|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,826
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,826 |
Cleveland Browns Hire Special Teams Coordinator After Bubba Ventrone’s Departure https://www.si.com/nfl/browns/onsi/...-bubba-ventrone-s-departure-01kh519ygphkCleveland Browns Hire Special Teams Coordinator After Bubba Ventrone’s Departure Here's everything you need to know about the first-time special teams coordinator just hired by new Cleveland Browns head coach Todd Monken. The Cleveland Browns are aiming to have their full coaching staff assembled by next week, and they made major progress towards that on Tuesday evening. According to several reports, the Browns have hired their new special teams coordinator. The Browns didn’t retain Bubba Ventrone, who was quickly hired as the new special teams coordinator of the Los Angeles Rams. The Browns are hiring Green Bay Packers assistant special teams coordinator Byron Storer. Who is Byron Storer? Storer played fullback for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers from 2007-2009. Immediately following his playing career, he transitioned to a special teams assistant with the Buccaneers from 2010-2011. After a few seasons with the San Diego Chargers, Storer took a five-year hiatus from coaching football until he landed with the Las Vegas Raiders in 2018. The 41-year-old has been a key assistant for Rich Bisaccia with the Raiders and Packers and now gets to run his own unit for new head coach Todd Monken. Special teams has always been a part of Storer’s story, as he was a second-team All-Pac-10 special teamer from 2004-2006 at the University of California Berkeley. ource: The #Browns are hiring #Packers Assistant Special Teams Coordinator Byron Storer as their new Special Teams Coordinator. A big hire for HC Todd Monken, Storer has been a key assistant for Rich Bisaccia with the Raiders and Packers and now gets to run his own unit in… pic.twitter.com/7hmyhNb1xs — Ari Meirov (@MySportsUpdate) February 10, 2026 The Browns will need to be much better on special teams than they have been over the last few seasons. Under Ventrone’s watch last year, the Browns had the No. 29 ranked special teams unit. As the Browns watched their season spiral, Ventrone called out the lack of talent on his special teams unit as the reason for so many repeated errors. "We haven't played near our capabilities," Ventrone said in December. "We've had too many, too many issues with just, just dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb football, dumb mistakes.” When a roster is young and inexperienced, special teams tend to struggle as teams might not have many talented depth players to play on that unit. That was the case for the Browns at the end of last season, as undrafted free agent receiver Gage Larvadain struggled with return responsibilities. Unfortunately, the Browns had to keep playing him as they didn’t have many other options. When the team introduced Monken, Browns general manager Andrew Berry stated that they would work to become one of the youngest rosters in the NFL next season. This would signal that special teams might not be a major priority. But with Storer’s experience working under an established special teams coordinator like Bisaccia, the Browns will hope that their unit will vastly improve.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,518
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 10,518 |
Meh.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,281
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,281 |
Who knows? Good luck.
