DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Deshaun Watson Legal Issues

Really at this point - if you want to come up with "plausible" constructs that are closer to impossible than they are to possible - there's little point in engaging.

There's absolutely a ton we don't know. And to use a famous phrase - there are unknown unknowns. There's also a ton we do know. There's stuff we know that lacks context. There's stuff we know that amounts to overwhelming abnormality for a pro athlete. So it's absolutely fair to discuss and ask questions about that.

Coming up with scenarios that DW is a victim. That he might be an alien (something we can't disprove). Or whatever other far flung "what if" - doesn't make a case for DW more or less guilty or innocent. It just deflects. Just how I see it. Contrived contrary arguments are just that - contrived.

Funny that you talk about not name calling.
You talk about misquoting posters.
You talk about lying.

Yet here you are - name calling. You are misrepresenting what posters are doing - no-one is trying to convince others, just expressing opinions. As for lying - I personally think you hold that crown. But you do you Vers. I'll repeat - 90% of the snark and angst were gone from this board when you weren't posting. I guess that's coincidence.

Nope. If it were to come out that Deshaun arranged to have sex with these women before they showed up, instead of the women thinking they were just there to give him a massage, then he would be innocent in my eyes. But at this point, I don't believe that is remotely likely. What is likely, in my opinion, is that Deshaun wanted easy sex. So he arranged the massages as just massages, then turned the tables on these girls once they were in a controlled environment; then, he used his celebrity and financial status to either get his desired ends or silence those who might speak out against him. If this is the case, he's a predator. And that's the way I think this unfolded currently. I haven't slammed the door shut on him being innocent, but the more I hear, the more it looks like there is little chance of that.

BUT, and this is where you probably think I'm condemning him unfairly, after learning what we have learned and processing it, then trying to remain neutral in not judging... there has just been too much put out for me to support him playing while this is unresolved. NOPE. He should be benched until we know what he is guilty or not guilty of, IMO. And I think this is where the Browns' "due diligence" went wrong. I can't imagine they knew about 66 women and the possibility of numerous more allegations coming down the pike before inking $230 Million fully guaranteed. From a business standpoint, it looks idiotic.

Pretty much this. I wish he were innocent because it would be nice to be able to feel good about rooting for this team, but given everything that has been coming out on this, I see little chance of that actually being reality.
Given his testimony, his actual words, regarding the one woman who left in tears and ended up quitting her job over it, I believe that HE believes he is innocent, but only because he doesn't see anything wrong with what he did. I think he simply doesn't recognize that the things he did, the things he is accused of, are wrong and that those things make him the monster.

From the bits of his testimony we've gotten, to what we've gotten from the women, to the payment made to the massage place owner, etc.... there is just far too much there for it to not be what everyone wishes it wasn't and for all of this to be simply misunderstandings and coincidences.

I somewhat closely parallel your thoughts. In your first scenario I would worry they agreed to sex and then the women backed out being a possibility as well.

My concerns started with the Browns putting the team in this position. This whole thing screamed 'Explosive' from the start. The idea that we did 'Our due diligence' is scary as that means either this is an acceptable outcome or our due diligence sucks arse.

They said they did their due diligence, five months worth, and they had constructed a plan to repair his public image as part of this. I think they simply grossly underestimated the enormity of it.

When the issue was in another city and he wasn't playing for the team that had him under contract, the story was quiet, so it didn't seem like much. A sleeping giant. Afterall, if he is essentially out of football, the story isn't nearly as big. However, as soon as you make a record-shattering trade and guarantee a quarter Billion dollars to the individual and he's no longer poised to continue to sit out, the sleeping giant that is the story awakens. I don't think they fully anticipated the magnitude of that, and the continued addition of more suits has further amplified it and continued to erode the number of people that wanted/tried/pretended to believe his innocence.

He doesn't really believe that. It's just another far fetched what if scenario to throw shade on all of these women by throwing out a virtually impossible scenario.

So is ejaculating on an unsuspecting woman, "just being a creep"? Is purposefully exposing yourself to unsuspecting women, "just being a creep"?

I ask this because if you "think he's guilty of some of it" where do you draw the line of "just being a creep"? Do you believe someone has to actually rape someone or physically force themselves on a woman to be anything more than "just a creep"?

I have a feeling that if he did this to a woman you know well as a close personal friend you would find it to be a lot more than that.

Sure, if that's what you call people that put the abuse of women over a sports team. There's names for people who don't too.

That's his MO. Do what he accuses others of, play the victim and act like he doesn't do the exact same thing.

I don't know what the outcome of all this will be. I'm just preparing myself for the worse, possibly not having DW for the entire 2022 season. IN the meantime, I'll hope for the best.

So the cop Baker said a woman just gave Watson a bj, because he was DW. She said he didn’t ask for it, didn’t ask for anything, he just took it. Very long read, but that is at the bottom.

https://sports.yahoo.com/tense-depo...cence-coercion-vs-consent-010619990.html

I will also wait to get all the evidence but I think this happened alot to DW. And 66 in 17 months is only 3 a month.

