DawgTalkers.net Forums The Archives 2021 NFL Season Looking Back: Browns 24 Ravens 22 Post game thoughts

I'm convinced they are calling the game from a tape delay on a screen, so they see events on the fields before they have to announce it. Way too many "coincidences" of "He's hasn't fumbled the ball in 300 carries... The ball is loose!!! he fumbled the rock!!!"

I don’t think our offense has been on track since the Chargers game honestly. It might be injuries, nobody to take the top off the defense, etc. But we feel like we’re playing in a shell

The offense is broken.

It's always excellent play calling when the players execute the play and it's always called terrible play calling when they don't.

j/c

As often is the case we had "The Tale of Two Halves"

We had both good Baker and bad Baker depending on which half you watched. From any of those who claimed Baker has been scared out of throwing the deep ball, I hope you watched the game. We had the offense executing in the first half and failing to execute in the second half. We had the defense playing well in the first half then faltering in the second half.

Now I could break down one half and claim that speaks for the entire game. I could claim either half tells the entire story. But as we all can see that's simply a fools errand and holds zero merit. Which is always the case. The first half it looked like we had very competent WR's and Hooper looked fine. And the second half it didn't.

Our O managed to put 17 points on the board in the first half and zero in the second half.

Bottom line here is that both our O and D played JUST WELL ENOUGH in the first half to outweigh the horrible second half performance.

It's a win so I'll take it. But it certainly doesn't give me a warm, fuzzy feeling.

We Won;
The ratbirds, stealers and bengals all lost.

It was an awesome week

Compelled to reply ( lol ) " Higgins, and all of our WRs, in general, are a complete mystery. " Nope ; they are not in position to make plays !

Funny thing. They certainly seemed to be in positions to make plays in the first half. Even Hooper did. Is this going to be one of those threads where posters forget what happened in the first half?

I wonder if we will ever figure out how to defend against competent TEs, let alone great ones.

LB in FA or draft?

Wow. You really, really, really didn't like Kurt Warner breaking down film and telling anyone that wanted to pay attention how the one game Baker wasn't at fault for the lack of points did you? Still seems like you are railing against his breakdown and film study weeks after he did it.

Tell you what. Instead of breaking down one half or the other - why don't you go back and breakdown the whole game from this weekend.

I do remember the very first play of the game - it hit Hooper in the hands and he dropped it. Now I know you say you don't know if our receiving core is elite or not, but maybe it's me ... but it seems most elite receivers catch balls that hit them in the hands.

I do intend to watch the game cuts on Sunday Ticket ... so I will let you know what I see. But I am not doing that in a vacuum - you need to do it to. Maybe we'll see the same things - or, better yet, maybe we'll see different things to discuss.

Hooper dropped the first pass of the game. Baker threw to guys who were tightly covered all day...all season actually. I'll believe Baker and Chubb when they express frustration about what happened in the 2nd half.

Best post yet.

Please enlighten as to what "bad" Baker was in the 2nd half.

4 possessions in the 2nd half.

Drive 1 - 10 plays: Taken out of the game for concussion check while team had 3rd and 6 at the Bal 44 yard line.
Drive 2 - 11 plays: Drives team down to Baltimore 23 yard line and play calling got conservative and settled for missed 40 yard FG - 11 minutes left in game.
Drive 3 - 3 plays: 3 and out with 7 minutes left in game and leading by 2 scores. all plays were passes - 1 screen and 1 pass to fullback and incomplete pass under pressure to Landry which would not have been a 1st down. Very conservative but intent was to keep play clock moving and not just run 3 plays into line of scrimmage. Should have taken sack to keep clock moving or force timeout.
Drive 4 - 3 plays: 3 and out with 6 minutes left in game. 2 Chubb runs for -1 yard and 4 yard pass to DPJ.

Oh - does that mean I don't need to go watch the game again? Or is this breakdown meritless because it is only one half? .... And besides - any good Baker Hater knows that the play calling got conservative because KS doesn't trust Baker. Duh.

You mean one half of one game to try and break down what happened over a three game stretch. In fact you could include the second half of this game. I gave you the perfect example. Do you think evaluating either half of this game explains the other half of it? Of course not. One half Baker and the entire team played pretty well. With the exact same players on both sides of the ball they stunk it up during the second half.

