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Early on property owners were the electorate and while that is much too narrow a field...
...except when paying school levies. 
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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1st String
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Thanks for proving my point!
No sir...voting rights did not apply to all citizens of the colonies. Hell- women of this nation did not receive the right until last century.
Early on property owners were the electorate and while that is much too narrow a field...is it too much to expect your fellow citizens to be lierate and read and write English?
qft 
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Dawg Talker
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The beginning of the end of our Republic occurred when voting rights were extended to anyone who is a citizen and of legal age with no requirements for logic or literacy.
Claim that this is racially,gender based bigotry but get it right in that voting in America should require the ability for rational thought.
Complain all you want...but intelligence is not a requisite of civic duty!
Now, you say rational thought...what's the definition...it's obvious that conservatives and liberals have two different types of "rational thought" So who's to say which one is correct...no one!
Just live with the fact that people vote for whatever reasons they see fit...AND THAT IS WHAT THIS COUNTRY IS SUPPOSED TO STAND FOR!
Furthermore...you should be more concerned with irrational people serving on a jury!
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Legend
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I also wonder if Obama will run into any Swift Boat type attacks
It looks like it's already started, a radio station here has been talking about this story. I can't link it because there is video taped interviews with this guy and it sounds like it contains some inappropriate stuff, but here is the article from World Net Daily:
ELECTION 2008
Sleaze charge: 'I took drugs, had homo sex with Obama'
Minnesota man takes his case to court, YouTube, $100,000 polygraph challenge
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Posted: February 17, 2008
4:45 pm Eastern
© 2008 WorldNetDaily
Editor's note: The accompanying YouTube video contains sexual language that some will consider offensive. The article itself contains material that is inappropriate for children.
Larry Sinclair accuses Barack Obama of homosexual acts and drug use in video posted on YouTube
WASHINGTON – The electrifying presidential campaign of Barack Obama faces a new challenge – a Minnesota man who claims he took cocaine in 1999 with the then-Illinois legislator and participated in homosexual acts with him.
When his story was ignored by the news media, Larry Sinclair made his case last month in a YouTube video, which has now been viewed more than a quarter-million times. And when it was still ignored by the media, Sinclair filed a suit in Minnesota District Court, alleging threats and intimidation by Obama's staff.
Sinclair, who says he is willing to submit to a polygraph test to validate his claims, will now get his chance – thanks to a website offering $10,000 for the right to record it and $100,000 to Sinclair if he passes.
"My motivation for making this public is my desire for a presidential candidate to be honest," Sinclair told WND by telephone. "I didn't want the sex thing to come out. But I think it is important for the candidate to be honest about his drug use as late as 1999."
Sinclair, who lives in Duluth and describes himself as "gay," claims he "personally engaged in sexual activity and personally used illegal drugs in November 1999" with the man who is now the leading Democratic presidential candidate. He claims the activity took place in the back of Sinclair's limousine and occurred again, later, in his hotel. Sinclair also says he personally no longer uses drugs.
In his lawsuit, filed last week, he charges his civil rights have been violated by Obama and the Democratic Party. Named as defendants in the case are the presidential candidate, David Axelrod of AKP Message and Media in Chicago and the Democratic National Committee.
Sinclair charges Obama smoked crack cocaine in the limo while Sinclair snorted powdered cocaine provided by the legislator. He says the two met in an upscale Chicago lounge before leaving in Sinclair's limousine where the drug use and sex took place for the first time.
Sinclair says he is a registered Democrat but has never voted for any candidate. He is 46 and claims to be physically disabled.
He says he was not physically impaired in 1999 when the alleged incidents with Obama took place.
Calls placed to the Obama campaign were not returned.
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Legend
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I know lots of people who can read and write, heck even a bunch that graduated college, that I would challenge on being capable of rational thought. 
yebat' Putin
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Bengal
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JC
Attn Dayton Dems...
Barack will be at the Nutter Center tonight.
Event is free
Doors open at 4, he spaks at 6.
Source: channel 7 news (whio.tv)
![[Linked Image from media.lehighvalleylive.com]](http://media.lehighvalleylive.com/tv_impact/photo/birds-of-war-3b1e411c023703c8_custom_120xauto.jpg) Birds of War
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Dawg Talker
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I know lots of people who can read and write, heck even a bunch that graduated college, that I would challenge on being capable of rational thought.
Depending on who's telling the story, I'm sure they could say the same about you!
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Legend
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Barack will be at the Nutter Center tonight.
Event is free
You get what you pay for. 
yebat' Putin
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Legend
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Quote:
I know lots of people who can read and write, heck even a bunch that graduated college, that I would challenge on being capable of rational thought.
