DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Deshaun Watson Legal Issues cont.

lol

I posted this on the Will Watson Play This Year thread, but there is "legal" information in this video. It's a shame that this topic isn't contained to this forum, just like all of the prior legal cases were. Anyway...not sure how some continue to deny that the owner's legal problems will not be used as a tool by the NFLPA and Watson's defense.

As it stands right now, it doesn't look like the owners are going to remove Snyder (JMO). Goodell seemingly made the full stop saying he can't do anything about Snyder, which he obviously can- he can initiate a removal. I don't believe Goodell said/did that for Richardson. It would take 22 owners to vote him out, if I am not mistaken, which seems like quite a bit of back-room negotiating needed prior to a vote. If the NFL wasn't able to get a 2/3 commitment from the owners and went to a failing vote, that would be another PR nightmare. I bet these owners are scared Snyder might be willing to drop some damaging knowledge on them. You know there are a ton of skeletons in those owner's closets that they all know about.

As Snyder goes through the political pageantry again as we speak, the NFLPA is certainly watching very closely to what is going on. I still think Watson will be suspended but I don't think it will be as dramatic as some suspect or even wish.

In the end, I don't think the powers that be want to risk fully blowing the top off of the cash cow that is the NFL. Snyder being investigated and what could happen afterwards might be a disaster for the league. I think the NFL is probably thinking to themselves a modest suspension on a situation that will be inevitably fade away because of either (1) time or (2) another incident the league will need to address is worth not putting a full court press on.

We'll see soon. Since the schedule came out, I always felt after the Monday night game against the Bengals would be the right time to bring him back....so Week 9 against the Dolphins.

. duplicate

A long time ago, maybe in the late 2000s but I can't recall exactly when, I looked at the shroud and controversy over it being faked. In conclusion, there were just too many unanswered questions to consider it proof of anything. There is a strong debate about the actual existence of Jesus as a real person, rather the shroud was a product of the church during the time they raised funds by selling religious artifacts, or if it is authentic is it Jesus or some random person. Then when overlayed upon a virtual mannequin the features did not really line up as expected. It was even speculated that it was painted in blood. So no, it doesn't change my mind any more than what I just said will deter or change your faith. Trust me, as an open atheist, I've had more convos like that than you could count. Nothing against you, but most Christians tend to challenge atheist beliefs, because my beliefs are somehow inferior, evil, or inconceivable because they fly in the face of their beliefs. It's a common experience.

I didn't know anyone was trying to say the NFLPA wouldn't try to use anything. Personally, I think a good defense uses anything they can. But that doesn't mean I don't think the comparison is irrelevant because I do. I also think they should be adjudicated as individual cases on the merits of the case. If there is some unfairness in the application of discipline, then that is an appeal issue, not a factor used to negotiate discipline going in, IMHO.

Nobody said that. That's just Vers being Vers. A few people said it wouldn't make much difference, myself included.

“I bet these owners are scared Snyder might be willing to drop some damaging knowledge on them. You know there are a ton of skeletons in those owner's closets that they all know about.”


Not to sound paranoid, but it would not surprise me. And not just the owners, but the LEAGUE itself.

One example: Kaepernic was blacklisted. Period. It took George Floyd and the tidal wave of public sentiment in the aftermath, for Goodell to say ‘oops, yeah we weren’t paying attention.”

[quote] I've had more convos like that than you could count. Nothing against you, but most Christians tend to challenge atheist beliefs, because my beliefs are somehow inferior, evil, or inconceivable because they fly in the face of their beliefs. It's a common experience./[quote]

Are you glad God gave you free will the believe what you want

But do you move your lips when you do that? LOLetc.

Solid take. I don't know about the number of games, but your points are all solid.

What kind of punishments could they give owners? How about loss of draft picks, or even for bigger issues, go the way of the NCAA and elimination from playoffs for X number of years.

Those things would hurt worse than any monetary fine, as it would affect their player and coach acquisition.

All serious media including someone inside Team Watson camp is mentioning a one year suspension to start with. Can’t see the NFL backing down without losing face. I expect at least one year and maybe something more like accept counseling from a professional therapist or similar.

And their fans...

