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#1908682 12/07/21 01:12 PM
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I haven't been on this site for several weeks now, not reading, not commenting, not even opening the page. I've been thinking about why not. I've come to the conclusion that I'm feeling betrayed.

I've been a loyal fan for years, steadfastly standing by my team through some horrific times, always holding out hope that things would get better. They had to, The Browns have been an epically bad team for 2 decades. Last year things ended on a high note; the HC won Coach of the Year, the Browns made the playoffs with a powerful offense. In the off-season they built a defense to match. I came into this season with high expectations...for once.

So, what happened? Despite having a talented team, this team is a hot mess. Too talented to be bad, they aren't good either. Baker has been playing hurt, but that doesn't explain the offensive woes. The receiver corps that looked like an abundance of riches, has turned out to be suspect. The OLine which graded out top of the NFL last year has been pedestrian. The play-calling has been seriously questionable. The defense seems to take whole games off. WTF(udge)!

This season that promised so much after so many years of putrid football has fallen flat. And I am feeling betrayed by the organization. I'm seriously considering giving up my season tickets.


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2. "I'm just trying to be the best Nick I can be." ~ Nick Chubb
3. Forgive me Elf, I didn’t have faith. ~ Tulsa
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W84NxtYrAgain #1908686 12/07/21 01:35 PM
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Well said. We were duped again. We are Charlie Brown and the franchise continuously pulls the football.

Injuries, tough schedule, and bad luck have played roles … but we also aren’t winners and don’t make plays when it counts.

My biggest concern: Baker. If he can’t cut it then we’re back to square one.


"First down inside the 10. A score here likely puts us in the Super Bowl. Landry is far to the left as Hooper settles into the slot. DPJ is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Hunt are split in the backfield as Baker takes the snap ... Here we go."
W84NxtYrAgain #1908695 12/07/21 02:03 PM
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There's a bright side to every dark side ! There's always next year !!

I also feel the same way, the biggest thing that put a hurt on this team was all the injuries ! How in the heck ?

I wonder if the players play into all the hype and it makes them think they can just roll into a season and come out champions with out putting in all the effort.. The starters not playing preseason games and getting in football shape.

The the OBJ and his dad drama, who expected that ?

Just seems like it's one thing after another...

Hard to spend money to go to a game and walk out losers... Having to watch pathetic referees who I believe need drug tested after a game !

As excited I was about this season... I just wish it was over now.. I'm actually enjoying Hockey and the Cavs..

Can't even score 17 points to beat a team that handed you the ball 4 times in interceptions.. Not fun football to watch at all !!




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DeisleDawg #1908698 12/07/21 02:07 PM
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"Can't even score 17 points to beat a team that handed you the ball 4 times in interceptions.. Not fun football to watch at all !!"

That says it all

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W84NxtYrAgain #1908700 12/07/21 02:13 PM
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Such it up buttercup. Life sucks then we die. You can either keep the faith or move along. Your choice.


I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
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W84NxtYrAgain #1908706 12/07/21 02:34 PM
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I'm sure the team feels the same way about a good portion of the "fans."


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You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns.
Fiercely Independent.
W84NxtYrAgain #1908708 12/07/21 02:37 PM
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I feel duped for continuing to buy club seats and convincing myself it is good experience. It's overcrowded, the lines are long and most are completely unorganized. You'll wait 30 minutes to get a beer because everyone in line in front of you is ordering 37 mixed drinks. Have a separate line for beer only and drinks only! Of course the Browns cannot figure this out.

There are never any tables or seats to sit at unless you get there when the gates open. My suggestion, eliminate the club corners. Way too many people in the club section.

This is all much more tolerable when they are winning and these annoyances are heightened when losing.

On the plus side of this disappointing season, STH should get a better STH gift at the start of next year as opposed to the junk they've mailed out the past two seasons. Glass half-full!

W84NxtYrAgain #1908711 12/07/21 02:46 PM
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(GM misspelled the word suck (such), would have thought we'd all be more familiar with (i) that (/i) words spelling.

I feel ya w84nxt year, This is the year they signed Clowney!
This is the year they also signed, ... Takk McKinley!
This is the year they beat the Steelers twice in two weeks last year, including knocking them out of the playoffs.

This is the year Beckham was going to be back, and across from Landry, and and and, Higgins! ... and The DEFENSE!!
This is the year Baker was going to ... be the most efficient, and get 6 touchdown games passing,
THIS IS THE YEAR!! and, it ain't over yet!!!

