DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Looking Back: Brown 13 Patriots 32 Postgame Thoughts

- The Browns managed their staple scripted opening drive for a TD and then managed nothing on offense until garage time.

- Kev's streak of losing by double digits on road games remains intact. Vrable kindly let off the gas at some point in third quarter.

- Myles Garrett had a monster game that had next to no impact on the outcome. 5 sacks, including a strip sack.

- Judkins was ineffective even before he banged up his shoulder. The Patriots still have not allowed a RB to rush for over 50 yards.

- Gabriel was lousy. 2 INTS and an intentional grounding in the end zone. Not sure he even bothered to look when he threw that pass.

- Opposing offense should just run laterally against the Browns. It's a clear weakness of the defense.

- The Browns offense is almost unspeakably bad.

- Jerry Jeudy 0 catches, 0 yards and just 2 targets. What is this team even doing?

- Isaiah Bond 0 catches, 0 yards and 4 targets.

- Nice interception by Schwesinger.

- Alex Wright continues to earn himself a second contract.

- Bojorquez and Szmyt both attempt onside kicks. Odd.

- There is nothing professional about this team's offense.

Schedule all remaining games against Miami in inclement weather.

Browns fans get a reprieve with bye week ahead.

This is the worst offense I have ever seen.

Milk while it is accurate to say judkins was “ineffective “, a defender, often multiple defenders, made contact with Q before he reached the los on many of his runs. He had no chance to even get started.

It doesn't help that Gabriel sticks the ball out in the direction Q intends to run to telegraph it for what seems like forever.

I don’t believe we have ever fielded a worse offense than the 2025 Browns offense.

The Browns telegraph their plays, the Patriots run defense is outstanding, all culminating in an ineffective run game performance today. We've seen lots of boom or bust.

Two head coaches in 3 weeks - one having a pop at Berry the other at Stefanski. Maybe it's reverse Psychology and these guys are scared about facing them over the long haul? Or maybe our FO is a predicatble joke to many in the NFL and neither will ever get a chance to hold the same position ever again once Haslam finally lets them go.

Berry put together a great Defense

Now it's time to use the next couple of drafts to build an offense that simulates the Defense

Slow steps

It'll work out

Hopefully, not too serious.

It's beyond bad. It's not even watchable. Our first string OL and we can't run the ball and our passing game is very substandard. I realize we don't have good wr's and DG is a rookie but something is seriously wrong with our offence. It's ineffective seemingly lacking imagination. It's almost impossible to watch and be optimistic. With the trade deadline, I'm expecting (and hoping for) big changes personnel-wise....

I'm not a Shedeur fan but I don't care, it's time to get him ready. There was never a better time than now, we have a bye week and the Jets.

I don't care, it's time to see him. I'm so sick and tired of Gabriel's dink and dunk crap. I don't want to see it again. He's not the guy.

Put Shedeur in, either he has it or he doesn't. He can't be worse than Gabriel can he?

I sure wish we had Kenny Pickett right now.

I got to watch the whole game today and except for the first drive and Myles it was unwatchable. In fairness Dillon does not have much to work with, but he did have some plays that could have been made and weren't. He will probably be a good backup and have a good career in that role. I don't think he is a starting QB in the league. Right now, with the lack of talent we have on O I don't think any QB could move this team.

This is the worst offense we've had since I can remember. The WRs stink, OL is old and bad, QB is an average backup type. Man, it's brutal

The first two comments are on mark. The third? Maybe.

When Joe was here, he threw a lot of dink and dunk passes as well. Maybe that is a "tell".

All right, we know Gabriel isn't it now, NEXT!

Anyone provide an update on DW's status? Just inquiring...

It’s gonna be funny to watch everyone when they see that sanders is just as bad. It’s bigger than the QB guys. Hate to tell ya.

It’s a combo of a bad o-line with a bad wr room

Everyone is bigger than the QB on the Browns. Gabriel's dink and dunk throws and watching him trying to play QB brings back way too many DTR vibes for me. Teams are stacking the box and and have no respect for his ability to push the ball down the field. If Sanders can't throw 5-yard passes to running backs out of the back field or screen passes to the tight end the team really does not have a QB on the roster. Gabriel actually had more time to throw today that Maye had. He was sacked much less times. His problem was his inability to push the ball down the field.