One thing I'd like to see is the addition of an assistant ST coach. I don't think the Browns have had any for a while. The job is big enough that the coordinator needs at least one asst.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
It seems rather odd that a guy that young would take "a five-year hiatus from coaching football". That or maybe that's just the best spin they could put on it?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
Cleveland Browns Hire Special Teams Coordinator After Bubba Ventrone’s Departure https://www.si.com/nfl/browns/onsi/...-bubba-ventrone-s-departure-01kh519ygphkCleveland Browns Hire Special Teams Coordinator After Bubba Ventrone’s Departure Here's everything you need to know about the first-time special teams coordinator just hired by new Cleveland Browns head coach Todd Monken. The Cleveland Browns are aiming to have their full coaching staff assembled by next week, and they made major progress towards that on Tuesday evening. According to several reports, the Browns have hired their new special teams coordinator. The Browns didn’t retain Bubba Ventrone, who was quickly hired as the new special teams coordinator of the Los Angeles Rams. The Browns are hiring Green Bay Packers assistant special teams coordinator Byron Storer. Who is Byron Storer? Storer played fullback for the Tampa Bay Buccaneers from 2007-2009. Immediately following his playing career, he transitioned to a special teams assistant with the Buccaneers from 2010-2011. After a few seasons with the San Diego Chargers, Storer took a five-year hiatus from coaching football until he landed with the Las Vegas Raiders in 2018. The 41-year-old has been a key assistant for Rich Bisaccia with the Raiders and Packers and now gets to run his own unit for new head coach Todd Monken. Special teams has always been a part of Storer’s story, as he was a second-team All-Pac-10 special teamer from 2004-2006 at the University of California Berkeley. ource: The #Browns are hiring #Packers Assistant Special Teams Coordinator Byron Storer as their new Special Teams Coordinator. A big hire for HC Todd Monken, Storer has been a key assistant for Rich Bisaccia with the Raiders and Packers and now gets to run his own unit in… pic.twitter.com/7hmyhNb1xs — Ari Meirov (@MySportsUpdate) February 10, 2026 The Browns will need to be much better on special teams than they have been over the last few seasons. Under Ventrone’s watch last year, the Browns had the No. 29 ranked special teams unit. As the Browns watched their season spiral, Ventrone called out the lack of talent on his special teams unit as the reason for so many repeated errors. "We haven't played near our capabilities," Ventrone said in December. "We've had too many, too many issues with just, just dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb football, dumb mistakes.” When a roster is young and inexperienced, special teams tend to struggle as teams might not have many talented depth players to play on that unit. That was the case for the Browns at the end of last season, as undrafted free agent receiver Gage Larvadain struggled with return responsibilities. Unfortunately, the Browns had to keep playing him as they didn’t have many other options. When the team introduced Monken, Browns general manager Andrew Berry stated that they would work to become one of the youngest rosters in the NFL next season. This would signal that special teams might not be a major priority. But with Storer’s experience working under an established special teams coordinator like Bisaccia, the Browns will hope that their unit will vastly improve. Can't be any worse than Bubba Ventrone.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
As Byron Storer says hold my beer.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
As Byron Storer says hold my beer. Bubba Ventrone special team's unit lost 2 games for the Browns in 2025 single handedly. The Bengals games missed an extra point and missed a chip shot field goal and lost by 1. The Jets game gave up a kick return and punt return for touchdowns and lost by 7 in a game the Browns out gained the Jets by 150+ yards.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
Of course as per usual that is the coaches fault and not the GM who built the roster. Did he coach them how not to catch a punt or kickoff? Did he teach them not to secure the ball? Some of the lengths people will go to in order to lay the fault at one mans feet amazes me.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,826
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,826 |
Ven trone was a massive disappointment as SCC. He even had guys from defense volunteering for SC duty, and still couldn't field as capable unit.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
Of course as per usual that is the coaches fault and not the GM who built the roster. Did he coach them how not to catch a punt or kickoff? Did he teach them not to secure the ball? Some of the lengths people will go to in order to lay the fault at one mans feet amazes me. No one said anything about the GM. Yes, he failed and should have been fired also. I am not sure why he is brought up talking about the special teams though. Special teams was a disaster in 2025 and Bubba Ventrone's coaching or lack there of was responsible for the special teams.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,831
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,831 |
Like baseball, you can’t sack an entire squad so the coach gets it. I’d imagine new coach would have had a guy in mind anyway. I’m more concerned about a DC hire who I thought the new coach might have had a VERY short list to begin with…
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
It seems I need to break this down for you in the most basic of ways. We all learned the story of the Three Little Pigs.
Remember the house made of bricks and how the Big Bad Wolf couldn't blow it down? The only unit on this team that has the talent level that would compare to brick is the defense.
The ST's is made out of straw. You know how easily the wolf blew that house down.
In the simplest of terms you are blaming the man that had no choice but to build his house out of the straw he was given rather than the man who would only give him straw to build the house with.
I hope that helps.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,700
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,700 |
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,480
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 43,480 |
Overall, I was kinda disappointed in the way ST played under Bubba... So I'm not sad about him being gone.
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.” Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe." Damanshot
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,421
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,421 |
It seems I need to break this down for you in the most basic of ways. We all learned the story of the Three Little Pigs.