I think of a movie, from about the year 1984 plus 2, It was called "Red Dawn" and in a scene in that movie,
I remember a still not quite a star actor, "Patrick Swayze" leading a bunch of

a bunch of scared teenagers, in an American hero story of a post Russian invasion, to acts of guerilla resistance,
and they were all whining, and sniveling, and tearing up, by a camp fire,

On the hills of some Uncle, in the woods, and What did Patrick Swayze's character say to the group...

Let it turn! Let this fear and hurt, turn to anger, turn to determination, Let it turn!

Let the sight of seeing their neighborhood and parents behind a fenced prison camp makeshift of enemy control on your soil,
LET IT TURN!

Let it turn to having the guts and determination to take on the overwhelming odds!

(Eh it was a movie. )


" You have to be able to throw the ball and throw the ball effectively in this league to keep up with the better football teams" Warren Moon. 1,8,12. Yes We Can Yes We Can!
W84NxtYrAgain #1908712 12/07/21 02:54 PM
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I understand feeling disappointed, but "betrayed" is over the top, IMO. This is the NFL, 31 out of 32 teams fail every year. Maybe some of you guys would be better off following TV wrestling if it's guaranteed outcomes you're looking for.

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Originally Posted by Steubenvillian
"Can't even score 17 points to beat a team that handed you the ball 4 times in interceptions.. Not fun football to watch at all !!"

That says it all
When I think that the Chiefs, of KC, who went to the SB, a couple times, lost 4 AFC games in a row,
about 2 months ago, even with the QB they had all year still healthy I believe,
and the same Head coach Andy Reid,
If the Chiefs can lose 4 games in a row, if teams like the Dolphins can beat the Ravens, I just believe,
the AFC is a tough place to get any kind of win this year.

It reminds me of an answer I received one time from the (e). "Oh you're struggling, well keep struggling."
(that's the answer? No answer? no fix? Just keep doing it? , but (e)'s are the guys who are supposed to come up with fixes.
Oh well, kept struggling, eventually things got...


" You have to be able to throw the ball and throw the ball effectively in this league to keep up with the better football teams" Warren Moon. 1,8,12. Yes We Can Yes We Can!
W84NxtYrAgain #1908716 12/07/21 03:08 PM
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Understandable.

Many of us felt this could be the year.

In light of the many things that has happened.

The only thing I can say is; sometimes you have to take a step back before you can take a step forward.

A lot of "stuff" happened.

Like you I am bitterly disappointed.

However, I have recently taken a different perspective. Until last year 500 looked real good. Always losing the first game I wondered if we would ever play above 500.

There are still games to play. Lots can happen although I am no longer optimistic.

bonefish #1908720 12/07/21 03:21 PM
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I lost my optimism after watching what the refs did to screw the Browns in the LA Chargers game that should have been a Browns win.

So I may be more near the acceptance stage of grief of this seasons results than some still in the denial stage.
Look! anything is possible, but, if the Refs aren't going to Let you win, then they aren't going to let you.

Anything is possible. The Browns have won 3 or 4 games the refs were trying to make sure they would lose in the last couple years.

Look at the last 2 minutes of the Bears game, iirc this year. On 5th down they tried to say when the bears Qb threw a pass to nobody but the ground to hope to get a first, that it must be a fumble that was recovered by the Browns with 3 Browns on top of the ball but no opposing players close,
and the opponent wanted the refs' to do something?
But after what they did in the Chargers game, the Browns whole season has been on a hope and a prayer. It's pretty obvious what the League wants.
and the league always want x, and x to come out of the AFC north. SPIT!

Last edited by THROW LONG; 12/07/21 03:24 PM.

" You have to be able to throw the ball and throw the ball effectively in this league to keep up with the better football teams" Warren Moon. 1,8,12. Yes We Can Yes We Can!
W84NxtYrAgain #1908724 12/07/21 03:34 PM
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2020 was simply an anomaly. The Browns is still the Browns.


"There's a gleam men. There's a gleam. Let's get the gleam." Marty Schottenheimer

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THROW LONG #1908735 12/07/21 04:57 PM
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Originally Posted by THROW LONG
(GM misspelled the word suck (such), would have thought we'd all be more familiar with (i) that (/i) words spelling.

I feel ya w84nxt year, This is the year they signed Clowney!
This is the year they also signed, ... Takk McKinley!
This is the year they beat the Steelers twice in two weeks last year, including knocking them out of the playoffs.

This is the year Beckham was going to be back, and across from Landry, and and and, Higgins! ... and The DEFENSE!!
This is the year Baker was going to ... be the most efficient, and get 6 touchdown games passing,
THIS IS THE YEAR!! and, it ain't over yet!!!