My guess is the NFL wants it known they pushed for a year or more so when the arbiter recommends 8 games the league can say they tried to make an example of him and people should be pissed at Sue Robinson and not the NFL.

The draft picks make sense. When you get to the point you eliminate teams from the playoffs, you are hurting the players as much as the owner and the players aren't the people you are trying to punish IMO

I mean look at the outrage you are seeing from a few on this board for punishing watson. Can you imagine the outrage of punishing an entire teams players for the actions of their owner?

Or maybe since it's not the Browns QB or a Browns player they wouldn't give a damn and that's really why it's bothering them so much.

I'm not sure. I do think this is more of a threat by the NFLPA to protect Watson's rights. Their words, not mine. Exposing the underbelly of the league probably doesn't do either side much good. I think a big story is whether or not the NFL should force Snyder out? I believe Memphis is right that it would take a vote where 2/3 of the owners would have to vote to expel him. The problem of doing that is already being discussed, such as the one video I posted a day or so ago, where people are saying that Snyder likely has dirt on other NFL owners and will expose them should be ousted. The fact that Congress is already involved makes the situation that much more troubling for the NFL. The timing is actually right for those defending Watson and the NFLPA has already laid out their threats publicly.

Lex has a good point that the NFL could blame the investigators and also the independent judge for the lack of a lengthy suspension. Goodall can override the decision, but perhaps he won't if he knows that the image of the league will be severely damaged if the NFLPA follows through on exposing the indiscretions of the owners and the lack of punishment handed out by the NFL in those cases.

NFL betting: It's not too late to cash in on a potential Deshaun Watson suspension

We have officially reached the slowest part of the NFL calendar. Minicamps and OTAs are done, but we're still about a month away from training camps opening up. While we don't expect much news from the NFL until training camp begins, there is a belief that we're nearing a decision on a potential suspension for Browns' quarterback Deshaun Watson.

Watson has not played since 2020, due to a combination of his dissatisfaction with the Houston Texans and what is now 26 allegations of sexual misconduct. The Browns decided that Watson's talent was worth the risk and subsequent PR nightmare, and traded for him in March. Just a few days ago, Watson settled 20 of his cases, but he's not out of the woods. It's not believed that settling his cases will have any impact on a potential suspension. Over the weekend, it was reported by the Washington Post that the NFL is seeking a full-season suspension for Watson.

While the Watson situation is much bigger than football and betting, there's no denying the impact any news will have on the field and with the betting market. Since the Browns acquired Watson, they've already dropped from 18-to-1 to win the Super Bowl to 25-to-1. They were once favorites to win the AFC North, but now they have the third best odds in the division. While the market has certainly adjusted due to the likely looming suspension, it's not too late to get in on some action. Here's two potentially lucrative ways to fade the Browns before the suspension news drops.
AFC North - Dual Forecast

While the AFC North may not be as hyped as the AFC West or the NFC West, it's still one of the very best divisions in football with four teams that expect to compete. The Cincinnati Bengals made it to the Super Bowl last season. The Baltimore Ravens were 8-3 at one point before their injuries became too much to overcome. Mike Tomlin hasn't had a losing record with the Steelers since taking over in 2007.

Even if Deshaun Watson was absolved and played all 17 games, you'd be able to make a very good case that the Ravens and Bengals are the two best teams in this division. If Jacoby Brissett starts a lot of games for the Browns this season, it's hard to envision a world where they can compete with two very good teams. He averaged 5.7 yards per attempt this past season with Miami in five starts. There is no downfield threat at all with Brissett, which will allow teams to stack the box and hone in on the Browns' run game.

Currently at BetMGM, you can bet that the Ravens and Bengals will occupy the top two seeds in the AFC North. This is the chalkiest bet in the market, but it still pays out at +175 which is more than good enough.
Browns to finish last in division

Last season, the Cleveland Browns finished the season with an 8-9 record, which tied them with Baltimore for the worst record in the AFC North. This season, the Steelers are prohibitive -190 favorites to finish the season in the basement of the division. The Browns are +400 to finish in last place.

