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#2146445 10/27/26 09:58 AM
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Before the Titans game I doubt that many could buy into true potential.

The offense was not good enough plain and simple. You can't continue to win games all year in the fashion we were winning games.

A good defense can only take you so far. You have to score points and 17 points per game is not going to do that.

In the Titans game Sampson returned. Judkins prior to the Titans game had not looked good. DW had not put together a full game.

491 yards of offense and DW looking like a real NFL quarterback changes things. The question now is can the offense repeat how they played in that game?

If they can we will be for some kind of ride.

This game against the Steelers in Pittsburgh will tell what kind of potential the Browns will have going forward.

bonefish #2146455 10/27/26 11:12 AM
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it is traditionally the most difficult game of the season - we're used to being lambs to the slaughter there, even if we have talent

It's a good measuring stick to see if these guys are intimidated or ready for a big game (Pittsburgh has much more experience, which IMO is the difference in the game)

Eliminating negative plays will go a long way IMO


"First down inside the 10. A score here will put us in the Super Bowl. Boston is far to the left as KC settles into the slot. Fannin is flanked out wide to the right. Judkins and Sampson are split in the backfield as the ball is hiked ... Here we go."
bonefish #2146461 10/27/26 01:16 PM
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If you go back and look at each game we have played in order.

You have to look at how we changed from week to week. We got blown out by the Jags. We stunk. The team looked ill-prepared. We could not do a thing on either side of the ball.
We had a load of penalties. DW job was on the line.

Game two we played better. However, the offense still looked bad and the penalties were still happening.

The Panthers, Steelers, Jets, and Ravens games were mostly about the defense. The offense was performing in the 4th to win close games. We lost to the Jets in bad weather because of a muffed punt.

Finally in the Titans game the offense put together 4 quarters and the defense faltered.

I watched most of the Steelers/Saints game. The Steelers were not some dominant force. They won a close game helped by critical turnovers by the Saints.

In week two the Steelers were gashed by the Pats 20-3. Lots of 3 and outs.

I don't see the Steelers as anything special. If the defense can put pressure on Rodgers and the offense plays like we did against the Titans.

We will win this game.

bonefish #2146474 10/27/26 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted by bonefish
If you go back and look at each game we have played in order.

You have to look at how we changed from week to week. We got blown out by the Jags. We stunk. The team looked ill-prepared. We could not do a thing on either side of the ball.
We had a load of penalties. DW job was on the line.

Game two we played better. However, the offense still looked bad and the penalties were still happening.

The Panthers, Steelers, Jets, and Ravens games were mostly about the defense. The offense was performing in the 4th to win close games. We lost to the Jets in bad weather because of a muffed punt.

Finally in the Titans game the offense put together 4 quarters and the defense faltered.

I watched most of the Steelers/Saints game. The Steelers were not some dominant force. They won a close game helped by critical turnovers by the Saints.

In week two the Steelers were gashed by the Pats 20-3. Lots of 3 and outs.

I don't see the Steelers as anything special. If the defense can put pressure on Rodgers and the offense plays like we did against the Titans.

We will win this game.

I think this game comes down to two things win the turnover battle and can the Browns contain Jaylen Warran. Hold him under 100 rushing and limit his receiving yards and the Browns have a chance. If he runs for 120+ and adds another 40+ receiving and the Steelers win this game going away. Turn the ball over at 3 rivers and well we have seen that game to many times in years past. I expect a low scoring game. Lower than the 1st matches up because both defensive coaches know the others game now. Jaylen Warren presents the biggest issue for the Browns D. Limit him, and don't give them easy points off turnovers and keep them under 17 and the Browns can win this game.

bonefish #2146475 10/27/26 03:58 PM
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Our run defense fell apart against the Titans.

I am sure that will be emphasized in this week's practice. The Steelers saw the film and will try to run on us.

Watching Rodgers it is clear. If you give him time. He will pick you apart. Metcalf's speed and size is a problem.

However, like every quarterback pressure is the key. We have to apply constant pressure. And we need to do it from different looks.

We can beat this team. We proved that already.

This is going to be an intense game. The crowd will be into it.