I think of a movie, from about the year 1984 plus 2, It was called "Red Dawn" and in a scene in that movie,
I remember a still not quite a star actor, "Patrick Swayze" leading a bunch of

a bunch of scared teenagers, in an American hero story of a post Russian invasion, to acts of guerilla resistance,
and they were all whining, and sniveling, and tearing up, by a camp fire,

On the hills of some Uncle, in the woods, and What did Patrick Swayze's character say to the group...

Let it turn! Let this fear and hurt, turn to anger, turn to determination, Let it turn!

Let the sight of seeing their neighborhood and parents behind a fenced prison camp makeshift of enemy control on your soil,
LET IT TURN!

Let it turn to having the guts and determination to take on the overwhelming odds!

(Eh it was a movie. )

Oh good lord I hit the wrong letters. Sorry everybody. I'm just thankful I don't hit the wrong posts and end up like your laugh


I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
W84NxtYrAgain #1908748 12/07/21 07:02 PM
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NOPE DAMMIT! If they don't get to the playoffs this year, I'm done with this team. Well, until next season anyway.


No really, I care about your feelings. rolleyes

#gmstrong

SuperBrown #1908749 12/07/21 07:05 PM
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Seems that way SB and some of us are getting old. Eventually, there won't be a " wait for next year".

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Dave #1908758 12/07/21 08:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave
I understand feeling disappointed, but "betrayed" is over the top, IMO. This is the NFL, 31 out of 32 teams fail every year. Maybe some of you guys would be better off following TV wrestling if it's guaranteed outcomes you're looking for.

Do you have season tickets Dave ?

I have met the OP and he's a great guy with a big heart for the team.. He spends lots of money on tickets , parking, and other money involved going to a game...

Peen travels 9 hours.. Columbus who I sit with in club travels 2 + hours and puts a lot into a tailgate. Saint is apart of the Columbus group along with his son and daughter who also put a lot into tailgating..There are others on this board who are in the group..Just don't post much and my old ass can't remember their DT name.. Know them by real name and love them !

Fate is another who I see every Sunday and there are so many who put lots of money into going. Yet they keep going and going like an energy bunny (battery) lol ! I get to see Arch once in awhile and he's a great guy ! I met DC and his son...Good people..

Then there's GM ...Jules.. Michelle.. love them big time ! Hard core tailgaters at one time.. Jan.. Browns Babe .. Purple..The guy from England..Hooper... so many and so many I can't remember names.. But Dang it was fun times really fun times !!

And ya know what ? the team sucked ! but everyone kept going and making the tailgates a great time ! Because of their heart and love for the Browns they made Sundays fun !!

I feel the OP's feelings... I also know all the road trips ..the flights.. the meeting up with posters and other Browns fans in other stadiums that a lot of these great fans do to support their team..

The OP is feeling down..so are many of us ! Telling him or any other fan who spends money..sits in sun rain and snow to support the Browns team they love ! to go watch a wrestling..Well Dave ! I like and respect ya.. But that kind of rubs me in a wrong way !

Just be a little more considerate to a good guy in bad feelings !




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W84NxtYrAgain #1908767 12/08/21 01:18 AM
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Injuries changed this team and what it could do.
IMHO, it's as simple as that.

They didn't lie to us, and they didn't sell us a pig in a poke.
We looked good on paper at the start of the year, and we only looked good as long as our entire compliment on #1's were on the field together.

W84- I get why you feel the way you do. We've all lived through the years when we deserved to feel betrayed (*cough*Holmgren*cough*), but I think that this was something quite different.

Two thoughts I'm keeping in my head at the same time:

1. The season isn't over yet, and CLE might still have some exciting games for us to watch.
2. The core of a good team will still be here to start the next season.


As a long-suffering fan, there's really no other mindset to take, when it comes to rooting for this team.


.02,
Clem.


24 is the new 32
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W84NxtYrAgain #1908769 12/08/21 05:14 AM
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Your anger is misplaced.
You fell for all the hype,mostly generated on this board.I would have thought that all this time you would have known better.
Blame your self for being gullible but don't blame the team.They are nothing more than highly skilled atheletes trying to make a million or two.


Indecision may,or maynot,be my problem
W84NxtYrAgain #1908771 12/08/21 07:08 AM
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Sports is just a form of entertainment - right?

Sometimes.

When things go right it is entertainment. Last game I was fired up. Then I started watching the game.

Am I having fun? No. I hate losing.

