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First I'd like to say that I'm watching way too much news again.  I was much happier being ignorant.  I defended Barack in a thread I started against what I considered slimey attacks against him being Anti- American. Now we hear all the crap his minister is saying. I don't believe for a minute that he agrees with this crap but I am troubled by it. This man is close friend of Obama. He married him and his wife, baptized his children. Obama has come out strongly today, distancing himself from Rev. Wright. He has said he never heard one of these Sermons when he attended services. With making that last statement, he is possibly opening himself to be wrong. If it is proven that he was indeed present, he will look like a liar. People are always being judged by the company they keep. Right or wrong, that is reality. What I want to know is how will this affect him. Will it just blow over? Will it turn off many who might vote for him? Will it cost him the nomination even though he is leading by over 100 delegates and popular vote? If he gets the nomination, will it be used against him in such a way where he will be crippled? Again, I want to make it perfectly clear that I don't blame Obama for what Rev. Wright says. I find it troubling that he is so close to this guy. Also, for the record I did vote for Obama last week.
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Well, at least as a "non-Democrat," I feel you voted the right way. The thing is, I am only an Obama supporter because I feel it is imperative to the value of the future of America to keep Bill Clinton OUT.
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http://www.tucc.org/about.htmYeah, I think it hurts him. This is the stated vision of Obama's church. They are unashamedly "black". I see this as unabashedly being racist. From the church's website:The Pastor as well as the membership of Trinity United Church of Christ is committed to a 10-point Vision: 1. A congregation committed to ADORATION. 2. A congregation preaching SALVATION. 3. A congregation actively seeking RECONCILIATION. 4. A congregation with a non-negotiable COMMITMENT TO AFRICA. 5. A congregation committed to BIBLICAL EDUCATION. 6. A congregation committed to CULTURAL EDUCATION. 7. A congregation committed to the HISTORICAL EDUCATION OF AFRICAN PEOPLE IN DIASPORA. 8. A congregation committed to LIBERATION. 9. A congregation committed to RESTORATION. 10. A congregation working towards ECONOMIC PARITY. These folks are frightening to me! I don't like any of the candidates but I would take Hillary over Obama. Their stated policies are nearly identical but I think Hillary is more pragmatic about things than Obama is. She'd be more level-headed.
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That's not the stuff that concerns me. What he has said in his sermons is what is of concern to me. There are many videos on you tube but I'm not sure if they should be posted. Here is a link to a couple of things he has said. Much, much more has come out today. http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=4443788&page=1
Last edited by Pdawg; 03/14/08 10:58 PM.
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It really shouldn't hurt him much:
Remember Gore's relationship with Fred Phelps of the Westboro Baptist Church?
Bush's ties to Saudi Arabian oil?
~Lyuokdea
"When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God." Leviticus 19:33-34
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Neither of them were black, and if there are people out there looking for a reason not to like a black presidential candidate, they just found one.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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j/c
I don't think it's going to hurt him much. I'd bet this will blow over in about a week, resurface in mid October, and disappear once again around the general election.
Just a boring time in politics, much like the boring times during the offseason.
Wise words spoken by sages
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He has been going to this guy for spiritual advice for decades.
Simply a radical black cult hiding behind the cloak of God.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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This is not going to go away, MaCain's campaign will make sure this is in plenty of ads if Obama wins the Democrat ticket. Heck, I won't be surprised to see Clinton use this.
"Change ownership of the team, the true change we can believe in." - I made this in 2008 
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This is not going to go away, MaCain's campaign will make sure this is in plenty of ads if Obama wins the Democrat ticket. Heck, I won't be surprised to see Clinton use this.
I am sure she(meaning her campaign) is the one pushing this.
As for McCain...he has said he runs a respectful campaign, and so far in his career, that is what he has done.