It should be a hard fought tight game. I sure hope we can win it.

bonefish #2146528 10/28/26 04:38 PM
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To me, the way Watson plays is key. If he keeps making mistake free football and plays at the speed of this last game then the Browns will destroy the Steelers. If Watson comes out with hesitation and letting the pressure of the game bog him down we could lose.


You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
Razorthorns #2146535 10/28/26 04:53 PM
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It seems obvious to me the reason he played the way he did the last game was in large part due to the running game. When you can run the ball well the QB doesn't receive the pressure he gets from the opposing D as he would if you can't run the ball. It makes it much easier for him to get into rhythm and get into his comfort zone. If they are stopping the run and getting pressure with a four man front easily they can drop more players into coverage as well. This greatly increase the pressure and difficulty factor for your QB.

That's what we were seeing until last week. A lot of pressures and QB hits and often with no place to throw the ball. The ability to run the ball against the Steelers will help determine the outcome of this game. That combined with the ability to get pressure on Rodgers.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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Razorthorns #2146538 10/28/26 04:55 PM
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I hope this past game was the tipping point.

It was the first time I have seen him play within structure. He stayed calm in the pocket and got the ball out. He stepped up in the pocket.

He played with confidence. He found the open guy and was fairly accurate. He is starting to develop the necessary chemistry with his receivers. The touches are being spread around.

Not sure who will be at RT. But Watt has to be handled. They are going to have to chip him.

Need to stay ahead of the chains. The run game will be important to stay away from third and long.

We have the players to win this game. DW has to be the point guard and distribute the ball.

bonefish #2146548 10/28/26 07:03 PM
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I don't think anything that happened in the Titans game matters except that we didn't blow it. They're a bad defense against which we should have done exactly what we did. Their only saving grace on D is that while they tend to give up tons of yardage, they somehow pull it together to not always give up 7.

Now, if we can come out against a relatively mid Steelers team and beat them a 2nd time....then we can start talking about potential.
Right now, it feels like we just keep stealing wins. I think we need to see the OLine do a decent job more often. We need to see these receivers and TEs getting open, and we need to see Watson actually finding them -- WITHOUT them dropping it, and we need that run game to keep looking functional.


Browns is the Browns

... there goes Joe Thomas, the best there ever was in this game.

PitDAWG #2146557 10/28/26 10:44 PM
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Originally Posted by PitDAWG
It seems obvious to me the reason he played the way he did the last game was in large part due to the running game. When you can run the ball well the QB doesn't receive the pressure he gets from the opposing D as he would if you can't run the ball. It makes it much easier for him to get into rhythm and get into his comfort zone. If they are stopping the run and getting pressure with a four man front easily they can drop more players into coverage as well. This greatly increase the pressure and difficulty factor for your QB.

That's what we were seeing until last week. A lot of pressures and QB hits and often with no place to throw the ball. The ability to run the ball against the Steelers will help determine the outcome of this game. That combined with the ability to get pressure on Rodgers.

Still the big difference was that he got the ball out super fast. He knew where he was going within 2 seconds and got the ball gone. That is a mental development. It doesn't matter what the defense is doing if he keeps getting rid of the ball that fast. Even bad olines can block for 2 seconds. Watson making decisions to throw that fast means he trusts the recievers to fight for the ball if he throws into traffic. The way he recovered after the interception also tells me Monken won't bust his balls for a mistake or two which is a huge improvement over Kevin's style of coaching.


You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
bonefish #2146563 10/29/26 09:07 AM
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As Rodney Dangerfield used to say "no respect."

I knew going into this game how the media would react. Very few will believe in the Browns.

And so it is. It is almost like we didn't play the Steelers and beat them. "They won some games in the fourth quarter."

mmmm. I guess when another team does that it counts more.

Games in the NFL are won and lost in the fourth quarter. Just a heads up there. Oh, by the way that is how we beat the Steelers.

I am glad that we are the underdogs. It will make winning sweeter.

bonefish #2146566 10/29/26 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by bonefish
Games in the NFL are won and lost in the fourth quarter. Just a heads up there.

As soon as we pummel someone, they'll just say it was a fluke.


