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Watson was HORRIBLE. He led the team to 3 points against the worst team in the league.

We squeezed out a win by the defense/special teams who had all the scores handed to them.

I have no expectations for a win in Cincy next Sunday.

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Between rust and just the pressure of the moment, Watson looked horrible. Now that the 1st one is over, it will be downhill from here for Watson. I have no real worries about him other than how long it will take.

Tony Fields has been getting more shots and has been looking pretty good. He looks like a player with upside.

Schwantz looked as expected. The fumble aside, he missed a couple of tackles on special teams. I saw Felton getting some time, mostly running around doing useless things. I suppose the FO wants to see these guys in action. I am not sure what else they need to see, but if it is one last look, it is what it is. Neither one of those guys needs to be on the team.

I guess we will now get to look at Ford the rest of the season. While he didn't look good yesterday, we do need to see what he brings. I do wonder why we even keep D Johnson on the roster? While he is clearly proven to be a good back, we never play him. If you have written the guy off, why even use up the roster spot? Something isn't right about that situation when a scrub like Felton is getting play time and DJ stands on the sidelines.

The DT's looked decent again now that we have finally decided that having our DT's shoot gaps and fly up field doesn't work. Every team wants to have an Aaron Donald or Randy White type DT destroying other teams in the middle of the D, but there is a reason why there are only 2-3 of those guys in the league at any given time. You don't scheme guys like that, they just happen, and they don't happen very often. I don't care what Joe Woods thinks, you aren't going to have a guy like Elliott play like Reggie White.

Too bad for Joe he needed to figure that out 8 weeks ago, not last week.

I wonder if we are going to be able to keep DPJ? He is going to garner a lot of interest from other teams. We aren't going to have much leverage in keeping him. I guess we could keep the Schwantz to take over for him....lol Speaking of Schwantz, when did he get his noodles rattled? On one of his missed special teams tackles?

I wonder about some of those kick-offs. They had to be called squib kicks. I can't believe York hit them that badly. I didn't have any volume for the game where I watched. Anybody know?

Guess that is it for now.


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Good point about Fields … he has some pop to him

I agree about Ford: he looked bad yesterday, but it won’t hurt to get him a little run here

And in terms of the DTs: sadly, we look better with Winfrey on the field. He’s got some toughness


"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Fields is just so small...looks like he should be a DB...

Winfrey should be playing more....





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Originally Posted by Dawgs4Life
Good point about Fields … he has some pop to him

I agree about Ford: he looked bad yesterday, but it won’t hurt to get him a little run here

And in terms of the DTs: sadly, we look better with Winfrey on the field. He’s got some toughness

I think Winfrey can be a solid player as long as he isn't an egg head. If he can start to think right he is probably a keeper. Now we will find out if it is simply a maturity issue or the guy is just a stone cold dummy.

We have to find out about Ford. It looks like he is the chosen player to replace Hunt. Ford has done a nice job returning kicks for the most part, but I don't care about that. We need to find out if he is a #2 back. He needs to show he is better than DJ before we just toss DJ out the door, even though it looks like we already have.


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Schwantz looked as expected. The fumble aside, he missed a couple of tackles on special teams. I saw Felton getting some time, mostly running around doing useless things. I suppose the FO wants to see these guys in action. I am not sure what else they need to see, but if it is one last look, it is what it is. Neither one of those guys needs to be on the team.

Yep. Berry needs to acknolwedge that these 2 aren't working out. If these small fast guys can't outplay their height or contribute on special teams, they are a waste of a roster spot.


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Well, a win is a win. No matter who you play. Houston is bad, we needed to win this one. We do have what it takes to lose to anyone.

- Obvious thought. Watson looked very rusty. He said after the game that he felt each one of those 700 days since he last played in an NFL game. When he was off, I was glad that it was short/low instead of high. Those tend to get tipped and up for grabs. Not saying that was intentional, just glad they were in the turf. Now that some live action is under his belt, let's hope it gets better, quick.

- Houston was able to get pressure through the center, and through Wills. Neither had a good game.

- I think we were missing Njoku. Bryant has made some nice catches (and runs) these past couple games, but he is still a liability as a blocker. And with contested throws.

- The run defense really had me nervous at first. They were getting gashed early, but tightened up.

- The Houston QB is not good.