Remember the house made of bricks and how the Big Bad Wolf couldn't blow it down? The only unit on this team that has the talent level that would compare to brick is the defense.
The ST's is made out of straw. You know how easily the wolf blew that house down.
In the simplest of terms you are blaming the man that had no choice but to build his house out of the straw he was given rather than the man who would only give him straw to build the house with.
I hope that helps. It doesn't help with my thinking This whole NFL and being a pro is becoming a joke to me anymore These players have played football, for most of them as kids. Learning and gaining experience as they grow into middle school, high school college. Then they are in a Professional football league. How they got there, does that change the fact they are considered professional ? As these players played and watched the game they should know. Not to down a punt return if your foot is standing on the goal line or catch the ball on the 2 yd line with no chances of running it back. Let the ball hit the ground and hope it goes into the end zone. Hell Pit you even know that. Here are words from Bubba himself. As the Browns watched their season spiral, Ventrone called out the lack of talent on his special teams unit as the reason for so many repeated errors. "We haven't played near our capabilities," Ventrone said in December. "We've had too many, too many issues with just, just dumb, dumb, dumb, dumb football, dumb mistakes.” So isn't it your job to coach and teach the players what to do and not to do on ST's ? Bubba was a Buffoon and couldn't coach his players up. Plain and simple. It's what coaches are meant to do. As so many said, if Bill Callahan was in Cleveland the Browns line would be better. Is that because Bill had players he didn't have to coach because they were just good. Or was it because Bill took players and coached them on how to be good ? Bubba is gone and you seem to have some kind of a coach crush on him. Stefanski is gone as well. Two coaches that not only fans saw that were't helping the team. So were the sport analysts who were saying the same thing. Idk, but I'm looking forward to seeing what the changes will bring. Might be God, or it might not. Until September, who knows.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,421
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,421 |
It seems rather odd that a guy that young would take "a five-year hiatus from coaching football". That or maybe that's just the best spin they could put on it? Maybe he wanted to spend time with his family or had personal reasons more important than a football game.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,700
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 13,700 |
I read he got into helping his family’s business, iirc
![[Linked Image from i28.photobucket.com]](http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c201/shadedog/mcenroe2.jpg) gmstrong -----------------
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,741
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,741 |
Of course as per usual that is the coaches fault and not the GM who built the roster. Did he coach them how not to catch a punt or kickoff? Did he teach them not to secure the ball? Some of the lengths people will go to in order to lay the fault at one mans feet amazes me. Well Bubba sure didn't teach them to block or tackle either. I mean he complained about having to many young guys on special tams. Umm Bubba you mean those young guys who are eager to learn, and chomping at the bit for any playing time 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,281
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,281 |
JC
In reading all the comments up to this point, my opinion is that it is a combination of all. Take your pick as to which you think was the main culprit, but either way a change was necessary.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759 |
My 2 cents worth. Our ST were awful ranked 29th if I recall correctly. Maybe we didn't have the talent I'll give you that, but didn't Bubba have these players since August? He was quoted as saying in December that we make too many dumb mistakes. The players have been making these so called "DUMB" mistakes since the season began. As the ST coach shouldn't you have been able to correct these dumb mistakes? You had 4 months. IMO the lack of talent doesn't equate to stupidity. How many times do you have to tell a player not to field the ball inside your 20 to just let it bounce into the end zone? I don't have the talent to play in the NFL but if a coach told me to do or not to do something like fielding a punt or not that has nothing to do with talent. It seems like Bubba didn't teach and coach our players up. Maybe they just tuned him out who knows. Let's hope our new coach can do better.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
You can lead a horse to water......
Ventrone was fired by the Browns on Jan. 29th. He was hired to the same job by the Rams on Feb. 2nd. He was out of a job for exactly four days.
It seems the rams identified what the problem was and it wasn't Ventrone.
You'll have to forgive me if I trust the opinion reached by one of the top rated teams in the NFL over posters on a message board.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
You can lead a horse to water......