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
bonefish #2146567 10/29/26 09:26 AM
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Agreed. My attitude; let them disrespect us. Who cares? I don't mind being the underdog. Todd Monken has instilled good worth ethic and the right attitude in this team. Keep playing hard and let the chips fall where they may.

bonefish #2146575 10/29/26 10:48 AM
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Browns May Have Found Football’s Next Dynamic Duo in These Two Rookies

Cleveland has two young studs on their roster, and they are on pace to take over the league


Louis Timura
|Oct 28, 2026

Coming into the 2026 NFL Season, the Cleveland Browns were in desperate need of wide receiver help.

Luckily for the organization, they were able to draft KC Concepcion and Denzel Boston in this past year's NFL Draft.

Seven weeks into their young careers, Concepcion and Boston are already proving that they are poised to be the NFL's next dynamic duo.




Putting Up Big Numbers

In the first seven weeks, each receiver has put up some big-time performances for the Browns.

For Boston, he leads all rookie receivers in touchdowns with three. Meanwhile, Concepcion is coming off a dominant game where he had eight receptions for 129 yards.

The two receivers rank second and third in total receiving yards, only behind the first receiver drafted, which was Carnell Tate.

Looking at the pace, both guys are projected to get close to that 1,000-yard mark. If they keep up the production they have had, there is no doubt they could both reach quadruple digits in their first season.


The Future

As long as the injury bug doesn't come around too often or severely, Cleveland has their wide receiver room set for the foreseable future with the two rookies and second year man Isaiah Bond.

It's all just a matter of who the quarterback is.

If the Browns can find a top-tier guy, they will have the chance to put together a team that can win lots of games, go on playoff runs, and maybe just try and compete for that coveted championship.

Regardless, having multiple great receiving options means whoever does inevitably take over the offense will have help. It does not fully matter if the Browns have a top quarterback or not.


Young Team, Big Goals

Outside of Boston and Concepcion, the Browns have had back to back phenominal draft classes.

Some other big names the Browns have drafted in the past two season are:

Carson Schwesinger (2025)
Mason Graham (2025)
Quinshon Judkins (2025)
Harold Fannin Jr. (2025)
Shedeur Sanders (2025)
Spencer Fano (2026)
Emmanuel McNeil-Warren (2026)
Austin Barber (2026)

If the Browns can figure out a quarterback that can take them to the playoffs in the near future, they can capitalize on all these star players being on their rookie contracts.

It's also a good time to note that they just traded for Jared Verse, who was drafted in 2024 and won DROY after his rookie campaign.

While Deshaun Watson has been winning games, how sustainable is the injury-prone 31-year-old? Now more than ever, Cleveland truly is a quarterback away.


Still More To Come

After the 2025 NFL Draft, I thought the Browns had to have just gotten lucky by getting so many great players. Then, they clearly did it again.

Something has changed in the front office, and Andrew Berry is seeing prospects clearer than ever.

Now is a great time to be reminded that Cleveland has 11 picks in the upcoming 2027 NFL Draft. Not only do they have two first-round picks, but over the past two seasons have been known to trade up and down and move all around the board while collecting more and more assets.

What if the Browns have another winning draft?

The future is clearly bright for a team with such a dark past. Cleveland, it's time to get excited.


https://www.si.com/nfl/browns/onsi/...ic-duo-in-these-two-rookies-01m5zcgzhafe


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
FATE #2146582 10/29/26 11:52 AM
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The Browns have not had this many good young players since I don't know when.

I don't want to get too far down the road on this. We are 7 games into the 2026 season.

Deshaun Watson turned 31 in September. We are playing Rodgers Sunday who will be 43 in December.

Nobody knows how this year will end.

If we win Sunday the odds to make the playoffs go to 80% plus.

When this season does end how Berry and Browns address DW only they know.

One thing is for certain whoever plays quarterback for the Browns in 2027 will have a good team around them.

Razorthorns #2146583 10/29/26 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Razorthorns
Still the big difference was that he got the ball out super fast. He knew where he was going within 2 seconds and got the ball gone. That is a mental development. It doesn't matter what the defense is doing if he keeps getting rid of the ball that fast. Even bad olines can block for 2 seconds. Watson making decisions to throw that fast means he trusts the recievers to fight for the ball if he throws into traffic. The way he recovered after the interception also tells me Monken won't bust his balls for a mistake or two which is a huge improvement over Kevin's style of coaching.

