"Serviceable" isn't exactly what I am talking about. Maybe it is just me, but that sounds like barely good.
I am not talking about that. No doubt you need a good back.
All I am saying is we drafted Chubb in the 2nd round. I am glad we have him. I am also pretty confident we can draft some player who could be a solid replacement if it came to that.
Let's hope it doesn't, but if it does, it is what it is. I wouldn't sell the farm simply to keep him.
When I look at what you are saying dispassionately I understand it. I'm not quite sure if I've arrived at the same conclusion on ease of replaceability quite yet. I think its safe to say we can count on Chubb to contribute 12-15 TDs in a season. I don't have the stats handy but I want to say most of his TD runs last year seemed like they were from further than 10 yrds out.
Could we in theory replace him with another back who could contribute that amount of scoring? Probably. It has;t been fully tested but I think we are developing an O Line / O scheme that could make any RB look good.
But what are the odds of finding another RB that is as much of a scoring threat from that far out? Actually, I'd go so far to say that Chubb is a home run hitter type of player. He's established himself as being able to score from anywhere on the field at any time.
If we lost Nick I don't think anyone would disagree that our Offense would be effected. However I do think we have a system whereby it would't collapse the offense either.
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things." -Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
The years that the Vikings were contenders with AP, they would NOT have been contenders with anyone else at running back.
Thats as good an example as I can think of. Well, I didn't think of it but you know what I mean.
Another thing to consider is that we are all focused on and expecting an improvement in the passing game in year 2 of this system. I don't see that it would be unreasonable (although hard to imagine) an improvement in the running game as well.
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things." -Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
In theory, you are absolutely correct, but first there has to be a guy there when we pick, and we aren't picking at the top of the rounds any longer, so we'd have to grab any replacement RB in the 1st. There haven't been all that many backs in the last twenty years that are as good as he is, so the chances are pretty slim we could get someone that would have us just as happy.
That said, unless Chubb gets grievously injured or demands some extortionate contract when we start talks, then I feel that this is all moo; there's little chance that we let Chubb out of Cleveland. And, honestly, I don't think Chubb ever wants to leave Cleveland, and I don't think his next contract will be an issue at all, especially with the new TV deal money kicking in after next year.
I don't know one way or the other about Chubbs wants and desires, but I agree, I doubt he leaves any time soon. With the expanded cap I wouldn't anticipate any real problem fitting him in on a 3 year deal. Maybe 4.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
"Serviceable" isn't exactly what I am talking about. Maybe it is just me, but that sounds like barely good.
I am not talking about that. No doubt you need a good back.
All I am saying is we drafted Chubb in the 2nd round. I am glad we have him. I am also pretty confident we can draft some player who could be a solid replacement if it came to that.
Let's hope it doesn't, but if it does, it is what it is. I wouldn't sell the farm simply to keep him.
When I look at what you are saying dispassionately I understand it. I'm not quite sure if I've arrived at the same conclusion on ease of replaceability quite yet. I think its safe to say we can count on Chubb to contribute 12-15 TDs in a season. I don't have the stats handy but I want to say most of his TD runs last year seemed like they were from further than 10 yrds out.
Could we in theory replace him with another back who could contribute that amount of scoring? Probably. It has;t been fully tested but I think we are developing an O Line / O scheme that could make any RB look good.
But what are the odds of finding another RB that is as much of a scoring threat from that far out? Actually, I'd go so far to say that Chubb is a home run hitter type of player. He's established himself as being able to score from anywhere on the field at any time.
If we lost Nick I don't think anyone would disagree that our Offense would be effected. However I do think we have a system whereby it would't collapse the offense either.
When it comes to scoring, it's hard to predict, but in my mind if he isn't scoring, somebody else probably is. No doubt he generates some scores on his own. The question is how many?
You mentioned 12-15 TD's as the number we can count on with Chubb in the backfield. That seems fair. Would we score fewer if he wasn't on the team? Maybe, but it wouldn't be 12-15 fewer. Maybe they wouldn't be scored the same way, but none the less a good number of them would be scored.
As you said, my passion for players isn't as high as some fans passion. That doesn't mean I don't like the guy or am not happy to have him, nor am suggesting we could bring back Travis Prentess to replace him.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
Don't forget to factor in the Law of Unintended Consequences. He may directly contribute to those 12-15 scores, but of the other scores that happen, how many of those, and how much of the flow of the offense in general, is influenced by his presence.