Ventrone was fired by the Browns on Jan. 29th. He was hired to the same job by the Rams on Feb. 2nd. He was out of a job for exactly four days.
It seems the rams identified what the problem was and it wasn't Ventrone.
You'll have to forgive me if I trust the opinion reached by one of the top rated teams in the NFL over posters on a message board. You are also trusting the team that fired their last ST Coach mid-season and lost in the playoffs to a ST blunder. The Browns improved letting Bubba hit the road.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
The Browns improved letting Bubba hit the road. You have no way of knowing if that is true. You have no track record of the Browns newest hire ever holding this job before to base that on. If nobody ever fired anyone on their coaching staff there would never be an opening for anyone to be hired. That makes no sense. I'm trusting the team that won both the 2020 and 2022 Superbowls. I'm not sure who it you are trusting other than your "thoughts and feelings".
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
The Browns improved letting Bubba hit the road. You have no way of knowing if that is true. You have no track record of the Browns newest hire ever holding this job before to base that on. If nobody ever fired anyone on their coaching staff there would never be an opening for anyone to be hired. That makes no sense. I'm trusting the team that won both the 2020 and 2022 Superbowls. I'm not sure who it you are trusting other than your "thoughts and feelings". Only one way to go and that is up. The ST was that bad!!!!
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
I suppose you have no idea what the saying "Hold my beer" means. Still nothing to support your claim that the man they hired to replace Bubba will be any better. He's never held this position before. You just keep on making noise with no substance to back it up.
Somehow you keep insisting that the talent on the field had nothing to do with it. Same as it ever was.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
I suppose you have no idea what the saying "Hold my beer" means. Still nothing to support your claim that the man they hired to replace Bubba will be any better. He's never held this position before. You just keep on making noise with no substance to back it up.
Somehow you keep insisting that the talent on the field had nothing to do with it. Same as it ever was. And you're making the same claim that Bubba was better with no facts to back that statement up. I am just saying the Browns special teams were terrible under Bubba Ventrone that is a fact. They ranked near last in the NFL.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,342
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,342 |
Of course as per usual that is the coaches fault and not the GM who built the roster. Did he coach them how not to catch a punt or kickoff? Did he teach them not to secure the ball? Some of the lengths people will go to in order to lay the fault at one mans feet amazes me. Well Bubba sure didn't teach them to block or tackle either. I mean he complained about having to many young guys on special tams. Umm Bubba you mean those young guys who are eager to learn, and chomping at the bit for any playing time  Complaining about the roster makes a LOT more sense when you're talking about offense or defense... not so much special teams, IMO. ST units are made up almost entirely of backups... you may have 1-2 dedicated ST players, outside of kicker and punter. The rest are backup-caliber players that are contributing however they can to hang onto their roster spot. So the truth is that there isn't going to be very much difference in overall talent level throughout the league because they are all backup-caliber players.
"I'll take your word at face value. I have never met you but I assume you have a face..lol"
-Ballpeen
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,826
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,826 |
I suppose you have no idea what the saying "Hold my beer" means. Still nothing to support your claim that the man they hired to replace Bubba will be any better. He's never held this position before. You just keep on making noise with no substance to back it up.
Somehow you keep insisting that the talent on the field had nothing to do with it. Same as it ever was. Somehow our defense made capable players out of "bums", whereas our special teams failed even with players like Grant Delpit contributing. (and being named special teams player of the week a time or 2 last season) Every team in the NFL has base level playters on special teams. The Browns just made less of these players than other team did.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
Somehow our defense made capable players out of "bums" This is nonsense. The talent level between the defense and any other unit on this team are miles apart. Every team in the NFL has base level playters on special teams. The Browns just made less of these players than other team did. This is claiming the depth chart on every team has the same talent level. Once again nonsense.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
And you're making the same claim that Bubba was better with no facts to back that statement up. There's only one problem. I never said that. Your claim is the new guy is better. The only thing I've said is you don't know that and neither does anyone else. A swing and a miss! I am just saying the Browns special teams were terrible under Bubba Ventrone that is a fact. They ranked near last in the NFL. No, you said that it would be better since he left. That there was "nowhere to go but up ". You have laid all of the blame on him without admitting that the talent level played any part in it. Do even remember what you have been posting?