That only works when watson is protected for those two plus seconds and his WR's are open. Trying to pretend those weren't the problems that existed before before is to deny what we all saw.

Watson's average time before releasing thew ball in the Titans game was 2.74 seconds according to Gemini AI. They state that according to NFL Next Gen Stats tracking in week 1 it was 2.82 seconds against the Jags and 2.55 seconds against the Panthers. In week 6 against the Ravens it was 2.89 seconds. just over one tenth of a second longer. He has had games he has held the ball longer than these games but it fluctuates and this isn't some new thing as it seems you are presenting it.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

#gmstrong
PitDAWG #2146586 10/29/26 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by Razorthorns
Still the big difference was that he got the ball out super fast. He knew where he was going within 2 seconds and got the ball gone. That is a mental development. It doesn't matter what the defense is doing if he keeps getting rid of the ball that fast. Even bad olines can block for 2 seconds. Watson making decisions to throw that fast means he trusts the recievers to fight for the ball if he throws into traffic. The way he recovered after the interception also tells me Monken won't bust his balls for a mistake or two which is a huge improvement over Kevin's style of coaching.

That only works when watson is protected for those two plus seconds and his WR's are open. Trying to pretend those weren't the problems that existed before before is to deny what we all saw.

Watson's average time before releasing thew ball in the Titans game was 2.74 seconds according to Gemini AI. They state that according to NFL Next Gen Stats tracking in week 1 it was 2.82 seconds against the Jags and 2.55 seconds against the Panthers. In week 6 against the Ravens it was 2.89 seconds. just over one tenth of a second longer. He has had games he has held the ball longer than these games but it fluctuates and this isn't some new thing as it seems you are presenting it.

Disagree. It is a new thing. You just had to watch it with your eyes and not rely on the most misleading stat in the history of football.


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
FATE #2146588 10/29/26 12:40 PM
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So how long he held the ball wasn't almost exactly the same inn some other games and in one game even less than the game against the Titans? That doesn't prove this statement false?

Quote
Still the big difference was that he got the ball out super fast.

This isn't some big secret. It isn't misleading any any way. It's a very basic concept.

Other teams were getting pressure and stopping the run with a four man fronts. They were applying pressure to watson much quicker on a regular basis.

This allowed them to drop more players into pass coverage. With more men in coverage the WR's were covered and it did not allow for his quick hit targets to be open nearly as much as they were in the Titans game. They didn't have to respect the run game before. With the run game clicking on all cylinders they couldn't sell out by attacking the QB or dropping more men into coverage like in games before.

Those are the factors that lead to holding the ball and or lower competition percentages. That tends to make QB's look worse than they actually are.

This is a team sport and without the ability to protect the QB and run the ball it makes for a huge difference in what a QB can and can not do. That's actually football 101 and those denying that are those who are either being deceptive, fooling themselves or being in denial.

watson played much better because the opportunities were there for him to do so unlike other games.

You can either use the passing game to open up the running game or use the running game to open up the passing game. In this case the Browns used the running game to open up the passing game.

None of this is difficult. watson did a great job of using the the opportunities given to him. Those same opportunities did not exist when the Browns lacked the ability to run the ball.

The ability to have a great running game was the new thing. everything else fed off of that. Or are you trying to say that the first game they had a dominant running game happened at the same time watson played much better is some freaky coincidence?


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

#gmstrong
PitDAWG #2146590 10/29/26 01:21 PM
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Cool story. I was talking about your TTT (time to throw) stats you supplied to refute him getting the ball out faster. Those stats are trash, they take nothing into account besides a snap-by-snap measurement of how long the ball was in the QB's hands before a throw. I'm 100% sure his statement about being "super fast" was Watson's decisiveness, not a hyper-analytical stopwatch comment. You just saw something to argue about and took the opportunity.

Now you pivot and talk about all the other factors that led to Watson being more effective, and in doing so basically contradict your own original statements. That's fine, and all of your points therein are valid, but you're just trying to create another argument out of thin air.

