DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum What can we expect from DW?

Agree.

There is something about DTR I like. I hope the Browns keep him. I'm not sure how.

Can Berry make a deal similar to the Dobbs trade last year? I think Berry is better positioned to make such a deal this year.

I don't see us keeping both Huntley and Jameis on the roster going into week 1.

I've mentioned this before and I think it bears repeating simply as a reminder about Berry's roster construction. Since Berry has been here, they've only carried 2 QBs on the 53- man roster. That could change but pointing out the trend. Unless an injury happens, it most assuredly will be Watson and Jameis. Part of me thinks the team signed Huntley to possibly trade him late in the pre-season for late round draft capital (like Dobbs). I do find it hard to think Huntley would go unclaimed after being cut and more likely DTR would to where we could keep him on the PS.

The only way I see it is if Watson is unable to go week 1.

This notion people have that Huntley is good is bizarre. He’s not.

I agree with oob. Huntley will not be on the roster come week 1 barring an injury.

Context actually matters. People think he is a "good third string QB". Not as a starter and not as the primary back-up. Did you miss that part?

Seeing as all our other QBs are coming off injury, I think the "barring an injury" may already have happened. I wouldn't be surprised if we carry an extra QB as insurance.

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Same.

How did you decipher that?

I don't get this thing you have about Huntley. He wasn't brought in to start... he's a backup. He would've run circles around our backups (other than Flacco, who was a longtime starter) last year.

Hopefully this year the excuse train will stop choo choo choo'ing
For Watson. I've never seen so many excuses laid
Out for QB before on why he can't produce at a high level

I agree, but give it up Bone.

There is a percentage of fans who just don't like the guy and unless he has an MVP type season they will never be satisfied. Their minds are clouded and they can't tell the difference between reasons and excuses.

By their reasoning, Nick Chubb had a crappy season. Last year he gained 170 yards with zero TD's. How is that considered anything but pitiful??

Considering he’s only started 12 games out of 48 possible games. It’s a stretch to even contemplate that he’s ready to play at a high level. My expectations remain low. Our best QB option is unknown as usual.

Nobody is saying what you said. Watson hasn't performed close to his expected level of play in 3-years. The Browns gave him the first totally guaranteed contract with high expectations. How can you honestly say that people would consider Chubb's play last year pitiful because he was injured? Chubb, unlike Watson, was performing at a high-level prior to his injury. The comparison is just foolish. The thing about Watson is that he missed 27 games because of his own scummy off the field actions. Comparing that to an injured high performing player is a stretch by anyone's imagination. Those 27 games were not a reason or excusable due to them being self-inflicted.

Unlike some people on this board, I do not believe that Watson should get any leeway from performing at an elite level. He has the highest cap hit of any QB in the NFL this season and anything less than top 5 elite play is inexcusable. If the Browns wanted Mayfield type wins, production, and middle of the road play - they should have kept Mayfield. Instead, they went after top-5 elite with MVP capabilities and payed through the nose with draft picks and money. The Browns absolutely should expect nothing less than elite MVP play or the trade was a bust. Mayfield is doing his part outside of Cleveland. Did the Browns actually sign an elite top-5 QB or are they and the fans content with winning 11 games with Mayfield type numbers? If so, the Browns wasted their money and draft picks because they already had that type of player! Afterall, this board was flooded with claims of must have an elite QB top-5. Now you want to drop those expectations? That my friend is what is clouded.

I think all people are doing is looking at the games in which he did play. You can't judge performance on games that weren't played. He pretty much stunk things up until his last two starts. If people are being honest he looked pretty good in those last two games. Hopefully that's a sign of things to come.

But we won't know what we have in him until he can play an entire season. Here's to hoping we see that this year. Because no matter what a QB is capable of that doesn't help you if he can't stay on the field.

The Browns have had a dismal history with QB injuries year after year. We usually go 3 deep. Last year 4. It would be foolish not to expect more of the same this year. But maybe just maybe we won’t. The odds are against us tho.

I don't know about that. One could say that with all the injuries we've had at the QB position over the years we're past due to have a healthy QB for a while. I'm a firm believer that over time the odds will work out. And according to the odds we're overdue. So either I believe in the odds or otherwise I would have to believe in superstition and think the Browns are cursed.

Please clarify what you mean by this. Are you trying to say that Watson's overall body of work with the Browns is on a similar level with Chubb's? Do you think the performance Watson has shown when on the field is acceptable?

It's crucial that Watson has to outplay or make more plays
Then the other QB across the field on almost every Sunday.
Rarely has he outplayed the other teams QB in consecutive weeks.
He cannot be average this year. It's possible he may have peaked
As a QB 4 years ago in Houston
In other words his best might be behind him.

The thing you are not factoring is he doesn't need to outplay. In Houston, he was THE guy. In Cleveland, they have guys.

Things to consider:
1. More attempts, more chances for interceptions;
2. More sacks, a better chance of getting hurt.

Everyone is more concerned with him getting specific stat numbers to justify his contract.

Effectiveness, efficiency, and wins. When needed, is he reliable in pulling out a win running out the clock? Having the lead can he drain the clock to preserve the win? He doesn't need a 400-passing-yard average per game.

Maybe I misread your above comments, but I don't disagree at all. I don't have reservations about Watson. My point is don't try to argue with those who do. Most of them are pretty much not going to be satisfied with anything DW does.

Clarify what? The comment was used to illustrate the type of thinking some people use.