I've also been so underwhelmed by our ST's unit. The return game is bad and never provides a spark at all

Our OL can’t block well enough to give our RBs or the QB, a reasonable chance to execute a play. Opposing defences don’t respect our deep throws, at all, they stack the box and dare us to throw.

Our WRs are little fellas. We need to draft a stud WR next spring, and a QB. DG will likely be a good backup, but probably not much more.
What a shame to waste this defence , even though they weren’t great today - run D was terrible- on this offence.

Bojorquez is having a bad year, too. It's overlooked because how bad the rest has been.

Look at this year's stats as a team and as individuals. Our offence sucks. And it's not their fault. They have no leadership, a rookie qb with no arm, and a coach who doesn't know a dang thing about the NFL based upon his up and down career. No stability at all. And then there's the qb pick that the front office went all in on. Gabriel ain't got it. And Sanders is gathering lumber. PLAY HIM! Only consolation after a game like this is in knowing that soon the Brook Park Browns will automatically get a super bowl win. That plus the Bungals losing to the Jets...that was a bright spot on the day.

You'll have to wait to find out.

I hate saying this but when will Watson be available to play?

Yeah I saw that.

I know it's more than just Gabriel.

From the offensive line to the wide receivers to the play calling to the coaching staff to the general manager.

We're ready for a complete overhaul of everything, I've tried to be patient but I can't wait any longer. It's time to make some changes everywhere.

I liked Stefanski also, until now. I just don't see him as the guy anymore with this conservative dink and dunk approach he's using, and now he won't let go of Gabriel.

I'm ready to move on to the next step, and I really hate to do it all over again. I really do, but it's time.

This offense is worse than the 0-16 Hue Jackson offense given we have more talent.

I sat through the 99-01 teams, 09-13 teams, 15-18 teams ... this offense is the worst of them all

My guess is Haslam will allow Berry and Stefanski to stumble along until it's time to foist PSL purchase agreements upon would be season ticket holders at the new stadium. About this time, he'll part with the old and bring in the new to sell that sense of hope and bright future as he has done so deftly in the past.

Getting blown out when a single player on your Defense has 5 sacks and your Offense barely gets over 200 yds and 13 points, should be a fireable offense.

The game went as expected. We scored more points than I thought we would which is nice. Myles got some sacks but new England was using his aggressiveness against him to pick up chunk yards on running plays. Our two safeties got bullied all day long. Our o-line blocked better than I thought they would. Sadly Gabriel was not able to take advantage of much better blocking.

I think I have already seen all I need to see of GB. He just doesn't have the physical ability to play in the NFL. Even when he has time to throw it just doesn't look very good. IF Kevin can't see that then it's time for him to go too. It's time to start Sanders and let him take his lumps. If he can do well then great. If he can't then it's time to draft a better one and let these two fight to be the back up. Sanders at least has a chance to become a good QB. I don't think DG does. DG has played 4 games so now give SS 4 games and lets see how it looks.

Thrash had a few nice catches I think but our WRs look like hot garbage. I hope we draft some BIG PHYSICAL WRs because I'm tired of watching our short WRs get punked and knocked off their routes constantly.

100% - Gabriel is struggling. I don't know what his floor or ceiling is but it's not looking great but then who would? I suspect Sanders is much worse. It'll be funny to hear all the people clamoring for Sanders give him get all the excuses after excuse once he starts, holds the ball too long (which won't be long at all) and is sacked endlessly.

Oh and here's RG3 talking out of his Butt. I'm not a KS fan but what RG3 is saying is junk.

https://www.facebook.com/RG3/videos...starter-in-cleveland-i/2030006254508356/

I think both things are true: Gabriel sucks and our OL/WRs suck. It's just a horrendous offensive unit ... and yes, that falls on the FO, coaches, and players

Started out promising.. Held them to a FG,, then go right down for a score. Geez,, From there it was Crap except for Myles Garrett and a few others.