TTT stats are trash. That's all.


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
bonefish #2146591 10/29/26 01:22 PM
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The part that is missing is the single play.

Averages can be misleading.


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You seem quite sure that ""super fast" isn't about time. Normal people think that when a person is claiming someone did something faster when they actually didn't is directly related to time. Hmmmmm....

I've used the exact same explanation as to why watson played better in several posts. It isn't my fault you weren't paying attention. It wasn't a pivot.

Claiming this was because watson had some epiphany that suddenly turned him from a frog into a prince in a week is nonsense.

But I get it. We now live in the world of "He didn't mean what he said".


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

#gmstrong
PitDAWG #2146593 10/29/26 03:32 PM
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I'm quite sure that "super fast" is related to his processing speed and decision making. Not some psycho-analytical statement related to his time to throw compared to every other snap in every other game using a stupid metric.

That's all. Now get your last word and go hump someone else's leg, l'il doggie.


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
FATE #2146595 10/29/26 03:46 PM
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You brought your leg into this topic to be humped. Nobody invited you.

When your first read is open there is nothing to process. When they have to account for the running game your first read will be open more often.

Having to go through your progressions because your first and sometimes second reads are covered takes more time to process. Opposing D's can dedicate more players in coverage when you can stop the run with four up front. That has been the case all along until the Titans game when the Browns ran all over them.

The circumstances are what changed in this game.

This has nothing to do with processing information faster. He also said this.....

Quote
He knew where he was going within 2 seconds and got the ball gone.

Are you trying to claim that isn't about time either? It seems my pointing out the falsehood in that statement really bothers you. That's a you problem.

I'm glad you decided to move on. You were making a feeble attempt at a silly argument. The weight you were adding to my jockstrap was making it very difficult to walk.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

#gmstrong
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Good dawgie.


HERE WE GO BROWNIES! HERE WE GO!!
FATE #2146597 10/29/26 03:56 PM
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Here kitty kitty.......


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

#gmstrong
PitDAWG #2146610 10/30/26 01:30 AM
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Originally Posted by PitDAWG
You brought your leg into this topic to be humped. Nobody invited you.

When your first read is open there is nothing to process. When they have to account for the running game your first read will be open more often.

Having to go through your progressions because your first and sometimes second reads are covered takes more time to process. Opposing D's can dedicate more players in coverage when you can stop the run with four up front. That has been the case all along until the Titans game when the Browns ran all over them.

The circumstances are what changed in this game.

This has nothing to do with processing information faster. He also said this.....

Quote
He knew where he was going within 2 seconds and got the ball gone.

Are you trying to claim that isn't about time either? It seems my pointing out the falsehood in that statement really bothers you. That's a you problem.

I'm glad you decided to move on. You were making a feeble attempt at a silly argument. The weight you were adding to my jockstrap was making it very difficult to walk.

Watson was visibly faster getting rid of the ball. He was making much faster decisions. Anyone who pays attention to QBs can easily see that. For a QB to make decisions that fast means he knew where he wanted to go with the ball before he snapped it because he read the defense and was keyed in on the tells. It also showed he is starting to have genuine trust in his WRs. To me this means Monken has loosened the chains and told him to let the ball rip which actually plays to Watson's strengths as a QB. Kevin was a control freak in how he wanted QBs to play and it was toxic to our QBs IMHO. Watson is getting looser, more decisive, and confident thanks to Monken.

Now that was how he played against Ten. How will he do against the Steelers? That to me will be the true mark of his development. Can he repeat that fast decision making and get that ball out fast when the Steelers are smashing his face in? Guess we will find out. BTW when Watson takes less than 2.9 second to throw the ball ... we win.


You can't fix stupid but you can destroy ignorance. When you destroy ignorance you remove the justifications for evil. If you want to destroy evil then educate our people. Hate is a tool of the stupid to deal with what they can't understand.
PitDAWG #2146613 10/30/26 04:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Razorthorns
He was making much faster decisions. Anyone who pays attention to QBs can easily see that. For a QB to make decisions that fast means he knew where he wanted to go with the ball before he snapped it

Being sceptical of DW's sudden ability to make faster and better decisions - I'd suggest that predetermining where to throw the ball before the snap and alway throwing that pass will be exploited by good defenses and good coordinators. We've had other QB's who threw the ball based on pre-snap reads and it might have gone well for a game or two (or more) but the NFL catches up quickly. I have less faith in Watson being able to process faster than I do in Monken creating cleaner receiving targets.

