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In many ways I don't disagree, but I don't think we can or should place limits on private business as to what a owner or CEO should or can make. Also, I don't think trying to compare what the CEO makes v the lowest paid group in the company is a fair comparison. I know the CEO make about 20 mil a year. About half a QB's salary

In the broad scope 20 mil seems like a lot, but compared to the total salaries paid across the board, I'd bet it isn't a gross percentage. If you cut his pay in half and spread it out over all the other people getting a pay check from Exxon, I doubt any would see much of a bump.

I just checked...round numbers has Exxon with a total of 75,000 employees. Remember, the guy at the gas station probably isn't a Exxon employee. I don't think Exxon actually owns gas stations any more.

So if you cut the CEO pay in half and spread it around everybody else, they would see about a $12 a month increase in pay.

But if you divide Elon Musk's 6.6 billion (in total compensation link ) in half and divide it amongst Tesla's ~70,700 employees, you'd get an additional ~$46.6k annually for each employee.

I'm not for setting a hard cap, just trying to figure out how to make it so that a rising tide actually will raise all boats. As it is, certain boats seem to rise at the expense of others. Is any 1 man 351 times more important/valuable than any other in his sphere? Without all the others supporting him/her, the "corporation" wouldn't be able to function. There is a symbiotic relationship, but it appears to me that in many cases the top has become more parasitic. How do we better financially encapsulate the interconnected relationship?

I think that's a fair point. One of the problems too is the growing ratio of an executive's compensation compared to the average worker of the same corporation from the beginning of America's economic dominance to the current period.

From a practical perspective, that is one aspect that is driving what is an inarguable wealth gap. If the upper echelon continues in that conduct and the gap keeps widening, for better or worse, the lower echelon will either get the the government involved, there will be social unrest, or both.

Peen, I know you are a strong opponent of communism, obviously, but I would just point to the economic scenarios historically that have led to the rise of communism or hard socialism.

What we have brewing is not good in a plain sense.

In the end it isn't about being more important. It's about the worth of the job and the ability to find people to perform the job, and that is employees. I am not even talking about owners who started the business. They deserve anything they can get. They are the ones who risked it all.

I don't disagree that some people need to make more. I just don't think comparing the worker at the bottom of the wage scale should be compared to the CEO. We are talking apples and oranges. Really, they are two different type jobs.

The person with the Harvard business degree isn't going to sweep the shop floors in one of the companies 15 plants, and the guy sweeping one of those plant floors isn't going to end up CEO. I think you can agree with that.

To your question about labor...I am not sure. I think in the end, management labor costs and separated from general labor costs. What they call management labor and general labor(or whatever you want to call it)I couldn't say.

At one point they may have "risked it all," but they shouldn't necessarily continue to be allowed to have unchecked avarice especially considering their personal risk is now greatly diminished and their personal assets are generally separated from corporate liability. How much is enough? Your argument implies that it's never enough, which is problematic. It is especially troubling when one's continued success relies upon the continued hard work of others struggling to simply survive, who can hardly fathom the luxury of a billion dollar yacht or a multi-million dollar trip into outer space.

I'm not saying the lowest and the high should be compensated the same. I'm simply saying they should be compensated equitably instead of the people with power being able to grab as much as they can. So some rich guy's yacht might have to be 1/20 shorter and he'd have to pass on the solid gold urinals, boo hoo. Meanwhile someone working their thankless yet necessary job, should be able to afford healthy food, the rent for their much less extravagant domicile, and probably unexpected expenses, like for repairs to a vehicle to get to said job. Is that really so much to ask?

I don't disagree. I see the problem a bit differently from you. I think a lot of the middle management jobs have vanished are rapidly as the labor jobs, and those jobs buffered the numbers.

Why have those left? Probably technology and competition as it has impacted the shop floor jobs. To me it isn't the shop floor jobs that underpay. With some overtime they make pretty darn good money. The problem is there aren't enough of them any more. How many jobs at Ford and GM have left over the last 25 years? Name any nuts and bolts company you want.

Now technology welds the parts, so rather than needing 20 welders to do the job, you need one tech person. Do that over serval different phases of the manufacturing process and you are talking about a loss of a good number of employees. Less employees means you need less middle managers to supervise the various departments results, thus you lose lots of jobs that would have been held by people in what might be called the upper middle class.

So now people are mad at McDonalds and Wendy's because they don't pay a living wage when traditionally they were viewed as a stepping stone job or part time job, and there are lot's of jobs in that category. I don't think bagging groceries at the store or ringing up sales at the drug store was ever intended to be a career.

I could see the point you are making except for one big issue: there are a ton of job openings right now and not enough people willing to fill them.

So it's not as though jobs are vanishing at a higher pace than people can keep up with.