I considerer myself patient. Hell I am a fisherman. It teaches you patience. I kinda like just reward. When you work hard at something and it finally pays off.

But damn being a Browns fan is like some form torture. "The fumble" damn near killed me. I sore after that game I would never let a football game hurt me like that again.

I have been waiting since 1964. I don't know if you can call that patience? More like cruel and unusual punishment.

Wait till next year. "Yes sir can I have another."

Clemdawg #1908773 12/08/21 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by Clemdawg
Injuries changed this team and what it could do.
IMHO, it's as simple as that.

They didn't lie to us, and they didn't sell us a pig in a poke.
We looked good on paper at the start of the year, and we only looked good as long as our entire compliment on #1's were on the field together.

W84- I get why you feel the way you do. We've all lived through the years when we deserved to feel betrayed (*cough*Holmgren*cough*), but I think that this was something quite different.

Two thoughts I'm keeping in my head at the same time:

1. The season isn't over yet, and CLE might still have some exciting games for us to watch.
2. The core of a good team will still be here to start the next season.


As a long-suffering fan, there's really no other mindset to take, when it comes to rooting for this team.


.02,
Clem.

Excellent. I thought at the beginning of the season that only 2 things will stop us......injuries and off the field shenanigans. We've had a lot of the first and a little of the second. But you are right. There are still 5 games left and we're playing meaningful football in December. Our injured players have had a week off. Lamar is playing like crap. The steelers aren't very good despite pulling a few wins out of their butt. The bengals have been taken down a notch. The Raiders are 1-4 in their last 5. I don't think we'll have a Chrismas gift from the Packers though. It could be an interesting few weeks and we might be feeling a lot better once it plays out.


And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir

#GMSTRONG
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DeisleDawg #1908778 12/08/21 09:15 AM
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That's a good point. I think I'm in the same boat as OP, but betrayed still isn't the right word.

...but, to your point, I'd prolly feel differently if I had a bunch of money tied up in tickets and such. Season tickets is almost a racket regardless of how the team is doing. Hell, I look at my yearly $100 gamepass subscription and grumbling this time of year.


There is no level of sucking we haven't seen; in fact, I'm pretty sure we hold the patents on a few levels of sucking NOBODY had seen until the past few years.

-PrplPplEater
W84NxtYrAgain #1908781 12/08/21 09:22 AM
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Who betrayed whom? Did the browns betray you or did you betray yourself by believing we were just going to jump right to the superbowl..

Whenever I spoke of the team during the lead up to the season, I always qualified things by saying, "on paper, we're pretty good".... ON PAPER.

I get the feelings.. I really do.. I don't feel betrayed however .. I feel let down.

This team can still get 11 wins.. Not sure that's enough.


#GMSTRONG

“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan

"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
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W84NxtYrAgain #1908786 12/08/21 09:35 AM
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I think all Browns fans are disappointed. I have never had season tickets, in fact I go to very few games live. IT actually is very difficult for me to sit through a game. When I watch I turn on Jim & Doug and with the TV sound down. I pace the room unless the Browns are getting blown out. So even though, I don't have the financial investment some of you have, it makes me no less emotionally invested. 50% of the time while mowing the lawn I play out the draft with deals in my head or go through game and season scenarios just hoping I will see them in a Super Bowl before I leave this earth. Not that I am ancient, but I am 60 and have been following the Browns with the same intensity since 1969.

This season had me very optimistic but cautious because of the new starters coming this year on defense. I assumed it would take nearly half the season to get these guys in sync, but even with that we won 12 games with some really weak defensive starters last season. Also, IIRC the new DBs played very, very little in the pre-season due to hamstring and calf injuries so to me that would account for even more need time to get it together. After game 6, our D has allowed more than 16 points 1 time in the second 6 games this season.

To me this comes down to the offense. Baker gets a lot of criticism and much of it is justified but some not at all. When I hear people say he is too busy making commercials that is laughable. I can't imagine they take that long to produce, and I can't believe all NFL QBs don't take time off in the off season. Saying that, I know he has been inured but there are times when he comes across as mentally soft. I know he has an extreme intensity & desire to win. He organized the off season WR workouts. The things that concern me are the type of thigs from his college days. When he keeps alive his little back and forth with Colin Cowherd, when he walked off the field after we won a game, I assume because he felt the boos were directed at him all indicate a possibility of a bit of maturity issue. He gets defended by people saying his O line has been much worse this year, but I saw a stat the past few weeks where his pocket is clean for longer than nearly all QBs in the league.