- I saw Greedy Williams put in so little effort on a tackle that Jamie Collins would have been embarrassed. Right as the receiver caught the pass Greedy was on him from behind and got both arms wrapped around his waist. Textbook. Then ... did nothing. Not only did the guy get out of that, he was able to get inside the 10. Pathetic.

- The punter continues to do very well. I was concerned when we signed him, as Green Bay's special teams were really bad across the board last year. But, he's been doing well.

- Fields with a tremendous game. Forced the QB fumble, recovered the special teams fumble. Pick 6. Not too shabby.

- York with 2 FGs. Hopefully a confidence booster.

- Nice to see the defense and special teams pick up the slack when the offense struggles.


How does a league celebrating its 100th season only recognize the 53 most recent championships?

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Ugly as Sin win - but I'll take it over the alternatives.

Watson - rusty as hell, can't discern anything or forecast anything based off this game other than he needs to start the rest of the season. Any thought of Brissett keeping the team close in the playoff hunt for Watson to come in and guide us to a 100% winning record for the rest of the season is clearly a pipe dream. This season is definitely now flushed down the toilet, Watson needs all the reps to get back up to speed and start fast next year.

I'm not going to get excited about the D playing against an inept HOU offense ... I'll wait to give them props when they do it against some of the teams on the remaining schedule.


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I liked that Feely kind of explained what he thought York’s issues were with the plant leg


"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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j/c:

- I expected Watson to be rusty but I didn't expect him to be THAT rusty. But the added pressure of playing in Houston and in front of family on top of not playing in a long time was expected. Hopefully, as the season progresses everything will slow down for him.

- I think KS called a good game that was simple for Watson to digest. Loved the play call idea using Brissett on 4 and 1....just wonder if it was necessary to use against Houston. I wouldn't be surprised to see little wrinkles like that with Brissett moving forward.

- Tackling continues to be half-assed and problematic. Guys are not wrapping up and simply throwing their body into the ball-carrier.

- I thought the offensive line struggles continued. Not having Piocic really hurts. Also, they might need to adapt protecting a different style of QB in Watson over Brissett.

- Houston's QB really struggled with extremely high and inaccurate passes.

- Good too see the defense capitalize on mistakes.


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Kinda funny how
Many Homer's on here said back in the summer Watson
Was better than guys like Burrow Hebert etc.

I don't remember that. I remember people saying he was in that class. I can pull up the thread that ranked the QBs if you want.

That's not really why I replied to you, though. You are constantly referring to the "many homers" on this board. It's a Cleveland Browns message board. WTF did you expect to find? Steeler fans?

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Originally Posted by MemphisBrownie
j/c:


- I think KS called a good game that was simple for Watson to digest. Loved the play call idea using Brissett on 4 and 1....just wonder if it was necessary to use against Houston. I wouldn't be surprised to see little wrinkles like that with Brissett moving forward.
Yes - loved the play design, it does seem wasting it on HOU was questionable. Obviously next time we might simply have JB keep it and having showed this variation maybe the middle will be a bit softer - but still it was such a good play for short yardage I would have saved it.

Last edited by mgh888; 12/05/22 09:35 AM.

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If the Browns are committed to moving on from Hunt, and let's face it Hunt has aged before our eyes this year, why not let Chubb and D'ernest man the position next year? They seem hell bent on letting D'ernest walk and having it be Chubb and Ford. Based on what happened this off season D'ernest shouldn't be that expensive.

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Originally Posted by Milk Man
j/c...

J-Dubs kiddos hanging out in the locker room for the victory speech!


Why is there a kid in there? I read there were kids on the sideline again. Is that normal?

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Originally Posted by Versatile Dog
Quote
Kinda funny how
Many Homer's on here said back in the summer Watson
Was better than guys like Burrow Hebert etc.

I don't remember that. I remember people saying he was in that class. I can pull up the thread that ranked the QBs if you want.

That's not really why I replied to you, though. You are constantly referring to the "many homers" on this board. It's a Cleveland Browns message board. WTF did you expect to find? Steeler fans?
I believe their are different tiers or categories of fans.
I think you have some that are realistic. They don't trick themselves
Into thinking everything is Rosey and awesome
Then you have a section that the wait and see, or prove it
To me attitude.
Then you have a part of the Homer's. They believe every
Move by the front office great. Every draft pick is a steal
Every player acquisition is a successful one.
Every year the Browns are playoff bound etc etc
Then you have a tier of fans that are cautiously optimistic

But in the past the ones that were realistic, were looked down
Upon by the Homer's. In fact at one time the Homer's had
The loudest voice in Dawgtalkers.