So you want me to break down the entire game but think Warner explains everything by breaking down one half? Hmmmm, interesting.

It's odd how you concentrate on Hoopers drop in the beginning but ignore his three catches, one for a TD. You act like targets never drop a ball. Yet he caught a TD pass which accounted for 7 of the 17 points our O scored the entire game.


That's simply a lie. My claim is that Baker has to play good enough for me to evaluate them. As for this game? They looked above average in the first half and well below average in the second half. Once again if you look at Bakers completion percentage in each half it helps explain a lot. Your contention seems to be that him throwing, in this case well below 50% is all on the WR's. But that doesn't explain his high completion percentage in the first half. It was the take of the two Bakers. Never have I ever claimed nor expressed that I "don't know if they're elite or not". There is under no circumstances I would ever claim they're elite. But then a good QB doesn't need an elite squad of WR's to play well.

Excellent game
We beat the division leaders and we did not play are best.

He also caught three in that first half. One resulting in 7 of the only 17 points the offense scored. But if you focus on the one and ignore the other three it kind of sounds like you made a point.

You wouldn't get the point if it was stuck in your eye. Elite TEs don't drop passes like that. Hooper also gets zero separation and zero YAC...Baker makes great throws to even get it to the guy. You were being asked if our receiving options are elite. It's ok to say they are not elite...while maintaining criticism of Baker's play. It's pretty-much what everyone else on the board is/has-been doing.

Hmmmm - most of my post was light hearted in nature. Hence the

However - regards claiming you don't know if the receiving core is elite or not. That's not a lie. I asked you flat out - do you THINK our recieving core over the last few games would be characterized as Elite - Very Good - Good - Average - Below average (I think those were the choices)..... you claimed you couldn't make a determination. Yes you used Baker as an excuse. But like I said before - if you can't see a below average WR core when you see it (for any reason) then I don't know what to tell you. You can claim it's because of Baker ... but you flat out said you couldn't tell if our receivers were Elite.

I didn’t like Baker and Stefanski’s post game interviews.

I’m a shake and Bake guy but my man needs to stop being so down mooted and critical about our game plan. Nothing good will come out of it. Where is the old Baker we know?

The front office and especially our GM also needs to stop playing mind games with the media about our most important position. All this endless speculations about Baker is killing some of the guys mood and some of the good vibes that the team is generating.

My take on this is simple. A healthy organization don’t start to shake the boat when we finally is getting somewhere. Crazy stuff. We all need to get behind our players and fill them with confidence, not the other way around. Andrew Berry should take a step forward and settle the score whatever it is and after that silence the surrounding narrative that there is tensions between our QB and other important members of the organization. Why has he allow the media to continue create such a self destructive narrative about our most important position?

Good leadership is to when necessary own the narrative of what’s going on in the organization.

Precisely so. You could even say something along the lines of the receiving core looks average but I believe that's because of the QB.

Anyhoo. It's a win. We are going to win the division. Monday's are good after a W no matter what.

I do agree with that 100%. No matter what - keep any dirty laundry in house. Period.

Does anyone remember the incomplete pass on 3rd & 10 to Landry before the missed FG at the start of the 4th Q? I had stepped away and only saw the missed FG. The reason I ask is because Stefanski echoed Mayfield's regret for "not putting an opponent away" (due to "conservative" play-calling), but then slipped in what I consider to be a passive-aggressive dig at Mayfield. He said he also lamented not making the FG to make it a 3 score game (18 pts), and then added he also regretted not converting on the 3rd down play before the missed FG. On the radio, Rizzo said it appeared that both Landry and Stefanski were visibly annoyed with Baker.

Did he throw to the wrong guy? Was someone else open? Was it a bad pass? Or none of the above?

Hooper was wide open on that TD pass. Wide open.


I said under no circumstances did I consider them elite. Read much?


So the fact that Baker threw for a 42% completion percentage during the second half is the fault of the same WR's that he did so well throwing to in the first half?

Or the NFL is the WWE.. you ever wonder how Vegas usually always wins!

