DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus One Major Problem With American Culture Today

So, i told you all before they i really enjoy reading about what other people around the world are going through, with their individual politics and such.

i especially like observing western Europe, as they are obviously the closes to us in terms of culture and values.

When i try to think of our history as americans, one thing i keep noticing is in today's world, we really don't have a direction as an american society.

here's what i mean by that. Typically in a homogeneous culture, a people would have more or less the same idea what the country should strive to be. a shared vision.

how long has it been since american had that? if you go and think about 1776 up until WW2, the shared vision amongst americans was gaining and SUSTAINING independence. expanding out to the pacific, defending the home turf once more in 1812, etc.

then thanks to JFK, landing on the moon was a priority, and it was a massive accomplishment for america and human being as a whole. then we had a shared vision about defeating the commies during the cold war, more or less ending with reagan's "tear down this wall" speech.

but ever since then?

what have we been doing except...existing? we couldnt even unite long term over 9/11. thats the truth. we united a bit when we went to afghanistan, but the moment we decided to go to iraq, the country became completely split, and continues to widen since that moment.

nobody, from our government down to the people, can agree on what this country should be about. what we should represent. we don't even talk about the bill of rights and US constitution with much pride anymore in this country, for multiple reasons.

we just have no direction. and because we have no direction, i think its a big part as to why we are at each others throats all the time in this country. we just became so...spoiled and entitled. its got to the point that american society can absolutely be summed up into reality tv shows across the networks.

For god's sake, we have a POTUS who brags and whines about how much ratings he's getting. that is the epitome of what i'm talking about.

in america, if you aren't shooting off fireworks, bragging on FB or IG about what you're doing or who you donated to, then it means that whatever you're doing isn't important enough to matter.

and i believe this is what happens when we allow the toxic nature of capitalism to leak into our social lives. we have become so overly competitive with one another that everything is a one-up competition. we all forgot to leave work at home, but the opposite has happened.

having no direction has directly led to American society having an 'every man for himself' mentality in damn near every aspect.

The american people dont have shared values and goals anymore. we all have a much different idea of what america should be, and because of that, we have a government unable - or unwilling- to provide the direction necessary to move our country forward.

government is most certainly a reflection of our people right now. vindictive, taking no responsibility, constantly point fingers, and beating our chest like gorillas.

i say this now because its just so hard to care about anything anymore. if life today around the world is the work of "intelligent species", i think those indigenous tribes who shoot arrows at outsiders to stay away might be on to something.

I can agree with that. I think internet culture is a part of it also.

I watch people at each others throats on the internet.
Then I leave and go to a bar and everyone of all races are cool with each other.

People should unplug sometimes and go be around actual human beings.

Also, I feel politicians and big media are corrupt. They make money by having the highest ratings and votes. So they need dramatic stories. They acheive that by being dramatic and riling people up into sides. You cant read or watch anything anymore without some political spin to it.

its just so crazy what the internet has done.

i agree that people go out in public, and in general its fine. but is it because thats our nature, or due to the fact that most of the crap said on the internet is stuff people wouldn't dare say in real life?

maybe a bit of both.

having good manners doesn't translate to being a good person, from what i've seen.

and yea i completely agree about politicians and the media.

there was a comedian who said they should all where the corporate logo on their suits so we know who we're really talking to.

he couldn't be more accurate today.

This is why I've said that I miss the cold war. At least we had a common enemy we could all root against. Ah, the good old days when chants of, "USA! USA! USA!", were not considered racist, and the majority of us called ourselves Americans without a hyphen.

While I do agree somewhat about internet culture, where everyone is trying to one up everyone else, I think the problem has more to do with anonymity. A person can be as rude and nasty as possible without fear of any repercussions. People don't act the same in pubs because they know they'll lose teeth.

I also think part of the problem are our lawmakers at all levels. They should not be making laws just to make laws. There should at least be a need. They should mostly be concerned about budgets, and how best to use money. Our lawmakers create strife out of thin air all the time.

The political parties have become subservient to ideology, which precludes pragmatism and compromise.

The American people are reflecting the ideology of the political parties, which creates greater conflict.

i agree... i feel the internet and social media particularly have made the divide much deeper... but i agree with Swish to a degree... it seems like even 10-15 years ago both sides of the isle at least respected each other and tried to work with each other. Now a days it's who can blame who and who can one up the other...