That leads me to think that the compensation is not there. To bolster that point, the former Pepsi CEO, Indyra Nooyi, just spoke on how we need to make childcare more affordable because people - women specifically (her words) - are leaving the workforce because the cost of childcare is too high when compared to what they would make on the job. Seems ironic considering that came from a CEO who probably made an insane salary that we have been discussing, but I doubt Pepsi introduced anything revolutionary to solve it during her time.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/former-pe...-184302504.html

So, perhaps it has gotten to the point that mega corps need to start examining their pay roll. If they want to both maintain a constant payroll cost pool and have adequate workers, perhaps start decreasing the executive total compensation and pay ratio back to historical metrics vs. the current outlandish disparity. Incentivize employment, get the workers you are looking for, and reduce the public calls for the Government to step in more.

Maybe it is the wages aren't there or maybe it is a left over from people getting a lot of free rides the last year, and I don't have complaint about that.

The jobs were full, or mostly full before the pandemic. Maybe with a new group in charge they feel that they will continue to get bailed out?

Maybe there are a lot of people still holding out because of fear the pandemic created?

If they don't go back to work, where ae they getting the money to live?

I don't know where to start should have responded to Bull dawg, but didnt' see his post, I saw this one.

It's way too early for math, 200% 2000% what is 351 times more.
351 times is 35100%
35 thousand one hundred percent. Or.

One for me... One for all 35,100 of you..
One for me... One for all 35,100 of you..
One for me... ?? -- it's only 351 ?? (It's more dramatic at 35,100 people) Still 35,100%??? "yes".

351 times = 35,100 percent. Which equals,
One for me... one for all 351 of you.
One for me... one for all 351 of you. (You 351 better work harder, don't you care?)
One for me... one for all 351 of you.

Basically, if you get 351 of your buddies... and pull all your resources together,
that's what your CEO is taking home, the guy who,
comes in 7:30 am 3 times a quarter, to add 7 minutes of bull to a 60 minute meeting that starts at 9:30 am and ends his day by 1-2 pm after a 90 minute lunch.
But!
He got into Harvard and you didn't so, you know.

https://eand.co/the-economy-is-self-destructing-dc66efa26b2f?gi=f73002b0bb67

This link claims that pre-covid, in 2019.
That is pre-covid, so pre all of the restaurants in Ohio being forced closed by the Governor and whatever Amy Acton was health official. for 6-months to 2 years,

So, Pre Covid. 75% of Americans, 3 out of 4,
Were either Unemployed,
In a loser go Nowhere job with no benefits, Mcjob,
Or had given up looking for work altogether.

Only 25% of Americans, had jobs that could be considered with benefits and going somewhere.
And that the middle class does not exist and hasn't existed for a while.

So, Maybe those teenage minimum wage jobs that go nowhere are not intended to be a career, but it looks like
for 262 million 500 thousand Americans, that's 75% of the population (350 million),
It's either that, or unemployment, or worse.

And then the article says Covid is going to make it worse and we're heading for a Depression, but you know.
Go Browns! (40 years of voting for democrats, smh)

Umm, Throw, pal, slow yo' roll! Pre-covid was during Trump's Presidency and so was 2020! Backing team blue is what YOU SHOULD DO! smh

I think at some point you will have to come to the conclusion that there is a certain portion of our society that will always come up with some excuse why there should be some continuation of a below poverty subculture to serve them. I mean they may have to pay 50 cents more for a burger. That people who do menial work simply don't deserve to make a living.

And no matter which angle you approach it from they will always have objections.

What a fraud these people are, then the President insults the American public saying he doesn't want us getting confused? LOL...what a joke.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/opinion/b...dhp&pc=U531


How long are some of you going to continue to support this buffoonery?

PortlandDawg and others are waiting for a statement from Don Lemon, Rachel Maddow, CNN, and the Young Turks before they can respond!

You all still support the last moron.

Biden is an idiot. I hated him as the democratic ticket choice. That said I’d still vote for him today over the festering human trash pile that is donny.

Laura Ingraham, really? That schtick is old and worn out. More fake outrage. We can afford 10 trillion in tax cuts for the rich over the last two GOPer presidents. Or looking at the low end 3.4 trillion... but the millionaires on Fox and behind fox and that advertise on Fox want you to hear a different narrative. She said 80 percent don't want THE tax increase... It's on the rich. And who cares if our goes up a little. At least we will get a return of value. PFFFT. Trumpian tears.

Hardly. We are fully capable of thinking for ourselves. I know that seems like a superpower to your ilk, but maybe one day Fox or Breitbart will suss it all out for you.

We all know I compromised when I voted for Biden. I think he's doing ok. And if they manage to pass this human infrastructure AND infrastructure, then he will have accomplished quite a bit. FDR-esque.

Capable, yes. But very out of practice.

It only seems a superpower because of its current rarity. Admittedly, on both sides.

So you post your talking heads blathering while claiming others are waiting for their talking heads to blather. Now that's rich.

It was all about beating the orange brat.

He did. He is a hero.

Jeb Bush would be ok. The no no list

Traitor Don
Ted Cruzer
Lindsey suck up
Ronny DeSantatize
Mike bootlick Pence

Most others I could handle.

At this point I want to see Weisselberg turn the tax cheat in and all the debt he has come due.

Court documents and interviews indicate that the Manhattan District Attorney is accumulating evidence of pervasive tax fraud.