Not to say he isn't somewhat glad the dems are tossing dirty laundry around because onces its out there, its out there.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I must admit after hearing some of those repulsive anti-american rants on tv yesterday, what Mrs. Obama was spewing is beginning to come into context just a bit better today. It's also difficult to imagine, with as many of the rants as were aired and to be honest borders on insulting ones intelligence that in 20 years of a very close friendship he flatly denys ever hearing that bigot pastor utter these feelings.
Will it hurt him? I've given up trying to guess how the American public is going to fell about things but one things for sure, the celestial choirboy robes sure feel off him yesterday.
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I find it remarkably Clinton-esque that now...and only now after a huge uproar...that Obama is "distancing" himself from his pastor of nearly his entire adult life.
For those who don't know what I mean, he wasn't doing anything to distance himself from that lunatic until AFTER it became a potential election problem.
Just like Clinton showing remorse for some of his shenanigans and being 'sorry'...when we all know he was only sorry that he got caught.
Obama is only distancing himself now because it's a problem for him.
That guy scares me.
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Everyone has a crazy uncle or two in their background. Obama has his and his is named Rev. Jeremiah Wright. The guy is a black activist preacher who makes no bones about his hatred of America as an international criminal entity. Whether he has a case is less important as the fact that Sen. and Mrs. Obama give tacit approval by their many years of silent attendance to this charlatan holyman. By far the worst aspect of this is that now the OBAMAs are to be known as being complicit in training their precious babies to be bigots in the Church where Rev. Wright has preached his message of hate whitey politics! Tell Rev. J. Wright your feelings on the issue at www.info@tccu.org
The American people will never knowingly adopt Socialism. But under the name of 'liberalism' they will adopt every fragment of the Socialist program, .
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I heard of the rantings and he's quit Obama's campaign now.
I don't see how Obama can distance himself from this man.
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McCain may not run this stuff in his official ads. But you can bet your bottom dollar that you'll see this kind of stuff in plenty of "unofficial" commercials starting right after the conventions.
I've said it before and I'll say it again......Obama may be the greatest thing since sliced bread but I don't think America is gonna elect a young, black man President. Especially one with a "funny" name. Not yet, anyway.
"People who drink light 'beer' don't like the taste of beer; they just like to pee a lot."
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Obama may be the greatest thing since sliced bread
Trust me, he isn't even close to comparing to sliced bread. 
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j/c
One thing to keep in mind is, if you were a black person (some of you may be but my guess is that most aren't) in America - would you feel any differently? I don't completely agree with everything Rev Wright said, but I can see why he would feel the way he does. As far as his comments about America being an international criminal - can't say I disagree AT ALL there. Rev Wright was speaking the truth, but people don't like to hear that.
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I equate obama saying he doesn't agree to everything this "preacher" says as david duke saying he didn't agree with everything the KKK says.
Racism is just as ugly if it comes from whites, blacks, asians, arabs, or anyone else. This "preacher" is preaching nothing but hate, and I don't recall that as being a christian value. Obama chose this man's church because of the preacher. I would think he must share some, if not most, of this man's beliefs.
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I admit I didn't hear everything that Rev Wright said, but I heard NOTHING that I consider racist. I consider it anger towards white america, but if you were a black person living in america - wouldn't you have anger towards white america?
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As far as his comments about America being an international criminal - can't say I disagree AT ALL there. Rev Wright was speaking the truth, but people don't like to hear that.
He was stating his opinion and it isn't the truth. That is why people are upset.
To go along with that, Michelle Obama's comments about her not being ashamed about this nation for the first time in her adult life tells me that not only she, but Barack Obama believe what this man says.
Does anyone want someone who espouses this crap (yes, it's crap!) running our nation? I can't say that I'm thrilled with any of the choices, but this man (not the preacher BUT Obama) scares the hell out of me.
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I would consider that hate brings you nothing but more hate. There is blatant racism in his statements, unless blaming all white people for the "plight" of the blacks in America isn't racist. If I blamed all black people for the crime in our inner cites, wouldn't that be a racist statement?