I agree with a lot that's been said ... then there are things like Money? People or corporations with too much power/influence?

Regarding a common goal or motive - I think back to immediately after 9/11 ... we had the entire world on our side. There was compassion and empathy. Solidarity between Americans and the rest of the democratic free world.... seems that moment was entirely lost and squandered by politics and the influence of the War mongers ... the attack against Iraq / Saddam had very little if anything to do with 9/11 ... the intel was manipulated and while most of the rest of the world new there was no arsenal of WoMD - it was rammed through. To question the war effort meant you were un-American. We lost standing and credibility with Allies like England and Tony Blair much loved before those events is a despised individual in Britain for towing the line.

When you talk about being united together - that's the time I think and the subsequent events that split the country after. . . . That's just m personally. I know there is a lot more going on throughout history etc and the internet is certainly a game changer too. Not only regards to individuals - but the media being 24/7 and the need for sensationalism etc.

Interesting topic.

You obviously have overlooked your neighbor to the north. Disappointing, Swish...

Not learning from our history

Which happens when people change history to fit their agenda.

At least to some degree I see what you're saying. I think a lot of it boils down to mans lowest common denominator. Tribalism. Watching what's going on around us has to make at least some who believe in evolution question it. Rather than move forward as evolution would have you believe, the mentality of most has moved back to the stone age. With the exception of dragging women around by the hair of course.

You would think over time the thought process would progress. But anything deemed progressive is fought against tooth and nail and deemed as something evil.

I would have thought by now people would at least be able to unite on basic human dignity of his fellow man. That things such as housing, wages, healthcare and other basic things all people need to have a better and normal life would be something Americans could agree on as has been done in many other democratic nations.

But this nation is too dog eat dog to put people ahead of greed and capitalism on any level. So we keep hearing reasons and excuses why most of the free world can do these things while we can't.

We see it on this very board how some posters try and label entire political parties by the actions of small factions that exist within those parties. Trying to use such examples to label and claim "they are all alike". How those who have differing views hate America. It's disgusting.

The problem with American culture today is that it's the obvious conclusion to the story that began with the two party political system. The majority of the population have (d)evolved to the point that they believe anything related to the other side of the aisle is evil, and must be fought to the bitter end. It is forbidden to consider that they may have some valid points. "We must not give an inch....if we recognize anything positive with them, we could lose some power". No one will ever admit that they are or were wrong, the other party will pounce all over it and consider it a sign of weakness. They feel they must dig for any ounce of garbage they can find in a candidate's history, no matter how mundane or how many years ago it occurred. This eliminates a lot of good people from running.

What people aren't considering is what got Trump, a non conventional politician, elected in the first place. Despite the above, there are a considerable number of people that are sick of this system and will vote for something, practically anything, different from the status quo. They saw Hillary and the other republican candidates as the SOS. I'm not referring to the republican party faithful here. A lot of people saw Trump as something fresh and figured the damage he could do wouldn't be worse than what we've had for the past few decades, and maybe voting for him could shake up the system. These people are a silent group, evidenced by the polls and media predicting a Hillary landslide. But there were enough of them to get Trump elected.

So what do the dems do? Throw in a fossil of a candidate that has played the party system shenanigans his entire career. smh

While there is certainly a degree of validity in what you posted, I think those who simply voted for someone who came from outside the system can now see that you must also consider who that person is and how they conduct themselves. Simply voting for someone because they weren't a part of the political scene in and of itself is flawed logic.

There are people outside of politics I believe could make fine presidents that both parties could run. But as you stated, many qualified people would never consider running due to it putting themselves and their family under the microscope. But as we saw in 2016, it seems people aren't really that concerned with what the microscope slides uncover.

Bringing in an outsider has opened our eyes to a vast cesspool of corruption.

The Propaganda of the National Media.
The Corruption of the heads of the FBI.
The Corruption of the heads of Intelligence.
Supposed Allies, paying us lip service while refusing to pay their fair share of Defense.
The Left with their Socialist ideology and destructive focus for America.

Mmmm,hmmm...