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759 |
I agree Oober and I would think those backup-caliber players being at the bottom of the roster would be doing everything they possibly could to hold down a roster spot by trying to learn and perform at their best, yet they were making the same mistakes all season and weren't any better at seasons end than at the beginning. That to me is on the coach.
Last edited by Homewood Dog; 02/12/26 03:47 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
And you're making the same claim that Bubba was better with no facts to back that statement up. There's only one problem. I never said that. Your claim is the new guy is better. The only thing I've said is you don't know that and neither does anyone else. A swing and a miss! I am just saying the Browns special teams were terrible under Bubba Ventrone that is a fact. They ranked near last in the NFL. No, you said that it would be better since he left. That there was "nowhere to go but up ". You have laid all of the blame on him without admitting that the talent level played any part in it. Do even remember what you have been posting? Bubba Ventrone sucked as Browns ST coach. Fact plain and simple.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
Bubba Ventrone sucked as Browns ST coach. Fact plain and simple. Not as plain and simple as you make it sound. I guess we'll find out. Unless of course the new guy is given better talent to work with. If so the product on the field should be better. Same goes with the offense. I guess you are going by a rule that doesn't exist. For future reference, no, you can't turn vinegar into wine.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
Every player that enters the NFL wants to succeed. They all do everything possible to make the roster and perform at their best. Most ST players are marginal and often times only make the roster to play on ST's and very limited situations. Most all ST's players are late round draft picks or picks from former years that could never make the 53 man roster. The odds of these players to ever make the 53 man roster are very slim.
It really has little if anything to do with desire or will. It has to do with them being on the fringe of having enough talent to hold an NFL contract.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 14,299
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 14,299 |
Or special teams were atrocious and badly coached regardless of the talent level... It was said early in the season and throughout the season. ST coach should have been fired during the season. This clip is from during the season after the 49ers game. They talk about special teams at the 16 and 1/2 minute Mark. https://www.youtube.com/live/xbpLwS3RqXo?si=MrLtO2gKiz-93WN2
The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,421
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,421 |
I read he got into helping his family’s business, iirc Thanks Lamp !
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,421
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,421 |
You can lead a horse to water......
Ventrone was fired by the Browns on Jan. 29th. He was hired to the same job by the Rams on Feb. 2nd. He was out of a job for exactly four days.
It seems the rams identified what the problem was and it wasn't Ventrone.
You'll have to forgive me if I trust the opinion reached by one of the top rated teams in the NFL over posters on a message board. Pit, you calling me a horse ? lol 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,826
Legend
|
OP
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 50,826 |
Somehow our defense made capable players out of "bums" This is nonsense. The talent level between the defense and any other unit on this team are miles apart. Every team in the NFL has base level playters on special teams. The Browns just made less of these players than other team did. This is claiming the depth chart on every team has the same talent level. Once again nonsense. Bums might be an overstatement, but on defense we had unheralded guys like Avery, Harden, Ross, Webb, Huntington, (who also helped on offense and special teams) Diabate, and Hickman, (who was developed over time) all contributing to the defense. It wasn't a case of All Pros everywhere on defense. We had these lesser talents helping, and doing a good job, as well.
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,741
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 27,741 |
Bubba Ventrone sucked as Browns ST coach. Fact plain and simple. Not as plain and simple as you make it sound. I guess we'll find out. Unless of course the new guy is given better talent to work with. If so the product on the field should be better. Same goes with the offense. I guess you are going by a rule that doesn't exist. For future reference, no, you can't turn vinegar into wine. If you want to turn water into wine I can't do it, but I know a guy 
I AM ALWAYS RIGHT... except when I am wrong.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,831
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 8,831 |
Of course as per usual that is the coaches fault and not the GM who built the roster. Did he coach them how not to catch a punt or kickoff? Did he teach them not to secure the ball? Some of the lengths people will go to in order to lay the fault at one mans feet amazes me. It’s no different than in baseball. You can’t crap can an entire team so the manager gets sacked. He’s naturally going to catch it fair or unfair. These guys know the way it works. ST’s were not performing as one would hope and a change was made. Lay it at Bubbas, Berrys, the players or all of the above feet but the coach is gonna go first most likely and did.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
And after this season it was the HC and the ST's coach. The DC knew what was actually going on in the building so he left too.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
And after this season it was the HC and the ST's coach. The DC knew what was actually going on in the building so he left too. You left out the part he tried to become head coach first part. That doesn't fit your agenda though!
