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Didn't know he was a malcontent?

I think Landry is gone as well.

Higgins is the one without a contract after this year. If anybody else is "gone" it's him. Getting rid of Landry would be a death blow to this offense. If you're gonna do that you might as well trade Baker for picks, blow it all up, and start over.

Landry is the heart and soul of this team, at least fir the O.
I say give him a raise, let OBJ walk (not hating on him, it’s just not working out). Develop DPJ and Schwartz.

I do NOT want to let Jarvis go. He is one of our best players, period.

I'm shocked nobody has asked the obviously looming question this brings up. Would those peanuts be salted or unsalted?

I am not saying that the father is not without fault here, but the truth is the truth no matter how it is presented.

None of our WRs' are flourishing with Baker.

Fact is that WR's do not flourish in Kevin's offenses no matter who the QB is.

This is a valid point … OBJ was never going to be a 1,200 yard 15 TD guy with the way we have our team set up.

The fact that he’s turned into a 1 catch for 6 yards per game guy is unreal though lol

adam thielen and steffon diggs says hi.

Didn't one (or both) of those guys also throw a hissy-fit at one point?

Yeah Diggs wanted out of Minny very badly

yep. as soon as kirk cousins got there.

hmmm....

The fact is that no receiver is exactly flourishing with Baker @ QB.

He is on a pace to have all of 13 TD passes for the season.

Or as soon as Stefanski took over as offensive coordinator.

During the segment on ESPN, Diggs revealed what led to him skipping that practice last year and basically what led to him seeking a way out of the Twin Cities.

“(The Vikings) were kind of gearing towards a run-heavy (offense) at that time. I didn’t know it going in. I didn’t know it was going to be that way. They only would allow me to do so much. In my eyes, it wasn’t going to be in the best interest of my career.”


https://thevikingage.com/2020/12/14/stefon-diggs-admits-minnesota-vikings/

Interesting that Stefanski was offensive coordinator at MIN when Diggs demanded to be traded and now we have issues with OBJ. Is it the players or is it the scheme that refuses to consistently capitalize on the TE/WR talent? I'm not so sure it's a coincidence that Stefanski has had issues with 2 of the leagues best receivers. Obviously, Stefanski has set the base with positive results in Min and Cle. Does he have the capabilities to adjust his scheme and take the Browns to a championship level? History says "No" to this point.

I buy that story. The stats and stories about Diggs (and I thought Thielen as well, to a degree) agree with what we're seeing on the field now. Superstar receiver types just don't mesh well with Stefanski's system. I was under the impression that Stefanski wasn't a rigid system guy when he was coming here, but I'm pretty sure that's been said about pretty much every coach we've brought in and it's never true.

Did Stefanski similarly 'inherit' Diggs and Thielen like he did OBJ?

too you, steve, and oob:

this is why people need to really look at stefanski. look, he's our HC and i love how dominating we've been running the ball. but was on the vikings staff since '06. he was on the staff when thielen and diggs went off and had one of the best season for a WR duo in the league.


so thats why i can't wonder about the playcalling. the same short throws baker seems to throw are the same ones kirk cousins is doing since he got there. did anybody see some of the clips from the vikings/cowboys game? kirk cousins had guys wide open and yet throw the ball to double covered running backs or behind the LoS.

so either Stefanski doesn't trust baker like he clearly didnt trust Kirk, or that's his preferred style of play.

if so, thats fine. but while he inherited OBJ/Jarvis/Baker, those are 3 big time guys we drafted/signed/traded.

oh and for the record, our running back group is started to have dalvin cook kind of injuries. always in and out of the lineup.

history doesn't repeat, but it often rhymes...

I don't quite follow you on the RB injuries front, but otherwise all that 'crazy talk' doesn't really sound so crazy. I wanna see how these guys respond to all this noise when it matters.

The only year Stefanski was the full time OC (aside from a couple games at the end of 2018) was in 2019. That's the year everything blew up with Diggs with him wanting out.

Stefanski runs a run-heavy, ball control offense.

