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99% with many of the posters here... j/s

Deshaun Watson, “innocent until proven guilty”
by CLEVELAND FROWNS on MARCH 19, 2022
http://www.clevelandfrowns.com/2022/03/deshaun-watson-innocent-until-proven-guilty/

Regarding the Browns having signed the superstar quarterback who has been sued by 22 women—but cleared by a grand jury—for alleged sexual assault:

First, this is absolutely not to excuse any grown adult for allowing their sense of well-being to rise or fall with the fortunes of the Cleveland Browns.

Second, of course, countless crimes go unpunished in this nation every day, for many bad and inexcusable reasons, especially when they’re committed by wealthy and powerful people. So yes, it is to some extent unsatisfactory to simply say “innocent until proven guilty” with respect to Deshaun Watson, as true and important as that principle is.

But about the 22 ladies who’ve sued Deshaun Watson for having sexually assaulted them, folks should consider not only that a grand jury refused to indict Watson based on these accusations and whatever evidence there was to support them. This is remarkable in itself because sexual-assault cases where more than one alleged victim is accusing the defendant of the same thing are generally considered to be low-hanging fruit for prosecutors.

But what is even more remarkable about these accusations is their timing, as they came in the wake of a flood of press coverage over Watson wanting to force his way out of Houston—based at least in part on the increasingly prevalent perception that the Texans owners are racists—despite having several years left on what was at the time one of the most lucrative deals ever given to a quarterback.



It is well documented that most of the Texans locker room (along with many other current and former players league-wide) was enraged in 2018 when then-owner (since deceased) Bob McNair — who already had “a questionable history of racially insensitive comments,” as one 2017 report puts it — infamously doubled down on his criticism of black players taking a knee for social justice by saying that he “can’t have the inmates running the prison.” And Watson was also upset in January of 2021 that the Texans didn’t hire one of the two qualified black men who were identified as the two best candidates by a search firm that the Texans hired to help fill their GM candidacy.

The “resulting discord” that this GM search caused within the Texans organization led to a piece in the Washington Post titled, “Deshaun Watson is taking a stand against disingenuous NFL owners,” touting the QB as having sparked “a player awakening that owners should acknowledge and respect rather than trivialize the men who enliven the sport.” In this piece, the Texans organization is described as “dysfunctional,” “particularly unstable,” and characteristic of “the NFL’s preset dehumanization.” Watson, on the other hand, is described as “thinking deeply about systemic inequality” and “want[ing] to be as far away from the Texans as he can get.”

It wasn’t until after these headlines about Watson wanting out of Houston that the first of the sexual assault accusations surfaced, all brought by women represented by the same lawyer, Tony Buzbee, who reportedly lives 300 feet down the street from current Texans owner Cal McNair.

It’s bad enough for the NFL plantation owners when star college QBs like John Elway or Eli Manning refuse to sign with teams that draft them. So imagine how the McNairs must have felt about a young black superstar quarterback, who was already beloved in Houston after having played there for several years, leveraging his star power to force his way out of town after having just signed a pricey contract extension — and how much worse that Watson was doing this based on accusations that the Texans owners are racists whom he could no longer stand playing for.

This was a colossal business and public relations crisis for the McNairs that conveniently happened to evaporate as the sensational accusations against Watson surfaced. Then all of a sudden everyone was supposed to believe that this young man who had always displayed high character and leadership in rising to stardom as an NFL quarterback and who is surely one of the last men on earth who’d need to pay for sex or otherwise force his way into it was some kind of sex-crazed brute who’d assaulted dozens of women. Nevermind also that the sex-crazed black brute is a well-worn racist trope.

I can’t say that Watson is innocent, and it’s doubtful that solid proof will ever come out affirming one way or the other; and this being the Browns I of course I can’t say I expect his tenure in Cleveland to end in anything but a heretofore unfathomable conflagration of disappointment and despair. But the folks who are saying that they’re not going to root for the team anymore or who otherwise want to denounce the organization for having signed a quarterback who has been sued by 22 women—but cleared by a grand jury—for alleged sexual assault, should at least consider the extremely suspect timing and circumstances behind these accusations.

I have seen that tin foil hat conspiracy. The gigantic flaw in the idea that this is some contrived conspiracy to throw shade on Watson ... there is no debate or argument what Watson was doing. And we're supposed to believe that Watson's teammates and Owner knew what he was engaged in - then went out and found these random women and convinced them lie. What a 100% crock.