OK, now that Baker is out of the way, our WR core this year has been a huge disappointment. I have no stats but it seems every game we at least 2 legit, easy catch dropped passes. Some games even more. I was hoping DPJ would break out a bit this season, but IIRC injuries have slowed his development. Hooper seems good for a drop a game. OBJ I will never figure but he lost me with the easy 4th and 2 pass early in the season that hit him chest high while he was running horizontally across the field that would have continued the drive. Having your LT play hobbled for several weeks then out for multiple game played a major factor.

Some of our play calls have been questionable like the the Landry WR pitch near the goal line, but overall, I think it has been a case of execution.

I am always optimistic. Baltimore, Cincinnati & the Steelers are all dealing with injuries at key position. Baltimore went for 2 because they did not have any DBs left, and their offense has been nearly as bad as ours recently.

Sorry, this was long but felt like ranting. Extremely disappointing. If/when the Browns do make it to the Super bowl I feel sorry for the sap who will be watching that AFC championship game with me. I will be a basket case.

DeisleDawg #1908787 12/08/21 09:37 AM
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Not sure how my comment was conflated into an attack on the OP and other season ticket holders? I don't claim to be some superior type of fan, and never have. I am suggesting that the risk of being let down/disappointed/crushed is inherent with any sports fandom. Its part of the deal, and nobody should know that better than we do. The decision to at least try to remain optimistic is mine, and mine alone. Others can carry on as they see fit, obviously.

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Originally Posted by Dave
Not sure how my comment was conflated into an attack on the OP and other season ticket holders? I don't claim to be some superior type of fan, and never have. I am suggesting that the risk of being let down/disappointed/crushed is inherent with any sports fandom. Its part of the deal, and nobody should know that better than we do. The decision to at least try to remain optimistic is mine, and mine alone. Others can carry on as they see fit, obviously.

I certainly didn't read it that way. You comment seemed reasonable and was articulated just fine.

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And yet things have changed cause here we are at 6-6 and we got fans stating how great they are and they are ready to give up. I've learned a little bit about giving up.

1. 1999 Survived widow maker heart attack in my sleep (100% blockage of the Aorta) at 43 years old and had to give up going for the $$$ my last game was 2004 as Paul Zuk treated me and the family to tickets to the game it btw was our only win on opening day but I never gave up on life even though it should have passed away.

2. 2007 had my 2nd heart attack again in my sleep. but I fought hard.

3. 2016 had 7 surge3ries on my legs - 5 by passes and went to wound care specialist and instead of wound care they cam up to me and told me that I needed to amputate my leg. When I refused they said I was in denial. Had my vascular surgeon to an extensive surgery and he woke me telling me he found the problem area and we were going to put a synthetic vein for a bye pass. Was told I would be on blood thinners for the rest of my life cause one more blockage and they have to amputate.

4. Since 2016 been on Coumadin and on Percocet my wound never healed until I went to a special service with the HEALING ICON St Anna (my mother's name and service was scheduled on my mother's birthday so I went. Within 2 weeks my wound healed! Prayer and hope kept me going strong.

5. 2018 Cancer hit I was lucky to find it as the pain meds had made me constipated and all of a sudden I had bleeding where the sun don't shine - It was a tumor. Because of my hear taking the beating over the years they didn't want to keep me under anestesia with surgery as my blood pressure would drop to 40's and they had problems waking me up. So they decided to blast me with radiation along with Chemo. I never gave up hope and my cancer has gone in full remission.

6. April this year my INR went over 11 and I was puking up gallons of blood so my hemogoblin dropped to where I need Oxygen 24/7 cause my blood is anemic to a dangerous point. But I still have survived

So here I am oxygen in my nose - having to rely on a wheel chair outside, No driving yet, no walking - My wife crying to me asking me to stay alive so I do not give up. Doctors are amazed but I have hope dwindling cause what good is my life if I cannot breathe, cannot walk - playing golf is a dream now. My Bucks who were the worst team for years in NBA turned it around like a miracle.

