DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum AFC North News and Notes 2021

I did a quick read of his wiki, and this sorta statement is repeated a couple times throughout the timeline. Where there's smoke, there's fire.

I just hope that we are looking HARD at his past and present conduct.

Tough, Smart Accountable:

Wonderlic of 9 and a history of conduct issues..... I trust Berry, but still question whether this one may be dipping a little too deeply into the Risk Well. It doesn't hurt to take a look, though. We do need to get better at LB, and a cheap infusion of talent with the right mindset would be golden. With a Wonderlic of 9, though, I wonder how quickly he can learn a defense.

Some risks will pan out, others won't. But Berry is working to improve the talent and I trust him.

The great thing about the FA scrap heap is that it's easy to cut bait if things start going sour.

The flip side of that is that now we have enough talent that we can’t pick anyone up without cutting someone else who probably has a fairly high street value and might themselves get snatched up quickly. I love taking a look but who would you cut to make room for a super high risk guy that hasn’t played since 2018? Maybe just stick him on the PS I guess.

any of the LB outside of JOK and maybe takitaki would be pretty easy to cut. But Foster is a bum, no idea why we are even looking at that trash

Are you trashing Walker after one game?

Week Two Results:

Steelers 1-1
Bengals 1-1
Browns 1-1
Ravens 1-1

4 way knot means next week is a chance to take the lead.

Well now- ain't that interesting?

Being "tied for first place" used to mean something.

_________


If this team is being built to outplay teams like KC and BAL, we're still a work in progress. Tonight's SNF game showed me that:

1. We couldn't beat KC last week
2. KC couldn't beat BAL this week.

I foresee BAL giving us the same trouble they always do.
That team had more injured #1's on the sidelines than any other NFL team- and they managed to do what CLE couldn't.


As stacked as this team looks on paper, it is not yet a lock for a deep playoff run. It's still the NFL- every given Sunday. Today's win would feel a lot better if the rest of the AFCN was playing the way they look on paper. The game's still played on grass- not paper.

Elves need to step up early and often.

We're going to finish the triangle and beat Baltimore.

Kc beats Us
Baltimore beats KC
We beat the Ravens
Triangle complete, who has tie breaker advantage there? Would rather have it over Baltimore than KC if not both.

I hope so, bro. I really do.

I'm looking for your 5-6 game "gelling period" for this D, but Dawg- I've now spent 2 consecutive games feeling underwhelmed. Usually, I can see flashes of what might be, but so far, I'm just seeing alotta mediocrity.

We need better from the D.
If today's CLE defense met tonight's BAL offense, I'm not confident CLE'd have an answer.

Nope, we'd lose that one. We could really lose any Sunday. But I think we'll be good by the end of games 5 or 6. If we don't see real improvement by then, Woods needs to answer for that.

T.J. Watt went out with a groin injury. Those can take a while to heal. Big hit to Pittsburgh's D possibly.

I wish I had your confidence, basically your forecast is predicated on belief ... at this moment we've seen no improvement in 2 games and not seen anything that would indicate that players are gelling or a light bulb is going to switch on. My concern is that our D woes are as much scheme and coaching as it is new players gelling.

Does anybody have as much fun playing football as Baker Mayfield and Lamar Jackson? Those two just seem to enjoy the crap out of what they're doing.

Next week:

Baltimore at Detroit (90% chance Baltimore wins)
Cincinnati at Pittsburgh (66% chance Pittsburgh wins)
Chicago at Cleveland (70% chance Cleveland wins)


I still think we have a lot of work to do to catch Baltimore, and last night proved it

I'm actually going to put my neck on the line and say Cincy beats Pittsburgh.

yeah, there’s a good chance its close, especially if Watt, Tuitt, Haden, etc are still injured

I'm also wondering if Turner gets suspended after the spitting incident.

