DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Everything Else... COVID-19 vaccine #2

I hate the masks because they make my glasses fog, and I get extra sweaty when wearing one. I guess I could go buy the more expensive masks, but that seems like a waste of resources to me.

I went to 4 different grocery store yesterday, and I have to admit that it was nice to see people smiling again. I wore my mask, and I probably will for a couple of weeks, to make sure that people aren't being re-infected, but after that, the mask is history.

Yeah, we'll learn a lot about "herd immunity" over the next few weeks. It will be interesting to see if there are any spikes in numbers. I don't think there will be -- I said on Easter that covid is an afterthought by July 4th. It was all simple math by then, and math very seldom lies.

Went to a baseball game, the zoo, and go-cart racing over the weekend... every place was "busy" (even though the ballpark was still staggering seating). It was nice to not wear a mask, especially since temps were near 90. Indiana peeps have seemed to be much more diligent than Ohio; even after the Gov removed the mandate, most people still had one on. Once the CDC said it was safe -- all the masks went flying. It seems weird to see faces again.

I play it by ear. I keep one in hand. If it looks like most are wearing, I'll stick it on. If it looks like most aren't, I'll keep in in hand.

Which is oddly the opposite of what a safe precaution would be. If everyone else is wearing a mask, you’re likely safe without one. If no one is wearing a mask, you wearing one would keep you safer.
I do understand the social construct for your response but it is contradictory to the actual science in this case.

Half the people in Meijer were not wearing masks on Tuesday.

I understand.

I think you know I am a cautious person.

In the end, the science says if I am vaccinated, it is good to go without a mask indoors and to use a mask if not. Well, I am, so it is time to carry on.

Here too. People everywhere with no masks. And I just read this week that 50% of US adults are now vaccinated at least one shot... that means 50% are not vaccinated.

At first this had me mad because I've done everything asked of me during this pandemic while watching others kick and scream and cheat their way through over politics, ignorance, and stupidity. And I DO understand vaccination scepticism, especially in POC. But I'm fully vaccinated and should be able to go without a mask AND not have to feel guilty that I might make somebody else (not vaccinated) sick. But we know that's not going to be the case. Idiots will idiot, and those of us who are responsible and care about our fellow man will have to decide if we want to be trapped in mask up mode for the next several years. NOPE. I did what they asked and I'm supposed to be safe now, so I'm going to shed that mask next week.

Wife gets her first Pfizer shot tomorrow. Cant wait for daughter to get her second shot, and the wife to get done. Then we will all be vaccinated, we’ve been pretty lucky since this all started, none of us has had any problems, but we have been overly cautious and it has worked for us.

I still cant believe that there are people that still.drive their
Vehicles with their marks on. Talk about prisoners of their own
Paranoia and fear.
It's nice to see smiles on faces.
I cant wait to go out in public and the only mask I see is on a catcher
Or its Halloween.
Thank god the Amy Acton Fanclub will cease to exist.

After 14 months of working from home-I got called back in the office last week.
I have a closed in office that basically nobody else ever comes in-they stand in the hall or I tell them to put on a mask-I have been double vaccinated for about 2 months and still wear mine everywhere.
I have talked to (5) people that I work with for more than about 5 minutes-they all brought up covid and vaccinations-1 is vaccinated and 4 are not-I didn't ask or tell them I was. One said she doesn't want to be branded or tagged-so she isn't wearing a mask-one guy in his late 20's says him and his wife are ready to work on a second kid and the vaccine messes with the little guys count and makes guys infertile-the other woman says she isn't getting no frigging shot and my foreman that is working on 2 of my largest hospital projects hears that the vaccine has more problems than just getting covid-and when I was talking to all 4 of these-3 in the office and one on a jobsite in a hospital-none of them were wearing a mask and I was.

also, went to a grocery store tonight and the mall by our house yesterday. In the grocery store, there was about 25% wearing masks-none of the workers were wearing masks.

at the mall, it was about 50/50-and it was really busy-like a couple weeks before Christmas busy-but what stuck with me was how many young mom and dads with kids in the 2-13 range where mom and dad and none of the kids were not wearing masks. We shall see what happens.