I would love to see Traitor Don share a cell with Manafort.

The Democrats ruined Christmas!!

Nope.
That was The Grinch.

And from his behavior, it's pretty clear that he was a Republican.

"Economic scenerios that led to a rise in communism historically"

What we need to focus on, is how the actions and decrees from on high, perpetrated by the democrat party, are communism, marxism, anti US constitutionalism and a threat to the constitution of the United States.

Currently, anyone standing up against this threat to the Constitution, is fighting for freedom.

Anyone standing up against the communist takeover of the United States, via the tool of the democrat party,
and standing for upholding the Constitution of the United States, is fighting for freedom.

Also...the ones at the bottom mostly don't work for these coporations. They may work for a franchine, or some spin off.

Fixing the pay at the bottom of the rung has little to do with the pay at the top.

Just a feeling that I have - I certainly haven't done any research, just listened and paid attention - but it seems that Covid is having as significant a role in helping to redress and elevate the remuneration of (many of) the lowest paid workers.

We saw many Republicans proclaim the labor shortage we witnessed as we opened back up after CV was due to the subsidies and government funding.... the narrative was folks were too lazy and happy getting money from the government for nothing. Some red states like TX were the first to cut all CV relief funding. . . . guess what - the last I heard (about a week ago) the states cutting finding on CV relief have the same ongoing labor shortages as the rest of the country.

Meanwhile - we've seen significant pay increase announced for entry level workers at many large employers. We've seen local firms who really want to get back to work - offer significant increases in pay to entice workers to apply and come work for them. Fast food workers demanding $15 an hour. Good for them.

Politicians probably aren't going to help or solve the problem. Fat cats and corporations probably not either. Maybe Covid is going to be a small reset for some industries?

Cheating on taxes is a family affair:

https://www.vanityfair.com/news/2021/09/...t=footer-recirc

ANYONE who pays taxes should have outrage.

However, I know those who will go along and say.

"No problem here"

I don't disagree.

https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/1446524622988615708?s=20

I wonder if the same voices that cheered the Trump economy will cheer for this too?

Good deal. I do question the numbers, but that is nothing new, not just something this President or administration does.

There is still a lot of unfilled jobs out there. Where are people working??

I am not really asking to get an answer, it's more me typing out loud as I ask the question to myself..

Do understand the lips of the left, Biden himself, have previously expressed the finances of the government are secure because private people still had savings' contained in banks, (and by inference, easily stolen by the democrats, actually the assumption they were already stolen by the democrats).

Expressions like this from the top, plus the actions of shutting down millions, and millions of jobs as just, "oh it's against the law to go into a restaurant anymore". on some, dictators whim,

have Enlightened millions that they are not working to get a better life, and gain a better position in life, for themselves and others around them,

they are simply wage slaves to the dictator without rights to liberty, property, or life.

Democrats simply have Run out of people to steal money from. because they believe, wrongly
that only Corporations, and billionaires, deserve to live. (or especially, have a better life, or outcome)

Don't you want to do your part to sacrifice for the democrat dictator leader? Or Dubai or China's prosperity?
Whether yourself or your children die of strokes or
grief while you work increasing amounts of time for less and less and less? do your parts peasants for the greater comfort of the democrats dictator leader, or leaders, or small leader class.

Funny. The economic model, has a long history of this very thing, going back more than 100 years.
The textile workers strike.

The mis-pronounciation of the word organization,
as the word organ(eye)zation, is a clear attempt to bring down the language of America,

to make it easier for people from the eastern hemisphere, of the (proposed spherical) earth, to pronounce, because they don't have languages that include the i-sound that Americans make, when Amerians say the word if.

hashtag say no to the bad guys.

I do agree there comes a point where we will run out of money sources from which to steal.

least we forget that under the current DOJ, the #1 terrorists are now classified as domestic...lol.

The Jack boots are now showing up at school board meetings. A sad state of affairs. Welcome to communism.

You need to put the cool aid down and step away.

Communism > Fascism.
Socialism > Authoritarianism.
Blue > Red.

School moms are now domestic terrorists for showing up and scolding school boards over CRT and masks and vaccines … we can’t have mom and dad interfering on the socialization of their kids … who do those parents think they are …

And then u have the marine who did nothin more than tell the truth and say what everyone other than the intellectually dishonest posters on here know sent to the brig and more than likely on his way to Leavenworth … he’s being held well beyond accountable meanwhile the folks who the intellectually dishonest on this board back who are responsible for the death of 13 American warriors and the CRIPPLING of many more, no one ever talks about that but dozens of our heroes that provide the intellectually dishonest on this board the very freedoms to post on this board lost arms/legs/eyesight … and over 200 Afghans were killed and then there’s the “over the horizon” drone strike that killed an aide worker and kids while loading his vehicle with water to bring to the folks that needed it …

And lest i forget the Americans and SIV’s still in Afghanistan …. For most Americans thats simply inexcusable yet the folks on here support the POC that is 100% responsible for al of the above ….

I have no clue how the intellectually dishonest on this board look in the mirror without getting sick to their stomachs ….

THANKS Y’All