He’s sucked to my eyes too, and I’m nothing more than an average fan. He’s always blown back, on roller skates, and you can tell it’s affecting everything else
"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Cooper is far to the left as Njoku settles into the slot. Moore is flanked out wide to the right. Chubb and Ford are split in the backfield as Watson takes the snap ... Here we go."
You are the lone drummer on this issue. I'd say that says something.
peen...It says a lot to me...most fans do not focus on the OLine and find it much easier to rely on an..internet dude..who tries to plant the idea that it's our CENTER'S FAULT that the offense is struggling..!
Old guys can be stubborn and being the "lone drummer" doesn't bother me a bit.
Yes, it's only you in your wisdom that could identify this fallacy the main stream media is perpetuating on our society. Once again you seem to not have a grasp on the difference between a key reason and the key reason.
I expect them to identify the severity of the problem and the expected duration of it, then, when needed, find and sign someone that will be at least serviceable at the position. If we're reduced to our 5th option at a given position, then it is a VERY safe bet that we could find a street free agent to come in and perform better.
While this is true, there are also ways to scheme to protect a guy if you know he is really in over his head. Instead, and this is just one example, on our first drive on 3rd and 1, we lined up Chubb and Hunt in the backfield, ran Chubb out to the right and handed the ball to Hunt to run right up over top of the center.. and Reader stuffed it. So why put your center in that position, if he is totally outmatched? We did.
While this is true, there are also ways to scheme to protect a guy if you know he is really in over his head. Instead, and this is just one example, on our first drive on 3rd and 1, we lined up Chubb and Hunt in the backfield, ran Chubb out to the right and handed the ball to Hunt to run right up over top of the center.. and Reader stuffed it. So why put your center in that position, if he is totally outmatched? We did.
DC...I went back and looked at that play...I'm not so sure that the ball was supposed to handed off to Hunt...the OLine blocking appears to be perfect for faking the dive play to Hunt with the QB then pulling the ball out and pitching it to Chubb who had a clear lane to the outside of our right end.
...in that situation, if the QB rides the RB who is carrying out the dive a split second too long..the RB takes the ball from the QB rather than risk a fumble on what was supposed to be a fake to the dive man.
There is a chance that the Browns offense simply had not run that particular running play enough with Watson at QB to get the timing down and work out all the wrinkles.
The Browns OLine looked to be blocking for a fake to Hunt, the dive man and a pitch to the right outside to Chubb.
BUT, to those looking to blame someone like THE CENTER...it's easier to claim that Froholdt got owned...lol.
I came across some comments concerning the NFL media sources that utilize the internet and twitter to deliver their pro football stories and opinions...
Kind of interesting: the following from https://247sports.com/ ... "After the game, I had to rush to my computer to see if I was needed for anything on the site (I wasn’t, of course), so instead, I started monitoring the post-game stories coming in from Browns sites for the newswire. And, I have to say, folks, it’s a mess. To stay in business, sites now throw out as many stories as they can, as quickly as they can, to maximize page views, which maximizes ad dollars, and gets them money to keep going. Along the way, they’ve laid off editors and content managers, so what you’re getting (from single outlets) are overlapping stories that often duplicate each other, being flung out willy-nilly with no rhyme or reason. Some outlets are worse than others, but when I do the newswire, I throw stories away because I’m not going to link essentially three of the same story from the same outlet." McBride
IMO, this 247 writer is saying something very similar to what I tried to point out about some in the media (Jared Mueller) who use their access to sports media platforms to write "CLICK-BAIT" opinions, with sensational headlines to get readers to "digest" their crap. These people don't care if their information is slanted or half true, as long as they can get you to click on their story...they have succeeded in maximizing their ad dollars...and if they write about an OLine guy...whose gonna try to interpret their assignment for each play..?