Mongering hate against a race of people will never get the hate mongerers anything but more hate. I had nothing to do with slavery in this country. My family wasn't in this country at that time. Am I to blame for their problems because I'm white?
I grew up with black kids attending the exact same schools I did. They had the exact same opportunites I did, and they were even given some more opportunites to make up for past inequalities (affirmative action, minority scholarships, hiring quotas, etc.) Am I still to blame for their problems because I'm white?
I have never participated in a willingly racist act against a person of a color or creed different than mine. The worse thing I've probably stated, is that if someone emmigrates to our country, they should endevor to become American, not try to change America to fit their old culture. They left that culture for a reason. If someone has problems adapting to our culture, am I to blame for being white?
I still don't see what being white 150 years after slavery ended and 40+ years after segregation ended has to do with being hated. I had nothing to do with any of that. This "preacher" has decided that I am part of the problem, and tells his congregation that I am at fault for their problems since the time of jesus, because I'm white. Are you starting to see the racism in his statements yet?
Anger and hate will get those people nowhere. It makes them racists.
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Well while I in no way support Rev. Wright some of the things that he says are true....It is true that we did intentionally give Syphlis(SP) to African Americans in the experiment that he mentioned....It is also been noted that FDR knew of the attack on Pear Habor prior to the event and the comment on the creation of Aids as a means to eliminate Africans has long been rumored , although usually I hear that the Arabs were behind it....As for us deserving 911 as some sort of pay back for our use of nukes during WW II , that IMHO is BS....We were attacked by a nation and responded for what was preceived as a sneak attack....What I think turns most people off is once again this mixing of church and state , personally along with that I can't stand the Preachiness in which it was presented....
The Mammal
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I consider it anger towards white america, but if you were a black person living in america - wouldn't you have anger towards white america?
It looks like I've found the problem. There is no "white America", there is the United States of America.
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Well while I in no way support Rev. Wright some of the things that he says are true....It is true that we did intentionally give Syphlis(SP) to African Americans in the experiment that he mentioned..
We did not give syphilis to those people. Yes, this did happen, but we did not do it.
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..It is also been noted that FDR knew of the attack on Pear Habor prior to the event and the comment on the creation of Aids as a means to eliminate Africans has long been rumored , although usually I hear that the Arabs were behind it..
The Japanese were trying to get a formal declaration of war to us before the attack. They did not. I don't think it's ever been proven FDR allowed the attack to happen.
If you listen to gay rights groups, they'll tell you AIDS was created to kill gays. Maybe if these people used condoms or practiced monogomy, AIDS wouldn't be such a problem.
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..As for us deserving 911 as some sort of pay back for our use of nukes during WW II , that IMHO is BS....We were attacked by a nation and responded for what was preceived as a sneak attack....What I think turns most people off is once again this mixing of church and state , personally along with that I can't stand the Preachiness in which it was presented....
The US has made arabs angry. I can't refute that at all. We support Israel, so they will be angry with us. I have no solutions for irrational religious beliefs. I do know that they should expect to be killed if they continue trying to kill us.
Our use of nukes in WWII was little more than a practical decision. We could have gotten 1000s of our troops killed invading the island of Japan. The Japanese were sworn to fight to the last child. We took the practical approach and destroyed two of their industrial complexes. We even asked for their surrender before the first and before the second bombing.
Separation of church and state is more for the state than a prohibition for the churches.
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Quote:
I consider it anger towards white america, but if you were a black person living in america - wouldn't you have anger towards white america?
It looks like I've found the problem. There is no "white America", there is the United States of America.
There most certainly is a White America and a Black America and a [insert race here] America. Not only is this country STILL divided by race but also in socioeconomic status and everything else that separates us.
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I would consider that hate brings you nothing but more hate. There is blatant racism in his statements, unless blaming all white people for the "plight" of the blacks in America isn't racist. If I blamed all black people for the crime in our inner cites, wouldn't that be a racist statement?
