DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Kevin Stefanski cont

Well, our Browns are officially in last place in the AFC North with the 4th worse record in the entire AFC. How many more games do the Browns have to lose before Stefanski is held responsible for his team's poor play. Only 3 offensive TD's by the offense in 4 games since Watson took over at QB. Tell me again how excellent Stefanski is at running the offense. 3 years- two 3rd place finishes and on pace to finish in last place in year 3 in the AFC North. Only team in the division going in the wrong direction. Even Pittsburgh with a rookie QB is looking better on the field than our Super Bowl contending Browns.

I think he’s back next year regardless. My hope is we have a new defensive coordinator and approach and he allows Van Pelt to call plays

In addition, we might look at some of the offensive coaching positions. A fresh outlook doesn't hurt.

As an example, Stump is a good coach, but it seems to me our rushing attack is going to be different with Watson at the helm. I don't see as much of a downhill rushing attack. We might need to coach the position differently. Our receivers haven't exactly been great the last few years. That might be another position that needs review.

I think the list of concerned fans is and should be growing - just like Woods and his slow starts to seasons with his defense, Stefanski shows some concerning tendencies throughout his entire time with the Browns - from getting pass happy, lack of adjustments and too many cute plays where he thinks he is smarter than everyone else. I'd like to see people hold him accountable instead of deflecting and making excuses for him time and time and time again. If each issue was unique it'd be a different story but there are repeating issues. . . . And that's just on offense. As a HC hew is responsible for the entire team's performance, their level of preparedness in each game and their motivation - areas we've seen a few issues with as well: Coming out flat and playing down after a week off or coming off a big win. Not as often - but we've seen this and it's a concern.

I think he's back next year regardless. My concern is that we'll see the same and we will have a new HC in 2024.

Shoulda, woulda, coulda.....All fans and posters wouldn't be complaining IF we'd not given games to Jets, Falcons, and Chargers....THREE dropped TD passes against Saints isn't on COACHES. It is a team game and ALL have shown they are human. I want young guys getting shot and still trying to win games....beating the SQUEELRS twice would make the season....GO Browns.
Merry Christmas to all.

With a new DC, some upgrades at DT. LB FS and another WR we will be a serious contender next year IMO. A little depth on the O-line would be nice too. With KS working with an up to speed DW our O should be much better than it was this year. I'm talking about an addition of about 6 starters. Between the draft and FA AB should be able to accomplish that and I'm not the most positive guy on this board. I can see something good for us next year IF we make the right moves. JMO

Logically and mathematically speaking, this upcoming information challenges one's mind. However, there seem to be certain givens in the world of sports. For example, if a NFL team gets a lot of turnovers one year, they typically do not follow that up w/getting a lot of turnovers the next year. Thus, one has to always cast a cautious eye on a team that is relying on the defense getting turnovers.

Likewise, teams typically do not have similar results in one-score games from year to the next. I give you the Minnesota Vikings as an example. Last year, they lost 8 games in one-score contests. They finished the year at 8-9. What about this year? They have been victorious in 10 one-score games and their record and are currently 12 and 3 and in first place in their division.

Good point. I’m sure that KS is going to have to tailor his system altogether. It just looks clunky right now

Merry Christmas ...
plenty of time to Rant later.
Kenny Rogers song

They'll be time enough for ranten , when the holidays are over and the seasons done.

I don't disagree with the premise behind your entire post - but how many years have we said something like this (the part I have quoted while removing the specific positions) over the last 20 years.... Sure some of those years we were woeful, and it might have been the brownsiest of browns colored spectacles that gave us hope from the off-season ... but I think overwhelmingly we *hope* for the best, while results show an entirely different story.

If the Browns are really serious about winning, they need to open their wallets and get a real HC in Cleveland.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nf...mp;cvid=07aa2ed1cf6848eeac45a44e4c75a3c5

I'm sure Berry as told Stefanski he'll be back next year. Watch out to see if Haslam and Berry don't hop on a jet to NO for a secret visit with Payton - that's the way they do things in Cleveland.

Honestly - if you've locked up 3 1st round picks and $1/4 Billion in a franchise QB, it'd seem a somewhat obvious move to ensure you get an proven elite HC to guide the team while you have said FQB under contract. Whether you have concerns or whether you think KS is a good HC - the reality is Sean Payton is light years better. I doubt KS is going anywhere but I would 100% understand it if Haslams went for broke. It'd redeem every other decision and screw up they have made since buying the team. jmo

The new Browns have never gone for broke with a proven HC. I’m not expecting them to start now.