This is a really bad offense. I hesitate to lay it at the feet of Gabriel but he's not taking control like say a Baker Mayfield might do. Actually does!

We seem rudderless on offense. The system isn't working out well.

Not sure if changing QB's at this point will actually accomplish anything.. But it might be worth a shot.

Bright spots: Fannin, Garrett, Carson S, (hope he's ok) and the D as a whole.

Gabriel looks terrible......again.

Yep, he looks almost like Flacco did when he was here .... except more TD, fewer yards and fewer INT.

There is a systemic issue here.

This was a game there is no excuse for. It's not that they lost. I don't think it's a surprise that they lost. The surprise for me is the way they lost. People can say what they like about DG but the one thing nobody can deny is that he protected the ball. Not yesterday. The first int. was well behind the WR and made for an easy int. The second int. was into clear double, tight coverage. A throw that clearly should have never been attempted.

The D played one half of football. More than I can say for the O but still not the D that we've seen for most of the season. Maybe they are starting to have trouble keeping their intensity level up since they are getting virtually no help or support from the O. There were certainly some good plays made. Myles and Schwesinger played well and I can't just trash the D without giving them some kudos. I hope Schwesinger's injury isn't bad.

Yeah I'm not sure what the noise has been about "We should have kept Flacco!"

They scored 16 points verses the Bengals, 17 points against the Ravens, 13 points against the Packers and 10 points against the Lions with Flacco at QB. The problem runs much deeper than the QB position.

It feels like our "script" plays give us the best momentum and drives, and then we sputter. So my question is, why don't we just script every drive lol

lmao. I thought the same thing yesterday when FrankZ brought that up on our Discord chat.

But seriously, for someone in the know. When we say "script plays" does that mean those plays are practiced way more? Is the script shared with the team??

If that's true... are we really that inept, from an execution standpoint, that we flounder through the rest of the playbook? Is it the young QB?

Because this is getting really hard to watch and I feel like defenses are already teeing off. We need to start throwing the ball downfield or this will get even uglier (yes, it is possible).

Absolutely.

Its Stefanski. Had a decent rookie year and has been an average to below average coach every year since. Flacco saved his bacon a couple of years ago.

My suggestion is to divorce yourself from this team until he's gone. They will never be good under him. He's incompetent. The sucky part is it looks like he isn't going anywhere.

What an awful, awful organization.

I was under the assumption that "script plays" mean the 15 (or so) plays that are really talked about to a T the days leading up to the game. And practiced over and over. It just doesn't make sense to me why we wouldn't do that with more plays then

sucks for him and us. Hoping it's not bad, but I also want him to full heal. No use in getting more injured in meaningless games

I haven't divorced, but we're definitely living in different households.

I get way more excited for real NFL games and basically plan my Sunday around the fact that I can generally LOL and walk away by 2:15.

Hope all is well with you and the fam, Rish. 👊

Goody-bye. I mean of you decide to take your own advice that is. Some people just run off at the mouth and never back it up. We'll see which one you are.

At some point, you have to respond to the ebb and flow of the game. If we scripted a whole game and stuck to it, we'd be running Judkins and kicking field goals despite being down by 20 points.

That may not be a bad idea, bro. Trying to score touchdowns definitely hasn't worked out. 🤣 Maybe we should work on trying to get more safeties as well.

I know it may not sound like it, but I'm not that far away from you in terms of how I watch these games. Not trying to pat myself on the back or anything, but I decided early on that I was watching to see how our young guys performed without getting wrapped up with the final score in any way.

It actually bums me out how well our defense is playing because it's such a waste.

I literally just got tired of being mad about it. It's one thing when you have a fighting chance; it's ridiculous when you know you have none. It is nice to see some young talent and recognize what looks like a solid draft, how that translates to next season seems like a slide-puzzle trapped in a maze at this point though.