Signs started popping up here that say "If you are vaccinated, masks are optional", so I decided I was done punishing myself for what others don't want to do... I'm vaccinated and that is reasonably safe, so I stopped wearing them wid week. I saw Bill Maher talk about it Friday night, and he had no symptoms at all after testing positive and being fully vaccinated. I think it's the best call. People don't want to protect themselves, then there's not much else we can do.

EDIT - But at the same time, my doctors office and the hospital here will not be dropping their masks mandates. And I can't say that I blame them. And some of the local city offices plan to wear them at least a bit longer than June 2nd. So there's that too.

This one is easy for me.

I get out of the car, I grab the mask. If a door sign tells me that masks are required, I'm good to go. If no sign or mandate, I check out the clientele. I'll wear it if most others still seem to. If the place looks chill and safe, the mask goes into my pocket.

The whole mask thing was never a political point for me- instead, it was a public health issue and exercise in civic responsibility. There was no way I was ever going to make a choice that would have disgraced My Parents' training.

This past year has changed me somewhat. I'm not real keen on the resumption of shaking hands. If I feel a bit under the weather, I'll most likely wear a mask out of common courtesy. I'll stop showing up to work when I know I'm sick. And the 20-sec handwashing thing is now an ingrained 'good habit.' I see no good reason to relax that new standard.

I hope hat this year of challenge compels a good number of us to re-evaluate some of these points. I fear that if the vast majority of us go back to 'biz as usual,' we will get complacent, lazy and careless... and leave ourselves vulnerable again.

There is nothing more dispiriting that seeing us NOT learn from our experiences.

But we have seen this more than once, Clem. Wave #1, Wave #2, Wave #3.....

I don't really believe we had any ability to control the virus through any of those waves by any action taken. Because the places hardest hit had the most restrictions. I think that the only thing that has stopped it is the vaccine.

Was having a discussion with a perspective client the other day and as we were wrapping up I put my hand out out of habit and we shook. A few seconds later we looked at each other and I apologized telling him I understood we don't really do that anymore and that it was out of habit. He told me not to worry about it because he was vaccinated and felt safe. But just the fact that it was even a thing kind of struck me in that same way.

Yeah- we're in this weird period, for sure.

When this all first started, I mentioned this idea in a thread:

From my days studying Eugue-Ryu, a slight bow (in the Japanese fashion) was always attractive to me. It gave the other his space, yet conveyed respect and regard. I found it to be civilized and restrained, and much to my liking. The irony was that after that slight bow, both parties were intent on kicking the s# out of each other for about 9 minutes!

I like the bow. It's neat, clean... and I'm really, really practiced at it.


Easy choice for me.

I was never really able to get used to not shaking someone's hand at work and stuff. For some reason that always bugged me. I imagine others have similar struggles modifying other behaviors (especially covering their face).

Semi-honest question....

So where are we on masks today? Do they protect the wearer, or no (I'm talking about not-respirators)? I feel like we've bounced back and forth on this point a couple times over the course of the pandemic.

I think Ohio is the perfect example of us absolutely having control over this. OH didn't just limit the first wave, we absolutely crushed it. New cases were rising and then OH responded and it eased and then trended down. Then the subsequent waves started and the response was muted and the new cases were allowed to climb. Just my .02.

Cloth masks don’t do a ton to protect the wearer. If everyone is wearing them it helps as it keeps everyone’s airborne droplets lower. That said, a well made cloth mask that fits well and has proper layers can be somewhat effective in protecting the wearer.
The masks I wear protect the user. Obtaining KN95 masks has been relatively easy since the pandemic started its spread. I ordered some right before all hell broke loose. I’ve been wearing them in public since. I honestly don’t understand why more people didn’t go this route.

I've just been getting annoyed about the yo-yo'ing regarding guidance over mask-wearing. Masks and viruses are not new... why is there so much confusion?