Mongering hate against a race of people will never get the hate mongerers anything but more hate. I had nothing to do with slavery in this country. My family wasn't in this country at that time. Am I to blame for their problems because I'm white?
I grew up with black kids attending the exact same schools I did. They had the exact same opportunites I did, and they were even given some more opportunites to make up for past inequalities (affirmative action, minority scholarships, hiring quotas, etc.) Am I still to blame for their problems because I'm white?
I have never participated in a willingly racist act against a person of a color or creed different than mine. The worse thing I've probably stated, is that if someone emmigrates to our country, they should endevor to become American, not try to change America to fit their old culture. They left that culture for a reason. If someone has problems adapting to our culture, am I to blame for being white?
I still don't see what being white 150 years after slavery ended and 40+ years after segregation ended has to do with being hated. I had nothing to do with any of that. This "preacher" has decided that I am part of the problem, and tells his congregation that I am at fault for their problems since the time of jesus, because I'm white. Are you starting to see the racism in his statements yet?
Anger and hate will get those people nowhere. It makes them racists.
I said I do not agree completely with what Rev Wright said, but I can see why he would say things like this. I don't believe America deserved the attacks of 9-11, but we certainly had it coming for everything we have done in the past. I don't feel that Rev Wright is blaming white people for the problems for Black Americans, but there is still a large portion of America that will not accept anything that has to do with black americans as valid - from rap music to a black president- and we all know that this is true. No, we as White Americans had ZERO to do with slavery or segragation, but those 2 acts -By White America- still affect us to this day.
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"The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, God damn America, that's in the Bible for killing innocent people," he said in a 2003 sermon. "God damn America for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America for as long as she acts like she is God and she is supreme."
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"We bombed Hiroshima, we bombed Nagasaki, and we nuked far more than the thousands in New York and the Pentagon, and we never batted an eye," Rev. Wright said in a sermon on Sept. 16, 2001.
"We have supported state terrorism against the Palestinians and black South Africans, and now we are indignant because the stuff we have done overseas is now brought right back to our own front yards. America's chickens are coming home to roost," he told his congregation.
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/story?id=4443788&page=1
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Wright has blamed the U.S. for the 9/11 attacks stating that U.S. sponsored terrorism was responsible. Wright also stated that the intended target of the 9/11 attacks was "white America".
https://www.dawgtalkers.net/newreply.php?...part=1&vc=1
From Richard Cohen of the Washington Post...
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Maybe for Wright and some others, Farrakhan “epitomized greatness.” For most Americans, though, Farrakhan epitomizes racism, particularly in the form of anti-Semitism. Over the years, he has compiled an awesome record of offensive statements, even denigrating the Holocaust by falsely attributing it to Jewish cooperation with Hitler — “They helped him get the Third Reich on the road.” His history is a rancid stew of lies.
http://lonestartimes.com/2008/01/15/jeremiah-wright-meet-don-black/
Other statements
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"Hillary is married to Bill, and Bill has been good to us. No he ain't! Bill did us, just like he did Monica Lewinsky. He was riding dirty."
January 2008
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"When [Obama's] enemies find out that in 1984 I went to Tripoli" to visit Col. Muammar el-Qaddafi with Nation of Islam leader Louis Farrakhan, "a lot of his Jewish support will dry up quicker than a snowball in hell."
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"In the 21st century, white America got a wake-up call after 9/11/01. White America and the western world came to realize that people of color had not gone away, faded into the woodwork or just 'disappeared' as the Great White West kept on its merry way of ignoring black concerns."
2005
http://www.radarmagazine.com/exclusives/2008/03/jeremiah-wright-barack-obama-pastor.php
He has made more comments that I have seen on TV but can't find on regular web sites. One had to do with the US being the "KKK of America" I'm sure some are on you tube but I don't want to post other peoples opinion videos.
Found it...
