Think what you want, I saw him slam her and her respond meekly. Does it matter though? Like I noted before, at this point, people know who they’re going to vote for, regardless of who yells at who/ argues with whomever on tv.
Yet I provided links showing the Pennsylvania Republicans, Republican officials and a Republican pollster all disagree with you. Even though we both know they don't want to do that. That's just how obvious it was.
I still haven't seen where "all the polls say trump is a ahead by six points" came from either. As a matter of fact after searching I can't find a single poll anywhere that says that.
As far as the gun comment that was my mistake. I was referring to a different poster.
And we do get it. No matter what trump does or says it doesn't make any difference to your and yours. That's been abundantly clear for quite some time.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Think what you want, I saw him slam her and her respond meekly. Does it matter though? Like I noted before, at this point, people know who they’re going to vote for, regardless of who yells at who/ argues with whomever on tv.
You totally underestimate the average American voter. Add a few million Swifties under trumps skin. People are seeing just how weak Trump is more and more every day. He has nothing on Harris but insults and lies. Pretty much what happens on this message board when a poster doesn’t have a leg to stand on here.
"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Thomas Jefferson.
Haitian families in Ohio under attack as racist claims spread As false claims spread, the more unsafe Haitian immigrants are feeling Haitian-American Macollvie J. Neel by Macollvie J. Neel Sep. 11, 2024 en English▼
Photo of a stranger walking to a Haitian family driveway in Springfield, Ohio. Courtesy Photo
FacebookTwitterWhatsAppEmailPrintShare Overview: Despite officials saying debunked claims by right-wing Republicans are unfounded, many Haitians are feeling physically unsafe as the falsehoods spread online and offline. Meanwhile, the parents of a child killed last year by a Haitian immigrant said politicians like Trump should stop using their child for political gain.
Ford Foundation This story is part of the Haitians in America series looking at Haitians and Haitian Americans across the United States. Financial support for this work is provided by the Ford Foundation.
The morning after former President Donald Trump repeated racist claims about Haitians in Springfield, Ohio, some Haitian families are keeping their children home from school for their safety, according to an area activist. Those who allowed their children did so, but with heavy hearts.
“She [my niece] was scared, but I told her to go, that God would protect,” said one Haitian resident, who asked that she not be identified publicly for fear of reprisal.
“We’re all victims this morning,” said the woman, who moved to Springfield six years ago. “They’re attacking us in every way.”
Aside from the anxiety caused by Tuesday night’s debate, the woman also said her cars have been vandalized twice in the middle of the night. She woke up one morning to broken windows and another to acid thrown on the vehicle. She’s added cameras to her driveway and tried to report the incidents to the police to no avail.
“I’m going to have to move because this area is no longer good for me,” she said. “I can’t even leave my house to go to Walmart. I’m anxious and scared.”
The families’ accounts, shared with The Haitian Times under conditions of confidentiality, are the latest tales of intimidation, bullying and assaults against Haitians as anti-Haitian sentiment has gone viral.
Springfield police referred calls about reports of crimes against immigrants to an employee who has yet to return a message from The Haitian Times as of Wednesday afternoon.
“People are very afraid for their lives,” Pierrelus said. “Many families are starting to leave Springfield last night and some kids aren’t even going to school because of fear of being attacked.”
In interviews over the past week and through a Zoom call of concerned Haitians rapidly organized by Haiti’s Minister of Haitians Living Abroad on Tuesday, local Haitians continue to share instances of bullying, intimidation that the city is not addressing.
“The reality is that these are people’s lives,” said J. Sylus, a Columbus-based Haitian woman who asked that her name not be used out of fear for her own safety.
“I understand the focus on the political, but what’s important is the safety and security of our brethren, our people, who have left their country,” Sylus said.
Over the past few months, nearly 20,000 Haitians have settled in Springfield over the past four years. Industries that have struggled with labor shortages have welcomed the Haitian workforce, according to published reports. However, the rapid shift has caused much strain on local agencies and facilities, including hospitals and schools.
The arrival of new immigrants in Ohio has also become an election issue, often driven by false claims vilifying the newcomers. In August, a white supremacists held an anti-Haitian demonstration during a music festival. City officials removed a white supremacist group’s leader from a meeting after he delivered “a word of warning” against allowing Haitian immigrants to settle in the community. The following week, vice presidential nominee J.D. Vance tweeted a debunked racist theory about Haitians in the stat that The Haitian Times is choosing not to repeat. In between, Haitians have seen a rise in threats against them on digital platforms such as Facebook community groups and in real life.