Does anyone remember at least a couple - maybe more - articles and analysis about Stefanski's offense and breaking down plays highlighting what little separation the CLE receivers had from other CLE receivers ... we aren't talking about the separation the receiver had from a defender... we're talking how bunched up and close to one another the CLE QB's targets were. Other than a slant play where the inside receiver might look to clear out space for the slant, I don't remember seeing many plays where the WR's or TE are stacked together with Monken. To be fair - it's something I haven't been watching for, I only just thought of that angle. But if my memory is working I think that may be one of the distinct differentiators in KS and Monken's offense. I also hadn't thought about it - but I do think Watson may have less reading to do and might be working one part of the field until a play breaks down and then he improvs. . . . I'll watch for both facets on Sunday (and maybe be proven wrong!)

Last edited by mgh888; 10/30/26 04:59 AM.

The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
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Its funny there have been many times a good coach comes into a team and turns it around. I think most just cant imagine it happening to us because it never has. This could be it!


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Razorthorns #2146639 10/30/26 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Razorthorns
Watson was visibly faster getting rid of the ball. He was making much faster decisions. Anyone who pays attention to QBs can easily see that. For a QB to make decisions that fast means he knew where he wanted to go with the ball before he snapped it because he read the defense and was keyed in on the tells. It also showed he is starting to have genuine trust in his WRs. To me this means Monken has loosened the chains and told him to let the ball rip which actually plays to Watson's strengths as a QB. Kevin was a control freak in how he wanted QBs to play and it was toxic to our QBs IMHO. Watson is getting looser, more decisive, and confident thanks to Monken.

Now that was how he played against Ten. How will he do against the Steelers? That to me will be the true mark of his development. Can he repeat that fast decision making and get that ball out fast when the Steelers are smashing his face in? Guess we will find out. BTW when Watson takes less than 2.9 second to throw the ball ... we win.

It's not a question of if he was getting rid of the ball more quickly. Which according to the times I have shown you to be factual it wasn't much faster than some other games and even slower than in one game this season.

The question becomes why? What circumstances were different that created that situation?

The Browns rushed for 183 yards with 3 td's and averaging 6.3 yards per carry.

Quite simply the Titans had to defend against the run which doesn't allow them to drop more players back into coverage.

When a QB's first read is open, they get rid of the ball quickly. There's really not much left to decide or process at that point. When a QB doesn't have his first read open he has to start going through his progressions. That takes longer. Even if his second target is open he gets to that read quickly. What we have seen in the past this season isn't that he was slower at processing or getting rid of the ball. It was that he didn't have to search for an open target. They were open.

It's sort of odd to me that you can't see this. In another thread discussing the WR's you yourself said you weren't impressed with KC. That he didn't get open that much and disappeared in a lot of games. Yet not in this game. You haven't figured out the reason why? Because he was open which made it easy to get the ball out to him quickly. When you are running all over them they tend to focus more on that.

And here is another thing that was a reason there seemed to be such s difference. In the Titans game watson was only sacked one time. The D only made contact with him 5 times and he was only hurried on 5 plays out of 38 drop backs. That allows for a comfort zone he hadn't seen this season.

Allow me to ask you a very basic question here. If KC and Fannin had been covered when he went through his progressions, could he have gotten rid of the ball as fast and made the decision to throw the ball as quickly? When you look at your first target and second targets and one of those two options are open the QB gets rid of the ball quickly. It's that simple.

Just one more question. If the Browns get into a game where the opposing D can stop the run and get pressure on watson with four or five guys and drop more players into coverage as we saw up until the titans game will you claim watson regressed and is less decisive because his initial targets are covered?

These things either work or don't work when looking at what else is happening on the field of play.

When you can run all over your opponent and your initial targets are wide open, QB's get rid of thew ball with success much quicker. They look decisive because because they can throw the ball to an open target.