My Browns have turned it around where 6-6 with games left to play is now where some are asking to give up hope....GIVE UP HOPE!?!? as I sit here in pain refusing to give up hope. Not being able to coach (just got asked) but I can't walk My players text me telling me they love me and give me hope. I will never give up on my Browns by this time in previous years we were talking about the draft. We are 1 RT from a SB team and our D is coming together as finally our DBs have gotten healthy. Ravens are one of the best defensive teams out there. So their QB continues to chuck the ball up for grabs and all they need is that one time catch of a hail mary and that makes it tough for us to win but we are in the game at their field where I don't think we ever beat them at their field. Well lets beat them at home and lets have the crowd go crazy not for them to feel betrayed and won't yell with all their might like they do at champion team with champion fans. DON'T GIVE UP!!! Act like Champions and don't give up hope be part of the GOOD not part of the bad and wait for us to turn it around without any fans!!! This our time to win at home!!!! Let's get this


bring in a BEAST of a TE and a DT then BPA in the draft....team gets healthy we should be good - Prayers for a positive surgery for Baker. Time for the draft again.
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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W84NxtYrAgain #1908797 12/08/21 10:38 AM
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J/c

I lost my optimism after the Cardinals game. However, the Charger game was a killer. We played very well on offense and just couldnt get off the field on defense.

THen, to me, the back breaker was Pittsburgh. Losing to them gave me that “same old” pit in my stomach


"First down inside the 10. A score here likely puts us in the Super Bowl. Landry is far to the left as Hooper settles into the slot. DPJ is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Hunt are split in the backfield as Baker takes the snap ... Here we go."
eotab #1908808 12/08/21 11:02 AM
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Damn tab, glad you are still fighting.

The Browns I hope for the best. Maybe the kid Hudson will play better than Hance.

If we can somehow some way kick start the offense.

We have a chance to make the dream come true.

eotab #1908812 12/08/21 11:19 AM
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EO, as I have done before I wish you all the best and will keep you in my prayers. My wife has had some serious health issues in the last 14 years. She had a stroke in 2007, Breast cancer in 2011and heart trouble due to the Chemo and radiation. In December 2012 her cancer was in remission and she was OK for a while with it. In July 2020 she wasn't feeling well. The Doctors found cancer in one of her kidneys, which had to be removed, and in the bladder. Tumors have been growing in the bladder off and on and have been removed as she goes for scans every 3 months. She just had another big operation 2 days before Thanksgiving to remove more Cancer that they found. They believe they got it all and now she is recovering and trying to get her appetite back. She will be starting treatments in about 2 weeks. That's the next step. Like you she won't give up. Our family has been positive and 100% supportive of her. It's not easy. The Doctors told her that they haven't seen anyone with as much will to live as her. That means a lot for her survival as well as the Doctors attitude toward the patient. We just became Grandparents for the 1st time in October and we couldn't be happier. There's a lot to live for. I understand what you and your family are going through and again, I wish you nothing but the best and will keep you in my prayers. I've never said so many prayers as I have over the last 16 months but I really believe someone up there is listening. God Bless!

W84NxtYrAgain #1908822 12/08/21 11:58 AM
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be·tray·al ~ The breaking or violation of a presumptive contract, trust, or confidence that produces moral and psychological conflict within a relationship amongst individuals, between organizations or between individuals and organizations.

Maybe a bit of hyperbole when your talking about a sports team, but I get it... and I was sold on acceptance when I saw your "thinking about giving up season tickets" statement. I was right there after the Steelers game. Sat in the stands feeling like a fool all day, watching another a p!ss-poor performance, then had to drive home four hours. The whole time I'm thinking "why?". Why be so invested? (literally and figuratively)

Got back to Fort Wayne, ripped off my Chubb jersey and threw it across the room (yes, still that heated), sat down at my PC and listed my remaining tickets at TM... face value.

Woke up the next morning thinking "what have I done??". I was sure the Ravens tickets would be gone - they were still there lol.

And so will I be.

It can be a love/hate relationship at times... dysfunctional, irritating, feeling like you're being "cheated on". So I don't think "betrayed" is out of the question. Especially if invested also means thousands of dollars, time, travel, enduring bad weather, etc, etc...

Hang in there, boss... eventually #NxtYr will be #ThsYr!


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
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W84NxtYrAgain #1908825 12/08/21 12:15 PM
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j/c

Life hits us with things we have no control over. Those are things we must face and fight head on. Then there are choices we make about things that we are not required to do. Options in life. Our hobbies and passions. Those we have a choice in. Those things we choose to love, follow and in some cases, like Browns fans, endure.

I've chosen to be a very passionate Browns fan. Sort of a family tradition handed down to me from my grandpa. I chose to endure "the drive", "the fumble" and everything that has smacked us in the face since 1999. I even had no team for a few years as the rest of you that are old enough to have hung on during that time. I've watched as long time posters have left this board and new posters have arrived. I've been posting on one version of Dawgtalk/Dawgtalkers since 1999.