I don't think Depo would approve of this.

And therein lies a huge problem.

I would like that. "Change for the better." Payton, eh?

I'm on record saying KS should get another year with DW. However, if we can get Payton here with Fangio as DC I'd make that move tomorrow. Jimmy Haslam went the extra mile with an elite QB. Maybe it's time he did it with a HC. JMO

Exactly what I am saying - it would be a bigger move than going after the elite QB because 1 has a proven history of winning while the other didn't. This will say a whole lot about the Browns organization as a whole - whether you get Payton or not, there shouldn't be a single team in the NFL that gets to Payton to give him an offer before the Browns if they are serious about bringing a championship to Cleveland. In fact, JMHO, the Browns offer should have already been received by Payton for consideration. Replacing Stefanski with Payton is a bigger and smarter move than replacing Mayfield with Watson. Hey Haslam - the fans are watching.................

So here you are saying we should have already sent payton an offer, yet before you say this:

I'm sure Berry as told Stefanski he'll be back next year. Watch out to see if Haslam and Berry don't hop on a jet to NO for a secret visit with Payton - that's the way they do things in Cleveland.

I don't mind having an opinion one way of the other, but to just flip flop between opinions as the narrative dictates to meet your agenda exposes your motive.

steve says:


But, he's moved on. This is all about Baker w/him and guys like 888.

He said what he thinks we SHOULD do and then opines as to what he thinks we've already done. There is but ONE agenda poster on this board.

From you on your Brissett/Baker thread::

"Thus, I'm gonna shove the Baker news down their freaking throats."

There is but one person on this board who is obsessed with Baker. BTW...are you shoving (more) crow down your own freaking throat today?

Like I said.............they have moved on. LMAO

You "moved on" because Baker sucked all year. Everyone knows you were salivating to trash the team and praise Baker.

That's all you've got? With your advanced English degrees all you've got is to make up what YOU think is in MY mind? Liars will say whatever they need to say to keep the truth hidden.

You are the only person on this board who can't move on from Baker...you prove that from your own keyboard on a regular basis.

What truth? The fact that the Browns decided not to extend Baker? The truth that they were willing to pay another team money just to get him the hell out of the locker room? The truth that only Carolina was willing to trade for him? The truth that Baker had to give up money and the Browns had to pay the majority of his salary for Carolina to actually make the trade? The truth that he was the lowest ranked qb in the league when he was their starter? The truth that he fell to 3rd string behind Darnold and PJ Walker? The truth that only ONE team put a claim on him after he was placed on waivers?

You can't handle the truth!

No...the TRUTH that everyone on this board except for you has moved on from Baker...the truth that you desperately need Watson to succeed and Baker to fail for your ego and thus agenda (to the point of snuggling up to a sexual predator without shame)...the truth that any rumblings about Ski's incompetence - and that of the FO - is a frightening thought to you because those are the guys who couldn't make it work with Baker. The truth that only ONE fan (outside of BakerDawg) disappeared...and you when the Browns were doing well WITH Baker and yet re-appeared when the Browns failed with Baker. Followed by the truth of YOU accusing people of putting a player above the team...which is actually part of your M.O. The truth that you do exactly what you accuse others of doing...except that they AREN'T doing what you say...which happens to be what you yourself do regularly...and the TRUTH that you will lie to feed your agenda.

Another lie by you. I talked about the outcomes of close games on this thread. steve was the one who introduced Baker into this thread.

Nice to see that you're trying to hijack another thread by bringing up a player long gone from the team as an excuse to blanket the poor play and lack of coaching by our Cleveland Browns that you refuse to address. This thread is supposed to be about Stefanski and how he has failed as a HC having never finished higher than 3rd in the AFC North and is on pace to finish dead last in the division this year. Yet now, the Browns have even a bigger opportunity to upgrade the team than the buying of Watson, by securing the services of Payton as the teams new HC but you want to deflect that opportunity by bringing up our former QB and rallying your "Stefanski Boyz." There is no reason why the Browns wouldn't attempt to make this move if they were really serious about winning and being a Super Bowl contender. Instead, let's hijack the thread and make it about our former QB - and you expect people to believe there's another agenda while you spill your "Stefanski Boyz" trash?