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2 years ago Watson was definitely in the same conversation as a top 5-7 QB. Of course, we’ll have to wait to see if he can return to that form


"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Originally Posted by Dawgs4Life
2 years ago Watson was definitely in the same conversation as a top 5-7 QB. Of course, we’ll have to wait to see if he can return to that form

Lets see if he can be better that Brissett



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So I haven't been posting lately...life and work have been a bit rough. So I just wanted to give my thoughts on the game yesterday and probably disappear again.

I will discuss DW Last. Lets start with the D. Man they had a bad first half. Peirce ran over them as if he was Walter Payton. Tackling was terrible. Houston had been taking advantage of our over pursuit. and even when tacklers got there, they missed. Tackling has been an issue all season. Houston is not a team built to come from behind. Else, we would seen a heaver dose of Peirce in the 2nd half. I did see a change in the 2nd half where Takitaki (hope he is ok) began to spy and mirror Peirce. The D also was more conservative in later in the game allowing Houston to move the ball better. That was understandable and typical of our team. We shot ourselves in the foot with penalties. The D though did well to capitalize on opportunities. I thought pressure was decent against a QB that was getting the ball out very quickly. We need to invest in DT. I like Elliott but I don't think he is an answer to anchor the middle of our DLine. I like our corners in Emmerson, Newsome, and Ward. Delpit is inconsistent. Considering the injuries he has had the first couple years...maybe that is to be expected. Fields had the game of his career. Lets hope it is a sign of things to come. Johnson has been solid and I think the defacto leader since Walker went down. In all I think Safety is ok for us but not pushing us toward the goal to be elite. I think the D won this game for us...not in a flukey way...they "made plays" to get those scores. But I would like to see a game played for a full 60 minutes. We seem to play for a half or 3 quarters. luckily this time it was the second half....

Special Teams....Holy Cow we returned one for a TD. I like what DPJ has done in the punt game. I understand the trepidation to put your #2 receiver in as the punt returner. But I think it was a good move to put him back there. I also like Ford returning KO's. He has had a few moments where a slight trip up kept him form possibly going to the house. But he is the best returner we have seen in a while. D.Johnson approached it more like a running back. Coverage is still an issue. But I like that Schwartz has found a role as a gunner and affects the run back. Also has the speed to get behind and get potential balls before they touchback. Bojorquez (sp) was BOOMING his punts. It is easy to say that he was over kicking his coverage...but I really don't think that is the case. I think Tackling was a bigger issue. Cade York was exactly who we would hope him to be. Overall, good job by the ST....but still room for improvement in the tackling is needed.

OK now the Big Elephant in the Room. Yes DW was rusty. Strange. I expected throws to go high. But his throws went low. And he had a bad read that lead to an INT....BUT...I do think we got some glimpses of what out Offense could be. Everyone spoke about how bad Allen had been throwing the week before....and this week he looked pretty decent. I thought the playcalling gave Watson chances. But you know I expected some bad throws...I thought the would diminish by the 4th, but they didn't fully. However, I want to look at some positives as well. he had good control of the offense and made good reads for the most part. I thought he did well communicating in the huddle and on the line. And even the INT...I can UNDERSTAND how that happened. It was a good play by Pritle and DJ should have seen it...But I do think both Cooper (who even stated so) and DW expected Pritle to follow DPJ. The D also got some penetration and so the throw had to come quickly. But I wasn't focusing on the throws as much. I thought he had GREAT pocket awareness. especially for being out so long. I thought for the most part he had good reads. I think he needs to work on his play action fake. Believe it or not, I like our receivers. and that includes Schwartz. Would I be sad to see Schwartz go??...only for him. But I think he could be that speedster that is overrated because his QB makes him look so good...ie. Will Fuller. I think as Watson gets more comfortable, he will spread the ball around...Hit TE's and utilize players like Bell and Michael Woods. Right now it is Cooper and DPJ. I also saw a change in his face as the game went on. At first it was a little more wide eyed. in the late third Quarter and Fourth it had changed to a more laser focused command type of face. All in all I am satisfied...the throws will come around. but the decision making, communication, and command doesn't always come around. When things start to click we will see more down field shots that will open up the running game and the offense as a whole far more. They mentioned Allen and how awful he looked against the Dolphins...but then had nothing but praise for him yesterday...So a week can make a difference.

