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Originally Posted by oobernoober
Maybe he took issue with the link itself and not the fact that Baker holds the ball. Baker holding the ball too long has been a topic of discussion on here at least since the Freddie year, so I didn't think I was blowing anyone's mind by pointing that out in a thread about sacks, and didn't bother taking the time to pull the actual advanced stats.

Anecdotally, the vast majority of the sacks he's taken have been where he didn't know where to go with the ball or was trying to make something happen out of nothing (he held the ball for forever) vs the immediate sacks where someone just blows through the line.

I just want to clear up my comment above about pass-catchers and separation...my intent was to add that issue to the unknown and not an attempt to put the blame there. It's classic Browns teams issue in that at the end of the year we still won't have complete confidence / consensus in what we have at QB.

For many years we had dysfunction, bad rosters and simply not-good QBs along with poor FOs and coaching...what a blend. But for many years we could never be "sure" that the QBs were not-good because everything else around them was (also?) a cluster.

2nd half of last year we got on a run in all phases of the team and organization - in spite of a Sendejo-led defense. It was evident that Baker was the guy.

This year we had a good 1.5 games from the offense and the defense - somehow - regressed with ridiculously better talent. Then the slide:

Baker gets hurt;
Wills was already hurt...in and out of games;
Conklin gets hurt and we have eotab and me at LT & RT;
Baker gets more hurt;
Conklin gets hurt again;
Chubb gets hurt;
Hunt gets hurt;
Chubb gets COVID;
DPJ shines...gets hurt...shines...gets hurt;
Landry is beat up;
The OBJ plan comes to an end but we got JaMarcus Bradley (who I like) on the team;
The defense has...maybe...come around lately...but I'm not holding my breath.

And...somewhere in there we fans are supposed to be able to make a clear determination of what is our problem. Just like the dysfunction-years from Freddie back to Palmer...we have yet another season where at the end we probably won't really know what we have at QB, DC, maybe HC, certainly WR, DT, LB, S, SS and possibly TE. At least we are used to dealing with such madness.

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I wonder what Baker's teammates have to say...well, just listen and maybe you will learn something...







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You would also have to say that the deeper he has to go in his reads the longer it takes, the more likely protection is breaking down, the more it becomes a scramble drill, the more likely it gets thrown away or becomes a sack, etc
Well sure, the longer you hold the ball to go through your progressions the closer the pressure gets, that's pretty self-evident. My point was that Baker has about the same amount of time before pressure as other QBs who have a lot less sacks and better passing numbers.. so they seem to be working through their reads faster/better and getting the ball out whereas Baker seems to be struggling more with it, taking more sacks, and being less efficient as a passer. This has always been a concern for him, but it seems that since he's been injured, the problem has been exaggerated and gotten noticeably worse.


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I just wasted 14 minutes listening to an interview that didn't even mention pass protection or sacks. I heard him say people don't play as well when they're injured. Something everyone knows. I heard him say they need to clean up penalties. Something we all knew. I heard him saying Conklin coming back would be huge. Something all of us already knew. Nobody believes Hance plays close to the level of Conklin. Yet every team in the NFL plays with back ups.

Maybe it's you who needs to learn the content of what is included in an interview and what's not. You can't change the fact that Baker is being given more time than most QB's. You can't change the fact that our players do well in their match ups in pass protection. Of course at times people get beat that result in sacks. That happens on every team. But if you're not willing to admit that sacks alone don't tell the whole story.... if you're not willing to admit that in some cases the sacks result from Baker holding the ball too long... You're beyond help.


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I just wasted 14 minutes listening to an interview that didn't even mention pass protection or sacks.

If you already have your mind made up..believing YOU KNOW IT ALL...then you might be wasting your time and everyone else's time who clicks on your BIASED responses concerning this subject. You won't even consider what one of Baker's teammates has to say in a 14 minute interview because YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU ALREADY KNOW IT ALL.

I prefer to believe the Browns starting Center Treeter...that Baker is doing all he can to help his teammates win and that they have his back.




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Originally Posted by mac
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I just wasted 14 minutes listening to an interview that didn't even mention pass protection or sacks.

If you already have your mind made up..believing YOU KNOW IT ALL...then you might be wasting your time and everyone else's time who clicks on your BIASED responses concerning this subject. You won't even consider what one of Baker's teammates has to say in a 14 minute interview because YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU ALREADY KNOW IT ALL.

I prefer to believe the Browns starting Center Treeter...that Baker is doing all he can to help his teammates win and that they have his back.

You could have said that without the insults...smh btw I know everything tongue


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You could have said that without the insults...smh btw I know everything

EO...I feel that I've been insulted enough to respond "in kind"...

While you might feel that "you know everything"...I know for a fact that there are many who don't have a clue...because they think they know all there is to know.

Could it be that some just don't know or even care to know the extent of Mayfield's injuries?

Sadly, that might be the case, imo.






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Originally Posted by mac
I wonder what Baker's teammates have to say...well, just listen and maybe you will learn something...




The biggest thing I learned?

Someone figured out how to mic the media pool so the listener can hear the questions. saywhat There must be a rift in the space time continuum.

Before you know it, There will be rainy days in Cleveland and someone will beam down a message from outer space telling the camera man to wipe the rain off his camera!


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You've been proven wrong by different posters. And as I said, there was nothing in that interview about pass protection or sacks. Since you no longer have OBJ to blame for Bakers woes you feel the need to find yet another victim to blame. I get it and I knew it was coming. We have a great OL and Baker is getting time. No amount of rants and attacks will change that. Carry on.


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Originally Posted by mac
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You could have said that without the insults...smh btw I know everything

EO...I feel that I've been insulted enough to respond "in kind"...

While you might feel that "you know everything"...I know for a fact that there are many who don't have a clue...because they think they know all there is to know.

Could it be that some just don't know or even care to know the extent of Mayfield's injuries?

Sadly, that might be the case, imo.



True you do get picked on a lot...

2. Know everything, being sarcastic although many think that is the way I feel...lol

3. Have learned so much the last few years "NOT COACHING" I can't wait to get out there again...fielding offers just yesterday wink All I got to do is walk again...lol


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Go Browns!
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Originally Posted by eotab
Originally Posted by mac
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You could have said that without the insults...smh btw I know everything

EO...I feel that I've been insulted enough to respond "in kind"...

While you might feel that "you know everything"...I know for a fact that there are many who don't have a clue...because they think they know all there is to know.

Could it be that some just don't know or even care to know the extent of Mayfield's injuries?

Sadly, that might be the case, imo.



True you do get picked on a lot...

2. Know everything, being sarcastic although many think that is the way I feel...lol

3. Have learned so much the last few years "NOT COACHING" I can't wait to get out there again...fielding offers just yesterday wink All I got to do is walk again...lol



EO...I want to apologize to you for my poorly edited post. What I posted in the quote below, was not meant to be directed toward you...but was meant for another board member...sorry.

Quote
While you might feel that "you know everything"...I know for a fact that there are many who don't have a clue...because they think they know all there is to know.

Could it be that some just don't know or even care to know the extent of Mayfield's injuries?

Sadly, that might be the case, imo.



EO...as for me being "picked on" ...I never feel as if I'm being picked on by my fellow board members. It's all part of the discussion and our ability to explain our view point.

Taking a step back (forced or planned)...and viewing a situation from a different perspective can be helpful and productive. I know you have been dealing with some health issues that might have altered your approach toward some situations. I certainly hope that you are able to pursue and succeed at all of the goals you have set for yourself...good luck, EO.






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