Perfect example of the very thing jfan was describing.

trumps presidency has showed us many things.
That with the right appointments (Barr) corruption at the highest level can be covered up.
That electing a businessman will lead to him handing huge tax cuts to billionaire businessmen.
That thinking a guy that constantly worked the system to his favor as a crooked businessman was going to change the system that got him there was insanity.
That having a mental midget in the highest position would put us in the worst position during a pandemic.
That having a cult following doesn’t take intelligence. Just speaking to the worst in people.
That there are still people in this country in so much denial of what’s obvious about this man.

There is nothing that unites us anymore, only things that separate us. The reason terrorism didn't do it was because it is a hidden enemy, unlike communism and fascism, whose leaders get up in front of thousands of people in there home nation and preach, terrorist hid in caves and bunkers.

Also, our country's system is built on compromise, and no one does that anymore. I think it started with the tea party and their 'my way or the highway' mentality. Compromise is weakness and there is no way someone on the other side could have a valid point.

Portland police are scrambling to respond to 15 homicides in the city so far in July.
That’s the most killings in one month in more than three decades, they said.

https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2020/07...ee-decades.html

Experiment failing.

Yet I’d rather live here than be your neighbor.

Like a Batman comic, It's sad to watch what's happening to Dem-run cities.

Social Media is the WORST cancer to ever be invented by human beings.

Its the number one reason why society is what it is today. It gives a voice to morons who otherwise would not have one. Its very nature allows fringe and extremist views on both sides to be pushed to the forefront and made to seem important while all the moderate normal people are just silenced and drowned out. Social Media gave rise to the activist journalists who care more about pushing SJW agendas then they do reporting factual news.

I don't disagree with you Swish. No one wants to work together anymore, our government can't even compromise and pass a budget let alone do anything substantial.

Where do we go from here?

I agree in the sense that social media has become anything but social. And the crap people post/repost/share that is so obviously wrong, full of mis-truths, or lacking proof just boggles my mind. Makes me wonder if they even read or looked at it before they shared it.

I know we have discussed mental health issues on here as well, and I think it is all tied together. Just look at the number of posts and photos people put up waiting for a reaction and self confirmation that they are important/loved.

It's like they are being conditioned to not be able to deal with reality when someone says they don't love/like something of theirs or about them.

'40, that's like the headline in a Trump-leaning media that only wants to highlite one side of a much larger story...

We are infants in a digital world. Until we get out of the social media growing pains it’s going to be more of the same.

Seems like Columbus has more than that, though I just read recently we have like 112 average 147 record for the year, 1997.
Actually when I read there was a highlight of 15 homicides I kind of figured they were all at once, one hour or one night.
It sucks that living in any city, sucks.

Things like Facebook, heck, even these message boards divide us. It's easy to sit there and ridicule behind a keyboard. It's not the same when you are looking people in the eye, and I am not even talking about any whoop ass factor. Not at all.


When you look a person in the eyes, you understand the meaning behind a comment. Written words can come off as more inflammatory. You don't see a persons eyes and body language.


Say as example I said "don't be an ass".


In person you might see me with raised eyebrows, a civil voice inflection, and slight smile on my face.

On the net, it is read as a dirty tone, furrowed brow, and no slight smile on the face. What went from a innocent comment went to being taken as a insult.

We just don't communicate the same way anymore. We are losing something as humans. We are losing what makes us human.

Depends on who you say that too. Maybe a friend. Say it to a trump supporter MAGA hater in person who you don’t know and expect a knock down drag out brawl.

LOL....Go away pal....I have a smile on my face

Don’t be an ass about it. Lol.

Since the scourge of Trump has been removed....

More Than 1,000 Protest Peacefully in Portland as Federal Agents Withdraw

https://time.com/5874586/portland-peaceful-protests/

They are not really withdrawing though

The Feds are still watching with drones, and are in the process of identifying and getting warrants for all the violent people they observed commiting crimes from drones. They have been watching these people with drones for months.

In a few weeks, many people in Portland will have a Federal SWAT team kicking in their door at 3am and hauling them off to jail...they saw you lighting that federal car on fire, they saw you busting out all those windows, they saw you rioting...they know who you are, they know your name, etc...mark my words...you just don't "get away" doing what these folks done...just doesn't happen...maybe in 1970 it does, but not today...be a rude awakening for many.