To stay in business, sites now throw out as many stories as they can, as quickly as they can, to maximize page views, which maximizes ad dollars, and gets them money to keep going. Along the way, they’ve laid off editors and content managers, so what you’re getting (from single outlets) are overlapping stories that often duplicate each other, being flung out willy-nilly with no rhyme or reason. Some outlets are worse than others, but when I do the newswire, I throw stories away because I’m not going to link essentially three of the same story from the same outlet."
Ahhhh..........remember all the "new" stories you posted about Watson this off-season?
Ahhhh..........remember all the "new" stories you posted about Watson this off-season?
vers...I would post every one of those stories again, too.
Most of what I posted came from a LAWYER and while you may not have wanted any discussion concerning Watson's alleged sex behavior, it was going to be discussed and it deserved to be discussed because the guy who settled something like 24 or the lawsuits against him..he wanted to be the Browns QB.
Watson paid a price for what he did and I'm fine with that..but I never believed what I determined were nothing but lies from Watson or more likely, his lawyers.
You want to restart that debate Vers...GO FOR IT..!!
Of course you would post them again. That doesn't change the fact that you take advantage of the very same practice that appals you now.
vers...OK, you made your choice and you can bet I will post every damn one of the posts I made and ask you one questions...vers, you tell me about THE OPINION I STATED and ATTACHED TO every article I posted..!
vers..so now that I called you out and told you to post the stories and my opinions that you claim were wrong or should not have been posted, your left with accusing me of deflecting something.
vers AGAIN...you tell me about THE OPINIONS I STATED and ATTACHED TO every article I posted..!
You are the one that opened your mouth...now backup whatever you might be claiming concerning Watson and his 24 cases by women who accused him of SEXUAL ASSAULT.
Vers....you obviously believe the sexual assault cases by a Watson were not legit, so let's review Watson's cases and the stories that Florio wrote concerning those cases...AGAIN..!
Then you can show me what the opinion I posted along with each story I posted...and show me what I had to say about the each story I posted.
Back up what you claim you might be claiming...BTW, you realize Watson settled the cases against him and did not appeal the NFL's suspension...the NFL obviously did not buy Watson's side of the story.
While Pocic missing is a factor Teller’s issues are wider
Memp...when I reviewed the OLine performance against the Rats, you could clearly see that Teller is not 100%.
Knowing that he has back issues, watching him, I could see that his ability to use his "brute strength" against defensive rushers is not what it was before the injury. I don't know how serious Teller's injury is but I would not be surprised if he has to have surgery after the season.
What the hell are you talking about. You complained about this in the Mueller piece regarding Froholdt.
"To stay in business, sites now throw out as many stories as they can, as quickly as they can, to maximize page views, which maximizes ad dollars, and gets them money to keep going. Along the way, they’ve laid off editors and content managers, so what you’re getting (from single outlets) are overlapping stories that often duplicate each other, being flung out willy-nilly with no rhyme or reason. Some outlets are worse than others, but when I do the newswire, I throw stories away because I’m not going to link essentially three of the same story from the same outlet."
Yet, you did the same thing you are complaining about w/the Watson stories. You broke them as new developments, but they were multiple pieces that duplicated and overlapped another story that came out before them. I guess it's okay when it's done to fit your agenda, but not okay when you disagree w/the "news."
Yet, you did the same thing you are complaining about w/the Watson stories.
vers...so you believe Florio's opinions that I posted WITHOUT GIVING AN OPINION OF MY OWN...you think Florio's articles were made up "click bait" to get looks..?
Yet Watson did exactly what Florio said he should have done by settling the sexual assault cases brought against him...(all but two) and the NFL handed down the punishment that was very near what Florio predicted.
Obviously the NFL ruled on Watson's cases just as Florio predicted...SO WHAT IS YOUR COMPLAINT, VERS..!
Florio posted factual accounts of what happened in Watson vs Therapists cases and Watson and his lawyer's CAVED and the NFL fined Watson and suspended him.
