DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Mass Shootings

SOME people were raised with morals, and knowing the fact money doesn't buy happiness, it just buys stuff, and with more stuff, more money is needed.

I see it daily: The couple with a fashion mag. home, 2 new cars in the drive, a boat or r.v., or a place at the lake. (and if you have a place at "the lake" you need a boat, and a sea doo,,,,, but then 2 sea doos)

I have a friend that sold his house - $359,000, so he could (and his wife) move to "the lake". Then he found out how much it cost to live at "the lake". So he bought a different house. And he works his butt off, often times 7 days a week, 12 hours a day, so he can have his "place at the lake". he wants to come across as wealthy. As it is, he has a decent house, and a trailer at a campground near a lake.

Money, or the want of it, or the desire to look like you have it, is a bad thing.

yeah, some people have ego problems. They want to be what the aren't, but put on a huge front. Airs are just that - airs. I can spot a fake a mile away. Like the guy that brags about how many guns he has........

I'm glad I was raised how I was. Simple. I grew up thinking my parents were lower middle class, and by their lifestyle, you'd have never guessed any different.

Wife and I are low middle class, if even that high. By our lifestyle, you would guess that. And that's fine. I'm happy. Wife wants more. More what? Money ain't gonna make you happy.

What the heck was going on there? Sounds like that school and the local police force were ill prepared to handle an active shooter. I know for a fact that all of our local schools have active shooter plans, drill regularly and that all school entrances are locked and monitored at the first sign of trouble. All but the main entrances are locked for the entire school day here.

They had:

- The gunman outside the school for 12min shooting his gun
- Then he was able to walk right into the school through an unlocked entrance
- No police response for 14min after the 911 call
- Parents were able to get into the school and remove children before the police entered the building
- The Border patrol officers who took care of the situation didn't enter the building until 40min after the shooting started

It's hard to wrap my head around this.

It is easy to second guess what happened, we probably won’t know for a while, and some truths may be buried.

But I will ask… are we expecting to see a textbook response from a small police department who’s officers were going into a situation where they be overmatched, their pistol feels like a cap gun? And there is also also a high likelihood that they know some of the children in the school or that the children are there own.

There may have been hesitancy, “business decisions” may have been made. Doors intended to secure the children may have aided the gunman… the worse may have been over and the smart move was to wait for reinforcements.

This tragedy will haunt many for the rest of their lives.

I wish people would not say things like that. I respect your opinion, but do you really think that is the right approach when trying to convince gun owners to re-think their position? I support changing the gun laws. Things like raising the age of gun ownership and background checks. On the other hand, I understand those who are avid in protecting their rights as gun owners are afraid to concede anything because it will just lead to stricter and stricter gun laws. Denying gun availability to innocent people is not going to eliminate guns and the "bad guys" will be the ones who are able to find them, just like w/drugs. Hard line stances either way are bad ideas. Compromise is a much more effective tool when wanting to invoke change.

Yeah, I hope that all of those things from mac's article are not true. Sounds really, really bad and I won't be surprised if "race" becomes a topic of conversation moving forward.

Very astute points by both of you. I realize that your two posts and tasty's post were in response to something I said earlier, so allow me to expand just a bit. We can argue until the cows come home over guns and political affiliations. In fact, we have been arguing over those things for as long as I can remember, but the problem never goes away. Clem, you mentioned in a previous post that perhaps there are studies being done as we speak about things like profiling. If true, I would love to see more emphasis placed on trying to determine Why and how is our society producing more and more social misfits that ultimately think that mass murder is appropriate?

In the meantime, here is some friendly advice for those of you who are parents or care providers of young children. Limit the amount of time they spend on things like the computer, watching TV, playing video games, etc. Get them involved in outside activities, whether it be various sports, music, dance, etc. Spend meaningful time w/them on a daily basis. Talk to them. Provide guidance while showing that you respect their individuality. Provide a nurturing environment while teaching them the importance of responsibility and accountability. Do not make excuses for their poor behavior and do not leave them isolated for extended periods of time. My children are older, but my wife and I were very diligent about such things. I remember our kids complaining about how their friends got to play video games and watch TV a lot more than they did. We were so mean. LOL It's a big job and it requires a ton of time where you put your own desires on the back burner. However, it's worth all the time in the world. We brought these children into the world and it is our duty to raise them properly in homes that are nurturing, respectful, and loving.