Some established residents have complained about quality of life issues as well. In particular, they have accused Haitians of being reckless drivers after a child – Aiden Clark, 11 – was killed when his school bus and a car driven by a Haitian man collided last December.
Haitians and some established residents, including the child’s parents, have said the death is being used as an excuse to perpetrate racist attacks. At a city commission meeting held earlier in the night of the debate, picketers held up signs saying “no more” alongside signs of Trump’s face, Aiden’s parents begged for people to stop using their son’s death for political gain.
A screengrab of the Clarks, whose son was Aiden, was killed in 2023 by a Haitian immigrant, fueling tensions and hatred of immigrants in Springfield and beyond. “Using Aiden as a political tool is, to say the least, reprehensible for any political purpose,” Nathan Clark, the boy’s father, said. “They make it seem as though our wonderful Aiden appreciates your hate that we should follow their hate. Morally bankrupt politicians – Bernie Moreno, Chip Roy, J.D. Vance and Donald Trump – they have spoken my son’s name and used his death for political gain.
“They can vomit all the hate they want about illegal immigrants, the Border crisis and even untrue claims about fluffy pets being ravaged and eaten by community members,” Clark continued. “However they are not allowed nor have they ever been allowed to mention Aiden Clark from Springfield Ohio.
“Please stop the hate,” Clark said.
Sylus had attended that commission meeting, where many long-time residents spoke about their fear of new immigrants. As she walked out, she also saw a picket with some people holding the pro-Trump signs.
“This is a unique opportunity to create a meaningful change by addressing cultural divides and helping our community grow with actionable plans that will foster understanding, integration, and support,” Sylus said. “The Haitian community as a whole, not just here in Springfield or Lima or Columbus, [to] set the standard by the response that we give to the world.”
As of Wednesday morning, however, as Trump’s debate night comments further roiled the country, Haitian families were left feeling unprotected and having to take matters into their own hands.
Philomene Philostin, a Haitian business owner, is among them. That morning, she was on her way to see an attorney about attempts to evict her from the place of business she had operated. The multi-service store owner told The Haitian Times she was seeking counsel because she suspects the eviction attempt was due to rising anti-Haitian sentiment.
“They’re trying to push me out, but this is my home,” said Philostin, who lived in Florida previously. “I set up my home, my store to be here. I’m not going anywhere.
And we do get it. No matter what trump does or says it doesn't make any difference to your and yours. That's been abundantly clear for quite some time.
Likewise for you and any blue candidate.
I prefer lower gas prices, lower food prices, a secure border, and support for Israel.
You and the rest of the blue crew could care less about prosperous USA, and will vote for whoever the democrats tell you to vote for. A couple months back, you were supporting Biden and were prepared to vote for him.
Thanks to dems the USA is a laughingstock to the rest of the world.
Why are we harboring Haitians in this country? Teach them some farming skills and send them back. No reason why Haitians can’t develop their own country. Make Haiti beautiful like some parts of the Dominican.
The vast majority of those Haitian immigrants in Springfield from every report I have seen are here legally. You can't "harbor" someone with legal status. Or are you now going to rail against immigrants who have legal status to be here?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Hmmm. Not according to what I’ve read. But hey, there’s plenty of ways that you can assist them. Lots of places in Springfield accept donations. Here’s an article for your reading pleasure. As it turns out, the actual residents of Springfield are in undue hardship because of the dems. But true to form, none of you who support this crap ever have to experience it firsthand.
Springfield, Ohio, resident sounded the alarm about the city's Haitian migrant surge, "If it took something like this to get the spotlight flashed on us, then so be it. We've needed help for several years, and maybe we're going to finally get it. The sad thing is, it's more of my money being spent on a problem that we did not create."
Thousands of Haitians have arrived in Springfield since the COVID-19 pandemic, and residents have been pointing to an uptick in crime, mayhem and car crashes due to the massive influx of new residents. In a town of 58,000 people, about 20,000 Haitians have arrived, according to city officials.
Residents have pushed back on the influx, sharing outrage at the ongoing surge during recent city council meetings to demand action on the issue. warning her community is like a "dystopian nightmare" as it struggles to provide basic resources for taxpayers.