Vers...the articles I posted turned out to be factually accurate while the stories some are writing about the play of the Browns offensive line have turned out to be PFF CLICK-BAIT.
mac, you are either a very good liar or have difficulty w/reading comprehension. A lot of articles were posted about the very same news. I never mentioned Florio. He would post opinions or news and many others would post the same opinion or news and you acted like it was a new development each and every time. You know, mac.........it would behoove to just admit that you're wrong sometimes. You just look silly w/the moving of the goal posts over and over again.
mac, you are either a very good liar or have difficulty w/reading comprehension. A lot of articles were posted about the very same news. I never mentioned Florio. He would post opinions or news and many others would post the same opinion or news and you acted like it was a new development each and every time. You know, mac.........it would behoove to just admit that you're wrong sometimes. You just look silly w/the moving of the goal posts over and over again.
vers...YOU ARE THE ONLY PERSON trying to turn this thread into a WATSON THREAD...!
I strongly suggest you stop trying to hijack this thread and start your own damn thread about HOW WRONGLY WATSON HAS BEEN TREATED OVER HIS PAST SEXUAL CONDUCT.
You did all you could to get the WATSON threads dealing with his SEXUAL ASSAULT cases, shut down or moved on this message board and thank goodness the moderators saw the issue differently than you did and allowed Browns fans to discuss the conduct and legal exposure Watson was facing...and how that might impact the Browns and the starting QB position.
JMO, but you can give it a try to blame others for WATSON'S PAST SEXUAL ASSAULT CASES...you know, the cases he settled with the women who charged him with sexual assault..?
...and feel free to point the finger at the NFL because they didn't believe Watson or his lawyers, resulting in a $5 mill fine and 11 game suspension. The NFL sure as hell didn't buy the story Watson attempted to spread.
Vers..I strongly suggest that you put the blame for whatever is ailing you on the proper source...DESHAUN WATSON...
Vers was the strongest voice on the board objecting to the watson legal cases and the details surrounding it being posted in the Pure Football forum. The refs made it quite clear that as the season approached this kind of talk should be relegated to the Tailgate forum. When these stories and details were unfolding it was long before the season was to begin and not much actual football talk to be had so they allowed it. Thus far the request by the refs has been honored as they should be.
It does seem odd that the most outspoken opponent of posting such content would now be the very person binging it back up in the Pure Football forum.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
At one moment you are challenging a person to debate, then you are telling them to start their own thread.
Again, Froholdt is a decent to good guard. He is a mediocre to poor center.
peen...I'm not the person that attempted to change the subject of this thread...that was your cousin versy.
I'm just trying my best to save THIS THREAD FROM BEING HIJACKED by your cousin vinny...I mean, versy..!
Froholdt is being judged by PFF and those who link to PFF information in an attempt to legitimize their opinions.
PFF's problem is, they admit that they don't have but maybe 10% of those people doing the video reviews who are actually qualified to judge a football players performance.
I contend that I'm sure as hell better qualified than those individuals PFF is paying to judge the play of the Browns offensive line...and PFF admits "We have analysts from all walks of life, we don’t care if you played."
One more time and then I will leave it go no matter what you and Pit are saying. I was not trying to make the conversation about Watson. How the hell can anyone even think that? I was saying that duplicate and overlapping articles were widely used by you [and others] in an effort to support your opinion, yet now they are all of a sudden a terrible thing?
Vers brought up Watson for one reason only... to show the blatant double-standard that Mac exhibited when complaining about the 'flood' of overlapping information these days. Vers hit the nail on the head, it has nothing to do with Watson.
At one moment you are challenging a person to debate, then you are telling them to start their own thread.
Again, Froholdt is a decent to good guard. He is a mediocre to poor center.
peen...I'm not the person that attempted to change the subject of this thread...that was your cousin versy.
I'm just trying my best to save THIS THREAD FROM BEING HIJACKED by your cousin vinny...I mean, versy..!
Froholdt is being judged by PFF and those who link to PFF information in an attempt to legitimize their opinions.
..PFF's problem is, they admit that they don't have but maybe 10% of those people doing the video reviews who are actually qualified to judge a football players performance.