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
Could you please translate that into English? I suppose you couldn't possibly fathom that it was this FO and owner who called him in to be interviewed for the HC position. As they do with all people they interview for coaching positions. All he did was take the interview. 
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
Could you please translate that into English? I suppose you couldn't possibly fathom that it was this FO and owner who called him in to be interviewed for the HC position. As they do with all people they interview for coaching positions. All he did was take the interview.  The media in the building said he told his staff if he does not get the head coaching job he is out and not coming back. He wanted the job. The Browns wanted him as DC. I do not dislike the hire they made at coach. Two things can be possible at the same time. I felt Schwartz performance deserved the promotion and am disappointed he did not get the job. That said I think they did hire a football guy that has won and had good offenses everywhere he has been. But to say Schwartz did not want to stay because of the FO is incorrect. He would have stayed with this FO if he would have got the Head Coaching job. He was upset and rightfully so that he did not get the promotion he deserved. He did a great job in Cleveland.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
Do you have any quotes to back up those rumors or just basing it on here say alone? "Some guy said" isn't quite enough to state something as a fact. At least not for most people.
Once again I never made a comment about who they hired. Sometimes your imagination runs away with you. I said the coaching staff in terms of the HC and ST's coach paid the price for a GM that gave them a terrible roster and he still has his job. If both the GM and HC had been fired I would have been fine with it. But as it turns out many times, the coaching staff paid the price for a GM's weaknesses.
Just ask the Titans, Vrabel and the Patriots how that worked out for them. I'm not sure why people watch the same movie over and over again and still can't figure out the plot.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 4,711 |
Do you have any quotes to back up those rumors or just basing it on here say alone? "Some guy said" isn't quite enough to state something as a fact. At least not for most people.
Once again I never made a comment about who they hired. Sometimes your imagination runs away with you. I said the coaching staff in terms of the HC and ST's coach paid the price for a GM that gave them a terrible roster and he still has his job. If both the GM and HC had been fired I would have been fine with it. But as it turns out many times, the coaching staff paid the price for a GM's weaknesses.
Just ask the Titans, Vrabel and the Patriots how that worked out for them. I'm not sure why people watch the same movie over and over again and still can't figure out the plot. I don't disagree with you Andrew Berry should have been fired. I agree.
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other peoples' money." Margarat Thatcher
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759 |
Why Berry wasn't fired is a matter of conjecture, but my take is he wasn't fired because of our last very good draft and some FA additions he made. Furthermore, he's probably the only one that will be able to maneuver us through our complicated cap situation. It might take a team of nuclear scientists to figure that out.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
No, a numbers guy is a numbers guy. There are a lot of them out there. So you're saying he was kept to fix the clusterfudge cap mess he himself created?
Sounds like Haslam thinking.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 572
All Pro
|
All Pro
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 572 |
Reality is, this is the work of Desean Watson's contract. Any good GM can Keep and improve 22 starting O and D players with the obstacles of large contracts. Problem here is, Berry doesn't have the longevity to bring in higher tier 3rd string, special teams specialists, because Watson's deal is eventually going to come into play. They had their shot 2-3 years ago with Watson's contract being pushed down the road. Now, they are setting up the roster to absorb the cost in 2027 so they don't have levity to sign better low end players and it is affecting the special teams lineup. Players signed in 2025-2027 will all be affected by Watson's endgame in 2027. Without a restructure (which I don't think is in play..does anyone want to see him here in 2027??) He is going to count $80.7M against the cap in 2026, then $50.4M against the 2027 cap, while on another teams roster. Unless there is another injury miracle, Watson is going to cost this team a lot of cap space over the next 2 years. Now, they are going to get some insurance relief on that $80.7M in 2026, but I don't think it has been released yet how much that is. We should know in the next 4 weeks or so as we get closer to the official start to the 2026 league year. It SHOULD be around $40M, but I don't know if anyone knows for sure yet.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,342
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,342 |
I have a hard time seeing how our contract/cap issues right now are affecting the portion of the roster that's by-and-large made up of league-minimum salaries and late-round draft contracts. Coverage units, in particular....