Occam's Razor. Not only does it help with implications on what the "story" is regards the 22 accusations. It most definitely tells us where to lean on this [censored] conspiracy theory.

From reading the link of what the accusers testified, no where did I see him force anybody to do anything. He suggested it, and from reading the testimony they declined. What he was doing was no right, but I don't see how this is made out to be sexual abuse. It surely is not rape, and there was nothing violent about it. The dude is probably a sex addict, which is a mental problem that can be fixed. I believe he was wrong bu suggesting they do something they didn't want to, but in all the accounts listed, most spoke their part, and then left. None of the testimonies listed said he forced them to do anything.

I am not saying he is a saint, and did nothing wrong, but the way many here are speaking of this, you would think he was trapping and forcing them into sexual acts. From what I read, it was suggestions that were declined, and the women immediately left. According to their own testimony, the sexual act never happened.

Placing your erection, unwanted, into another woman's hand is what then? No big deal according to you as long as he doesn't do anything once his offer is declined?

I mean with all these hypitheticals being thrown out, it seems your hypothetical is that if a man places his erection into your wife or daughters hands but doesn't rape them, it's all good.

Did Watson learn anything from this? If he didn't, I could see him keep doing what he's doing, get caught and have to miss some serious time. It just seems like such a Browns thing that would happen.

The fact that we just traded for a “top 5 QB” and this is basically the only conversation we and anyone else is having about it pretty much tells me it was a gigantic mistake. Here we are, probably the most divided I’ve ever seen the fan base and local media. People walking away and honestly, they may be replaced by new fans in time but I don’t see them coming back.

There’s a million proverbs and allegories and fables and stories that basically outline the same message: There are things that you can do that may give you everything you’ve ever wanted in this world that simply aren’t worth the price. It’s the devils bargain. We may indeed win a Super Bowl with Watson… I just don’t think I’d be able to really enjoy it.

I know every team is made up of mercenaries but there are lines, it’s not all relative, you can’t unsee or unknow at a certain point. A team represents a city and ultimately the kinds of triumph we want to embody. Im too old to go back on the stuff I truly believe about how people should treat other people. Short of Watson doing an about face and truly seeking to properly rectify this and change (and my ability to actually believe it’s sincere) I just can’t support the team with an unrepentant beast leading the team. It’s not about being sanctimonious, it’s about being a good person. If you have no interest in being a good person in the world, I don’t want anything to do with you. I definitely don’t want to see you get away with (much less incredibly rewarded) while you seek to only escape justice and throw mud on your victims. It saddens me tremendously that MY team is the one to reward that person. I’m done.

Browns trade for QB Deshaun Watson
Watson has been selected to three Pro Bowls (2018-20) and led the NFL in passing yards in 2020 with 4,823

https://www.clevelandbrowns.com/news/browns-trade-for-qb-deshaun-watson

The Cleveland Browns and Houston Texans have made the following trade:

Browns receive:
QB Deshaun Watson

2024 5th round pick

Texans receive:
2022 1st round pick

2023 1st round pick

2023 3rd round pick

2024 1st round pick

2024 4th round pick

Watson has been selected to three Pro Bowls (2018-20) and led the NFL in passing yards in 2020 with 4,823. He has recorded the highest completion percentage in NFL history (67.8 percent) among all players with at least 1,500 passing attempts. Originally a first-round pick by Houston in 2017, Watson has appeared in 54 career games and has completed 1,186 of his 1,748 passes for 14,539 yards with 104 touchdowns, 36 interceptions and a 104.5 rating. He has added 1,677 rushing yards with 17 touchdowns. Watson helped Clemson win the 2016 National Championship and won the Davey Brien Award as the top NCAA QB in 2015 and 2016.

Dee and Jimmy Haslam:

"We spent a tremendous amount of time exploring and investigating the opportunity to trade for Deshaun Watson. We are acutely aware and empathetic to the highly personal sentiments expressed about this decision. Our team's comprehensive evaluation process was of utmost importance due to the sensitive nature of his situation and the complex factors involved. We also understand there are still some legal proceedings that are ongoing and we will respect due process. It was pivotal that we, along with Andrew Berry and Kevin Stefanski, meet with Deshaun to have a straightforward dialogue, discuss our priorities, and hear directly from him on how he wants to approach his career on and off the field. He was humble, sincere, and candid. In our conversations, Deshaun detailed his commitment to leading our team; he understands and embraces the hard work needed to build his name both in the community and on the field. Those in-depth conversations, the extensive evaluation process, his dedication to being a great teammate and devotion to helping others within the NFL, within the community, and through his charitable initiatives provided the foundation for us to pursue Deshaun. We are confident in Deshaun and excited about moving forward with him as our quarterback and supporting his genuine and determined efforts."