I do think we will need to invest in Center and DT in the coming FA and Draft. Froholdt is doing an admirable job. But isn't an answer yet. Most of the pursuit in the run game is coming through him. But they also overload his spot as an attack point. He has been put in a terrible situation and is handling it very professionally. That doesn't mean the quota is being met...But again...Watson gets comfortable...that attack point diminishes because those guys will have to stay back more often.

One question...why was the illegal procedure against Houston "disregarded by rule" when they declined the Offsides and accepted the Roughing the passer? I am not sure I understand that rule point.


I thought I was wrong once....but I was mistaken...

What's the use of wearing your lucky rocketship underpants if nobody wants to see them????
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Originally Posted by Swish
I'm just glad it clearly looked like rust, and not that he lost a step.

aint it crazy how there was finally a game where the defense actually showed up and carried the team? im not gonna lie guys.....

im glad we won, but imma be really paying attention to the defensive effort the last bit of this season. cause this is two weeks in a row now that they suddenly decided to play like they have talent. we keep playing like this, the more upset imma be, because i can't help but think the defense decided not to try until DW comes back.

I'm telling you bro, look back at his record here. Woods starts slow, and his D looks like crap until the half to the tail end of the season, then they come on like gangbusters. It's a pattern, and it's a problem.


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I’ve said that about Woods too. He has them playing well in the last third of the season, but it’s not good enough because we’re already out of it lol


"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
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Originally Posted by redddog
Wouldn’t it be hilarious if Watson was never the same and never improved beyond today?

240 million guaranteed and he’s a bust?

Not funny at all and would be ugly af trying to ship him. But the chances of that are almost nil. DW will bounce back. But I won't be sold on him being a great QB until I see it in a Browns game. However, even though he played ugly yesterday, he still looked the part and looked comfortable doing it.


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Not trying to be argumentative w/you, but we gave up:

6 in week 3
7 in week 4
14 in week 6
14 in week 7
10 in week 8
16 in week 9
7 in week 10
7 in week 11
10 in week 12

Our bye week was the following week.


https://www.espn.com/nfl/team/schedule/_/name/cle/season/2021

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Originally Posted by Versatile Dog
Quote
Kinda funny how
Many Homer's on here said back in the summer Watson
Was better than guys like Burrow Hebert etc.

I don't remember that. I remember people saying he was in that class. I can pull up the thread that ranked the QBs if you want.

That's not really why I replied to you, though. You are constantly referring to the "many homers" on this board. It's a Cleveland Browns message board. WTF did you expect to find? Steeler fans?

This is how I remember it too. And we're all homer here.


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Originally Posted by Versatile Dog
You are constantly referring to the "many homers" on this board. It's a Cleveland Browns message board. WTF did you expect to find? Steeler fans?

Answer; Objectivity.

j/c

I didn't see the game so I can't speak first hand to watson's performance. From reading all of these posts it appears watson stunk the place up. I'll use a quote by Memphis to sum up what it appears most agree they saw....

Quote
I expected Watson to be rusty but I didn't expect him to be THAT rusty.

That's not what the end result will be. There weren't many posters on here that didn't expect to see some rust. It was only logical. He will certainly be much better when all is said and done. Now I know people think he will be as good as he was before and that's entirely possible. But it isn't as guaranteed as some seem to think.

As many have said, a win is a win. After all it is a team sport. So hats off to the D and ST's, both much maligned all season, for saving the O's ass today.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Originally Posted by Rishuz
If the Browns are committed to moving on from Hunt, and let's face it Hunt has aged before our eyes this year, why not let Chubb and D'ernest man the position next year? They seem hell bent on letting D'ernest walk and having it be Chubb and Ford. Based on what happened this off season D'ernest shouldn't be that expensive.

It's as if many fans have forgotten he's on the roster and has proven his worth on game day. Instead they promote yet another project. I don't get it ether.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Isn't that Harrison Bryant?

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Originally Posted by Versatile Dog
Not trying to be argumentative w/you, but we gave up:

6 in week 3
7 in week 4
14 in week 6
14 in week 7
10 in week 8
16 in week 9
7 in week 10
7 in week 11
10 in week 12

Our bye week was the following week.


https://www.espn.com/nfl/team/schedule/_/name/cle/season/2021

That makes what the D has done so far this season even worse. Rather than building on what they were doing last season they regressed by a large margin. That's never a good thing.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Originally Posted by Iluvmyxstripper
Originally Posted by Versatile Dog
Quote
Kinda funny how
Many Homer's on here said back in the summer Watson
Was better than guys like Burrow Hebert etc.