I could see the argument if our specialists were letting us down, as those salaries are on the lower side... but they actually bright spots, overall.
"I'll take your word at face value. I have never met you but I assume you have a face..lol"
-Ballpeen
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,281
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 40,281 |
I have a hard time seeing how our contract/cap issues right now are affecting the portion of the roster that's by-and-large made up of league-minimum salaries and late-round draft contracts. Coverage units, in particular....
I could see the argument if our specialists were letting us down, as those salaries are on the lower side... but they actually bright spots, overall. I agree Oobs. The days of having 2nd contract special teamers are pretty much over. As you said, it is pretty much guys on rookie deals once you get past the kickers. Those guys can get into 2nd, and even 3rd contracts.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 572
All Pro
|
All Pro
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 572 |
I have a hard time seeing how our contract/cap issues right now are affecting the portion of the roster that's by-and-large made up of league-minimum salaries and late-round draft contracts. Coverage units, in particular....
I could see the argument if our specialists were letting us down, as those salaries are on the lower side... but they actually bright spots, overall. I have a hard time seeing how our contract/cap issues right now are affecting the portion of the roster that's by-and-large made up of league-minimum salaries and late-round draft contracts. Coverage units, in particular....
I could see the argument if our specialists were letting us down, as those salaries are on the lower side... but they actually bright spots, overall. I agree Oobs. The days of having 2nd contract special teamers are pretty much over. As you said, it is pretty much guys on rookie deals once you get past the kickers. Those guys can get into 2nd, and even 3rd contracts. So for example, on punt team, the best special teams coverage units in 2025 were Washington Commanders 4.56yds/return and Indianapolis colts 6.31yds/return, the Browns were the worst in the nfl 12.73 yds/return. Taking specialists out of the pay equation, Kicker, Punter, Long Snapper. They have roles, but they are minimal... In this case of punt coverage, Bojorquez was only 24th in punt average, so we were low as a punter AND low as a coverage team. Average pay per special teams player: $1,561,168 - Commanders $1,393,707 - Colts $1,109,901 - Browns League minimum for 3yrs or less accrued experience in 2025 - $1,100,000 The Browns have been forced to take cheaper inexperienced players at the low end of the roster and it shows. We are talking ALL league minimum players. I don't know that is a true reality, since Berry keeps carrying over cap money, but the cap carryover is part of the plan to eventually pay off Watson's deal. Regardless, if money is an indicator of talent, Ventrone was working with less talent than at least the top two teams in this special teams category.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 572
All Pro
|
All Pro
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 572 |
In case you were wondering, the Browns were 26th in punt return average at 7.2 yards per return(returner plays a bigger role in this)... top of the league was New England at 17.3 yards per return.
Another one though to gauge the coordinator is special teams penalties.. Browns were second in the league with only 11 special teams penalties(2 pre-snap penalties, all season, tied for 4th best)... this would tell me it had more to do with talent than coordinator.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 572
All Pro
|
All Pro
Joined: Apr 2013
Posts: 572 |
No, a numbers guy is a numbers guy. There are a lot of them out there. So you're saying he was kept to fix the clusterfudge cap mess he himself created?