So a new person every 10 days. And you used 'only' before that?

So, you ignored the rest of the post to poke fun at Frenchy?

As always you miss a point trying to show how clever you are.

1 every 10 days is nowhere near excessive imo.

If that's the only BS you have to spread I suggest you park your manure spreader.

Thanks for the on-topic response! I'd imagine finding and arranging a new masseuse every 10 days would have to be quite laborious, almost a job in itself.


Edit: Of course if you kept a spreadsheet of women that have used and have no further interest that would help.

Especially when the team you played for has them on staff.

FIFY

On topic? This was the actual topic of Frenchy's post.



You ignored all of that, which has a lot more to do w/the topic of Watson's Legal Issues than this: "And 66 in 17 months is only 3 a month."

Let's just ignore that evidence because it doesn't fit your agenda. At least you didn't say Frenchy was mentally ill.

Yeah, one story out of 66 holds a TON of weight! Sometimes I don't actually believe you hear yourself. And I'm sure that has nothing to do with why she felt watson committed a crime. Would you like to see why she said that? Nah, you don't care about that part.

It's much easier to just ignore him, unless you are doing it for the post count. He is not well.

Another mental health putdown? As I said before, look at the character of those who are so morally offended by Watson being on the Browns.

The worst would be that he never plays a down as a Brown and the browns still have to pay him and lose all the picks. I'd say that's an actual possibility at this point.

That's why I had asked the question about the NFL stepping in and maybe giving us our picks back if he's not going to be able to play.

I'd say the opposite. Look at the character of those who aren't morally offended. Since you want to go there. Shall we discuss that?

The best thing is to hope they don't let it get to that point. But any settlement at this point will look like a stain on the Browns and DW for a long ass time IMO.

Under different circumstances I could see something similar happen. But we went whole hog on a player in a precarious position and set records doing it. I have a feeling the NFL will be more inclined to let the lesson be learned the hard way in that scenario.

So how many times have you called Baker a Mental Midget? How many times have you called him an emotional midget? Dozens? Hundreds?

You realize both those are double whammy's because not only are you doing a mental put down you are compounding it by using the insulting term "midget" ... But we know, one rule for you and a different set of rules for everyone else.

One massage every 10 days is not excessive.
Finding a new masseuse every 10 days is BEYOND EXCESSIVE.

j/c: I have never once called Baker a mental midget. It is yet another lie being told over and over and over again by 888. I have let it go because I try really hard not to respond to him and Pit, not because I am afraid to argue w/them, but the bickering ruins threads. But, enough is enough. He does this repeatedly w/so many things. Just makes them up and says them over and over.

I have called Baker an emotional midget many times. I truly believe he is emotionally underdeveloped and his actions back up that claim, just as the "adult" comment from someone in the organization suggests. Maybe he should grow the hell up and man up? And no, I will not respond to 888's next post or Pit's when he clocks in tomorrow.

Not for a civil matter. If it was criminal, I might agree.

Just a general question. Does anyone at this point think Watson can get a fair trial if it comes to that?

Remember, fair means fair on both sides of the matter.

How many women did he ejaculate on Pit? How many women did he expose himself to? Why would any woman in her right mind keep massaging him while he was exposing himself? Why would they keep massaging him while he played with himself? Why wouldn't they leave?


Could DW be a sex addict instead of just a creep.... yep... is he???
Does exposing yourself make you a rapist, or sexual preditor???
Does wishing for a happy ending a crime???



I have a feeling that if this happened to a woman I know, that she would have left the room and not returned as soon as he started letting his junk hang free, and have run from the room if he started playing with it.


Like I said I think he is a creep. I get that sick disgusted feeling in the Pit of my stomach when I think about him being our QB. But I'm a Browns fan and I root for the Browns. there have been many Browns players over the years who were creeps, as well as lots of other NFL players current and past who were/are creeps.

Not if there are any females on the jury.

Not just them. Read the board. I don't see many females posting all day about the guy.

Other than Eve and Sk8termom, I'm not aware of any current female posters. (There may be some that I didn't know were females.) The board used to have a small but vocal group of females, but since Watson I haven't seen them. I'd be interested to hear from Jules, or especially Dawg Michelle, who I believe is a massage therapist. Others like Iambrown, Dawgylama, Nursedawg, Couchgirl, ONB, and a few more, all dropped out a while ago. I wish they were still here, I liked reading them.

You know what - if it wasn't you calling Baker a Mental Midget, but you have been using the term Emotional Midget - I will apologize. Someone for damn sure has used that phrase a LOT and since you are one of the most frequent posters to chastise and belittle Baker any chance you get, it was pretty natural for me to think it was probably you. But go and spin that any way you like.

Some of the women have mentioned being a single parent and being afraid he would impact their livelihood because they did not do as he wanted. There is a term for it that escapes me right now, but it has to do with coercing someone into sex due to being in a position of power over them. This was one of my concerns as Watson maintains his innocence, he could possibly have no clue how his behaviors impacted these women.