go buy another gun. It really is that simple to simpletons. Buy another gun. You’ll be safe with more guns.pffft. The Simpleton’s with guns. Hurry up now simpleton’s get your guns before they take them from you. Lol

Maker of rifle used by Texas gunman draws fury for 'incendiary' ads

https://www.yahoo.com/news/maker-rifle-used-texas-gunman-210311160.html

https://www.yahoo.com/news/sen-bill-cassidy-claims-people-092133091.html

Sen. Bill Cassidy claims people need AR-15s to defend themselves from 'feral pigs,' inadvertently echoing an old meme about 'feral hogs'

Didn't copy and paste the articles because there are photos/tweets that don't come across and are fairly essential to the articles

I saw someone talking about the school shooting and existing security measures the school had in effect on tik tok last night and I couldn't believe it so I looked it up on the school website.

Uvalde school district had its own police force consisting of 4 officers. This includes a Chief, a detective, and two officers. It also had (4) licensed counselors for support for the kids. Also had case managers

The school district also already had a social media monitoring service, Raptor Technologies to monitor visitors who might be sex predators, threat assessment teams, canine services to detect drugs, ammo, gunpowder and firearms.

The buildings had burglar and alarms systems, security vestibules and outdoor buzz in systems, metal detectors and the kids were supposed to be hand wand inspected when they entered the school.

They also had a locked at all times classroom policy
They also list 124 security cameras, but don't say specifically if any were installed at Robb.

But it does say that Robb Elementary had a perimeter security fence and encircled the building.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZF2gE6nkl8cwoJpiSkNm8VNNQwNyVsV0/view


There is not much more you can do to to fortify a building or provide security

Now, I do not know if all of those precautions were working as they were designed.

I see you're no longer claiming you have a permit to buy fully automatic weapons. At least that's a step in the right direction.

Also, on a side note-this 18 yr old was arrested with the gun about 2 miles from my house.

supposedly the kid had some sort of beef in the school and went to a pawn shop in Youngstown and passed the background check and picked up his AR-15 type weapon and ammo. In talking to the kid, I believe a worker in the pawn shop found out where the kid went to school. The worker in the pawn shop knew somebody in the school and gave them a call and was told that this kid was in some [censored] at the school and was making threats-so they called the authorities and arrested the kid and are holding him without bail pending a mental eval.

The complaint says the threats caused an evacuation of the PIA School for Aviation Maintenance near the Youngstown-Warren Regional Airport on Youngstown Kingsville Road.

According to dispatchers, a call came in shortly before 4 p.m. Wednesday that a student was on his way to the school after buying a gun and two boxes of ammunition from a Youngstown pawnshop to shoot the school up.

I can spot a classless cheap shot artist a mile away too.

j/c:

Texas cop says officers didn't rush to find gunman because 'they could have been shot' then claims they DELIBERATELY locked inside classroom to save other students: Experts slam 'disgusting' decision that doctors say sealed the fate of injured kids

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...cers-retreated-gunman-shot.html#comments

Reports I saw said while all entry doors to the school were supposed to be locked to prevent entry, the shooter found one that was not. Here is a snippet from a much longer article questioning the police response and their conflicting reports.


A plan is only as good as such a plan is implemented.

j/c:

Texas Rep. Tony Gonzales says gunman was one of two 'Columbine infatuated' teens arrested FOUR YEARS ago in Uvalde for plot to shoot up a school

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-years-ago-threatening-shoot-school.html

He already walked back that false claim.....

Texas Rep. Tony Gonzales WALKS BACK unfounded claim Uvalde gunman was arrested four years ago for plotting to shoot up school after slamming cops for letting him 'slip through the cracks'

Tony Gonzales said on Friday that Salvador Ramos was arrested four years ago when he was a juvenile

He claimed the then 14-year-old told people: 'When I'm a senior in 2022, I am going to shoot up a school'

'This wasn't hearsay. This is what I got late last night. The shooter was arrested four years ago,' he said

It was during an appearance on FOX on Friday morning at around 7.33am

DailyMail.com can confirm that two 'Columbine-infatuated' boys were arrested in 2018 over a shooting plot

However their identities are not known because they were juveniles at the time

Uvalde Police quickly denied Gonzales' claim on Friday, prompting him to walk it back an hour later

Ramos legally purchased the two AR-15s he used in the attack last week hours his 18th birthday

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-years-ago-threatening-shoot-school.html

Okay Pit, thanks for the update.