So Baker must have done extremely well yesterday with a below average WR group in one half and done terrible because of the WR's in the second half. News flash. It was the same players. Oh no, that's not it. Baker only threw for 42% of his passes in the second half because of the play calling. The plays that are called must effect his arm.



Just remember I'm joking because I used a laughing emoji.

Can you confirm this because I'm arguing with a guy on Twitter at the very moment that says the pass was bad and behind Hooper and there was no replay during the game? Just was called a drop

Those knocking Hooper don't want you to see this one.



A basic pass and catch. They claim he doesn't get open. One poster said the only reason Hooper catches the ball is because Baker makes such terrific passes when he is covered. The film says no.

Just watched it again.

Drop.

That was perfect ! would love to see more passes and catches like that more often !

I re-watched the game. I thought Baker played excellent in the first half and decent in the second half. Our last 2 drives were brutally conservative.

Does anyone have access to PFF - I guess I would take their grades as a neutral overview of how the Offense performed. I'd be interested in season long grades on our WR, TE and QB as well. I know Baker's grades should be below average for most of the games since he tore his shoulder ... I'd still be interested to see if anyone can post.

And there were a lot of those during the first half. I think Baker played very well in that first half. I think the receiving targets played pretty well during that first half. I guess where my issue is, is where people are quick to point out that Hooper dropped the first pass but not willing to give him credit where credit is due.

I mean I could sit here and point out the int. Baker threw by throwing the ball well behind Landry as some sort of indication of how Baker played in the first half but that would be trying to focus on one of only a very few mistakes he made during that first half as being indicative of how he actually performed overall in that first half. And that would be painting a false picture.

We certainly agree on the first half. I don't see how anyone could pull "decent" out of that second half though.

Ok let me set the record straight as far as my post went . I was and am talking about the WR Room , play calling and Ski as a total body of work so far the season . I was responding to Purp. as it pertained to disappearing wideout's through out the season. Now you can bend the thread anyway you want , but that's what I was posting about ! I believe most posters caught my drift .

That's not the one where Landry only went 7 yards out is it? Landry looked annoyed after that one, but I don't know if he realizes he had two guys draped around him and Baker was being chased to the sideline... and even IF Landry had caught it, he wasn't anywhere close to getting that 1st Down. He was going to be crushed on the spot like a grape.

You say Baker missed this throw behind Landry.

What if Landry was supposed to break in and not out based on where the safety was located.

Possibly, Baker threw it where he was supposed to be and Jarvis made an incorrect route adjustment. It happens.

j/c...

Actually if you have the chance to look at that play again. Landry was crossing in his route before Baker let go of the ball. The only possibility is that Landry was supposed to make a sudden stop in the middle of his route while he was running full speed. The pass wasn't delivered inside of where Landry made his initial break to the outside. This one was pretty obvious. Good Lord. I gave Baker credit for playing a great half of football. Now saying he wasn't perfect isn't enough? lmao

I need the All-22, or someone with it to look, to be certain, but I'm 99% certain that when the ball was released, Landry was headed one way. He abruptly altered his direction and went to the outside right about that time. You can get a feel for that by looking at the amount of time that passes between Landry's move and when the ball arrives, but also by looking where the ball arrives. I suspect that Baker anticipated Landry to stop and turn around/come back a step and not to stop, come back and do an out. Which of the two was right based on the scheme/route rules and the read is anyone's guess.

When you see something like that, almost never is it something so super simplistic like "missed him behind". He was throwing to a spot. Either it was the wrong spot to throw to or the WR went to the wrong one. These are the things they practice over and over and should be second nature. In practice, defenses should be changing up their coverages and techniques to practice them for themselves, but also to give specific looks to the offense so that they can practice their stuff. Granted, it's a little more nuanced, but this is the sort of thing that like not having 12 men on the field, all of the players should know to the point of subconsciously reacting in the correct manner.

Ahh, you were talking the failed attempt at a 1st down, not the play that resulted in the INT.

That ball was definitely behind, but had it been less behind, it could have been picked. Either way, there was a guaranteed 0% chance of it being converted for a 1st because Landry was short and tightly covered.