Springfield resident Diana Daniels joined "Fox & Friends" to describe what life has been like in recent years since thousands of Haitians have been transported to their city, starving it of resources like housing and health care, while also having an impact on public safety.
It's like living in a dystopian nightmare," Daniels told Lawrence Jones on Thursday. "You hope you wake up and it's 2019 again, and then you realize it's 2024, and it's the same thing over and over again, day after day. It's hard sometimes to get up in the morning and hear residents that I've known for years struggle. This is a paycheck-to-paycheck… kind of town… working class. The citizens that depend on our social services like health care, the Rocking Horse [Community Health Center], going down to the Social Security office for benefits are waiting in line, and they're not getting the services they need."
"It breaks my heart to see people that I taught and their children experiencing this, so I took it upon myself to make sure that I showed up at every City Commission meeting pleading our case," she continued.
"If it took something like this to get the spotlight flashed on us, then so be it. We've needed help for several years, and maybe we're going to finally get it. The sad thing is, it's more of my money being spent on a problem that we did not create."
Thousands of Haitians have arrived in Springfield since the COVID-19 pandemic, and residents have been pointing to an uptick in crime, mayhem and car crashes due to the massive influx of new residents. In a town of 58,000 people, about 20,000 Haitians have arrived, according to city officials.
Residents have pushed back on the influx, sharing outrage at the ongoing surge during recent city council meetings to demand action on the issue. “
Let me know when any "blue candidate" I support tries to undermine and overthrow our election. Let me know when one of "blue candidates" I support has been convicted by a jury on 34 felony counts or when a jury has found them to have committed sexual assault. Let me know when one of the "blue candidates" I support openly says he is going to pardon the very people that on Jan 6th interrupted the peaceful transfer of power through violence and criminal activity.
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I prefer lower gas prices, lower food prices, a secure border, and support for Israel.
As has been pointed out to you time and time again, inflation after covid was global. From nations with liberal governments to conservative governments. Not that facts matter to you. But I understand you have been trained to look at it under a microscope as it applies only to this country and not with a telescope to see it was a global issue that nations around the globe couldn't escape. Gas prices have gone way down, inflation has gone way down and you keep pretending it's 2021.
Please explain to me how trump is going to make people charge you less for the things you are buying.
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You and the rest of the blue crew could care less about prosperous USA, and will vote for whoever the democrats tell you to vote for. A couple months back, you were supporting Biden and were prepared to vote for him.
If you mean I would vote for almost anyone who did not try to overthrow our election, a convicted felon and a sexual predator, you are right. Or almost anyone who will not give immunity to those who assaulted police officers on Jan. 6th and committed other crimes on that day you would be right.
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Thanks to dems the USA is a laughingstock to the rest of the world.
Another repeated trumpian lie. You have been programmed to believe everything he says no matter what lies he keeps telling you.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
Nothing in that article even suggest they are there illegally. Just a few of the highlights based on an article from a non bias source......
How Haitian immigrants fueled Springfield's growth
What didn't happen, according to interviews with a dozen local, county and officials as well as city police data, was any general rise in violent or property crime. Wages didn't collapse, but surged with a rising number of job openings in a labor market that remained tight until recently.
More recently, Vance and other Republicans have amplified false claims aired by some residents at weekly city commission meetings. City commissioners in their public comments have pushed back, noting that the vast majority of Haitians are in the country legally and have a right to live where they choose.
Springfield police also responded forcefully: "There have been no credible reports or specific claims of pets being harmed, injured or abused by individuals within the immigrant community," they said in a statement. "Additionally, there have been no verified instances of immigrants engaging in illegal activities such as squatting or littering in front of residents' homes."
I get that many people care about abortion. I think a lot of people realize that the President has more pressing concerns and other areas are more relevant in a day to day sense. Abortions are already protected in some Blue states. People need to able to afford food, gas, and housing. Most people don't necessarily need to be able to get an abortion. Sure, they'd like the option, but I think it is not the greatest reason to vote for someone.
If that's the argument, it's an incredibly short-sighted one.
Somebody who already can't afford food, gas, housing is gonna be in 10x worse situation if they are forced to bring a child (even a healthy child, nevermind one that will require significant life-sustaining treatment not to mention potential health-complications for the mother).