Underwhelmed 2.0 here as well. The Rats looked more dialed in when it counted. They survived last night with a stupid blind luck mistake (seen it before repeatedly). We couldn't stop them IMO with our soft play.

But how many folks did we put out? Body count was high.

Big issue with our team: we don’t have play makers outside of Chubb when it counts. Our defense literally can’t get off the field against Houston, let alone the Chiefs when it counts

Beating a dead horse ; But wasn't that our problem last season ?

Joe. Woods.

You have all pro talent in Ward and Garrett who were both terrible yesterday.

You had a third string rookie QB in his first game action and decided not to do anything to make his like harder. You actually created a comfortable environment for him to succeed.

At some point this is Stefanski's fault.

Not to make excuses, but this defense has only been together for 2 weeks, and even then there have been changes.

I was frustrated with the defense yesterday. I am not ready to call for anyone's head just yet, though. We lost the green dot after week 1. We just got Delpit back. JOK is playing his 2nd game as a pro, as is Newsome. 3/4 of our starting DL is new. (actually, most of it, including depth, is new) Our starting FS and Nickel were on the Rams last year. It does take some time to get all on the same page, and playing instinctually.

If we haven't found our footing after week 5 or 6, then I will not stand in the way of those calling for Woods's head. At this early point in the season, though, it's still way too early.

I understand the frustration. I share it, and would like to add...

In both KC games now, the road team was winning and gave up 2 4th quarter TOs (1 fumble and 1 falling-down pick) to let the home team off the hook. Of course, God hating the Browns and all, we came down on the losing side of both road losses.

Bright spot for me is that as poorly as our defense played yesterday, we have ABSOLUTELY been a much better run D so far this year. That doesn't guarantee that we hold Lamar & Co. completely in check, but it is step 1 in that process.

They've only played real games for two weeks; they've been together for about 12 weeks.

"The Browns' biggest weakness is still at the second level of their defense. Cleveland allowed Houston to convert seven of 13 third-down attempts largely because they repeatedly failed to tackle the ball carrier in the open field. Defensive coordinator Joe Woods also has some explaining to do, directing a largely vanilla defense that didn't show any significant creativity until a key sequence late in which he sent Grant Delpit on a blitz (resulting in the Browns' lone sack of the day) and then dialed up a well-timed stunt on the defensive line, leading to a quarterback pressure that produced an incompletion. The Browns weren't able to get too aggressive last season because of personnel deficiencies; That's no longer a valid excuse, and they need to be better going forward."

The Browns defense is giving up an NFL worst 63% conversion rate on 3rd down.

It does not appear the players are being put in the best position to succeed. Lots of talent being wasted so far.

I agree Milk … if you look at our players, there’s no way we should be ranked 31st right now

The Browns gave up a 3rd and 13 to a third string QB and a lumbering TE on a 5 yd check down yesterday at a critical point in the game.

This is not a "the defense needs time to gel" issue. That's excuse making. This starts with Stefanski and Woods.

Get it fixed.

I will also say "fair enough".. any play not made by the offense that can change a game.. a turnover, a safety, a blocked kick, a big return, heck pinning a team back inside the 5 and keeping them there and getting possession in + territory is like a turnover...