With a lesser back, or set of backs, that they don't have to stack the box to stop, defenses can play our passing game a LOT differently. As is the case with so much in football, the impact/effect of a player ripples proportionately beyond their individual position. The greater the ripple, the greater the player.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
I have been a believer that the running game is vital for an NFL team while the experts were touting the running era was dead - meanwhile every NFL team was looking to establish a running game as a necessity for a passing game.
But the adage of "Dime a dozen" in regards to RB. I think is more so because there are so so many talented RBs coming out of college and they are more adept to the passing game as in running routes, blocking etc.
You still have to do your homework and pick the right guy. Look at Hunt, what was he a 3rd round pick? Even Chubb was a 2nd rounder.
I really really hope we can manage to keep Chubb...but after Zeke from the Cowboys got what he did I'm afraid it will take a lot of money to keep him here and in the scheme of things you don't want to break the bank on a RB or a WR for that matter.
jmho
Average RB's are truly a dime a dozen..Guys like Chubb and Hunt are not... I agree, I sure hope we find a way to keep them
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
I was watching some of our games from last season and one of the announcers (can't remember which) pointed out the number of people in the box when Chubb was in the game, and if you watch any of our games you will see it, Now they also mentioned the defense plays less in the box for Hunt because of his receiving skills, although that backfires too
John 3:16 Jesus said "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
We have first hand data of what it means when Chubb suited up or did not as from the Cowboy game until just before the playoffs, around half the year last year, Chubb was out.
Can Deshaun Watson play better for the Browns, than Baker Mayfield would have? ... Now the Games count.
No matter the position there is talent and there is lesser talent.
Chubb is arguably the best runner in the NFL.
Then there is the team and how Chubb is viewed as a player and teammate.
From every corner of the Browns organization Chubb is respected.
So, when contracts come due. How does the management reward performance? It is one thing to be looking at a thirty year old producer and one who is 25/26.
IMO there is no doubt that Berry will sign Chubb. You reward players like him. You do that for them and as an example for others.
You want to attract free agents? Have a good reputation as an organization.
But as far as running a football team if I had to choose spending a boat load of money on Chubb possibly I would look hard at a 3rd round pick like Elijah Mitchell from Louisiana. Kid can play football and catch the ball as well as run.
Defense wins championships. Watson play your butt off! Go Browns! CHRIST HAS RISEN! GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
I'd say that Chubb is an absolute lock to get a 2nd contract. I'd say that the approach of taking another back to begin replacing him will happen as we approach his 3rd contract. There is still a LOT of rubber on them tires.
Browns is the Browns
... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.
I'd say that Chubb is an absolute lock to get a 2nd contract. I'd say that the approach of taking another back to begin replacing him will happen as we approach his 3rd contract. There is still a LOT of rubber on them tires.
Absolutely lots of tread especially with Hunt sharing reps
John 3:16 Jesus said "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
I saw what you are saying for both players, mores for Chubb. Amazing how he still balled out. This just makes me want to say it again that we should have some series script of plays where they are both out there in the same backfield or at least formations. Defensively, I think it would be a nightmarishly great challenge for an opposing DC to breakdown. It might be similar to Byner-Mack or Csonka-Kiick, but these guys may have more skills. Offense has to bust the D and force their adjustments. This set might overwhelm some folks we see; it would also be great for audibles. Not sure how great it might be in Red Zone )I really think simpler may be better in the hole) but even there it demands some defenders to adjust to potentially more things. Tie up their heads!
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
NICK CHUBB CAREER STATS GA. 44 STARTS 37 ATT. 680 YDS. 3557 TD's 28 YPC 5.2
John 3:16 Jesus said "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
I saw what you are saying for both players, mores for Chubb. Amazing how he still balled out. This just makes me want to say it again that we should have some series script of plays where they are both out there in the same backfield or at least formations. Defensively, I think it would be a nightmarishly great challenge for an opposing DC to breakdown. It might be similar to Byner-Mack or Csonka-Kiick, but these guys may have more skills. Offense has to bust the D and force their adjustments. This set might overwhelm some folks we see; it would also be great for audibles. Not sure how great it might be in Red Zone )I really think simpler may be better in the hole) but even there it demands some defenders to adjust to potentially more things. Tie up their heads!
Man, how awesome would it be to see an entire drive where its Chubb and Hunt in together and the entire series is just handing off to one or the other (or both!) and taking it the distance???? Talk about beating up a defense
"Hey, I'm a reasonable guy. But I've just experienced some very unreasonable things." -Jack Burton
-It looks like the Harvard Boys know what they are doing after all.
For the record, I'm a "running backs can be found anywhere" kind of guy. Like, looking at the success of mid-to-late round running backs or clearly undervalued free agents.