"I'll take your word at face value. I have never met you but I assume you have a face..lol"
I get that many people care about abortion. I think a lot of people realize that the President has more pressing concerns and other areas are more relevant in a day to day sense. Abortions are already protected in some Blue states. People need to able to afford food, gas, and housing. Most people don't necessarily need to be able to get an abortion. Sure, they'd like the option, but I think it is not the greatest reason to vote for someone.
If that's the argument, it's an incredibly short-sighted one.
Somebody who already can't afford food, gas, housing is gonna be in 10x worse situation if they are forced to bring a child (even a healthy child, nevermind one that will require significant life-sustaining treatment not to mention potential health-complications for the mother).
Who says you have to keep the kid? Put it up for adoption. There are plenty of people who can't have kids that would love to adopt a child. The waiting list to adopt babies can be years.
Because we have such an effective and efficient system of adopting out children. And that does nothing for the woman who's pregnancy could have longer-term health impact.
Keep in mind, I was responding to Bull's example of financial stability being the more important topic to tackle. I think that's a short-sighted approach.
"I'll take your word at face value. I have never met you but I assume you have a face..lol"
Because we have such an effective and efficient system of adopting out children. And that does nothing for the woman who's pregnancy could have longer-term health impact.
Keep in mind, I was responding to Bull's example of financial stability being the more important topic to tackle. I think that's a short-sighted approach.
You can whine and complain all you want, but it doesn't change the fact that there are many people who would love to adopt an unwanted child. If a woman doesn't want to be pregnant she and he should use birth control. Killing babies is not a fall back plan.
So Trump beat Biden in the first debate, beat Kamala in the second debate, and now she won’t agree to a debate hosted by Fox? She was supposed to debate him on Fox weeks ago and didn’t even show.
Unreal. I don’t blame him for not debating her when the only debates that she’ll participate in are on her terms.
Fox won't allow her to rehearse her answers for two weeks and promise not to ask follow-up questions. Fox won't attack her opponent for 90 minutes while she sits there with a stupid smirk on her face. If it were on Fox she would have to show she's (1) qualified, (2)accountable, so we know that won't go down.
I get that many people care about abortion. I think a lot of people realize that the President has more pressing concerns and other areas are more relevant in a day to day sense. Abortions are already protected in some Blue states. People need to able to afford food, gas, and housing. Most people don't necessarily need to be able to get an abortion. Sure, they'd like the option, but I think it is not the greatest reason to vote for someone.
If that's the argument, it's an incredibly short-sighted one.
Somebody who already can't afford food, gas, housing is gonna be in 10x worse situation if they are forced to bring a child (even a healthy child, nevermind one that will require significant life-sustaining treatment not to mention potential health-complications for the mother).
Somebody that can't afford the basics is likely to have health complications if they get pregnant regardless of whether or not they have the baby. To me, we should promote avoiding the pregnancy rather than how to get rid of the "problem" after the fact.
Abortions aren't a good thing no matter how you spin it. Perhaps they're the less bad thing, but only if one is positioned that those are the choices they have. It's best to avoid that position.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
Me either. One public flogging in front of 58 million viewers is quite enough. Self preservation is instinctual, not intellectual. The schoolyard bully got his clock cleaned on the playground by the nerdy girl who actually did the homework. In front of the entire school.
"They're eating the dogs!" What a 78 year-old brain-fart meltdown.
Stupidest thing I've ever heard in any presidential debate.. and he's been in 6 others before Tuesday night.
Backing out, tail between legs is the right call..
I fit in the middle, not affiliated with any party and have voted both ways in the past. I have not and will never vote for Trump.
Ummm… then you don’t fit in the middle. And you prove my point that there is no middle with this election.
I see no reason why anyone would vote for Kamala. She’s done nothing over the last 4 years and is clearly over her head.
However, if you’re hatred for the Donald outweighs your desire to have an improved economy, secure border, and a reasonable level of respect from the rest of the world, then hey, have at it.
Umm, he won the debate. Not sure what some of you are watching here.
