DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Palus Politicus Question for professed Christians

Everything written here could be used to describe a virtual world coming into existence from a developer/creator. And, actually, so can the scientific view of the Big Bang.
At first, on Monday, there was nothing.... RAM was empty, until the Creator booted the server and loaded up the modelling space and created the 3d environment.
Then, He created the Earth, but it was just a series of points with no texture or other models on it.
Then, he added a light source for shadows, but he got creative and made it move, and made Earth move around it, etc....

We're all just NPCs and those people we all know that are crazy good at something are likely PCs being controlled by some kid in another world showing off with a controller, and when someone dies unexpectedly, the person controlling them actually just rage quit.

But, if this were true, you'd expect to find some evidence somewhere, like maybe detect the universe doing the sort of artifact that only happens inside a computer.



#WeAreLivingInASim

That's not a failing with religion, though. That's a problem with those people who would pervert, misrepresent, and manipulate things for themselves.

You show your ignorance by posting things like this:







I'm no Bible expert. I do know that:

The Bible is full of things that can be interpreted multiple ways. You claiming you alone have the only way to know the intentions of what is written is ignorant and prideful.

I know that claiming your way of being a Christian is the only way to be a Christian is ignorant and prideful.

Claiming your argument is irrefutable when interpreting a book that contains known text and even words whose meaning can be debated - is ignorant and prideful.

Claiming others don't comprehend or can't follow along because your argument is weak - is ignorant and prideful.

Claiming people whose arguments you have never heard or debated with are often poor debaters or lack a point - or fail to understand Gods word - is ignorant and prideful.

Claiming Hitchens was a wannabe Bible scholar - is beyond ignorant and prideful.

Yeah - I am no Bible expert - I did see that the first person to date the earth using the Bible was Archbishop James Ussher. Maybe you should spend some time belittling him and boasting some more?

At the end of the day the Bible is a work of fiction written by man - just like the Quran, The Tanakh, The Rig Veda and others ... and if any were the word of God, his message got corrupted by man in the process of writing it. ALL contain many words and phrases that are open to interpretation and debate. Claiming you alone know how to interpret the Bible does exactly make you sound like a cultist and a zealot - and ignorant and prideful.

Question for you - doesn't the Bible preach against pride? And when someone is prideful again and again and again, boasting and belittling - does the sin get compounded? Is it the same sin? If you do it once you may as well continue to do it ? Or with each new show of pride does it multiply the sin. Right here in this thread you've shown an awful lot of pride in multiple posts? What does the Bible teach you in this situation?

To quote you Hitchens ... 😊 ""Then I'd say that something that provides such effective cover for those atrocities should be viewed with at least suspicion."

a. Can you give me an example of a passage that can be interpreted multiple ways?

b. Saying that I claim that my way of being a Christian is the only way is a straw man. I never said it. In fact, I have fellowshipped and served With people of many different denominations.

c. The word beginning is pretty straightforward. I don’t think it’s very difficult to know what beginning means and to know that Genesis 1;1 Is the temporal beginning of the passage not Genesis 1:3. If you Have an alternate meaning for beginning that you would like to suggest, feel free.

d. Saying that a. The beginning of creation is mentioned in Genesis 1:1 and the first day is in verse 3 and in between is verse 2…and

b. We don’t know how long verse 2 was…and

c. Therefore we cannot assuredly date the earth using the Bible

Is pretty straight forward.

d. I’ve been called an uneducated @&£hat and a guy who lives in my dead mother’s basement, and you didn’t complain about that. You called me “Stiffy”. I’m sorry you boys can dish out but yourselves can’t handle criticism.

e. I do not critique people that I’ve never read. I was speaking of atheists that I’ve heard or listened to. You’re making things up.

e. Where did Hitchens study Koine Greek? Where did he study Hebrew? How about Aramaic? If you don’t know Biblical languages, hard to be a scholar.

f. the first person that tried to date the Earth lived almost 1600 years after Christ. That should tell you something right there.

g. People here like to play dirty and call people names and accuse people of living in their dead mother’s basement and call people uneducated—-hats. Then, when someone gets a little testy with you or pokes you, You become righteously indignant. Maybe you should read the Bible. John the Baptist called people “brood of vipers”. Peter compared people to dogs with to return to their vomit.

My argument on Genesis 1:1 can only be refuted if we change the meaning of the word beginning, Which I would not be surprised if someone tried to do that.

You've been exposed - and now are deflecting.

A few additional points - I never called you stiffy. I don't know who called you an names or said you lev in a basement. And it's not my job to complain about that. Do you need a protector?

As for dishing it out and not taking it - again, no expert but isn't Jesus and the bible about love and forgiveness? Isn't there something about turning the other cheek?

As for Jesus trying to date the earth - you'll have to show me that part of the bible because that's something I never heard before.