According to your logic it seems you think watson turned from a frog into a prince over the course of a week in season 10 of his NFL career. That's not what happened here.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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mgh888 #2146657 10/30/26 02:29 PM
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Originally Posted by mgh888
Originally Posted by Razorthorns
He was making much faster decisions. Anyone who pays attention to QBs can easily see that. For a QB to make decisions that fast means he knew where he wanted to go with the ball before he snapped it

Being sceptical of DW's sudden ability to make faster and better decisions - I'd suggest that predetermining where to throw the ball before the snap and alway throwing that pass will be exploited by good defenses and good coordinators. We've had other QB's who threw the ball based on pre-snap reads and it might have gone well for a game or two (or more) but the NFL catches up quickly. I have less faith in Watson being able to process faster than I do in Monken creating cleaner receiving targets.

Does anyone remember at least a couple - maybe more - articles and analysis about Stefanski's offense and breaking down plays highlighting what little separation the CLE receivers had from other CLE receivers ... we aren't talking about the separation the receiver had from a defender... we're talking how bunched up and close to one another the CLE QB's targets were. Other than a slant play where the inside receiver might look to clear out space for the slant, I don't remember seeing many plays where the WR's or TE are stacked together with Monken. To be fair - it's something I haven't been watching for, I only just thought of that angle. But if my memory is working I think that may be one of the distinct differentiators in KS and Monken's offense. I also hadn't thought about it - but I do think Watson may have less reading to do and might be working one part of the field until a play breaks down and then he improvs. . . . I'll watch for both facets on Sunday (and maybe be proven wrong!)

I think it's normal to be skeptical of WHY he was suddenly making much faster throws. I am going to say from my perspective that it's impossible to make decisions that fast unless you read the defense and was looking for a certain trigger sign that tells you who you plan to throw the ball to. He obviously threw into coverage several times but trusted his receiver to fight and catch the ball. That will definitely cause some problems against a better team. The real question is if that game was just a fluke or has Monken woken something up in Watson through good coaching. I honestly don't know. I just know it was the first time he played with confidence and purpose in this throws.

Part of that is that Kevin is well known as a control freak as a play caller. He wanted QBs to do exactly what he called and not deviate. It's one of the reason Baker hated him so much. It's also one of the reasons our QBs didn't do well because they became scared to make mistakes. Monken is more a process type guy. He wants players to follow a process and then be bold. Monken also doesn't beat a QB over the head with their mistakes and just go through the process to hammer down the process better. I am a HUGE fan of Monken for this. Teach a QB how to make decisions and then let them make them. I can't stand Watson as a person but he is really getting better as a QB in every game. If he keeps up like this he is going to get resigned.


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PitDAWG #2146658 10/30/26 02:50 PM
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Originally Posted by PitDAWG
Originally Posted by Razorthorns
Watson was visibly faster getting rid of the ball. He was making much faster decisions. Anyone who pays attention to QBs can easily see that. For a QB to make decisions that fast means he knew where he wanted to go with the ball before he snapped it because he read the defense and was keyed in on the tells. It also showed he is starting to have genuine trust in his WRs. To me this means Monken has loosened the chains and told him to let the ball rip which actually plays to Watson's strengths as a QB. Kevin was a control freak in how he wanted QBs to play and it was toxic to our QBs IMHO. Watson is getting looser, more decisive, and confident thanks to Monken.

Now that was how he played against Ten. How will he do against the Steelers? That to me will be the true mark of his development. Can he repeat that fast decision making and get that ball out fast when the Steelers are smashing his face in? Guess we will find out. BTW when Watson takes less than 2.9 second to throw the ball ... we win.

It's not a question of if he was getting rid of the ball more quickly. Which according to the times I have shown you to be factual it wasn't much faster than some other games and even slower than in one game this season.

The question becomes why? What circumstances were different that created that situation?

The Browns rushed for 183 yards with 3 td's and averaging 6.3 yards per carry.

Quite simply the Titans had to defend against the run which doesn't allow them to drop more players back into coverage.

When a QB's first read is open, they get rid of the ball quickly. There's really not much left to decide or process at that point. When a QB doesn't have his first read open he has to start going through his progressions. That takes longer. Even if his second target is open he gets to that read quickly. What we have seen in the past this season isn't that he was slower at processing or getting rid of the ball. It was that he didn't have to search for an open target. They were open.