Baker Mayfield played through injury from Week 2 on in 2021, which severely impacted his play and the Browns' ability to win. There were questions about whether Mayfield is a franchise quarterback to begin the season anyway, which is the main reason why the Browns went out and acquired Watson. However, even while playing with a torn labrum and other injuries, Mayfield is a better quarterback than Jacoby Brissett. So with the Watson suspension looming, it appears the Browns will play a sizable part of their season with Brissett under center. This would mean that rather than improving their biggest question mark, they downgraded.

The Steelers are the favorites to finish in last place, but they're coming off a nine-win season and a playoff berth. The combination of Mitch Trubisky and Kenny Pickett can't be worse than the version of Ben Roethlisberger we saw last season. As mentioned above, Mike Tomlin's teams are always in the mix. We saw him coach a team with Duck Hodges to an 8-8 record a few years ago. If you're giving me Jacoby Brissett and Kevin Stefanski at +400 to finish below Mike Tomlin, I'm taking it all day long.

The Ravens finished last in the division in 2021, but it's really hard to envision that repeating itself. In fact, the Ravens are the current betting favorites to win the division at +165. They were 8-3 last season before injuries to Lamar Jackson and a boatload of other important players submarined their season. As long as Baltimore doesn't have another catastrophic season on the injury front, they'll avoid the basement.

A lot of people around the NFL expect the Bengals to take a step backwards in 2022, and that's not a terrible take. They did win the AFC last year; it'd be easy to take a step back from that. However, with Joe Burrow and Ja'Marr Chase another year older, I certainly don't expect them to fall into the basement of the division.

If we're banking on a lengthy suspension for Watson and a lot of Jacoby Brissett under center for the Browns this season, then +400 odds to finish last in the division seems like a good bet to make.

https://sports.yahoo.com/nfl-bettin...deshaun-watson-suspension-170808240.html

The 18-1 odds were set right when Watson signed w/the Browns. I remember ESPN showing a graphic of how no NFL team had as big of a positive jump than the Browns. I think the Browns were 40 to 1 before Watson signed. Not positive about that number, but I think it's right. I'll see if I can find it.

Deshaun Watson suspension decision: NFLPA concerned NFL will discipline Browns QB indefinitely, per report

Some believe the league will try to suspend Watson for the entire 2022 season, if not longer

Deshaun Watson has settled 20 of 24 civil lawsuits accusing him of sexual misconduct, but the Browns quarterback is not out of the woods when it comes to NFL discipline. While the former Texans star has publicly sworn innocence and avoided criminal charges for an alleged pattern of abuse during private massage therapy sessions, the NFL Players Association is concerned the NFL will suspend Watson for the entire 2022 season, if not indefinitely, according to Pro Football Network.

This echoes reporting from The Washington Post, which said last week that Watson's camp expects the NFL to argue he "deserves to be suspended for at least one full season," and that league executives will likely seek a "significant" penalty for the QB. The Browns have been awaiting a "lengthy suspension" for their new starter, per Aaron Wilson, and are expected to proceed with new backup Jacoby Brissett as their emergency No. 1 in the event Watson is suspended for most, or all, of 2022.

The NFLPA, meanwhile, previously championed Watson's record contract with the Browns, who signed the QB to a five-year, fully guaranteed $230 million contract, despite him still facing almost two dozen lawsuits at the time. NFLPA president JC Tretter, a former Brown, has celebrated Watson's earnings as a potential "turning point" for other guaranteed contracts around the league. Watson's own agents negotiated the contract to protect the QB from any substantial financial losses in the event of a lengthy 2022 suspension, suggesting the former Pro Bowler always anticipated NFL discipline for his alleged off-field transgressions.

As for the possibility of the Browns reconciling with former No. 1 overall draft pick Baker Mayfield -- who remains on the roster -- as a fill-in for Watson, that's considered almost impossible in Cleveland, per Wilson. The Browns are still seeking to offload Mayfield's $18.8 million guaranteed salary via trade, aiming to deal the QB by the start of training camp, and if not then, by the start of the regular season. The Seahawks, who have a high level of interest in Mayfield, per CBS Sports NFL insider Josina Anderson, are considered a more likely landing spot for the veteran than the Panthers, who had prior talks with the Browns.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...nick-bosa-among-underpaid-stars-in-2022/

The mention of "indefinite" certainly ratchets things up a bit. I wonder if this isn't the league dangling that out there to get the NFLPA and Watson's camp to think a year maybe isn't so bad. While I suppose it was always possible, that's more than I thought the league would ever consider given their penchant for slaps on the wrist with these things.