Depending on who's telling the story, I'm sure they could say the same about you!
That's why I don't listen to those people.
yebat' Putin
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Legend
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#gmstrong
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Dawg Talker
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Barack will be at the Nutter Center tonight.
Event is free
You get what you pay for.
Seriously though, why should I have to pay to hear you tell me why you think you should be president?!?!
I think he's doing the right thing, not charging...or "asking for a donation"
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Legend
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Hey I agree. I was just making a funny... fundraisers should be fundraisers and speeches for the public should be free... at least that's my thoughts.
yebat' Putin
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Dawg Talker
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Hey I agree. I was just making a funny... fundraisers should be fundraisers and speeches for the public should be free... at least that's my thoughts.
My thoughts exactly!
BTW...keep your day job 
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Dawg Talker
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Ndutyme, "Complain all you want...but intelligence is not a requisite of civic duty!
Now, you say rational thought...what's the definition...it's obvious that conservatives and liberals have two different types of "rational thought" So who's to say which one is correct...no one!
Just live with the fact that people vote for whatever reasons they see fit...AND THAT IS WHAT THIS COUNTRY IS SUPPOSED TO STAND FOR!
Furthermore...you should be more concerned with irrational people serving on a jury!
Three points
Rational thought based exclusively on one's feelings concerning as issue...is not true rational thought. If a conservative or liberal claims his thought is emotionally based rather than based upon the given facts of the issue ...he or she is a fool.
"People vote for whatever reason they see fit"...and yes that is the problem!! Too many vote for the goody bag politician who promises things not owed to voters and in amounts excessive to what the situation call for.
Why would I worry about irrational jury members? Do you know something that I don't know of ..yet?
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, .
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Dawg Talker
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Rational thought based exclusively on one's feelings concerning as issue...is not true rational thought. If a conservative or liberal claims his thought is emotionally based rather than based upon the given facts of the issue ...he or she is a fool.
Says you...somebody else may feel completely different...that's what freedom is all about...it is what it is
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"People vote for whatever reason they see fit"...and yes that is the problem!! Too many vote for the goody bag politician who promises things not owed to voters and in amounts excessive to what the situation call for.
People vote for the people that promise to address the issue they care about...no president can fully live up to their campaign promises without congress. So they're all liars by that train of thought...should we just stop voting then?
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Why would I worry about irrational jury members? Do you know something that I don't know of ..yet?
Yes I do...I know that jurors that can't separate emotion from facts have more of an impact on our judicial system than the president or any politician will ever have
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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Looks like that dude failed his poly.... http://www.whitehouse.com/NewsComments.aspx?start=&NewsID=116Dr. Ed Gelb, Former President of the American Polygraph Association was the Polygraph expert selected by Whitehouse.com. He has done over 30,000 polygraph examinations over his long career. There were two polygraph tests administered by Dr. Gelb on Friday. the first polygraph asked Mr. Sinclair on his sex claims. The second polygraph test asked Mr. Sinclair on the drug use claims. There was deception indicated in both tests. As mentioned yesterday Mr. Sinclair did pass his drug screen so there were no drugs in his system which could have interfered with the test. We have asked Mr. Sinclair on several occasions to put us in contact with the Limousine driver that he named for other news organizations earlier and for us on Friday that was supposed to corroborate his story. As of today he has still not put us in contact with the limousine driver whom he told us he stays in constant contact with. It was our intention to get to the truth in this serious matter rather than have these allegations that were made almost a month ago drag on to election day. Due to the seriousness of this issue we made the results public today rather than waiting until Monday when we would have received the second expert's conclusions. When we receive the second expert's conclusions we will post those results as well. We will have all of the written results posted on the site in the next week including video taken of the Polygraph testing so there will be full disclosure and transparency on our part and eliminate any suspicion of any wrongdoing or manipulations of the testing or the results by Whitehouse.com or the polygraph experts. Later this afternoon we will post the actual report by Dr. Gelb. Update 2/24/2008 10:40 PM We have a handwritten report from Dr. Gelb but we would rather put up the typed report since we know it will be tightly scrutinized. When we get the typed report we will immediately put a copy of the report on the site. Sorry for the delay
<><
#gmstrong
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 That dude better be careful that Obama doesn't come after him for defamation if he loses the election. That guy could really lose his ass.
Blue ostriches on crack float on milkshakes between the sidewalk titans of gurglefitz. --YTown
#gmstrong
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I really, truly hate the mudslinging garbage that seems to appear every stinking time there's an election.