NFL tie breaking procedures are available at NFL.com. let me try from memory.
In a 3 way tie, compare any two teams to eliminate one and then go back to the two way tie breaker.
ONE Paramount in the tie breaking process is an individuals quest in achieving winning 'it's own' division, closest to being 1st place in it's own div. so standing out right away is KC is tied for 2nd place, the Browns and Ravens are tied for first 4 way with Cincy holding the tie breaker, because it's loss to Chicago was a loss to a non afc team, meaning their wnning percentage vs the afc is better but,
that puts KC out, (in consideration for the first spot)
and today the two way tie breaker would revert to Cleveland vs Baltimore, clubs in the same division tie breaker,
until they get one winning club to award the playoff spot to, and then start all over with the teams still trying to gain a spot.
( At this point I forgot you have a hypothetical Browns over Ravens win, .. I'm throwing that out.)
3 way tie, today, comes down to Ravens over us.
Wait, we didn't lose head to head, A
we = 0-0 in div record B.
we = 1-1 in afc record c.
The spirit of rule #4(D) is common opponents 3 or more, would probably say the Kc loss vs win gives the tie break to Baltimore, but if it throws out, the Browns may find a way ahead of Baltimore in strength opponent, which would also be thrown out for not enough, until total touchdowns which I bet Baltimore still has. So.
Baltimore 1st in.
Then start over Cleveland and KC tie break. - Is head to head #1? yes. If that didn't exist Cleveland would win on the fact they're in a first place div. tie and kc is in a 2nd place div. tie. But, head to head exists, so I think it's Baltimore, then KC, then Cleveland in the tie breaks today. Off my head.

Wait, I thought of something, Strenght of victory is ahead of TDs, which the 10 point win, vs. the 1 point win, would put Cleveland in spot #1 ahead of Baltimore.
So if you don't have the strength of victory:
it's Baltimore, KC, then Cleveland.
If you DO have the strength of victory, it's Cleveland, Baltimore, then KC. (because Baltimore has the head to head over Kc.
Very easy just one step at a time. (but, playing only one game, so many of those may be thrown out, or not thrown out.)

And all of that is fixable. Coaches need to adapt to players as much as players to the scheme. On paper, Woods knows what they should be able to do, now he is trying to bring that all together, but coaches and players are still learning each other and tweaking the defensive schemes. Like Purp said, the D is an unfinished product.

And yes, much of my confidence comes from what 'should' happen under normal circumstances. If Woods is going to dominate with his D here, we will know by mid-season or around games 10-11 at the latest. But marked improvements should start showing weekly after the next game or two. Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if they start showing that next week. The reason I say that is that week 1 did not give Woods a good sample of the D's current capabilities because they were playing Mahomes and the Chiefs... They beat everybody, so a loss to them might make you think you still have work to do but the extent of that work needing to be done showed up this week, IMHO.

Until Cincy starts winning road games I'll say they can't. Unless the other team is bad. Pittsburgh is not bad.

To me it’s clear that the lynch pin for our defense is the assumption we’re going to create a lot of pressure on the QB and we’re simply not doing that for whatever reason. Maybe Garrett is still dealing with Covid lungs (my formerly very fit brother in law struggles to run a mile a year after almost being hospitalized twice for covid). Maybe Clowney isn’t totally right. Maybe it is a “gelling” thing. I don’t know but we’re not scaring QBs up front. I think we’re built on the backend to thrive on rushed passes and quick check downs. But the QBs are just sitting back there, waiting for guys to get open.

They aren't good, either.

They are only what their defense carries them through, and that defense is already taking hits to their best players.

I think we split with Baltimore... we win at home and lose at their place... we play them at their place in primetime which will be tough.... then they play steelers and we get a bye.... don't think we'll beat them at their place in primetime but should be able to bounce back to win after a bye at home...

J/c

Has anybody watched the Bears thus far? I haven’t really. All i know is that their OL has typically been bad and that Dalton has a low ceiling. I’m hoping he plays instead of Fields, but I think we’ll see the latter

All I really know is that they are 1-1 and their win was against Cincy.

Cooper Kupp and Tyler Higbee tore them up in Week 1. Stafford went 20/26 for 321 with 3TD. I saw some of the highlights, and Kupp got behind their Safeties more than once. If Schwartz or OBJ get to play, either one should be able to do the same.

They don't appear to give up much in the Run game, but that may be their ability to stop it, but it also may be more a factor of how they are in the pass game. Hard to say at this point without watching them.


I think Dalton was hurt against Cinci, so we will likely see Fields. However, their coach says Dalton is the starter if healthy, and he did NOT tear his ACL.