Since you brought it up, let's hear some of your millions of excuses for our 230M QB going 15-31 for 135 yards with no TD passes, 2 sacks, and 1 INT. with the OL perfectly intact on Saturday. We're sure getting our money worth out of the 230M position thus far.

So, tell us "Ol' Wise One", why is it better move for the Browns to skip attempting to go after Payton as the Browns HC and staying pat with a Stefanski who has never finished better than 3rd in the AFC North with a talent laden roster? Is it the Browns would show no faith in Stefanski if they went after Payton and lost in the sweepstakes - that Stefanski's feelings might get hurt - that it may appear to be stabbing Stefanski and or Berry in the back after two 3rd place finishes and 1 last place finish in the AFC North? Should the Browns just pass on the obvious upgrade just to keep from hurting one's feelings? Please tell us 'Ol' Wise One."

The questin is: Why haven't the Browns openly gone after Payton at this point?

Well, finishing third in division is irrelevant if you make the playoffs. Winning a division only means where playoff games will be played. Yes, having home playoff games is a good thing but it does not mean that the home team will automatically win. As for the talent laden roster? I don’t buy that. I think that the defense was and is lacking.

Of more importance regarding the existing on field talent is the ability to get, develop and most importantly, keep talent. The parity that the NFL allegedly strives for means that some teams will likely be stuck in a never ending cycle of sucking then being almost good and then sucking again. Talent evaluation becomes extremely crucial. The salary cap impacts this as well. The bottom line is that most teams simply won’t make it to the next level. The numbers of quality qualified people to fill positions in an organization is not unlimited. The talent pool is small. Arbitrarily putting a Payton in place of a Stefanski (I support moving on from Stefanski as I think OC is the top of his competence level) will NOT mean that we will be better next year. It certainly would be worth the risk but unless the team has the talent either in place or capable of being put in place I don’t think he would be as successful as we would have built up in our minds.

As for Watson? I would wager he plays at most 3 years here before getting moved. I could certainly be wrong and would be happy to eat crow but I just don’t see the pieces all being in place at the same time for him to take us to the promised land.

If I could do whatever,
I'd try either, Kevin HC, or Alex Van Pelt get moved to coach special teams, whichever one of them currently takes more blame for the offense. The current special teams coach would get axed,
Joe Woods would remain at DC, Jon Gruden would be brought in to coordinate the offense which is in need of a fix.
and then either Alex Van pelt or Kevin HC would remain or become the head coach. Berry would probably have to go because really how do you not get real players in the draft, and Depo, what consistent strategy has the team followed since he arrived? None, get him outta there too.
I don't really like the idea of Peyton the coach but whatever.

There is also that Baker was injured for the 2nd half, or latter 3/4s of last season, and what you reference occurred in the first half, or first 2/3rds of this season so remaining injury concerns teams may have had about Baker may have played a role in any negatives you reference.
edit: maybe only the Rams claimed him off waivers, that's ONE, BUT in the past year, BOTH the Panthers, and Rams wanted him so that is TWO not one.

And that's the narrative you would love for everyone to believe in order to cast shade on anyone who disagrees with you.

News flash. Your feeble attempt at character assassination isn't working.

What truth? The truth that Baker is outperforming Watson right now? You are such a bitter little man.

Kind of done with KS, here. He's meh.

Go out and get Demeco Ryans, not Payton - he aint coming to Cleveland, anyway.

Elevate AVP to OC. Draft some quality defenders in the draft (DTs and LBs), retool the D. Get a top flight WR in free agency (hopefully).

Easy peasy back to relevance.

First you would have to find a HC willing to walk into the current power structure. A structure where Depo and Berry actually dictate most everything. Payton certainly wouldn't and if Demeco Ryans cares about his resume and his future career as an NFL HC, he won't either.

You can tell by his tone today that Baker had a good game yesterday. He just can't help himself.

Imagine if you would, the Browns Berry and Haslam hopping on a plane without telling Stefanski and going to NO to pitch a deal to Payton to be their next HC. Meanwhile, Stefanski finds out and is sitting in Cleveland wondering what the hell is going on. Do you think Stefanski is just going to sit there, and hope Payton says "no?" The Browns recruitment party returns not getting the answer they wanted from Payton and decide to continue with Stefanski. Do you really believe Stefanski would have sat there all meek and reserved while the Browns are looking for his replacement behind his back?

Stefanski doesn't seem to be good at making adjustments during a game.

I believe Stefanski would sit there meek and reserved

Not sure he could make an adjustment !