Now that my mini-rant is done, I've been giving lots of thought towards my mask wearing. I'm still wearing like I did before because I'm used to it, and if it makes someone feel better, that's fine. Also, my wife works for a local hospital system here and I do want to support her 'back-up-talk-with-action' thing.
I'm not going to be tied to my mask for forever. I see myself keeping a cloth mask for when flu season comes around and things like that where I'll want to make sure I'm not unintentionally passing a bug around. I also wonder if I should incorporate an N95 or KN95 for when I feel I should be protecting myself.

I have to wonder how long businesses will allow masks, once they no longer have to. Masks are a great threat to security inside a business.

To be honest, I have kind of been that way for a long time. I am a hand sanitizing son of a gun. I haven't liked to shake hands for maybe 20 years. Many times I have told people that I was a bit under the weather and didn't want to pass anything, even if I was feeling great. I just give them a nod of the head or a semi bow.

As to the yo-yo’ing… I get that. It sucked that there wasn’t a universal stance. The slow spread of information and the wishy washy messages made for confusion and pushback. I never got the pushback though. Science changes, sometimes rapidly. People that got angry that there wasn’t some perfect edict of protection on day one must have trouble with changes in general. They’d have been the ones that got angry at those proclaiming the world was round when science to that point claimed it was flat. The rest of us would have been like, “sure, I guess that’s a possibility” and moved on with our lives.
I guess coming from a medical background I just took it upon myself and my knowledge of viral spread. As soon as I learned it was spread via respiratory droplets I ordered KN95 masks. The ‘experts’ flip flopped on some level but I pretty much knew as soon as it hit China as hard and fast as it did… then the nursing home in Seattle… no other mode of transmission spreads that fast. I knew it was respiratory droplets. I didn’t need experts to confirm it. Or reconfirm it. Once I came to that conclusion my masks went on. And stayed on. I was one of the first people at the grocery wearing a mask. I got a couple odd glances at first but within weeks everyone was masked up.

I’m still wearing KN95s in enclosed public spaces. No one is allowed in my home yet. These are things I can do to continue to protect me, my community, and the patients I see.
I do now socialize with friends outdoors unmasked. I’ve even hugged a few of my vaccinated friends recently. I’ll be heading back to Ohio to see my family next month. I’ll be wearing a KN95 for the duration of the flights but my family is all vaccinated so my time with them will be normal. Though I’ll likely be a little more careful around my mom. She’s such a high risk, vaccine or not.

That is why I don't blame a whole lot for covid....except China.

We were kind of learning on the fly...how does it spread, how fast does it spread, do masks work or does it not matter? Much to figure out during trying times.

Like you said, science is a process. Rarely does science get it completely right the first go around.

Many times, it like peeling down a onion. You eliminate one thing or layer at a time. Most of the time it is a process of elimination as much as anything else.

What exactly do you think caused us to need to learn on the fly?

Because it was a new virus the world had never seen before. There was much to be learned that we didn't know.

Whats everyone’s thoughts on an outside concert? Im vaccinated, daughter has 1st pfizer shot. A small band we have wanted to see is headlining at a local spot just 3 miles from the house for $10. I’m so tempted, wife says no til daughter gets her 2nd shot. Thoughts?

I’d go in the right setting and with the right precautions. If it was crowded while funneling through the gates I’d mask. If the crowd dispersed once in and you could throw a blanket down to grab some personal space, the mask would come off while I enjoyed the band. Bathroom, mask. Beer line, mask.

It's fine to blame the person who stated the fire. But excusing the fire department for sitting there while doing nothing and watching the building burn isn't acceptable.

I got my second shot of Moderna yesterday and feel fine today other than a sore shoulder. I wonder if its because I took vitamins beforehand. I took multivitamin and megadosed on Vitamin D.

I know there is a lot of literature about Vitamin D and Covid. They cant quite decide if it helps or not.

About half an hour after posting that I got the chills and bodyaches.

Not overly surprising. My chills and such showed up 30 hours after my second shot. Got the shot at noon. Hit by chills and fever at 6pm the next day.

Both rounds of my vaccination I played a beer league hockey game that night and felt fine. Symptoms never showed up until the next day.