Also, Justin Jefferson has been lighting it up w/ Kirk Cousins as his QB with Klint Kubiak as the OC.

In the end, it's a multitude of reasons, but the bottom line is that it just has not worked out with OBJ and this offense.

The next few weeks will be interesting to see if "Baker and the offense are better without OBJ" theory proves to be true.

Stefanski joined the Vikings in 2006. From 2017-18, he coached the quarterbacks and added the role of interim offensive coordinator before being named the team's sole offensive coordinator in 2019 before coming to the Browns in 2020.

Thielen joined the Vikings in 2014. Interesting that in 16 games in 2018, Thielen caught 113 passes for 1373 yards. In 2019, after Stefanski took over OC duties, Thielen only played 10 games due to injury but his output was seriously lacking compared to 2018 with 30 receptions for 418 yards.

Diggs joined the Vikings in 2015. In 14 games started in 2018, Diggs caught 102 passes for 1021 yards. In 2019, after Stefanski took over OC duties, Diggs started 15 games and only had 63 receptions compared to 2018. Combined, Thielen and Diggs lost 122 receptions in 2019 compared 2018 and thus caused Diggs to demand a trade.

One other note, Cousins completed 425 passes in 2018 - in 2019 he only completed 307 on 162 less attempts from the previous year.

So, we're not seeing dynamic WR play because we're never going to see dynamic WR play here. Stefanski either can't, or refuses to, adapt to and fully utilize the personnel talents at his disposal.

THIS explains why our 4th quarters look the way they do. We're not playing to put teams away by burying them or even by doing what was successful in getting us to that point; we're committed to being a hamstrung and controlled offense.

I love Stefanski as our coach, but he CLEARLY needs to grow and adapt in how he uses and views the WR talent on his rosters.

Furthermore, if we KNOW we're not going to be using the WRs to their potential, then Berry, why haven't you traded that premier talent away for picks?

When your QB has a bum shoulder I don't think it's going to tell us much of anything or will prove anything true or untrue.

Clearly, you all do not recall Mike Zimmer demanding that they be more run oriented in Minnesota.

https://www.startribune.com/vikings...ccord-in-run-first-philosophy/559207682/

Yep...the perfect Catch 22. I'm afraid we won't know anymore at the end of the year than we do today.

Unless OBJ really was siphoning Baker's talent somehow.

Except that this was going on way before Baker got injured and into last year. Excuses are like azzholes, everyone has one. Stefanski is a one trick pony that has a scheme (successful) that focuses on running the ball. It's a great idea except that when you fall behind and need to score it is very prohibitive. Add to that fact that his premier receivers will not perform at the needed level because they are not included in the game plan. To this point I give Stefanski a B+ for what he's done with the Browns but that score will continue to drop each game he shows the continued failure to put teams away, run a 2-minute offense, or show the ability to come from behind because until he learns to do that as a coach - his tenure will be short lived.

The Browns should be set to be competitive for the Super Bowl for sure next year if not this year. However, unless they prove they can move the ball through the air consistently, we're not going to see them in the Super Bowl. This is still a passing league and will be for the foreseeable future. As a team, they must have the ability to move quickly through the air and the present scheme is not set up for that to happen. As a group, you can't just turn it on and off every second or third game. It needs to be a part of the game package every week. Great coaches make adjustments - Stefanski lacks that ability at this point and proved by his history over the last 2 1/2 years. I mean look at his track record, you can't be down 20 points with 2 quarters and 10 minutes left and have your QB only throw 19 passes from the point forward and expect to catch up.

The impact of those voodoo mind tricks are amazing as to the power they possess.

There was know lively discusion about this last season with a winning record .. Coincidence ? lol

Remember the first half of the Titans game last year? We were destroying them. And the passing game was front and center at all levels. Then came that dreadful second half.

Very confusing.

Edit: And O'dell was not on the field.

And Vrabel still had eight in the box until he was down 38-7. Craziest case of stubbornness by a coach that I've ever seen.