DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Supreme Court strikes down Biden student loan debt forgiveness program

Good. I'm happy to pay my loans. I don't feel the need to pay for others.

I don't see how they could have ruled any other way. You can't punish loan companies or the federal government for how screwed up the cost of higher education is in this country. The entire system needs revamped but punishing the companies that gave out these loans isn't the answer and as far as I know, congress has the power of the purse. I think Biden overstepped his bounds in this instance.

Part of how much higher education costs in this country is because of Federal involvement. When i went back to school the loans offered were based on tuition cost and had nothing to do with my ability to repay, either currently or speculatively based on degree sought. An unlimited well behind the scenes drives higher costs.

I would say that I would have to agree with that at least in part. There is also how these universities are being turn into Club Met. They are supposed to be institutions of learning not vacation resorts. Like I said before, the entire system needs to be revamped.

I have said so for many years.

You have all sorts of half assed colleges springing up to cash in on the flow of money.

There are so many degreed people out there, many don't mean anything any longer. It's been sold that without a college degree, you can't succeed. That is so wrong...or it shouldn't be that way.

I am heartened to see a trend back to vocations.

Not that a person wanting to be a electrician doesn't need training....apprentice programs, or a jr. college.


Most apprentice programs don't cost anything, other than working for your license at a lower rate of pay. Most 2 year colleges are very affordable, or as in Tennessee, free if you received decent grades in HS. It might be 3.0, but might even be a little less. It's not like you have a carry a 3.8 or more.

You brought up a point that I find to be a great thing that so many seem to be misguided about IMO. It's the fact that Tennessee has a program to get two years free community colleges. As you brought up, many trades these days require more than a high school degree. Heating and air and auto mechanics are two prime examples. Both now involve computer training. I'm sure there are many more examples of this. High school alone just doesn't cut it anymore.

So high school graduates in Tennessee can choose to take a vocation at a community college or earn credits towards a four year degree so when they move to a four year university they will not have to take out such big loans as they have already built up credits towards that degree for free. Thus making a four year degree much less expensive. Many see this as some socialist concept of giving them something for free.

But all of this was proposed and passed in a Republican state with a Republican governor and a Republican legislature. And the reason is a simple one. Having a better educated population draws better paying jobs to your state. It's an investment for a better state economy in the future. We all know you can't get a return on an investment if you make no investment in the first place.

It's actually what I consider to be a common sense approach to making college more affordable which is something I think most everyone approves of in principal. I mean there you get two years of college credits without having to take a loan out for it in the first place.

100% agree with you Pit... I think Texas has a similar program, but I haven't looked into it too closely yet as my kids are still young... my wife did two years of community college and then two years at A&M... and her A&M years were paid by the state through a disability program.... but even if they weren't, she would have had a lot less debt by going to community college first...

I did four years at a private undergrad and then 4 years of grad school.... undergrad I got a bunch of scholarships and then my parents helped out with... grad school I couldn't get scholarships but worked throughout grad school and then worked my tail off to pay the loans back... but I also knew I was going to get a pretty decent job and live really frugally for several years, so I would be able to pay them off...


to me, I think we need to get a better handle on college costs.... I love the 2 year community school then going to a state or private school.... I also think we need to do a better job at educating young people on what degree is best for them and what the ROI is on that degree...

I agree with you at least to some extent that a student loan should be based on the degree a student is majoring in. Some of the crazy degrees handed out these days leave little chance for success from a financial standpoint. Risk assessment is a always a huge factor in the ability to secure a loan. But at the same time it leaves me with some concerns. From a financial standpoint teachers make very little money in the grand scheme of things. Yet we need well educated and highly trained teachers to help insure the future of our nation. A well educated populace is a foundation of a strong economy and future innovation. That's not an area you wish to be fighting on a global scale from a position of weakness. Something I feel we are already doing to some degree.