While I disagree with Obama's politics, everything I have heard about him indicates that he's a decent man. People like that don't deserve having their names dragged through the kind of filth this guy is spewing.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article3433929.eceDemocrat race blighted by row over turban pictureThe Clinton camp has been accused of circulating this photo in order to smear rival Barack Obama  Tom Baldwin in Washington Barack Obama's campaign yesterday accused Hillary Clinton’s aides of engaging in “shameful, offensive fear-mongering” by distributing a photograph of him in a turban and tribal costume. The Clinton camp responded swiftly, saying it was unaware of any such picture and that it was Mr Obama’s team that “should be ashamed”. They accused her rival of making a “transparent attempt to distract from the serious issues confronting our country”. The row was sparked by a photograph appearing at the top of the Drudge Report — a political gossip website which is no friend of the Clintons — showing Mr Obama dressed as a Somali elder during a visit to Kenya in 2006. The accompanying report claimed the picture was being circulated in e-mails by “stressed Clinton staffers”. Mrs Clinton’s aides were furious at the prospect of her foreign policy speech in Washington being overshadowed by a row which, they suspect, had been deliberately concocted. Some even expressed doubts that the e-mail referred to by Drudge existed. But David Plouffe, Mr Obama's campaign manager, was already firing off press statements about it at a time when most voters were still digesting breakfast. “On the very day that Senator Clinton is giving a speech about restoring respect for America in the world, her campaign has engaged in the most shameful, offensive fear-mongering we’ve seen from either party in this election. “This is part of a disturbing pattern,” said Mr Plouffe, alluding to a previous controversy in which one of Mrs Clinton's volunteers had been dismissed for forwarding an e-mail falsely stating that Mr Obama is a Muslim. His counterpart in the Clinton campaign, Maggie Williams, said: “Enough. If Barack Obama’s campaign wants to suggest that a photo of him wearing traditional Somali clothing is divisive, they should be ashamed ... We will not be distracted.” Mrs Clinton’s spokesman, Howard Wolfson, later added: “I just want to make it very clear that we were not aware of it, the campaign didn’t sanction it and don’t know anything about it. None of us have seen the e-mail in question.” Mrs Clinton later delivered a foreign policy speech at Georgetown University in Washington where she sought to underscore her credentials as a prospective commander-in-chief of the US military by appearing alongside some of the 27 former generals and admirals who have endorsed her. “We’ve seen the tragic results of having a President who didn’t have either the experience nor the wisdom to manage our foreign policy and safeguard our national security,” she said, comparing Mr Obama to the Bush Administration. “We can’t let that happen again. America has already taken that chance one time too many.” She highlighted Mr Obama's willingness to invade Pakistan if there were “actionable intelligence” that the country was harbouring terrorists, as well as his repeated pledge to meet the leaders of rogue nations such as Cuba and Iran. “He wavers from seeming to believe that mediation and meetings without preconditions can solve some of the world's most intractable problems to advocating rash, unilateral military action without the co-operation of our allies in the most sensitive part of the world,” said Mrs Clinton. But the speech was notably not covered live by any of the cable TV news networks and her campaign has expressed growing anger at what it regards as the fawning attitude of the US media towards Mr Obama. Although a new poll yesterday showed her with a double-digit lead in Ohio — one of two key states along with Texas that she needs to win on March 4 to halt Mr Obama's surge — Mrs Clinton herself appears frustrated at her opponent's gathering momentum which has now included 11 straight victories. On Sunday, she resorted to sarcasm, saying: “I can stand up here and say: Let’s just get everybody together, let’s get unified, the sky will open, the light will come down, celestial choirs will be singing, and everyone will know we should do the right thing, and the world will be perfect.” Mr Obama's chief foreign policy advisers yesterday conducted a “pre-butall" briefing on Mrs Clinton's speech and criticised her judgement on issues such as voting to authorise the Iraq war. One adviser, Air Force General Scott Gration, added that he had accompanied Mr Obama on his trip to Kenya two years ago. The Senator had demonstrated he was a “great guest”, he said, and by trying on the tribal outfit, he “did what any leader should do”.
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Hillary is getting pretty desparte.
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!
