DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum The OBJ-Baker Connection: Linchpin to the season?

You don't have to chastise to make a public statement saying that you're all good right here.

Hue Had Good players! Kirko, and Schobert, look how good they played this year against the Browns. Schoberts' so good he got Melvin Ingram Traded off the Steelers, I think. Flat took his job.
Keenum To Schwartz, Seriously is it so much to ask Schwartz to get 50 yards a game?

Ok, Browns, woes... (unpopular opinions . com or something) - 1C. Terrence Mitchell not retained from 2020. 1B. JOK, as a draft pick, trading up for JOK. 1A. They wouldn't have had to reach for Greg Newsome as a decision in the draft at pick 29? if they had not created the hole with Mitchell. (Which again had them reaching at JOK again avoiding WR with either of their top 2 picks)

2C. No real WR. drafted except the guy from the other team, Beckham with a 1st round pick. 2B Having Beckham kept them from doing it, even though many were drafted the 2 drafts, which included the same draft and the one before, the Schwartz pick.
2A. Schwartz is not a real legit target, and how that stresses the rest of the franchises' decisions.

3C, The Browns OLine stinks, it is only a shell of what it once was, (collectively, not individual players but as a collective), when it had Chris Hubbard and Kendall Lamm as options 6. and 7. and healthy. 3B. Letting Kendall Lamm go was another linchpin when knowing the (nature, not extent) of Hubbards injury in week 18, or 17 or 2020's season, and (should be), how most OL don't do well in coming back from Upper Arm, outside of the shoulder muscle tears. (Jack Conklin, Joe Thomas, not related). 3A. James Hudson is not as good of an option at Tackle, as the Browns had to put out there in 2020.

(Certainly Unpopular opinions I guess.)

IMO, it would just make him look better.
In the interviews yesterday both coach and Baker were asked and both replied that they haven’t heard from him. If he would pick up the phone and say listen, that was a mistake by my father… I want to be here and win some games, etc etc… it would have helped squash this media storm that are saying he’s done here. Again, jmho. Maybe his agents and advisers told him to stay quiet.

Man there are so many layers to this. But trying to keep it simple:

When we traded for him everyone hoped we'd get the stud OBJ that had at least a couple of elite seasons in NY.

For whatever reason he never performed up to his status in a Browns game with the exception of two games. He was negatively impacted by Kitchens in exactly the same way Baker was. He's been injured. So there are mitigating factors.

However - I've seen him line up in the wrong place too many times, seen him drop way too many catchable balls. To consider him a true elite player at this point. Couple that with the injury history and his high salary and he was never, ever going to be traded unless it was minimal AND the Browns paid some of that salary.... of course if this has all come out a week earlier, sure he'd most probably have been traded somehow.

He's been a pretty good team mate - there has been much, much less drama than advertised when he was unhappy in NY. The watch thing, the shoe thing, nothing major. Until now.

The way he has conducted himself - lost any respect i might of had for him. I agree with many that think there is NO WAY that OBJ was not in on and aware of what his dad did. I also think it's telling he's made no comments to try to reconcile, defuse or distance himself from his Dad's opinion. . . . You can most definitely, make a statement and distance yourself from what his dad posted without chastising him and state that you don't share those sentiments.

So, barring an absolute miracle, he's never playing for the Browns again. How you handle it - I actually like that (given the poop sandwich they have) Berry and KS seem to be handling as professionally and the best they could to try to minimize the impact on the team and the chance of a W on Sunday.

I'm one that said early on that when folks claim OBJ is "always open" - we don't know if he is running the right routes, freelancing, getting open after the play is busted ... so while Baker has definitely missed him sometimes through bad QB play ... I don't buy that he is open 'a lot'. I've heard plenty of stats about how much he's been thrown to and don't by that pile of BS either (about Baker deliberately not throwing to him)..... I also heard one of the talking heads on ESPN talking about how the "separation stats" also do NOT support OBJ being open 'all the time'.

I expect OBJ to do well (much better than his time here) if he goes to somewhere like the Rams or New Orleans ... I think those offenses are nothing like the Browns and would play to OBJ strengths. I think if he ended up with the Ravens it would be bad for us too - Lamar can buy a ton of time, and those broken plays where its a free for all is when OBJ finds the spaces and is probably at his best.

I thought it was telling that Landry came out in support of Baker. I hope that continues. Hope DPJ is healthy and can make us all forget about OBJ and consistently be the playmaker we've seen glimpses of. And that's it right there the season is all about so many good players needing to get healthy. But for right here and now - bye bye Odell.