It's sort of odd to me that you can't see this. In another thread discussing the WR's you yourself said you weren't impressed with KC. That he didn't get open that much and disappeared in a lot of games. Yet not in this game. You haven't figured out the reason why? Because he was open which made it easy to get the ball out to him quickly. When you are running all over them they tend to focus more on that.

And here is another thing that was a reason there seemed to be such s difference. In the Titans game watson was only sacked one time. The D only made contact with him 5 times and he was only hurried on 5 plays out of 38 drop backs. That allows for a comfort zone he hadn't seen this season.

Allow me to ask you a very basic question here. If KC and Fannin had been covered when he went through his progressions, could he have gotten rid of the ball as fast and made the decision to throw the ball as quickly? When you look at your first target and second targets and one of those two options are open the QB gets rid of the ball quickly. It's that simple.

Just one more question. If the Browns get into a game where the opposing D can stop the run and get pressure on watson with four or five guys and drop more players into coverage as we saw up until the titans game will you claim watson regressed and is less decisive because his initial targets are covered?

These things either work or don't work when looking at what else is happening on the field of play.

When you can run all over your opponent and your initial targets are wide open, QB's get rid of thew ball with success much quicker. They look decisive because because they can throw the ball to an open target.

According to your logic it seems you think watson turned from a frog into a prince over the course of a week in season 10 of his NFL career. That's not what happened here.


Some fair questions.

Yes, when a qb's first read is open it speeds up the game for him. No doubt. But that seldom happens unless the QB is reading the defence presnap and KNOWS where the open guy is going to be. Then he has to have the confidence to TRUST how he read the defense and that his receiver is going to get open or fight for the ball if they are not.

yes, when you can run the ball it helps a lot too. I mean it was against the Titans but we are the team who has scored the most points against them all season so far. The thing is when you can pass the ball effectively beyond dink and dunk passes it opens up the run game because they can't just stack the line to stop the run. I don't think it's a surprise that as Watson suddenly started opening up the pass game that our running game got much better. The thing is that when both the run game and the passing game are working it opens up the game for BOTH like a self feeding loop. The trope of a good run game opens up the passing game is only true when you have an offensive line that can dominate. The Browns do NOT have a dominant offensive line. I think this game is a case of the Titan's defense sucks so all facets of our offense was working.

Yeah, Watson got sacked less because he got rid of the ball fast. Funny how that works ... We have also won every single game where watson gets rid of the ball in under 2.9 seconds and when he takes longer we lose.

If the receiver are covered then I expect him to know that and RUN. Don't just sit there and get hit. Making that decision is also important. So far we only have one game against a bad team to show he is capable of making fast decisions. I am not ready to anoint him as the second coming so don't over play what I am saying. I am only saying he has made progress and shown what he can do in THIS system and under this coach for ONE GAME. I hope to see him continue that level of play because I am a Browns fan not a Watson fan.

All I am saying is that Watson has shown improvement from the start of the season and it LOOKS like Monken is doing some fine coaching for Watson because he is transforming before my eyes. He IS making faster decisions. He IS more confident. He IS far happier. He IS making better throws. I just hope he continues that against Pittsburg who is an actually decent team and will sack him several times.

As a side note, it might actually be the offensive line is starting to click. They are a group of guys who are playing together for the first time. It takes time to build chemistry for an offensive line. So MAYBE, just MAYBE we have several factors all coming together to improve the team compared to the start of the year. Either way, I am rooting for the Browns to win!!!!


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Razorthorns #2146662 10/30/26 03:38 PM
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Plays when called most often already have your route tree included in the play call. A QB doesn't normally decide on his own which target is his go to read. That target is either open or he isn't. The same with the second designated target in the play design.

In the Titans game they used the run to open up the pass. Not the other way around. All three TD's were scored on rushing plays.

Prior to putting up 183 rushing yards against the Titans, the last time the Browns rushed for at least 183 yards in a regular season game was on September 18, 2023, when they ran for 198 yards against the Pittsburgh Steelers.


Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.

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