I contend that I'm sure as hell better qualified than those individuals PFF is paying to judge the play of the Browns offensive line...and PFF admits "We have analysts from all walks of life, we don’t care if you played."
Sorry Mac, PFF is pretty reliable. It isn't just some fan site. The NFL looks at the info they provide. I am sure teams have crossed checked their grades enough to know they are a valid source.
If you are so sure their ratings are inferior and yours are so superior, maybe you should contact teams and let them know you can be of service. Who knows, maybe you can start another career and scout for NFL teams?
For now, I'll trust the PFF grades as good enough since their's are widely used and yours are limited to a few board members on a team specific, somewhat limited message board.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
Getting back to Froholdt. And ignoring PFF. He sucked again Saturday Constantly getting knocked into the backfield. Wiffing on blocks., needing constant help from both guards and except for two or three exceptions not winning his battles in one on one blocking. He is by far our worst lineman. And it's not even close. Of course I don't know any team that has a 5th string center thats good.
PFF's problem is, they admit that they don't have but maybe 10% of those people doing the video reviews who are actually qualified to judge a football players performance.
I contend that I'm sure as hell better qualified than those individuals PFF is paying to judge the play of the Browns offensive line...and PFF admits "We have analysts from all walks of life, we don’t care if you played."
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul. - John Muir
Getting back to Froholdt. And ignoring PFF. He sucked again Saturday Constantly getting knocked into the backfield. Wiffing on blocks., needing constant help from both guards and except for two or three exceptions not winning his battles in one on one blocking. He is by far our worst lineman. And it's not even close. Of course I don't know any team that has a 5th string center thats good.
GM...post the video of the plays you speaking of and I'll give you my opinion...
Froholdt wasn't perfect but not too bad as a fill in center who has already shown to be a better OG when he was forced to take over when Teller went down.
Vers brought up Watson for one reason only... to show the blatant double-standard that Mac exhibited when complaining about the 'flood' of overlapping information these days. Vers hit the nail on the head, it has nothing to do with Watson.
Well God knows that watson is the only example he could have used to point out such a double standard. You're smarter than that.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
There is a reason he is a backup. He is also young and has not been Callahanded.
Woof...actually, Fro has been schooled by Callahand and improved his play to the point that a couple of other teams wish they had not cut him..Patriots & Texans. The Dane has physical tools that a player must be born with. IMO, he has the tools to play any position on the OL and I would not be surprised if he doesn't get a try at OT next season.
Getting back to Froholdt. And ignoring PFF. He sucked again Saturday Constantly getting knocked into the backfield. Wiffing on blocks., needing constant help from both guards and except for two or three exceptions not winning his battles in one on one blocking. He is by far our worst lineman. And it's not even close. Of course I don't know any team that has a 5th string center thats good.
GM...post the video of the plays you speaking of and I'll give you my opinion...
Froholdt wasn't perfect but not too bad as a fill in center who has already shown to be a better OG when he was forced to take over when Teller went down.
Gee let me get right on that. Let me try to find 50 + plays online. Then let me try to learn how to post those on here.
Getting back to Froholdt. And ignoring PFF. He sucked again Saturday Constantly getting knocked into the backfield. Wiffing on blocks., needing constant help from both guards and except for two or three exceptions not winning his battles in one on one blocking. He is by far our worst lineman. And it's not even close. Of course I don't know any team that has a 5th string center thats good.
GM...post the video of the plays you speaking of and I'll give you my opinion...
Froholdt wasn't perfect but not too bad as a fill in center who has already shown to be a better OG when he was forced to take over when Teller went down.
Gee let me get right on that. Let me try to find 50 + plays online. Then let me try to learn how to post those on here.
Not to mention the big waste of time. Mac has said he has already broken down the film showing the guy has played well when it is clear to everybody but him that Froholdt hasn't played all that well as a center.
I think most of us feel that Froholdt is a decent enough guard and has value on this team, but a center he is not.
Last edited by Ballpeen; 12/21/2207:56 AM.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn.
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