Executive Vice President of Football Operations and General Manager Andrew Berry:

"We look forward to having Deshaun as our starting quarterback. We have done extensive investigative, legal and reference work over the past several months to provide us with the appropriate information needed to make an informed decision about pursuing him and moving forward with him as our quarterback. Deshaun has been among the very best at the position and he understands the work needed to re-establish himself on and off the field in Cleveland. We are confident that he will make positive contributions to our team and community as we support his return to football."

Head Coach Kevin Stefanski:

"Our organization did a tremendous amount of background on Deshaun. We understand the concerns and questions that exist but are confident in the extensive work Andrew and his staff have done to feel confident about him joining our organization. It was important for us to meet with Deshaun in person as part of our team's evaluation process, we had a candid conversation regarding his approach to coming into our organization and community. I'm looking forward to the opportunity to coach Deshaun, he is ready to put in the hard work needed to help our team improve and make a positive impact in our community."

LMAO.

What a bunch of marketing BS. But it sure does beat the truth - "We don't care about the accusations or what his character is, we just wanna win"

Inside the Deshaun Watson deal
Posted by Mike Florio on March 20, 2022, 12:28 PM EDT
https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2022/03/20/inside-the-deshaun-watson-deal/
The Browns were out of the Deshaun Watson sweepstakes until they dug extra deep in the couch cushions of Jimmy Haslam’s Cleveland steamship.

So how much money will they be paying Watson? We’ve gotten our eyes on the details, per a source with knowledge of the contract.

Here’s the breakdown, which is as simple as it gets:

1. Signing bonus: $44.965 million, fully guaranteed.

2. 2022 base salary: $1.035 million, fully guaranteed.

3. 2023 base salary: $46 million, fully guaranteed.

4. 2024 base salary: $46 million, fully guaranteed.

5. 2025 base salary: $46 million, fully guaranteed.

6. 2026 base salary: $46 million, fully guaranteed.

Rarely if ever has a deal looked so clear and clean. No games, no fluff. He gets $46 million each and every year. Each year, the relative impact on the cap will shrink, because the total spending limit will keep going up and up and up.

As previously reported, there’s no signing bonus forfeiture or voiding of future guarantees based on the existing allegations against Watson. If he’s suspended by the league, the guarantees remain.

And the current structure minimizes the financial impact of a suspension, given that he’d lose only $60,882 for each game missed. If, for some reason, a suspension doesn’t happen until 2024, the Browns surely would convert most of the $46 million to a guarantee, dropping the salary to the minimum and once again minimizing the cost of a suspension.

It seems like a too-convenient loophole, but plenty of players and teams have done it in the past. The league presumably could impose a separate fine aimed at reversing the impact of the obvious manipulation of the consequences of a suspension.

If my hypothetical wife or daughter willingly agreed to work on an athlete's glutes and groin, I would regrettably expect that they would come into contact with the adjacent anatomy.

It's a situation filled with hard to interpret signals (from an evolutionary perspective) and/or autonomic responses. I know we like to act like we're noble and upstanding, but if an attractive female is putting her hands near a healthy hetero male's intimate area, there's going to be a physiological response.

To me the question is did he force clearly unwanted sexual contact or was there only incidental contact that made some women uncomfortable and consensual sex with others? There are a nearly infinite number of "degrees" between those different scenarios.

There's also the whole issue of perception. It's hard to know the intentions of another person's actions without clear communication. People can't read each other's thoughts.

For me, a licensed professional should make clear any expectations before getting in the room. If the client is told there will be no sex before there is contact, there is no room for misinterpretation/"confusion"/too intimidated to say anything scenarios.

If this was clearly stated before Watson did something unwanted, he deserves to be punished. If he forced anyone, he deserves to be punished. If the women lied about what happened, they deserve to be punished.

I still don't know what actually happened. We'll probably never "know" what actually went down. Or maybe we will.

We have Bengal fans and even a Steeler fan who post on this board. Being here has nothing to do with supporting this team. I will be here to watch the circus.