Sounds like Haslam thinking. I don't think that was what he was saying. We really aren't in cap hell like everyone says year over year.. even with Watson's contract. Now, it is eventually going to be starting this year, but no more than any other team with a half way decent QB. Our biggest issue is that QB they signed has only played 19 out of 51 games, and when he was in there he was well below average. His yards per attempt and yards per catch were the 3 worst seasons of his career. Despite the Watson situation, Berry kept rolling over the highest amount of salary cap of any team in the league the past two seasons. This is because we are eventually going to have to cut Watson post June-1st and we will need it. The thing is, from the time they signed Watson, until that date in 2027, the salary cap will have risen approximately $100M. So the actual cap will have eaten almost half of Watson's contract and injury insurance will get it down to a manageable number. THAT is why Berry still has a job, to go along with this past draft class, his first real draft class of his tenure. His first year drafting brought us Grant Delpit His second year brought JOK and Greg Newsome, I know we traded Newsome, but he was a good starter in this league for the 3 years he was here. Then he didn't have first round pick until last year... and only one second round pick in those 3 years. We can only hope, last year was a better indicator of his ability. We could be wrong, but we have a small sample size so it's all we have to go on.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
Every time the salary cap rises it rises for all teams. As the salary cap has risen so have the price of the player contracts. That's the very reason the salary cap rises. So any way you slice it we will have less salary cap money to sign higher priced players which other teams who didn't place themselves in this situation will have. For example......
Based on top-tier contract data, elite NFL offensive guards in the 2021-2022 era averaged roughly $10–$16 million annually, with premier players like Brandon Scherff and Joe Thuney reaching $16+ million per year.
For the 2025 NFL season, top-tier offensive guards are earning over $20 million annually, with elite players like Tyler Smith averaging $24 million and Trey Smith over $23.5 million.
These increased salaries are across the board from S to CB to WR to QB. Being at the lower end of salary caps among NFL teams makes it nearly impossible to compete for top players on the FA market. If you do manage to get one that's even less money you have to address other glaring needs with quality players. Guys with the least amount of money end up with the fewest good toys.
You know, like that one kid on the block who has a nice bicycle but every other toy his parents buy him come from the Dollar Tree.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759 |
AB also made some pretty good trades and FA signings. We got a better player back for Newsome and the Cooper and Jeudy trades were good for us too. I like AB and glad we kept him. I'm anxious to see how he does in the upcoming draft and FA period. If AB does as well this year as last, I think we can be very competitive this season.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,837
Dawg Talker
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 1,837 |
Yep, I am happy we kept AB too. For the reasons you and Irish mentioned.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Mar 2013
Posts: 5,759 |
Honestly, I liked KS too but after what I've been reading and what I heard on talk shows I'm glad we made a change. KS is knowledgeable and is a good coach IMO. From what I've read and heard on talk shows I think he was lacking with discipline and holding players and other coaches accountable. In other words, he was too easy on them. Todd Monken seems just the opposite, and he has a good track record as a coach. Will he work out? Who knows but I certainly hope so.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 78,684 |
Talk shows are where I get my opinions from. They have to know more than the Falcons do. I mean he couldn't even make the playoffs after this FO got Flacco off his couch.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,342
Legend
|
Legend
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,342 |
Taking specialists out of the pay equation, Kicker, Punter, Long Snapper. They have roles, but they are minimal... In this case of punt coverage, Bojorquez was only 24th in punt average, so we were low as a punter AND low as a coverage team. Average pay per special teams player: $1,561,168 - Commanders $1,393,707 - Colts $1,109,901 - Browns
League minimum for 3yrs or less accrued experience in 2025 - $1,100,000 While I didn't put a ton of time into it, this is what I was searching for the other day and kept running into the numbers of our specialists (kicker/punter/LS). So thank you for finding and posting that up. Also, your post about penalties was illuminating. I did not realize we were on the one end of the ST penalty rankings. Thank you for posting that. I can definitely see how those two things point to roster vs coaching regarding our ST woes. Now I'm wondering if that $400k difference in average pay was us not having that "ST ace" on the roster (ex. Cribbs, who was as good a gunner as he was a returner).
"I'll take your word at face value. I have never met you but I assume you have a face..lol"
-Ballpeen
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Browns hire new Special Teams
Coach
|
|