With that said, I've grown attached to the idea of keeping Nick Chubb long term if he takes a reasonable deal. The talent is undeniable, and the impact he has on this team is consistent.
I'm looking forward to watching what he can do this season being what I'm thinking will be an improved aerial assault.
My thoughts. Consider Hunt as a superslot or extra OL in a slot with Chubb. The O's guys should have some giddy options if they try to engineer mismatches. Some clever here could help our throwing as well. Aerial assault and dirt hurt. I would watch this all day long. I just don't feel the offense has brutalized people as much as I like, butmeh, that's just me. We can do more.
"Every responsibility implies opportunity, and every opportunity implies responsibility." Otis Allen Glazebrook, 1880
For the record, I'm a "running backs can be found anywhere" kind of guy. Like, looking at the success of mid-to-late round running backs or clearly undervalued free agents.
With that said, I've grown attached to the idea of keeping Nick Chubb long term if he takes a reasonable deal. The talent is undeniable, and the impact he has on this team is consistent.
I'm looking forward to watching what he can do this season being what I'm thinking will be an improved aerial assault.
I feel the same way... RBs in general can be found everywhere... but Nick isn't just a RB... I'd do whatever I can to give him a fair market deal.... if we can't sign him I pray we find a good RB in the draft and can scheme well enough...
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
The thing is as I've gotten older I always try to look at the NFL and The Cleveland Browns for what they actually are, a corporation that winning and managing your salary cap is the bottom line in every decision. It's not about personalities or a players background. It's not about their story or who they are as a person come contract time.
Yes, I try my best to do that. But every once in a while players come along like Myles and Chubb that make it, no matter how hard I try, virtually impossible not to become attached to them as people.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
The thing is as I've gotten older I always try to look at the NFL and The Cleveland Browns for what they actually are, a corporation that winning and managing your salary cap is the bottom line in every decision. It's not about personalities or a players background. It's not about their story or who they are as a person come contract time.
Yes, I try my best to do that. But every once in a while players come along like Myles and Chubb that make it, no matter how hard I try, virtually impossible not to become attached to them as people.
Can't imagine (I would be shocked) if the Browns let Chubb test Free Agency, Berry would be destroyed by this fan base if we lost him ... JMO
Last edited by PastorMarc; 04/28/2102:17 PM.
John 3:16 Jesus said "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life."
The thing is as I've gotten older I always try to look at the NFL and The Cleveland Browns for what they actually are, a corporation that winning and managing your salary cap is the bottom line in every decision. It's not about personalities or a players background. It's not about their story or who they are as a person come contract time.
Yes, I try my best to do that. But every once in a while players come along like Myles and Chubb that make it, no matter how hard I try, virtually impossible not to become attached to them as people.
I can say that about a lot of players. There are just some players we like and who do the things that deserve respect, yet in the end, they will jump ship as easily as we would let them go.
I might get irritated when that happens, just like when we release a player such as Richardson. Like it or not, it is just business, it isn't anything personal, so I don't hold it against the player or the team. The player has to do what is best for him and the FO needs to do what is best for the team.
It is what it is.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
Man, how awesome would it be to see an entire drive where its Chubb and Hunt in together and the entire series is just handing off to one or the other (or both!) and taking it the distance???? Talk about beating up a defense
Early 2nd qtr. Just make them choke on run after run after run...
Impose the run upon them, demoralize them early in the game. A D that loses its will to tackle before halftime will give up 40+ yard broken tackle runs in the 4th. These 2 in the backfield give 6 an embarrassment of riches to throw to so long as they are a threat to grab a first down with any/every possession.
CLE is going to be responsible for a lot of DC's sleepless nights this year.
he’s exactly the type of player I love. Just his attitude, work ethic, etc
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
some of the best cutbacks i've ever seen in my life.
“To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.”
In that reel, you can see when Chubb was out and having Hunt was such a blessing.
There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.
The thing is as I've gotten older I always try to look at the NFL and The Cleveland Browns for what they actually are, a corporation that winning and managing your salary cap is the bottom line in every decision. It's not about personalities or a players background. It's not about their story or who they are as a person come contract time.
Yes, I try my best to do that. But every once in a while players come along like Myles and Chubb that make it, no matter how hard I try, virtually impossible not to become attached to them as people.
Love this PitDawg and agree 100%. Part of loving the team is loving the players. We are finally building that again.
“It doesn't make sense to hire smart people and tell them what to do; we hire smart people so they can tell us what to do.” -Steve Jobs.
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