Now that doesn't make me any better fan than anyone else. But what I can say is this. I don't blame anyone who gives up on this team. I don't blame anyone who decides that they no longer wish to spend their free time, which should be used for enjoyment, to suffer through the agony Browns fans have had to endure. It's frickin' tough at times! Most of the time actually. So I'm not going to give you some speech about how when the going gets tough, the tough get going. That would be ridiculous. Everyone has their line in the sand. I get it.

As for myself? I'm just going to keep keeping on. It's the path I've chosen to walk and won't be stopping at any point I can envision. Much like some others on this board, I used to go to games and tailgate with many members of this board. I went to a draft party to celebrate with the Columbus crew many years ago. I went to Cleveland to meet DPG and Shep for those of you who remember them. GM and I have become very good friends over the years as well as some others. Little Brownie and I stay in touch. There was nothing like Hooper's Omelettes and a cold Colorado Coolaid at 7:00 A.M. in the Muni Lot. I'll never forget the team doing Dawgtalk Day at training camp and treating us like royalty. The parties at Nursedawgs house. Michelle and Jules. I could go on for what seems like forever. So many great people and friends I have made and memories that I will never forget. It runs much deeper than "a football team" for me. I've learned lessons and gained perspective about many things from the people I've met.

So to me that's the long and short of it. Everyone needs to do what's right for them and I get it. For me it's to continue as I have for well over 50 years now. A life long browns fan. For any of you who decide you have had enough and choose to find a different path to walk? All of the best to you and I hope you find what you are looking for.


Help Wanted: Stalker expert needed to rid Dawgtlkers of serial stalker with obsession issues. Apply via PM.

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FATE #1908836 12/08/21 12:44 PM
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I'm pretty upset the Browns can't have their best players suit up in a divisional game.
I don't want to watch Miller Foristall do anything!!

I'd rather watch Myles Garrett, As a Tight End, and know that maybe there's a chance.

This happens EVERY YEAR, but it only happens to the Browns!


" You have to be able to throw the ball and throw the ball effectively in this league to keep up with the better football teams" Warren Moon. 1,8,12. Yes We Can Yes We Can!
THROW LONG #1908909 12/08/21 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by THROW LONG
I'm pretty upset the Browns can't have their best players suit up in a divisional game.
I don't want to watch Miller Foristall do anything!!

I'd rather watch Myles Garrett, As a Tight End, and know that maybe there's a chance.

This happens EVERY YEAR, but it only happens to the Browns!

Actually, I'd bet that Myles could easily line up at TE, and if he has EVER worked on that craft *and* can catch, I bet he'd be an absolute monster.

Dude his size and runs a 4.48 (after a practice last year, but 4.57 at his Pro Day). He's bigger and faster than Travis Kelce.... the question is can he use his body like a basketball player (coach knows he can, lol).

Would he have any legs left at the end of the first half, though??


Fear us, for we have Hughlett

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

PrplPplEater #1908917 12/08/21 08:43 PM
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Originally Posted by PrplPplEater
[quote=THROW LONG]

Would he have any legs left at the end of the first half, though??


I think I'd be more worried about flags ! I can see him jumping off sides a bit trying to knock someones helmet off before he catches a pass for a 15 yd pick up !




PitDAWG #1908918 12/08/21 08:45 PM
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Hooper still makes those eggs but across the street , even the Muni became to much for him lol, he still stops by our tailgate spot every Sunday ! Great post Pit !




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FORTBROWNFAN #1908919 12/08/21 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by FORTBROWNFAN
IT actually is very difficult for me to sit through a game. When I watch I turn on Jim & Doug and with the TV sound down.

I enjoyed your post overall, but I am genuinely curious about people that turn the sound down and listen to Jim and Doug w/ the TV on. It seems anymore with HD channels and TV broadcasts in general, that the radio broadcast it typically a few seconds ahead of the televised broadcast.

Are you hearing the play call on the radio before visually seeing it on the TV? This would seem maddening.

Being up at Indians games (while in concession line) they play Tom Hamilton through the speakers in the concourse, but all the TVs have the local TV broadcast. You always hear Tom Hamilton's call (plus fan reaction) before what is seen on the TVs. It's akin to watching a movie when the sound doesn't line up with the actors mouths. Drives me nuts.

Milk Man #1908943 12/09/21 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Milk Man
I feel duped for continuing to buy club seats and convincing myself it is good experience. It's overcrowded, the lines are long and most are completely unorganized. You'll wait 30 minutes to get a beer because everyone in line in front of you is ordering 37 mixed drinks. Have a separate line for beer only and drinks only! Of course the Browns cannot figure this out.

There are never any tables or seats to sit at unless you get there when the gates open. My suggestion, eliminate the club corners. Way too many people in the club section.