If you think refusing to support a sexual predator makes you "holier than thou" I think you have a warped perception of what that means. It's far different than having a basic minimum threshold for human decency. As the Watson story unfolds I will be laughing by watching you all fall more desperately flailing making excuses for his treatment of women. Not only don't I like what the team is doing, I refuse to support it. And I'm not going anywhere Skippy.

That was fantastic.

Thank you for posting and making my Sunday.

Well sure - and but that wasn't the scenario or the question. But you go ahead and keep deflecting.

It's funny - in my 100's of massages and stretches and manipulations by registered massage therapists I have never once ever had my junk incidentally come into contact with any part of the therapist. Maybe I am doing it wrong?

Neither - in all this time have I placed my erection into the hands of the therapist.

Like I said - feel free to support Watson. No worries. Continue to try to find some gray in the situation - no worries. Keep trying to contrive false situations and avoid the question actually posed, if you really need to.

What a terrible agenda! Supporting rape victims. Just when you thought it couldn't get any lower...... it does.

I don't actually agree with this perspective - it's overly conclusive and judgmental. But here's a view from outside of fandom:

https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/03/19/cleveland-browns-never-live-down-deshaun-watson

Maybe this is how it goes after so many years of getting kicked around and picked on. If you’re a laughingstock loser for long enough, you start thinking like the teams that have long bullied you around. You lose your pluck and your grit and you turn a little bit colder because that’s what everyone else does, right? You convince yourself that winning is all that matters to everyone else, too, making all decisions in shameless pursuit of wins feel defensible.

Right?

You trash your own people, smear them on the way out and try to trade them with some anonymous middle finger about childish behavior. You trade for a quarterback who was accused by 22 women of sexual harrassment and assault and pretend that a criminal nonindictment from a grand jury is the same thing as an exoneration. You reward that same player who acted like the entire thing was just an inconvenience for him. How about we ask some of the people impacted by his behavior how it feels to carry pepper spray to work now or choose outfits meant to deter unwanted sexual contact? (Sports Illustrated’s independent reporting uncovered corroborating evidence for one plaintiff’s account, and another woman who isn’t suing shared the details of her massage therapy session with Deshaun Watson as a way of publicly supporting the plaintiffs.)

Not only did Watson get a financial windfall from Friday’s absolute farce of a signing, but the Browns, according to our Albert Breer, structured the contract in a way that would minimize his fines if the NFL suddenly grows a conscience and suspends him.

The Browns are never going to live down trading for Watson, to whom they immediately gave a five-year, fully guaranteed contract extension. They groveled at such volume, oozed such desperation, that Watson couldn’t ignore them, even after he’d removed them from his list of finalists. Congratulations to a club that now becomes the fifth-best team in its conference at best. It cost them only their souls.

In-depth analysis, unrivaled access. Get SPORTS ILLUSTRATED's best stories every weekday. Sign up now.

What could Watson have said in those meetings that not only eased their concerns (L-O-L) about the nature of the lawsuits filed against him, but also forced Cleveland to perform cartwheels in the street just to get his pen on paper? What kind of miracle happened inside those four walls?

The truth is that the Browns didn’t care. The Saints didn’t care. The Falcons didn’t care. The Panthers didn’t care. None of those teams for a moment saw the irony in their auditioning for Watson instead of the other way around. A handful of Pro Bowls went a long way, apparently. A down market for quarterbacks turned them all into nicotine fiends without a pack in sight, looking for old cigarette butts to smoke on the sidewalk.

Once upon a time, Cleveland was a lost franchise but in a way we could all respect and admire. The team chugged in the mud, season after season, making comical pratfalls in the process but remaining endearingly The Browns. Maybe they had a lot of quarterbacks, enough that you could fill the full backside of an adult extra-large jersey, but they had fans who loved every one of them to pieces. Have you ever talked to someone from Cleveland about Kelly Holcomb? Did you ever for a second listen to the completely baseless momentary excitement for Jason Campbell? Brandon Weeden? Colt McCoy? Tyrod Taylor? Robert Griffin III? So many diehards believed in all of them, the way we might believe in new presidents or spiritual leaders. It was part of the entire milieu, knowing that it may not work out but willingly going along for the ride anyway, hoping it would all turn out fine.


Did you watch the press conference interim coach Mike Priefer gave in January 2021 after Cleveland won its first playoff game in decades, during the moment when he thanked the fans? He nearly cried. He grew up a Browns fan. He understood what it meant against the backdrop of all the decades of losing. What it meant to have a team of homegrown boys come out and whip the Steelers.