There are a ton of articles on this if you type in: "bettting odds of browns winning super bowl once Watson was signed"

Sportsbooks Shift Browns’ Betting Odds Ahead of Deshaun Watson’s Likely Suspension

https://www.gamingtoday.com/news/browns-betting-odds-deshaun-watson/

This link will show you where the odds were set when he was signed and how they changed since then.

Cleveland’s Season Win Total Off the Board at Most Sportsbooks

Same link.

Sportsbooks Adjust Browns’ Season Opener

Same link.

There's no doubt that the looming suspension has impacted the odds of the Cleveland Browns to win the opener, the division and their odds to make and or win the SB in the sports betting world.

Is that the correct link? I clicked on it and it was an article about Best Bargain NFL players.


Also, I can't find quotes to support this claim at all: "NFLPA concerned NFL will discipline Browns QB indefinitely." The NFLPA said they were concerned? I doubt the validity of this claim.

True, but there is also no doubt that the odds of the Browns of winning the Super Bowl are still better now than before they signed him. Might as well look at the entire picture, right?

Sorry about that. Not sure what happened.

Here's the link.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...pline-browns-qb-indefinitely-per-report/

The entire picture? First your claim was that the odds hadn't changed. So I guess since that fell through.......

In a way, I disagree. The league pulling draft choices as an example IMO is a penalty on the fan base as much or more than anyone else. I am trying to think of ways to assess penalty without impacting the fans.

I did not say that. Man, why must you resort to telling lies when the facts are distributed?

Here is what I said:



How in the hell do you get "First your claim was that the odds hadn't changed." out of what I said? Freaking lame.

Also, I can not find one quote from the NFLPA that supports this part of the headline in that particular article: "NFLPA concerned NFL will discipline Browns QB indefinitely."

peen, I am not saying draft picks should be taken away, but college fans are penalized when their team has sanctions levied against them.

But again, I think the NFLPA is using the threat of exposing the underbelly of the NFL as a negotiating tool rather than actually harming the NFL brand. They are just trying to get the NFL to play more fair while they protect Watson's rights.

So you then claimed we should look at the big picture after first trying to show that the odds of winning the SB shot up after watson was signed? And that wasn't you trying to indicate something? You weren't trying to counter my assertion that the odds of winning the SB had gone down since the watson suspension now seemed eminent and long term?

Well alrighty then.

It seems as if they are trying to undermine the reality of how sexual allegations on a grand scale have been dealt with too lightly in the past and that the NFL needs to step up in such cases. That if they continue to use the past to deal with the present, the NFL will never be able to seriously address the egregiousness of this degradation and abuse of women in a serious and just way. You know the old "we were wrong in the past and need to correct it" can never happen according the NFLPA.

This is not the political forum.

My apologies. I’m just disappointed in humanity. Between DW and the brain dead SC.
Yuck.
Bring on the asteroid.

Your words- egregiousness of this degradation and abuse of women in a serious and just way- they are masseuses, who should be afraid of NO human body part. DW hasn't been charged with ANY CRIMINAL charges- I don't get the folks who judge him- he doesn't think about the body or sex like you do......the NFL should just stone him to death, then some folks would be happy. Long ago we had a President who didn't have sex and didn't commit perjury- and he walked.....DW should continue whatever counselling he's getting, pay the other money leaches and get on with football. Go Browns!!!

Yeah, that makes it all better. That president you talked about didn't sign an agreement to a personal conduct policy. And he was a scum bag too. So because someone got away with it means it's fine if others aren't held accountable for their actions either. Somehow in your mind that seems to make sense. You are not alone.

IMO, if Mike Vick can come back into the league and play after being part of a ring that had living creatures fight to the death for money, if Josh Gordon can come back and play after multiple substance abuse issues, then DW should be allowed back to play after an 8 game suspension.
Also if it is a year suspended, I wonder what kind of rust DW will have after 2 years of not playing? at least he'll be healed from any nagging issues.

A massage professional would shut things down as soon as the alleged behavior started. Sorry man, this massage is over.