My take aways from this game are many. Gabriel had time in the pocket, but it is clear he can't see the field from in it. I was watching close, he steps up, and then you can't even see him. I doubt highly he can see down field. He has a weak arm, the long pass to Juedy was a high floater like a hail mary pass.

This is the worst set of receivers I have ever saw. Berry has no clue how to draft them. Every guy is 160lbs soaking wet and short. Juedy is a waste of money, too many drops and can't get open.

The RBs besides Judkins are horrible. Samson is too light and has poor vision. Ford is just not good at all.

I actually think the pass blocking was okay, it is just the QB can't see over them. As for run blocking, I don't think there was any.

I think Delpit having the toe injury hurt his performance big time. How many times was there TE and receivers wide open uncovered? Myles played a hell of a game after being absent the past couple weeks. Alex Wright is improving every year. I'm not sure how this defense gets rated so high, when they constantly give up big runs and big plays down field.

I'm done with Stephanski, but Berry is the guy that needs to go. He has no concept on what a good offensive player looks like. He drafts these lineman and signs FA lineman who are atrocious. I watch many team playing with back-ups, and still perform competently, none of these guys do. WQe have a ton of picks next year, and if Berry is still making the picks, it will be more of the same. Podesta needs to ride with Berry out of town. This analytics heavy process is failing and needs to be scrapped. We need talent evaluators who watch players perform instead of looking at stats and whatever [censored] they are using.

It is a shame that this team can't put it together. Time to clean house. Start with Ventrone, this is the worst special teams I have ever seen.

Sad thing is, if they are lucky and build an offense next year, you can count on the defense to do what they always do, fail when it is time to put the game away

Yeah, it is called Stefanski's offense. That is the problem.

I think Gabriel's lack of vision and ability to push the ball down the field basically dooms him. He has no chance to be a good QB in the NFL with those limiting factors.

Honest question then... is he already doomed or is pushing the ball down the field a work in progress complicated by playcalling that favors the short game?

Not asking you to read Ski's mind or predict the future; just asking the results of your "eye test" so far.

A question I have. Why was our passing game so much better last season. I understand the QB’s are different but the WR group isn’t much different and Fanin is an improvement. Was Jameus Winston that much better than what we have now?

We will draft a QB with our 1st pick. DG doesn’t threaten anyone, WRs are short, lightweight and drop-prone, we can’t run block because the D is stacking the line.

Nothing we do scares a DC.

That much better? Definitely "better".

Here's his three outstanding games over 300 yards though...

Cedric Tillman / Elijah Moore: 15-184
Cedric Tillman / Elijah Moore: 9-113
Elijah Moore (Tillman out): 8-111


This year our #1 leads the league in DROPS. Doesn't tell the whole story, but definitely not some obscure sub-plot.

Gabriel may be doomed - I just don't think it is possible to tell yet. He might be really good. We can't tell yet and as the week's go by there are issues that show up on game day.

However before we try to grade him on his ability to push the ball downfield and his vision - surely we can draw some real conclusions from what happened before he started? Flacco had 4 games in the same offense, same OL and same WR ... and it was all dink and dunk underneath plays. Flaccos last 3 games - admittedly against good teams - 184, 148 and 199 yards per game. I know Flacco has gone to a team with great WR - but the difference since he left is stark and should be a very significant indicator about how we judge Gabriel.

The issue and limitation EVENTUALLY may prove to be Gabriel - but right now it really is impossible to say. He's a rookie. He's on a bad team. He has virtually no time to throw. His WR are not good. Fannin and Judkins the two pright spots on offense. I'd add another negative being Stefanski's offense and play calling - but that's very much my opinion, the rest of it is pretty much a collection of observable facts.

I think he's doomed because of his own limitations. KS has not evolved as a play caller/designer, but I can remember many instances when we were pushing the ball down the field in the past (Baker/Flacco would .. even Jacoby). There's a reason Gabriel isn't asked to do it IMO

From Jake Burns....

Goes to show you how incredibly bad our entire Offensive is from the coaching to the play calling to the inability of our tiny WRs to be able to block to Dillion's horrible QB play for the "most ready" QB the Browns have. Changes have to be made during the bye week