When did I claim to have a permit to buy one? Quit reading what I write then making up your own story. That is why I say you are here for the fight, because that is you trying to make one.

This is what I said:

The article says that we don't know the names of the 2 juveniles because their records are sealed. So we don't know that the shooter was one of them, but we don't know that he wasn't either. It is possible Gonzales got access to those records then made his statement, then realized that he shouldn't have had access to it. I don't know if accessing those inappropriately is a crime. Also, if the records were sealed, then I don't think it would come up on a background check either. Not sure

You only really need to look in the mirror.

Well which is it then? Were you trying to indicate you had a full auto permit or that you were considering committing a federal gun crime?

I'll let you decide.

Well duh you got me... I never thought of it that way.

I have looked at pricing. It isn't hard to find full auto for sale. Once you find what you want to fill out the forms and give em yer money. You need to list the gun you are interested in on the forms, so you have to know which one it is. If they approve your forms you get your gun. All done through a FFL with a class 3 license.

With apologies to Reagan, you seem to know a lot that isn't.

It's what he does. He makes things up or twists your words around. When you try and point out what you actually did or did not say, he moves the goal posts. Toxic.

#manup

Now who's trying to twist what they said?

Still you. I never said anything about a permit. You did.

I said you have to fill out the form (Form 4 BTW) give them the money for the tax stamp ($200) and wait. And wait. And wait. My understanding is clearance is taking 12-18 months.

To fill out Form 4 you have to know what you are getting. You need the serial number, it goes on the form. You don't just ask list something you would like to have.

You still know a lot that isn't. You are still here for the fight.

And then we have some who are just whiners and get easily offended when everyone else doesn't kiss their ass. Speaking of someone needing a mirror.

Pit, Port, OCD, PS, MGH, DC, Jester, and a bunch of others...

im really struggling right now. dead ass serious. seeing so many people around the country get angry and voice more support over guns than the people that were murdered in buffalo and ulvade is really getting to me.

seeing so many people fight for a tool harder than an individual makes me want to just isolate further than i already have from society.

He's not changing anything. He "peeked", as in, 'looked into' getting a full auto whatever. He wasn't comfortable with the prices of the guns, as well as probably, the fees involved to get a FFL. So he quit looking.

You read way too much into things.

In hindsight maybe so.

I have not read all the posts .. I dont know if this was mentioned. The gun salesmen has blood on his hands. How do you sell an 18 year old two assault rifles and thousands of rounds of ammo in a couple days. I hope he enjoys the money he made. Sure he didnt break the law. But common sense says he should have known this wasnt right.

The guns and ammo were sold 100% legally according to the existing laws that are on the books. If it "isn't right" it should not be legal. The only thing I would hold the person who sold him the guns liable for would be IF the kid made statements that he intended to carry out such an action or made statements that he intended to commit since a violent act with those weapons and that ammunition. At that point I would consider it the gun salesman's duty to report it at the time of purchase. I have seen zero evidence that anything remotely like that happened.

Fortunately, while a liquor store can lose their license for selling alcohol to a person who is too drunk - or a convenience store can lose their license for selling cigarettes to a 17yo with a fake ID -- we've been able to implement strong laws to make sure that a gun store can never have their license questioned for selling two assault rifles and a thousand rounds of ammo to a mass shooter.

Nope, the gun salesman did nothing wrong. Sold a gun legally to an 18 year old.

Selling an AR-15 to an 18 year old is what is wrong. The 18 year old can't buy a handgun, but an AR-15 is fine.

That is wrong. Plain wrong, yet the politicians see nothing wrong with it.

This is not accurate. A FFL is supposed to pay attention and if there is something that indicates seling to someone that is dangerous they are obliged to report to BAFTE. FFLs have lost licenses over thing like that. And there may be state level laws that also require such, in MD there's all sorts of extra stuff.

j/c...

I don't believe that your .22 statement is at all accurate.

More articles on the AR-15 lethalness. It is pretty well established that it cavitates through the body.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/04/health/parkland-shooting-victims-ar15.html

https://www.sun-sentinel.com/opinio...iologist-perspective-20180223-story.html