You may not be certain what I watched, but here are some quotes from others who watched the same debate I did:
"It was a big missed opportunity in not defining Harris. All the pressure was on Harris to prove that she was up for the job... Harris succeeded, partly because Trump was so ineffective." -Mike DuHaime, GOP political consultant'/former political director, RNC
"Debates are the most important moments in presidential politics. Very little else can change the direction of a race. Not only did (Trump) miss an opportunity, she seized hers." -Alex Conant, Marco Rubio staffer/surrogate
"Will this debate have an effect? Yes, though perhaps not as much as Team Harris hopes or as much as Team Trump fears. But there's no putting lipstick on this pig. Mr. Trump got crushed by a woman he previously dismissed as 'dumb as a rock.; What does that make him?" -Karl Rove, GOP strategist
"I think there were times when he got frustrated, but you would get frustrated is somebody lied about what you said, lied about how you made your money and lied about how you got your start. What we learned (Tuesday) is Kamala Harris is pretty good at needling people." -Byron Donalds, R-FLA
"It's certainly a missed opportunity, it's a swinging strike. He had an opportunity to at least demonstrate to people in the middle that he's the candidate who will bring back a sense of order, and he didn't do that In fact, I think Harris succeeded in that better, at least in terms of her presentation" -Paul Dame, Vermont GOP chair
"It was a candidate in trouble we saw last night... without a question." -David Jolly, former GOP congressman
So, don't take my word for it, Muni. Take the words of folks on Team Trump who saw the same spectacle I (...and 53 million other American citizens) saw.
Perhaps it's time for you to see your Opthamologist for a new eyeglass prescription. While you're at it, I suggest an appointment with your audiologist- because it's patently obvious that you heard things the rest of America did not.
"I think there were times when he got frustrated, but you would get frustrated is somebody lied about what you said, lied about how you made your money and lied about how you got your start. What we learned (Tuesday) is Kamala Harris is pretty good at needling people." -Byron Donalds, R-FLA
If you're explainin', your mojo is wanin'. If your people are excusin'.... your azz is losin'.
See what you want. That is your prerogative. Everyone else saw what was/is.
KH wasn't great in that debate, by any standard I hold. On that night, she didn't really have to be. Her opponent was just that bad.
"They're eating the dogs!"
But do go on, with yo bad self: convince us all (and yourself) how DJT 'crushed' a debate that numerous Lifetime GOP Team Players say he squandered... while crapping a bed of his own making.
Bring something back to the conversation, Dawg. I openly invite lively political discourse.
I fit in the middle, not affiliated with any party and have voted both ways in the past. I have not and will never vote for Trump.
Ummm… then you don’t fit in the middle. And you prove my point that there is no middle with this election.
I see no reason why anyone would vote for Kamala. She’s done nothing over the last 4 years and is clearly over her head.
However, if you’re hatred for the Donald outweighs your desire to have an improved economy, secure border, and a reasonable level of respect from the rest of the world, then hey, have at it.
...Donald Trump and reasonable level of respect from the rest of the world just don't seem to belong in the same sentence. Honestly, they probably don't belong on the same planet.
I can see the view of Kamala, but it could just as easily apply to Trump when he was in office. Clearly over his head and didn't actually do most of what he said he would.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
I know that my food costs were lower under Trump, I know that my gas costs were lower under Trump, I know that Israel was safer under Trump, and I know that immigration was under much better control under Trump.
As for Kamala and Joe, none of the aforementioned aspects of life are true. In fact nothing is better under them.
Imagine that, we weren't focused on immigration during a pandemic and lockdown.
Gas prices were lower when the demand was down because people were staying home. People want to travel again so prices are up. Prices go where people will pay them. Do you think Trump is going to do anything to limit corporate profits?
Food prices didn't go up due to politics. Prices went up due to greed and decades of lousy agricultural practices.
The greed isn't going to go away with Trump.
What is Trump going to do about Israel? Israel is a powder keg. It has been since the Jews were settled there.
We need cooler heads with actionable plans. Not a devious blowhard with a Napoleon complex.
You mess with the "Bull," you get the horns. Fiercely Independent.
Easy to say gas prices were down when global demand was shot. Nobody was traveling because…now this may shock you…but there was a global pandemic that meant nobody was traveling.
But if you get to claim that as a good thing, then I get to blame him for losing $75,000 a year in salary because I had to take a different job with live entertainment going away during that same timeframe. It wasn’t until Biden came into office that I got my old job back. Heck, it wasn’t until this year that I started making as much money as I was before because some of my freelance clients went under during the pandemic.
I do suppose you are right that there it no middle this time around, as several from the right have pledged support for Kamala. You have the far right vs the far left all the way past the middle and into the right.
Trump has never once won the popular vote and you expect a landslide when even the right is supporting Kamala? That must be some special Kool Aid.
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/fkjZc8B/Bull-Dawg-Sig-smaller.jpg)
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