Justice will be served I assure you. these people will be brought to justice for their crimes.

Say what you will. When they had a physical presence it only escalated the violence. Now that they are no longer front and center on the street thing have improved. There's really no way to sugar coat that.

You just keep posting from the same guy who shows less than 20 people on his Twitter feed claiming it represents thousands that have been there. Zero credibility factor.

Portland protest peaceful after federal presence reduced

https://www.wbtv.com/2020/08/01/oregon-hopes-changes-ongoing-portland-protests/

Calm night of protests in Portland after Oregon State Police step in for federal officers

https://www.kgw.com/article/news/local/p...f3-07eb76000450

I guess you think some right wing Twitter poster knows more about what's going on there than the local journalists. But then again I'm not surprised by that.

July 29th-July 30

People blocked vehicular traffic in the area for several hours. During this time, people in the crowd made speeches, yelled, chanted, and banged on the fence surrounding the Mark O. Hatfield U.S. Courthouse.

As the night progressed, the group that remained in the street continued to gather primarily outside the Mark O. Hatfield U.S. Courthouse. They wore gas masks and helmets, and carried signs, hockey sticks, lacrosse sticks, umbrellas, leaf blowers, and fireworks. People outside the Courthouse threw rocks, bottles, gas canisters and other objects towards the building.

While officers were providing security for the parks, two subjects were arrested:

34 year-old Kristina Naranja Rivera was charged with Disorderly Conduct II and Criminal Mischief II,

25 year-old Camillo Massagli was charged with Criminal Mischief II, Trespass II, and Interfering with a Peace Officer.

Several concerning items were located in the park, including weapons such as a pipe, chain with a lock, and a sledgehammer. Other items seized included leaf blowers, helmets, body armor, and shield. There were shocking amounts of refuse in the parks as well.
https://www.portlandoregon.gov/police/news/read.cfm?id=251051

At times people lit small fires along sidewalks on surrounding blocks and attempted to light fires inside the fence at the federal courthouse. Others in the crowd put the fires out. Some people climbed on or near the fence at the federal courthouse, but others admonished them and they got down. People could be heard in the crowd repeating that the protest was to remain peaceful.
https://www.portlandoregon.gov/police/news/read.cfm?id=251054

August 1st
On August 1, 2020, at about 8:50 p.m., people began to block traffic along Southwest 3rd Avenue outside the Mark O. Hatfield U. S. Federal Courthouse. Hundreds of people gathered for several hours giving speeches. A large portion of the crowd marched through downtown before reforming back along Southwest 3rd Avenue.

Meanwhile, a group of about two hundred marched from Laurelhurst Park, blocking traffic lanes, to the Penumbra Kelly Building, 4735 East Burnside Street. The group stood blocking East Burnside Street, shined bright lights at Portland Police officers standing outside the building, directed lasers at the officers and eventually began throwing glass bottles at them. Vehicles blocked East Burnside Street from Northeast 47th Avenue to Northeast 50th Avenue.

A person in the crowd threw a glass jar or bottle filled with paint, which struck a Portland Police officer in the head. The officer was not injured. Portland Police provided public address announcements directing people to remain off of the property of the Penumbra Kelly Building and to move away to the west. As people continued to throw glass bottles and other objects Portland Police declared that the assembly blocking East Burnside was unlawful and directed people to disperse.
https://www.portlandoregon.gov/police/news/read.cfm?id=251060


I guess people will fall for any headline.

So how does that change the fact that violence decreased in Portland after federal agents left the streets? It doesn't.

Ok. So I guess the "zero creditbility" thing is over and done with since you've chosen to steer it in another direction as you seen the police info..

How are you quantifying your violence has deceased claim, by the way?

Personally, I don't know if it has or not. Yet I see the same thing happen each and every night there it seems.

I'm guessing if it has, it has to do the the Feds and Local police working in concert to rid the area of these thugs. It's amazing what in increased amount of human capital can do when you initiate a very deliberate plan.

Still, I haven't seen much to think there has been a dramatic decrease. People still being arrested. People still throwing bombs. People still lighting fires. People still assaulting one another.

But hey, this is your "fIGhT FiRe wItH FiRe" mantra. You should be proud.