading your post made me think of something I read today about kids. As of last weekend in one state (Florida), there have been over 31,000 kids under 17 that tested positive for covid, over 300 hospitalized and a handful of deaths.
In the video the doctors discuss that. Kids 14 and under have an almost zero chance at getting or passing it on. In the 15-17 range, they start becoming more adult than kids and then therefore have the receptors that can cause some to allow the virus grow/infect (whatever the right term would be).
I don't know what you mean by "a handful of deaths". Three? Five? And that's in 2020. If 5 kids died in the past 6 months in a huge state like Florida, without knowing their exact age, medical condition and anything else, I don't know what to tell you. Is that enough to go under lockdown again? I don't think so.
Look, I'm not a doctor. I don't know the rates in which kids under 17 died of the flu, HPV or whatever. Maybe that's a great number (you know what I mean, I'm not celebrating 5 kids that died, but 5 might be well within a normal or good range). I don't think you can hear "5 kids died in the past 6 months in Florida" and then make policy over it. What if 15 kids died in Florida last year from the flu? I'm not saying the flu and Covid are the same, just saying, without knowing all the stats, all the numbers, be able to compare them against normal years, it's hard to know what to do with that story.
It's possible I die from covid. I have an autoimmune disease. But if you only read that a 46-year old died in Chicago from covid today, I don't think that should make anyone stay inside for the next 18-24 months. All I'm saying, is talk and listen to the doctors. One news report from Florida and how you interpret it might not be how 99.X% will be impacted.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
Reading your post made me think of something I read today about kids. As of last weekend in one state (Florida), there have been over 31,000 kids under 17 that tested positive for covid, over 300 hospitalized and a handful of deaths.
In the video the doctors discuss that. Kids 14 and under have an almost zero chance at getting or passing it on. In the 15-17 range, they start becoming more adult than kids and then therefore have the protein that can cause some to allow the virus grow/infect (whatever the right term would be).
I don't know what you mean by "a handful of deaths". Three? Five? And that's in 2020. If 5 kids died in the past 6 months in a huge state like Florida, without knowing their exact age, medical condition and anything else, I don't know what to tell you. Is that enough to go under lockdown again? I don't think so.
Look, I'm not a doctor. I don't know the rates in which kids under 17 died of the flu, HPV or whatever. Maybe that's a great number (you know what I mean, I'm not celebrating 5 kids that died, but 5 might be well within a normal or good range). I don't think you can hear "5 kids died in the past 6 months in Florida" and then make policy over it. What if 15 kids died in Florida last year from the flu? I'm not saying the flu and Covid are the same, just saying, without knowing all the stats, all the numbers, be able to compare them against normal years, it's hard to know what to do with that story.
It's possible I die from covid. I have an autoimmune disease. But if you only read that a 46-year old died in Chicago from covid today, I don't think that should make anyone stay inside for the next 18-24 months. All I'm saying, is talk and listen to the doctors. One news report from Florida and how you interpret it might not be how 99.X% will react.
5 deaths in Florida, the last being a 9 yr old girl with no known pre existing conditions. Died in like 2 days after getting a fever.
I didn’t refer to anything about shutting down. Just looking at the numbers, the hospitalization rate is low, death rate very low but 1 is too many. Just seemed like 31k cases in one state is a lot. And a lot of worried moms and dads.
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