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http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chi-farrakhan25feb25Louis Farrakhan backs Obama for president at Nation of Islam convention in ChicagoSenator has criticized him, says support not sought By Margaret Ramirez | Tribune reporter February 25, 2008 Speaking to thousands of members of the Nation of Islam at their annual convention Sunday in Chicago, Minister Louis Farrakhan praised presidential candidate Sen. Barack Obama as the only hope for healing the nation's racial divisions. Farrakhan, 74, the longtime leader of the Nation of Islam, said the war in Iraq, the nation's faltering economy and the increased number of natural disasters were signs of "a nation in peril." He said those problems provide the broader context for Obama's rise. "We are witnessing the phenomenal rise of a man of color in a country that has persecuted us because of our color," Farrakhan told the crowd of nearly 20,000 gathered at McCormick Place. "If you look at Barack Obama's [diverse] audiences and look at the effect of his words, those people are being transformed from what they were," he said. "This young man is the hope of the entire world that America will change and be made better." Although Farrakhan's praise for Obama may generate increased support from the black community, the Obama campaign's response was cool. "Senator Obama has been clear in his objections to Minister Farrakhan's past pronouncements and has not solicited the minister's support," said Obama spokesman Bill Burton. Farrakhan's two-hour speech, titled "The Gods At War -- The Future is All About Y.O.U.th," closed the Nation of Islam's annual Saviours' Day Convention, which commemorates the birth of the movement's founder, Wallace D. Fard Muhammad. In his opening remarks, Farrakhan commented on his unexpected return to the public stage. Last February, the controversial leader said his Saviours' Day speech in Detroit would likely be his last public address. Speculation also arose about a potential successor to Farrakhan after he handed leadership of the Nation of Islam over to an executive board and underwent surgery for complications due to his treatment for prostate cancer. On Sunday, Farrakhan said he was thankful that God had granted him another year. He said he had spent most of the last year working internally within the Nation of Islam to put the movement on "the best road possible" to the future. "I'm still here. I'm alive. My mind is very sharp," he said. In the past, Farrakhan has sparked outrage for his controversial comments, which include anti-Semitic statements. But in recent years, most significantly after his battle with prostate cancer in the 1990s, he has tried to strike a more conciliatory tone. His popularity among young black Americans grew significantly after the 1995 Million Man March. Farrakhan said he refused to be a stumbling block to Obama's success. "Why do you hate him so that you want to make me a stumbling block?" Farrakhan asked. "I want to see that brother successful and I don't want them to use me or that Nation of Islam." After Farrakhan's speech, some Nation of Islam members such as Jabari Muhammad, said Farrakhan's comments had changed their opinions of Obama. Muhammad, who traveled from New Orleans for the convention, said he had become disenchanted with politics, until he heard Farrakhan's message. "I was never political because I felt like nothing changes," he said. "But, after all that Minister Farrakhan said, I'm going to look at Obama a little closer and see what he's about." ----------- maramirez@tribune.com Copyright © 2008, Chicago Tribune
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She highlighted Mr Obama's willingness to invade Pakistan if there were “actionable intelligence” that the country was harbouring terrorists
Good for him.
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Maggie Williams, said: “Enough. If Barack Obama’s campaign wants to suggest that a photo of him wearing traditional Somali clothing is divisive, they should be ashamed ...
Nice attempt to turn it around. I don't know who circulated this email, but I wouldn't put it past the Clinton's.
#gmstrong
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Dawg Talker
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“We’ve seen the tragic results of having a President who didn’t have either the experience nor the wisdom to manage our foreign policy and safeguard our national security,” she said, comparing Mr Obama to the Bush Administration. “We can’t let that happen again. America has already taken that chance one time too many.”
i thought she was talking about her husband 
Attitude is everything....FEAR THE ELF!!!
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[Nice attempt to turn it around. I don't know who circulated this email, but I wouldn't put it past the Clinton's.
This email was around long before anyone even gave Obama a chance to beat Hillary.
You know, I try to like that woman but she's so stringent. And her new role of attacking chihuahua yapping at Obama's heels really does her no good.
...always have been, always will be...
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j/c
Going into these nominations, I already knew that Hillary was for the war before she was against it.
Now I find out she was for NAFTA before she was against it. Other than health care, is there anything this woman hasn't flipped flopped on?
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j/c
Going into these nominations, I already knew that Hillary was for the war before she was against it.
Now I find out she was for NAFTA before she was against it. Other than health care, is there anything this woman hasn't flipped flopped on?
Only thing I can think of that she hasn't flip flopped on is her desire for power and her willingness to do anything to get it.
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Hall of Famer
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is there anything this woman hasn't flipped flopped on?
Resisting to respond.....I dont wanna get banned from this sight..... 
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And her new role of attacking chihuahua yapping at Obama's heels really does her no good.
That's a new role?? Unless you are talking about her yapping at heels rather than bushes.
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Legend
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Other than health care, is there anything this woman hasn't flipped flopped on?
Uh, health care is one of her biggest back and forth's.