This is all much more tolerable when they are winning and these annoyances are heightened when losing.

On the plus side of this disappointing season, STH should get a better STH gift at the start of next year as opposed to the junk they've mailed out the past two seasons. Glass half-full!

I enjoy the club section. Yes, it is crowded, but no more so than anywhere else. I agree, it can be hard to find a seat in the club, so I get there by 11:30 and never have a problem. To me, part of the value in being a club holder is to enjoy the club, so I do. I find it refreshing to get there early to find a seat and cool down for those 2 early games where it is fairly hot outside, and more so to warm up on the cold rainy days the rest of the season. All it takes is a little planning and start your out of stadium activities a little earlier. As for beers, I don't drink alcohol anymore, but do drink non-alcoholic beers. I just buy two for me when I go up.

As for bars, a bar is a bar. I have spent many months of my life in total sitting at or walking up to bars. Unless it was a beer honky tonk, I have never seen a set-up where beer was sold at one bar and liquor drinks at another. I am not sure it reasonable to expect the Browns to set it up that way. I know a few years ago they did have a couple of Goose Island taps set up in the corners. They probably didn't last because either people didn't like the selection, or it was a little more expensive. Yes, it cost more. To me, what's another $buck when you are already paying a high price? I figure they could charge $20 and you would still buy a couple. In the end, they probably closed because not enough people used them.

We still need to meet up. Before games, you can find me sitting along the Lake glass, usually across from the B spot...I don't usually wear a hat indoors, so look for the guy with a close cropped haircut. There will probably be a white can of Bud NA in front of me. Russ is the name, so you don't have to walk up to people asking for Ballpeen...lol. I am leaving for the game in the morning(Fri). Hope to see you Sunday.

As for the original comment about betrayal, I don't feel that. That would be more about Modell moving the team, but even then, he did what he felt he needed to do, so I don't place all of that on him. The city was involved in that mess as well.

To me, football is entertainment. If it ever gets to the point I don't like going, I won't. It's pretty simple. The team doesn't owe me wins or better gifts. The only thing they owe me is to open up and kick off when they are supposed to kick off. If they do that, they have met their obligation. That doesn't mean I don't get ticked off when things don't go well. Trust me, I do, but as others have said, it isn't just about how the team plays, it's about the entire experience. I have met everybody mentioned in other people's posts, as well as many who weren't mentioned. I also post on another board...the browns board...I have joined up with many of those people over the last 6-7 years. I post under the same name over there. The entire experience isn't just about winning...at least for me it isn't. To me there is value in meeting up with other people with similar passion. I wouldn't trade that....ok...I might trade a few of you for more wins....ahhh, probably not.


If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.

GM Strong




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bonefish #1908945 12/09/21 07:29 AM
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There is so much effort that goes into predicting games.

Everybody has a take. Everybody makes a prediction.

But we do not know. That is why we watch sports. We love it even more when there are upsets. Like when Buster Douglas knocked out Mike Tyson.
Or, the US Hockey team beat the Russians.

The Cubs finally won the World Series.

The history of the Browns is weird. The whole Modell Belichick thing.

In the end nothing is given. You have to earn it. Football has become so popular because every team has an equal chance.
All teams get the same amount of money to spend. Free agency and the draft allow small market teams to have equal footing with big market teams.

The Browns finally have a good foundation in place. I remain confident that Berry and KS will fulfill our dream of a championship.

I can not predict when. But I do believe it will happen.

Homewood Dog #1908950 12/09/21 08:19 AM
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Don't mean to hijack the thread but prayers out there for your wife and posters please don't insult me by taking it easy on me due to illness - getting me angry helps as an infusion of blood rush helps as my blood pressure needs that. Just yesterday went to cardiologist as follow up from Hospital visit -- I use this one as my GP they got all crazy cause my blood pressure was coming up 70/45 we couldn't understand why? outside of they were ready to call an ambulance then I said wait...my Oxygen tank is out and sure enough for the last 15-20 minutes I was getting no oxygen, I couldn't walk as my legs were all numb/asleep and could not stand up from wheel chair so now I know if legs are numb and out of wack its because of a lack of Oxygen....we didn't even put on the finger thing cause as soon as they brought in a new tank I was able to move my legs and then in 5 minutes or so my blood pressure reached 95/65. Ummm dumb ass you need to breathe...lol laugh


bring in a BEAST of a TE and a DT then BPA in the draft....team gets healthy we should be good - Prayers for a positive surgery for Baker. Time for the draft again.
GM Strong! & Stay safe everyone!
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