I don't remember that. I remember people saying he was in that class. I can pull up the thread that ranked the QBs if you want.

That's not really why I replied to you, though. You are constantly referring to the "many homers" on this board. It's a Cleveland Browns message board. WTF did you expect to find? Steeler fans?
I believe their are different tiers or categories of fans.
I think you have some that are realistic. They don't trick themselves
Into thinking everything is Rosey and awesome
Then you have a section that the wait and see, or prove it
To me attitude.
Then you have a part of the Homer's. They believe every
Move by the front office great. Every draft pick is a steal
Every player acquisition is a successful one.
Every year the Browns are playoff bound etc etc
Then you have a tier of fans that are cautiously optimistic

But in the past the ones that were realistic, were looked down
Upon by the Homer's. In fact at one time the Homer's had
The loudest voice in Dawgtalkers.

You forgot to mention the tier that whines, pizzes and moans about anything and everything.


And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir

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Originally Posted by OldColdDawg
Originally Posted by Swish
I'm just glad it clearly looked like rust, and not that he lost a step.

aint it crazy how there was finally a game where the defense actually showed up and carried the team? im not gonna lie guys.....

im glad we won, but imma be really paying attention to the defensive effort the last bit of this season. cause this is two weeks in a row now that they suddenly decided to play like they have talent. we keep playing like this, the more upset imma be, because i can't help but think the defense decided not to try until DW comes back.

I'm telling you bro, look back at his record here. Woods starts slow, and his D looks like crap until the half to the tail end of the season, then they come on like gangbusters. It's a pattern, and it's a problem.
No team can WASTE HALF A SEASON figuring out how to play defense. That is just foolish.


The Browns finally have a leader in the building. It won't be long before Jim Schwartz is in charge. Thankfully.
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Maybe I missed it but any updates on Taki’s injury?
Bell’s?
Shwartz’?
Bryant’s?


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I haven't seen any updates on Take, but being taken off on a cart is a bad sign. It's too bad because the D is playing so much better once he was inserted at LBer.

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Watson phew that was ugly. Rusty is an under statement. Still saw flashes of what I expect to see. The Schwartz fumble play was what I expect, was a great play and of course Schwartz fumbled it, that dude sucks.

Very rusty with live speed and throwing mechanics, it was expected but it was more than I thought. A win is a win.

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Bummer. He had been playing well and is in a contract year.


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Well isn't that just a kick in the nuts. That's going to hurt, and I enjoyed watching him play.


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Any word on if Buzbee and his entourage enjoyed the game?


And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir

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You know my love will Not Fade Away.........


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Originally Posted by jfanent
Any word on if Buzbee and his entourage enjoyed the game?

I haven't seen anything regarding this. But overall, it was reported that the expected vitriol Watson would receive was wildly overblown.


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Originally Posted by MemphisBrownie
Originally Posted by jfanent
Any word on if Buzbee and his entourage enjoyed the game?

I haven't seen anything regarding this. But overall, it was reported that the expected vitriol Watson would receive was wildly overblown.

Except by Sam Ponder.

I love contrived mental anguish by sports media.

BpG #1990903 12/06/22 06:36 AM
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Originally Posted by BpG
Watson phew that was ugly. Rusty is an under statement. Still saw flashes of what I expect to see. The Schwartz fumble play was what I expect, was a great play and of course Schwartz fumbled it, that dude sucks.

Very rusty with live speed and throwing mechanics, it was expected but it was more than I thought. A win is a win.

I know it doesn't matter because he did catch the ball, but he almost dropped that pass. He had to grab it a 2nd time after it initially bounced out of his hands.


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Originally Posted by Rishuz
If the Browns are committed to moving on from Hunt, and let's face it Hunt has aged before our eyes this year, why not let Chubb and D'ernest man the position next year? They seem hell bent on letting D'ernest walk and having it be Chubb and Ford. Based on what happened this off season D'ernest shouldn't be that expensive.

I have already voiced my displeasure with the DJ situation. It makes no sense to me. I will say if DJ is causing problems, then that is a different deal, but I haven't seen or heard about anything along those lines.


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