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Quote:
j/c
Going into these nominations, I already knew that Hillary was for the war before she was against it.
Now I find out she was for NAFTA before she was against it. Other than health care, is there anything this woman hasn't flipped flopped on?
Only thing I can think of that she hasn't flip flopped on is her desire for power and her willingness to do anything to get it.
And her undying support for Bill, even though he was bangi........Meh, you all remember the details.
![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/Punchsmack/punch.gif) “...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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I'm not Hillary fan, but the criticism for staying in her marriage, to me seems unfair. So many people complain about how everybody gets divorced and runs away from hard times, but here's a woman who faced the worst public humiliation, and survived it. She gave her husband a chance to earn her forgiveness...and that's a bad thing?!?!?! 
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
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I'm not Hillary fan, but the criticism for staying in her marriage, to me seems unfair.
So many people complain about how everybody gets divorced and runs away from hard times, but here's a woman who faced the worst public humiliation, and survived it. She gave her husband a chance to earn her forgiveness...and that's a bad thing?!?!?!
No. For 99% of the population. But come on, do you think she stayed with bill for the sake of their marriage, or did she stay with him for the sake of her political career?
Let's face it, Bill is a cheating, 2 timing, never going to change kind of person. (yes, with all the affairs he's had, I can say that).
Bottom line, in MY opinion, and that of most people, hillary stayed with bill because he was in power, and because she felt it would help her politically.
When your kid is grown - out of college and working - you don't stay with a 2 faced, many times over cheating husband for any reason other than what he can do for you.
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Well, I see it the other way. He cheated on her. It made her look weak in my opinion for not standing up for herself and kicking that loser to the curb.
Divorce is a bad thing, don't get me wrong. However, it's the byproduct of men and women like Bill. If you can't keep "it" in your pants after you made promises to your wife and to God....then you deserve to be divorced. You make it sound like if Hillary wanted a divorve than it would be on her shoulders that the marriage crashed and burned. Like it was her responsibility to save everything when Bill made the mistake.
She could have forgiven him while leaving him too. I see your side but once a cheater, always a cheater.
“...Iguodala to Curry, back to Iguodala, up for the layup! Oh! Blocked by James! LeBron James with the rejection!”
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I see ndutymes point as well, and I wouldn't even be as harsh as you (once a cheater, always a cheater)
But, a chronic cheater - that's a different story. And bill is a chronic cheater.
Hillary stayed with him for 1 reason: power. And that is pathetic and lame in my opinion.
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But come on, do you think she stayed with bill for the sake of their marriage, or did she stay with him for the sake of her political career?
None of us have the answer to that question that isn't wild speculation.
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Let's face it, Bill is a cheating, 2 timing, never going to change kind of person.
I have no idea what kind of person Bill Clinton is. He was a marginal president.
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,826 |
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But come on, do you think she stayed with bill for the sake of their marriage, or did she stay with him for the sake of her political career?
None of us have the answer to that question that isn't wild speculation.
In most situations I would agree with you. As for bill and hill, I disagree with you.
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Let's face it, Bill is a cheating, 2 timing, never going to change kind of person.
I have no idea what kind of person Bill Clinton is. He was a marginal president.
What kind of president he was is totally irrelevant. If you can't see bill for what he is, it's not my problem.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,465 |
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What kind of president he was is totally irrelevant.
No, what kind of person he was is totally irrelevant.
I've known plenty of people who have terrible vices and really messed up personal lives, but who are very good at what they do. I know plenty of morally flawless people who are terrible leaders. It takes all kinds.
BIll Clinton's personal life has never affected me by one iota. His professional life has.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,826
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,826 |
Quote:
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What kind of president he was is totally irrelevant.
No, what kind of person he was is totally irrelevant.
I've known plenty of people who have terrible vices and really messed up personal lives, but who are very good at what they do. I know plenty of morally flawless people who are terrible leaders. It takes all kinds.
BIll Clinton's personal life has never affected me by one iota. His professional life has.
Well, good for you. And me I guess, because his personal life has not affected me either. However, if you followed the gist of the thread, we WERE talking about hillary and why she stayed with bill.
You're trying to argue a totally different topic. I don't care if bill's personal life had anything to do with you, nor do I care if it had anything to do with me.
What we were talking about was hillary staying with a chronic cheater in bill, and WHY she would do that.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 11,367 |
I guess the question is, why do you care?
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,826
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,826 |
Quote:
I guess the question is, why do you care?
To put it as plainly as I can: I can't stand hillary.
I do believe I have made that point clear in many threads.
However, I was discussing the topic at hand.
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