It it be about 12 hours after my 2nd shot and lasted a little more than 2 days on and off. Vitamins, Ibuprofen, and water didn't help me much...or did help me from making it worse than it could have been

Hope you feel better soon

For one it hasn't been fully approved. It has been approved for "Emergency Use" but that is not the same as it having been run through all the FDA paces. I don't have a problem that in of itself but way too many people are acting like its a sure thing and making assumptions that it is necessary. Its been what, a year and a half in there is still no coherency to any of it. About the only thing anyone can say right now about the vaccines is that they help the individual if they became infected.

No proof it mitigates spread (yet), no proof it prevents you from getting infected (yet). Everyone likes to talk about "following the science" but the "science" changes literally from week to week. Well at least the message from authorities who claim to be following the science who tell us what needs to be done changes from week to week.

There's very little evidence so far to demonstrate what the external/social benefits are from me the individual, to get one of these vaccines is. Yes they talk about herd immunity' and have said we need to hit 70 or 80% but those are seemingly arbitrary numbers. Depending on where you live, where are we at? 40-60% vaccinated? With that we have been seeing substantial declines. If you presented me with the argument that if we can hit 70% the virus would for all intents and purposes be eradicated, I'd listen if it weren't for the same people pushing that number quietly suggesting the need for annual "booster" shots.

Do I believe they are dangerous? For a number of people they have been. Plenty have died or experienced serious side effects. As tragic as that is I don't necessarily think it should grind distribution to a halt but these were issues that weren't identified as known possible side effects prior to. Which brings me back to my earlier point that they haven't been fully approved. Emergency authorization implies that not all risks associated have been identified.

I think its also important to point out what isn't being talked about (or allowed to be talked about). Over the last couple of weeks the efficacy of using Hydroxychloriquine (sp?) and other therapeutics to successfully treat patients has been surfacing again.

What about people who already have anti-bodies? I'm considering getting a test in the next couple weeks in case I was one of the estimated millions who were asymptomatic. If you have anti-bodies you don't need the vaccine.

Instead what people like me are faced with is vaccines are the ONLY way forward, they are the ONLY solution. If I don't I'm stupid or I'm selfish. I'm putting someone else's life in danger, etc etc I mean whatever.

As I've said before, for those who have made their own assessments and the risk is worth it, more power to them. I'm not going to say they are stupid or attribute motive to them. Even if it were to turn out one day that some catastrophic side effect takes out most of the people who took the vaccine, I'm not going to demean them or call them stupid for taking that risk.

I don't think any of my questions or concerns are so terribly unreasonable.

JMHO, if you decide not to take the C-19 vaccine, you made that choice. By definition vaccines are developed to prevent some disease or illness- they attempt to help, most do. A 50s child, America helped get rid of mums, measles, smallpox, polio, etc thru vaccines. I took all those shots and at 73 still ticking. A new "flu", which our former president claimed would be gone by summer "2020", has killed millions. Make your choice. Looked up vaccines causing deaths and long term problems- NO major problems EVER, some die, have side effects, NEVER widespread and those once approved are pulled when percentages get to large.

Lastly, I feel real sorry for the couple who put their ten year old on a plane to Hawaii and he got the virus and died. Their vacation couldn't wait. Parents need to think for their children.......Peace.

Myths are the reason many refuse to get vaccinated...

‘Real world’ study by CDC shows Pfizer and Moderna vaccines were 90% effective

A new study suggests the messenger RNA vaccines produced by Moderna and the Pfizer-BioNTech partnership appeared to be 90% effective in preventing Covid-19 infection in a real-world setting.

The study was released Monday in Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report, an online journal published by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.

The study followed nearly 4,000 health care workers, first responders, and other essential workers in eight U.S. locations as the first Covid vaccines were rolled out starting in December. Participants were tested weekly to look for all cases of Covid infection, even asymptomatic ones.

The article continues.....

https://www.statnews.com/2021/03/29/real...e-90-effective/

You made a lot of accusations with no evidence to support it.

He didn't make any accusations at all. Are you saying his statement about new info on hydroxychloroquine is an accusation? Maybe, but on my first read I didn't take it as such. I don't think he's being unreasonable at all. People hysterically screaming "but SCIENCE SAYS" are conveniently ignoring the fact that "science" hasn't made it's final decision on any vaccine.