Somewhere along the way, that became not good enough. Not fast enough. The entire operation turned into some callous shadow corporation plotting and scheming. They lost what it meant to become the Browns, and, over the course of the next few months, while they lift Watson up on some kind of dais despite 22 civil cases still pending, they’ll lose whatever ounce of genuine goodwill was remaining.

This isn’t a closeted defense of Baker Mayfield, who needed to get better on the field. This isn’t some kind of empty saber rattling for clicks. This is just an acknowledgement of a damn shame. Just a moment when the crushing reality of the NFL sets in; when you wonder how the whole operation could ever act in fans’ best interests when its primary concern is passing along booze and gambling ads, all while tolerating enough unsavory behavior to drown out the reason we all came together around it in the first place.


Maybe some of us, and, again, we’re talking to the Browns’ front office here, just reach a point where the losses drown out the last bit of common sense we have. Maybe we all sell out at one time or another. Maybe our bosses strong-arm us into this kind of behavior and we put up with it because we all have mouths to feed.

That sounds better than the truth about what happened Friday.

Right?

https://www.si.com/nfl/2021/03/29/f...on-inappropriate-behavior-not-in-lawsuit

And here's the actual events that are alleged. So lets not talk about "incidental" contact.

Nonsense? seems like making bold accusations of reputable and credible women would fall under that category, would it not? This is Watson's first accuser. Are you trying to say she is some sleazy sex worker on Instagram?

Her web site.

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Yeah, having even the lowest threshold of human decency from someone makes you self righteous. More excuses for the inexcusable.

If that isn't the pot calling the kettle black.

j/c...

You know how it works. "Well he didn't sexually assault all of his massage therapists so he must not have sexually assaulted any of them."

Which sounds much more stupid when you break it down that way.

"Let him who is without sin cast the first stone."

We are all uncut stones in need of polish.

And should have the Cleveland Browns make you the highest paid player in the NFL by dismissing the word of 22 women instead. It's funny how the very same people only say these kind of things when it's someone they choose to support. Those they don't? They'll call them every name in the book.

Those are the alleged events.

I've never claimed that incidental contact was the actual event.

There's as much hard evidence for the one as there is for the other, which is basically nothing.

Even in the title of that link they have the honesty to call it what it is, a "story."

Personal testimony is not particularly reliable evidence.

There are my feelings towards the case, and there are the facts of the case. My feelings are it's all horrible. Factually, I don't know. Many seem to be presenting their feelings as facts. I'm just pointing out that what people believe could be wrong.

Look friend, the first person Watson thanked (publicly) after his acquittal from the GJ ... was Jesus Christ who will judge us all, and if he can forgive him, then who am I (or any other neutral party) to judge him?

Yeah, that's what convicts do in prison to gain sympathy and impress the parole board to. Claim they turned to Jesus.

The myth about Due diligence and a good explanation on why the Grand Jury not indicting means diddly squat.

https://www.si.com/nfl/2022/03/18/deshaun-watson-trade-due-diligence-myth


Only 1.6% of cases where sexual assault was reported to police ever made it to court.

“several of the women who filed criminal complaints also sat in a room together at the Harris County Criminal Justice Center, ready to provide testimony, but only one was called in front of the grand jury,”

I answered the question and then went to another possible scenario. I never said it was the actual scenario. There is no more actual evidence for either scenario than the other.

Have you ever had treatment for a pulled groin muscle? There are "standard" massages and there are "sports" massages. Have you ever been a professional athlete?

All the anecdotal experiences people are bringing to the discussion aren't very helpful for this particular scenario. They're different situations.

We don't know what actually happened in these specific situations.

I'm sorry if my speculation on possible scenarios triggers you. I'm not presenting them as facts. I grind problems down from every angle to get a handle on them. Plenty of people seem to have the Watson's the worst angle covered.

We as a collective fan base have tossed a QB under the best for things like social media posts and speeding tickets, I think being in the position to get 22 accusations from women wouldn't be shocking.

Not when they think he can bring them a SB. Then everything changes. Hell, they get irate about changing the name of the Indians. Putting a logo on the Browns helmet. Ben was a scum bag. But now? It's all quite obvious. It's not about what someone does. It's about who they are.

Those are words for YOU to live by, not to throw at OTHERS(like a stone) to chastise them.

That's the best they can come up with to get people to ignore the obvious.

That's my quarterback.

You can have him.

If Watson gets hurt and cant play for a year does he still get paid?
Can we cut him?
Can we trade him?