It's odd, well considering it's you, maybe not so odd, that you conveniently left out the part preceding what you quoted....


The part you quoted would be the only option left after that. But that's okay.

What did his dad post on social media during the Eli situation? You seem to be trying to say this was some coordinated effort between his dad and himself. Yet there is no evidence that's true. And who exactly is "Odells camp"?

I've got that same feeling. Who knows, maybe lightning strikes twice against the Bengals.

If I had to venture guess, which is exactly what everyone else is doing at this point, I would venture to guess that his agent has told him not to make any comments to the press. Which would also be my advice if I were in his shoes. That doesn't make it some nefarious plan. And if my HC had told me to stay home for two straight days when I was ready to practice and the public knew that, would anyone believe that "It's all good right here"? I don't see how stating an obvious lie to anyone reading it would help the situation.

I'm not familiar with Instagram - is there a way to tell if Lebron James was following Beckham Sr before a couple days ago? The reason I ask is because I'm not particularly surprised at a father supporting his son on social media, but my BS antenna twitched a bit when I saw the supporting post from Lebron. It *felt* choreographed, like maybe a certain NBA superstar got a call from a certain NFL WR asking him to do his buddy a solid.

The more I think about this .... this can't be the 1st episode with OBJ. It makes no sense that it would be.

If your Dad said something and you didn't counter it then people would assume he spoke with your agreeance. Hell, OBJ doesnt even have to disagree with his Dad in public, merely state that is his Dad opinion and not necessarily his. It looks like OBJ is throwing shade without getting his hands dirty this way. If Mayfield could have said "OBJ and I talked about the video his Dad posted and we are good" this would all be moot. If he didnt talk to Mayfield it looks really suspicious.

I know OBJ would be pissed if Emily posted on social media throwing OBJ under the bus and Baker ghosted him.

j/c...

It doesn't get any clearer than that.

Pure speculation.

I think too many people are confusing being a likable dude with being a good teammate. A good teammate doesn't show up to the game putting the team at risk to start the game with 15yrd unsportsmanlike penalties because he wants to challenge the League dress codes (see shoes, visor, etc..)

A good teammate doesn't need to be directed as to where he should line up virtually every play like he did in 2019.

Having said that, OBJ did seem to mature and got away from all that nonsense. But to say he's been nothing BUT a good teammate since being here isn't entirely accurate.

As for what's going on now, I'm inclined to give OBJ the benefit of the doubt that he's not coordinating the social media stuff.

[img]https://scontent.fyyc2-1.fna.fbcdn....579276586546777c80a733d6&oe=61A945D3[/img]

"He does nothing. He talks to no one. He's just got a malcontent attitude"...anonymous Browns player on OBJ to Mike Garafolo.

wut...

This is all just a contrived smokescreen planned in the offseason. Baker and Odell are going to light it up Sunday...stunning the football world and catching the Bengals completely by surprise.

Obviously. Or am I OBJ Sr.?

Between this video and Garafolo video it looks like the Browns are starting to circle the wagons.

I'm thinking "sinking the ship" would be more accurate.

You obviously aren't listening to the two videos. Start with post #1899392, then cfrs15's posted video.

I’m wondering why all of this happened the way it did. A couple other ways it could have gone: One, if OBJ is unhappy, he just keeps grinding away, and finishes the season, then looks for another team. Two, the Browns could have (I think, I don’t know) put him on IR for the shoulder injury.

I’m confused as to what the end goal was for OBJ, if indeed this was all of his doing. The Browns organization doesn’t come out of this looking badly, since he seems to be the decider of if/when he might come back. He looks like the diva he had been reported (justly? unjustly?) to be, and he has to know that it will affect his future career when he’s a free agent next year.

I just don’t get it.

All that keeps repeating in my head is the memory of right when we got him, or maybe it was just before that, Landry kept Tweeting to him "get your mind right!".

Well, I think he went away from that.

The 1st read is usually the deepest route.

I'd imagine OBJDAD realizes that Mayfield was hurt and missed a game.

Keenum was our QB then, not Mayfield.

OBJ caught 2 passes for 23 yards from Keenum.

Guess it's a huge conspiracy.

Why is it every time we are picked by the media to go to the playoffs/Super Bowl, something has to happen. One year we had 5 prime time games and stunk it up, then the Freddy fiasco one year, and then the Browns move to Baltimore, and now the Odell drama. The Browns are truly cursed.

Releasing OBJ on his 29th birthday.

Poetic.