And then there are the arts. While it seems to be a less and less favorable view, I think art in many forms is a foundation that's critical. No it's not what many think of as foundational but it's about culture. Not everyone with an art degree or music degree can turn out to be Clem. His career in music has not only rewarded him from the perspective of fulfillment, but also financially to some extent. And no, I don't think one has to be wealthy or rich to be financially fulfilled.

For me at least to some extent it's a balancing act and I wish I had the answer to where the lines should be drawn, but I don't.

if you want free education... join the military. Otherwise, you should have to pay.

Yup ….murica. Dumbed down and numbed up. Educate the rich. The rest can eat cake.

I don't think there are many that actually disagree with you. The problem seems to be many believe that it shouldn't cost so much that it's a lifetime burden of debt.

Pit, I think I agree with everything you said...

And I should add a little more where I was coming from... I read about a study where a guy looked at undergrad and grad degrees from a variety of schools and tried to figure out starting salaries for graduates with those degrees along with the cost of getting that degree... then developed ROIs for the degrees and schools... one thing I loved about it, if you want to get a teaching degree you could look at several schools to compare their ROIs for a teaching degree... That way a kid can making an informed decision and maybe it makes more sense to get that teaching degree from the University of Findlay instead of OSU...

I also agree that I think the arts need to be continued to be taught. I appreciated get a well rounded education... I always chuckle when thinking of my undergrad degree because I have a Bachelors of Arts in Exercise Science... you'd think I'd have a Bachelors of Science, but my school had us take a wide variety of course work for our core

100%... prices are outrageous...

You have no idea how right you might just be.

Finland does something kinda nifty. Every Able Bodied young man MUST serve at least 1 year I think it might even require some reserve time but I'm not 100% sure.

For that, they get a 4 year college education Paid For. I'm not sure if there are GPA requirements, but that would be a good thing. I'd love it if we could do that.


This would handle two problems. 1. It would fix the shortfall in Military recruiting and 2 would eliminate lots of student loan debt. WIN WIN

Not sure how they handle NON able Bodied young men, but I'd hope for a fully paid education.

As for young ladies, I would think the same deal can be made for them...

https://www.goarmy.com/benefits/while-you-serve/education-training.html#:~:text=The%20GI%20Bill%20helps%20current,full%20tuition%20for%20their%20service.

LOAN REPAYMENT PROGRAM
Under the Loan Repayment Program (LRP), the Army can repay close to $65,000 of your current outstanding student loan debt. This program applies to active duty, Army Reserve, and Army National Guard Soldiers. There are a variety of requirements needed to qualify. Please talk to your recruiter for more information.

FEDERAL PERKINS LOAN CANCELLATION PROGRAM
The Federal Perkins Loan Cancellation Program gives active-duty Soldiers who have served in combat situations the chance to potentially cancel 100% of their Federal Perkins Loans or National Direct Student Loans. This benefit does not apply to Stafford loans or PLUS loans. Active-duty Soldiers serving at least one year in hostile fire or imminent danger pay areas are eligible for cancellation of their Federal Perkins Loan Program student loans.


GET YOUR POST-GRADUATE DEGREE
Soldiers interested in pursuing post-graduate education may be eligible to potentially receive 100% tuition coverage. Please talk to your recruiter for more information.

So let me get this straight. Military personnel have college dept? How can that be considering it’s been stated here they get a free education?

Some people go to college before joining the military.

Officer candidates who go to West point as an example have that paid for, but many go to colleges such as VMI or The Citadel come out with a unpaid commission. I would think the same for those who go the ROTC route in college.

So the statement “ If you want a free education, join the military” is not true at all. Go figure. We can’t even guarantee our military personnel a free and fair education even after they risked their lives for US. Pfff murica.

My vet brother went to Ohio State for free on the govt's dime. Same for masters. Although I think his masters was at a different college.

You don’t and this line of thinking is a sack of crap. You only pay the taxes you owe, that’s why there is a deficit. FFs, smh.