Of course Chubb didn't have a crappy season. He was hurt.

I think all fans are concerned with their QB’s stats to justify his contract. That’s the first thing a fan will say; he’s making all this money and he’s playing lousy.

Lousy Play? A QB actually needs to be playing to come to that conclusion . 12 games in 3 years only says that someone made a bad decision to sign him in the first place.

Who are "those/them"? What thus far has DW done on the field that everyone is supposed to approve of other than a game and a half? I would be thrilled to see him perform in line with his counterparts according to his level of pay. The same thing everyone else in society is expected to do. I've never seen a situation where a person is paid in the top five of their position who isn't expected to perform in the top five at that position. And other than excuses there's no reason to accept that.

Those people you're talking about are wrong, but going to the opposite extreme doesn't make you right.

Watson's play (with a few exceptions) doesn't pass the eye test, the smell test, etc. He's looked mediocre to downright bad far more than he's been good. He looked great vs the Titans, and that one second half vs the Ravens was pretty much perfect. While that is very positive and COULD indicate an upward trajectory in his play, it's nothing more than projection. His overall body of work on the field has not been good by most reasonable metrics.

Reporting and stating what he's done thus far isn't "how one wants to paint what he has done". And yes, what he does moving forward is the most important part. But let's stop pretending there is a small body of evidence to this point that has a lot of people having some cause to question him. That doesn't mean they'll be right but it does cause them to have questions and no matter what anyone says, it doesn't change what they've seen to this point.

So, you're saying that the acquisition of Watson and the high price paid with a fully guaranteed contract and multiple first round picks had nothing to do with his "body of work?" It appears that you believe that it makes no difference how one paints what he has done. If so, how did the Browns determine that Watson was their "must have guy?"

Unfortunately, as much as Watson's 4-year "body of work" was the basis for the Browns wanting to upgrade to him, his "body of work" over the last 3-years over 12-games doesn't come closer to matching the smell test. In fact, it could be easily said that not only has he been bad, the player ran out of town for him has outperformed him over the last 3-years.

As Pit said, "And yes, what he does moving forward is the most important part. But let's stop pretending there is a small body of evidence to this point that has a lot of people having some cause to question him. That doesn't mean they'll be right but it does cause them to have questions and no matter what anyone says, it doesn't change what they've seen to this point."

To date, Watson has collected 92M for mostly mediocre play or at a minimum poorer than our previous QB. Resetting the expectation level to just playing well is "NOT" what the Browns expected when they went all in on Watson. Watson has the highest cap charge of any QB in the NFL this season and anything less that top 5 elite play would just solidify that the trade was a horrible move for the franchise. This is year 4 since Watson had anything close to a good season playing QB. It could be said that he's just an average QB if he doesn't produce at an elite level this year after posting 4 good years and 4 bad. That will officially make the Browns move to get him a poor move. Hopefully, the conversation next off season isn't focused on running another QB out of town.

Context is important. When you say he went 3-3 some of the details matter.

The first start in 2022 was a win against the Texans while watson went 12-22 with 1 int. and 0 td's. The offense generated 6 points on two FG's. The rest of the points were scored by the ST's and D.

In bis second start, a loss, the Browns scored a total of 10 points.

In his third start which was a win the browns scored a total of 13 points.

I could go on but I think you get my point. You can point out the record and it looks good when you leave out all of the context.

Except our past QB has never had an 8-4 record as a starter. Our previous starting QB could not beat Lamar Jackson and Deshaun has never lost to Lamar. I don't know if Deshaun can still be a true franchise QB, but I do know our previous QB cannot be elite. This is a huge year for the Browns and Watson but if the Browns win games I don't care if Watson throws for 5,000 yards. All I care about is he wins games.

What I do know is talent has signed on to play for the Browns because of Watson and talent asked out because 0of our previous QB. His act wore thin, and the head coach and GM got tired of it and went a different route. They swung but we are yet to know if they hit yet. I like that they were willing to swing. If they miss, they will swing again in the future. If they hit, we will all be happy.

It's quite telling when a fanbase HOPES a QB can meet expectations
Especially when a team gave up the magnitude of picks
The Browns gave up.
In KC they expect Mahomes to get the Chiefs to the SB
In Cincy it's the same for Burrow ...In San Fran the fans expect
Purdy to get to the SB.
The reality is that the Browns front office thought the
Franchise was going to go as far as it could with Baker.
A playoff exit. No title game no nothing
The ascension of the Bengals reaching the SB made the
Browns front office rethink their QB situation
So they traded for a great individual talent at QB
But not a DIFFERENCE maker.
Watson simply did not deliver in Houston
If he can't take the Browns to the SB then the trade will
Go down as the worst in league history

In the realm of context, it's interesting that because Watson started and played 12 total plays before exiting already behind in the game that Watson is credited for the win against Indy last year when he actually had nothing to do with the win. As far as our past QB goes, you fail to remember that he went 11-5 as the starter in 2020 and on December 6th had the team at 9-3. To the best of my math skills, 9-3 is still better than 8-4 even giving Watson the unearned Indy win.

However, this is not about the former QB. What it is about is Watson not performing any better than our former QB at 46M per year thus far. Now we are in year 3 with the highest cap charge QB in the NFL and people are lowering their expectations of Watson to just manage the offense to get wins. We've went from having acquired a supposed top-5 elite QB to now having one we hope can play just well enough to get us wins.