"People here like to play dirty and call people names and accuse people of living in their dead mother’s basement and call people uneducated—-hats" -- Gas light much? I never said you lived in a basement or talked about your mother or call you uneducated .... but there you go again lumping everyone together.

"Where did Hitchens study Koine Greek? Where did he study Hebrew? How about Aramaic?" - Gaslight much? No-one said or claimed any of those things.



Your pride is a serious problem I can see. I'll let you crack on and deflect and change the subject again but I'm out - my work here is done. You've been exposed.

Actually, the way that the Bible describes creation is nothing like a computer model. It’s more like a building a house, because it describes God first taking unformed matter (except He created the matter) then forming a house, complete with electricity, plumbing, etc. and then putting occupants in it , filling it.

That’s how Genesis one is. In verse one, God creates the matter. In verse two, The matter is unformed. During the first three days God begins forming the world preparing it to be inhabited. At first, the earth is and empty and unable to sustain life. Gof lights it up on day one and then begins forming the atmosphere, oceans, etc day 2-3. Day four, God puts luminaries in the expanded sky . (I’m surprised no one brought up this one, I was waiting for someone to mention the sun on day four. ) But Remember, The Heaven and Earth were created in verse 1. If you read some Jewish Rabbis and also some Christians who are more lettered in Hebrew, you will find that some hold that the luminaries were created on day one, but Did not become visible in the firmament sky until day four.

There are two words in genesis one that describe God creative act These words are bara and Asah. Bara means create and asah means to make as in forming or assembling. The heavens and the earth were created in Genesis 1:1 and formed on days 2-3, the appointing of the luminaries on day 4 and the Kosmos was filled in days 5-6 or possibly days 4-6.

This is from a careful exegesis of scripture, and there are theologians and Rabbis who agree, because the Hebrew strongly indicates it.

I am not fluent in Hebrew, but I consult those who are and I know some Hebrew. I also have studied Koine Greek, but do not claim to be a scholar.

Your ad hominem are not strengthening anyone’s arguments. But you are right, you did not call me Stiffy, I apologise for the mistake. Perfect spiral called me Stiffy You did not call me uneducated &@£-hat, And I didn’t say you did. You also did not call me a red pill guy who lives in his Mothers basement. I never said you did But I apologise for the mistake on Stiffy

You took issue with me calling Hitchens wannabe Bible scholar. Well, he runs around trying to acct like an expert in something he is not trained in. Kind of like malpractice

The only thing negative I said to you was that maybe you don’t comprehend my post or the actual question was posed. If you want to say that I’m a horrible person for that, You must think that the other people that accuse me of living in my dead mothers basement and called me an uneducated £&@-hat are dreadful.

You did not show comprehension in one of your replies. Someone claimed that the Bible teaches that the Earth is 7000 years old. I refuted that and then you came back and something along the lines of the stuff I believe in is absurd or something. I’ll have to go back and look it up. So you did not comprehend the original question because you did not read it carefully.

Calls people ignorant and calls foul when someone says he didn’t comprehend an exchange.

What projection.

🤣

Yes, if you properly define time.

a. : the measured or measurable period during which an action, process, or condition exists or continues : duration. b. : a nonspatial continuum that is measured in terms of events which succeed one another from past through present to future.
https://www.merriam-webster.com › ...
Time Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster

Again, No. But you carry on. And calling out your ignorant statements and labeling them as such isn't name calling.

"I can't tell if you are .... " isn't really name calling either. It's passive aggressive, yes.

You mentioned 'self righteous' in another post - and I'd warrant anyone coming to this thread and reading it from the start would agree you do come across as self righteous and sanctimonious. And boastful too - which is that Pride thing I asked you about that you never answered.

Yes, if you properly defined time

a. : the measured or measurable period during which an action, process, or condition exists or continues : duration. b. : a nonspatial continuum that is measured in terms of events which succeed one another from past through present to future.
https://www.merriam-webster.com › ...
Time Definition

How could they tell us how Old rocks and bones are that existed before humans if Time did not exist before humans😀

Where did I Call someone self-righteous? Let’s see the post.

Questioning someone’s comprehension of a post or question is not name-calling or ad hominem either. So what’s your beef? 🤔

Do you know what arrogant is? Calling someone ignorant on a topic when you’re discussing a topic that you know very little about. You’re not a Bible scholar you’re not even a Bible student and you call me ignorant when I’m talking about the Bible. That’s arrogant Questioning Hitchen’s credentials on the Bible is not arrogant, Because he had none. He’s entitled to his opinion, but it’s not an educated opinion or I should say it’s not a biblically literate opinion. Your posts are not biblically literate. Perfect spiral posts are not biblically literate. So you to call me ignorant when I am explaining a text obviously, you have done nothing more than a cursory glance at is arrogance. So, you’re kind of projecting, pal.