I really hope a team claims him (preferably a bad NFC team) because I don’t want to see him go to the Ravens, Raiders, etc and then beat us in a few weeks

So, let's consider history and what the real "OBJ" plan has been:

OBJ is unhappy with the amount of usage he's getting out of Stefanski's controlled offense scheme. Blaming Baker, the sun, or a rock he tripped over is just the vessel - not the destination.
History has shown, an unhappy OBJ means a plan has been hatched and he intends to get his way.
It has been reported that OBJ requested to be traded. OBJ knows that his contract greatly reduced the odds of being traded because the Browns had no intention of paying him while playing with another team. That in itself is exactly why the trade offers fell through on Tuesday.
The video his Dad posted was well planned, the timing of the release coinciding with the trade deadline was not accidental - OBJ was trying to force a trade (or was he?)
OBJ, being the smart person spearheading the plan, almost immediately requested the Browns release him after the passing of the trade deadline, why?

Problem 1, the CBA doesn't allow the team to just stop paying OBJ unless he refuses to play - thus the next move by OBJ with his only statement so far "I'm available if they want me."
Problem 2, the Browns are not going have a disgruntled OBJ in the locker room causing issues or a disgruntled OBJ on waivers where another AFC team competing for the wildcard or division against the Browns gets him.
Problem 3, being put on waivers allows any team to claim your services but the issue still remains that the claiming team has to honor the current contract. Since OBJ's deal runs through 2023 at 18 million annually, investing in OBJ is more than a season thing and knowing his history of being disgruntled, most teams don't want to buy into the possibility for the 2-years past 2021.

The Browns, the issue the Browns have is a 2-fold situation. First, allowing OBJ to manipulate the team to get what he wants sends a terrible message going forward. Second, paying any amount of money to OBJ while he's performing for someone else sends another questionable message the Browns want no part of especially all the way through 2023 not to mention cap money that becomes unavailable to finish the build the Browns are working on.

Now OBJ isn't stupid so he has to have a plan - and he does.

Knowing the Browns won't pay a portion of his salary, any team that picks him up off waivers gets the bill.
That's more than likely not going to happen especially if you just look at the results for 2020 and this year - is OBJ really worth more than 40 million through 2023 to any team at this point considering the results the last year and a half?

OBJ's plan at this point:
1. Be a distraction, try to force the Browns to release you or make them pay by being a weekly healthy scratch due to being disgruntled and a distraction to the team while continuing to say "your available."
2. Continue to allow your agent to negotiate the release. Don't accept release restrictions but continue to appear to want to play.
3. Demand the Browns move quickly or just make them pay as you become more disgruntled. The more the Browns delay the more social media posts will appear supporting your agenda. Make the Browns look like the "bad guy" in this standoff.
4. Get your release from the Browns and clear waivers because few or any have the cap space to absorb your current contract.
5. Clear waivers and sign with your team of choice. I would expect that the LARams are #1 on OBJ's list at this time but the LAChargers, Tampa, and Green Bay will also be in play.
6. Expect OBJ to come out after the signing to tell how mistreated he was by the Browns.

The biggest issue at this point that I see is the Browns are hell bent on making sure that OBJ doesn't get his way and rightfully so. OBJ manipulated the Giants to get what he wanted and now is trying to do the same to the Browns. If I were the Browns, I'd make him a healthy scratch the rest of the year since the money is already accounted for in the budget. Then in the off season I'd trade him to Jacksonville, Houston, or the Jets. This guy is a growing cancer and now is screwing his second team in a row because he doesn't get what he wants. I'm sympathetic to OBJ's concern about the offensive scheme that Stefanski is running. I'm also sympathetic to the fact that it's not only OBJ but also Diggs that had serious issues with Stefanski - is this a trend? What I'm not sympathetic too is calling out a teammate, taking to social media, and QUITTING on your teammates mid season. I don't care whose right or whose wrong, quitting on your team mid season is unforgivable. There's 10 other players on the field when you are and 52 others on the roster working toward a common goal of winning which obviously you are not. Good teammate - BS! OBJ is for OBJ in a team sport - plus he's not delivering.

Based on early odds:

Saints
Ravens
Bills
Colts
Raiders


This is the top 5 teams likely to sign him per Vegas

If I were a betting man I think we will be more successful without him. Not sure that means the playoffs, but I think having him on the roster vs not having him on the roster isn’t a big deal

I hope they don’t sign another “star” receiver…
Just not enough targets in this offense to keep them happy.
Stefon Diggs in Minn ( when K.S. Was O Coordinator) Thielen, and now Odell.