Let’s see if you can produce that post where I called someone self-righteous. If you can’t produce it then you can admit it, just like I admitted when I was wrong about you calling me stiffy. 😀

Also, if you can show me one place where I called another poster a name, I will apologize. So feel free. If you can’t, then ill disregard your criticisms, as clearly you have been far more argumentative than I have.

The only question worth talking about is why would anyone vote for Trump.., A guy that thinks Hitlers generals should be what we have here. The rest of your rant means NOTHING.. They are the meanderings of a strange man.

Irrelevant.
But please provide a source and citation for your Trump claim.

You will vote for a woman that wants to take away peoples religious freedom and freedom to act according to conscience

Oh, I see Kelly said that

With all the lies that I’ve documented on the other thread about all the lies that the Democrats told about Trump you’re You’re going to bring that. 🤣
Lies.

Trump told people to inject bleach. Lie


Trump called white supremacist fine people. Lie

Trump called coronavirus a hoax. Lie

Lafayette Square was shut down for a Photo Op for Trump. Lie

Quoting Trump saying get your people to fight without including context that indicated that he was talking about senators Deceptive


Hunter Biden’s laptop being Russian disinformation. Lie


Using photos from 2014 As if they were current to protest cages on the border Obama had built. Deceptive

Using video footage of Eric Trump watching people gather at the Trump rally Before the speech on January 6 and claiming it was a video of him watching the event at the capital that happened. Bald faced lie.

I could go on, but that should suffice.

I'll let you tell me how becoming righteously indignant doesn't equate or mean the same thing as self righteous.

But it's all good. I see you for what u are.

And no, I've not once said anything about you being ignorant regards to the Bible. I followed along just fine on the age of the earth and was aware how 6000 years was arrived at and why it's not commonly believed to be accurate by most Christians. I called you ignorant on the miriad of other statements. Some I've spelled out and you choose to deflect. All good. You do you.

Maybe look indignation up in the dictionary. Righteous indignation is not the same as self righteous. It could mean justifiable anger at an injustice or anger at An imagined injustice

So what post were you talking about when You said “ With every post you show how ignorant you are more and more” or something like that. Which post were you were referring to?

Do you have an instance where I called somebody a Name? I asked you and you did not answer. Would you please answer now? Can you provide me with a place where I called someone a name or is it just a matter of questioning whether you comprehended a part of the conversation. Your post where you said I was ignorant was immediately after the post about Genesis one and my explanation of part of it and you said “with every post..”. Maybe you didn’t see that particular post As Pos so I can ask you well what post were you talking about? What post prompted that reply?

You can answer or not whether you answer or not, I’m pretty much done talking with you because it is clear that all you wanna do is argue and I’m not interested anymore with arguing with you. It’s become quite a bore. You’re just going around in circles and repeating everything you’re saying and everything you’re saying is projection and everything you’re saying is argumentative so you’re really not much, addition to the conversation. tTherefore unless you talk about something relevant, I will no longer reply to you

Unless also if you can show a quote where you think I called someone a name and then I will either explain it as in your imagination or if it is true I will apologise to that person for calling them a name

Put up or in regards to you, I will shut up.

Well, I’ll tell you what I’ve been on a lot of message boards and the replies by opposers here have been by far the weakest, most impotent, most unchallenging replies I’ve ever encountered. I can think of about 10 things that would’ve challenged me and would have caused me to Work hard to answer and none of you brought them up.

Then again this is not supposed to be a debate on Christianity. This was a simple question for Christians. No I know I can’t tell people what to post and I can’t control the discussion, but really it’s been an anemic showing by most of the replies.

There was a few good replies, but the rest were mostly chaff. PS, I’m only talking about the people that only came on here to argue and hijack the thread. Which was about 90%

PS, someone accused me of putting everyone in the same bunch or category when I talked about name-calling and ad hominem. It actually wasn’t true but it’s kind of ironic that he said that, because that’s what many of you have been doing with Christians by focusing on the bad parts of Christianity and the atrocities of professed Christianity which do exist, But to focus on them exclusively and ignore the topic of the OP and to ignore the many goods that genuine Christianity has done like build hospitals build schools feed the poor people overcome addictions, et cetera ) is the same thing as me saying that people on this thread have committed homonyms and insults and then calling. Actually, it’s more of a broad brush, because I did not characterize all of you this way.

So you all just completely discarded Christianity and the Bible and and Jesus teachings because of the atrocities of Pseudo Christianity. I expect this from atheists, but I don’t expect it from Christians If you are a Christian and you reply to this thread by speaking of atrocities committed by Pseudo Christians to argue against the OP, it really only demonstrates one thing, that your answer to the question “do you believe the teachings of Jesus or the teachings of the secular world” is that you believe in the teachings of the secular world and reject some of Christ’s teachings. In particular, in regards to the two topics mentioned.

It’s expected for atheist to do this, it’s shocking yet Not unexpected for professed Christians to do this. it’s not unexpected because the Bible said it would happen

It's turtles all the way down.

It’s more like a contractor and builder of a house, as I explained in my reply.

Just turtles.

Of the teenage mutant ninja variety?

The idea of we are just constructs being controlled but another construct leads to the question who is controlling that construct which beats an infinite number of constructs, or turtles all the way down.

Turtles all the way down.

That might have been an argument, except God is not a construct.

Is it the “who made God” thingie? That would be a category error.

Did Hitchens use that fallacy?

Infinite regress cannot be tested, so it is not a valid hypothesis, is it?

It would be a matter of nothing more than belief.

Do you feel left out that my response was not directed to your arguments?

Believing the word of Jesus and believing the word of Stffarm aren't the same thing no matter what your claim is.

You have addressed the things you have chosen to and ignored the things you can't defend.

You have been shown multiple reasons why there are so many in the world that reject Christianity. Why they refuse to believe in God or Jesus. Even Christianity has many denominations within it because they can't agree on what the Bible teaches and exactly the message Jesus gave. You have been shown how the Christian religion keeps and endorses pagan customs in the man made holidays they have created and stamp their seal of approval on them by wrapping their Christian arms around them in support. You have been shown how the bulk of Christianity in America promotes a man lead this nation who is the very antithesis of everything Jesus said we should be. The very opposite of the morals we teach our own children. How many people have been killed in the name of God.

Religion taught by man is nothing more than a twisting and bastardized version of Christianity. The reason why there are so many denominations in Christianity is because even they can't agree on the teachings of Jesus. That would certainly indicate you are no expert on it either.

I'm not quite sure what point you think you're making here. Sadly if you can't own up to and accept the flaws in Christianity, if you can't accept that much of the Bible can be interpreted in many different ways, you'll never manage to get outside of your own bubble.

I've given you the reasons, which are valid why I believe in the word of Jesus but organized religion is a sham. But since you seem to find that offensive and outside of your comfort zone, you label me otherwise. I think the bible addresses that as well.

Or are you still going to defend the vile words that come out of his mouth daily?

Are you still going to blame others for the felony counts a jury convicted him of?

Are you still going to point fingers at his victim who a jury found he sexually assaulted?

Are you still going to defend his charity that ripped off the poor and was closed down because of it? In fact as restitution he had to donate funds to other charities.

Are you still going to defend him ripping off students in a sham university?

Let me guess, it's everyone elses fault.......

Was hoping this was a reference to the Great A'Tuin?

Yes. How else would they be able to date rocks and bones that existed before humans.

I posted the proper definition of time earlier.

No.

So Pit…

…in other words you don’t believe the Bible on gender and marriage.

I got it. You don’t need to keep repeating yourself.

That’s fine if that’s your choice. Everyone is free to believe what they choose.

Pit, I’m not getting what your point is. Please answer the following for clarification.

a. In your view of what scripture says, did Jesus believe that the Torah was the very Word of God?

b. Do you hold Paul to be an apostle of Jesus Christ, or was he a false apostle?

If you answer these two questions, I might better understand what you’re getting at.

I’m going to try to make this my last post, since we’re not getting anywhere. I would appreciate it if no one replies to this thread if you do not reply to this thread I will not reply to this thread further

It seems like some people are assuming that I’m some kind of judgemental homophobe that I hate LGBT, And assume I condemn and judge people.

Here are the actual facts. I have never mentioned a person’s assumed gender, sexuality, or any other such matter when sharing the Gospel. I will share my faith with them and invite them to trust in Jesus My Wife and I know of two people who are LGBT who converted to Jesus and they told us that the one of the reasons why they converted was because we loved them and never made them feel uncomfortable or judged, and we often dined with them as we do with many other people. . I’ve never once brought up their sexuality, and I have not brought up their sexuality even this day and I never will. That’s something That’s between them and the Holy Spirit.

So if anybody thinks I’m preaching hate against LGBT, Youre flat wrong.

Go ahead and talk on yourself, but please do not reply to me anymore

So you want the parting shot?

No, you can have it. But if anyone says anything that I feel the need to reply to then it’ll just keep going😀

[quote=FrankZ][quote=Stiffarm]

By the way, you’re not a careful reader. I didn’t say I wanted to parting shot I just asked not to be replied to That doesn’t stop you from replying to the thread.

But I am already anticipating a particular thing that someone is going to say that I will definitely have to reply to. I have a pretty good idea of what the most logical reply to earlier post would be, and if it comes, I will have to answer.

If not, cheers and cherio, Turtle man. 👍

5 posts is a row with the last saying you aren't responding anymore is an indication of needing the parting shot.