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Obama's spiritual leader for the past 20 years has encouraged his congregation to sing "God Damn America," stated from the pulpit that our nation is the "U.S of KKK A," and declared that America deserved to be attacked on 9/11.
http://newsbusters.org/people/jeremiah-wright
Last edited by Pdawg; 03/15/08 02:05 PM.
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I understand that some of his comments can be considered racist- I admit that- but what I've said is that if I were black, I don't know that I wouldn't feel the same. Maybe not as strongly, but I still may feel some resentment.
That being said I agree with a large part of what he says about America and the government. If America were a person it would be a cocky, conceited a-hole that most people wouldn't like - myself included. I love living in America, but I do not agree with many of Americas actions. America has supported terrorists in the past, has supported the overthrowing of governments, put in new governments and support them, then when the relationship isn't going the way we want we turn on them. I don't consider any of his comments that you quoted in your post to be racist - maybe others will - but I don't. I feel that they are extremely accurate.
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You said you didn't know a lot of what he said, so I posted the comments I could find. I do think calling us the "US of KKK America is racist. How can you take it any other way? Does this country go out of it's way to attack and lynch blacks? Isn't the leader in the race for the White House black? Considering "White America" is still the majority in this country how can he be winning without a large amount of support from whites? He was right about Tuskegee (sp), about the slave trade, and more recently things like Jim Crow laws. You say you have heard rumors that aids was created by whites to kill blacks. You use that to justify him saying it. There is zero evidence to backup that claim. You might want to dismiss it but I won't. He whole heartedly supports Farrakhan, who is without a doubt a racist and anti semite. You think thats ok? Quote:
That being said I agree with a large part of what he says about America and the government. If America were a person it would be a cocky, conceited a-hole that most people wouldn't like - myself included.
I don't care if they like us, as long as they fear us. This is a very dangerous world. We are being attacked because of who we are and what we represent. All this crap about us hating Muslims is just that. We are hated by extremists because we don't subscribe to Islam as a country. We do make bad choices in foriegn policy. We protected Saudi Arabia from being taken over by Saddam, yet they blame us for being there. We protected them from genocide in the former Yugoslavia ( I know the spelling is waaay off) yet not one word. The French bend over backwards not to do anything to offend Islamists yet they get attacked by terrorist.
We back Israel and I think we should.The Arabs and some of our so called western allies bitch about the occupied territories. What were they saying when Israel was attacked by all of it's neighbors? That was ok, Israel is wrong for existing or taking territory as spoils of war. This guy blamed Jews for being part of the Holocaust!!
You're right. We are nothing more then a nation of racist. Our government is made up of nothing more then a bunch of racists.
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Extremely accurate?
Wow...that is unbelievable. I won't waste any bandwidth with a further response on that topic.
If America were a person, I would see a dramatically different person than you would.
America makes it very easy to be her friend...when a country is not her friend, I tend to believe our government moreso than their government.
I have plenty of issues with my government...but I'll stand by them before the government of anywhere else on the planet.
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I've said it before and I'll say it again......Obama may be the greatest thing since sliced bread but I don't think America is gonna elect a young, black man President. Especially one with a "funny" name. Not yet, anyway.
I think America disagrees with you. Just look at the numbers.
As for this people a big deal... it's ridiculous. What the hell does this even have to do with Obama's presidency? Does anyone actually believe that Obama is running for president because he hates America as much as his priest does? T
The presidential campaign is wayyyy too long. It's just like the NFL's offseason--people make huge deals out of the most insignificant BS because they don't have anything else to talk about. I mean there has been 20 debates for christ's sake. There is only so much to talk about anymore, so stupid stories like this make huge headlines.
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Well while I in no way support Rev. Wright some of the things that he says are true....It is true that we did intentionally give Syphlis(SP) to African Americans in the experiment that he mentioned..
We did not give syphilis to those people. Yes, this did happen, but we did not do it.
That's funny....i think you need to re-read your history,but not the one that was given to you in school!!!!
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First, I didn't say anything about the aids thing.
Second, I exaggerated a little bit when I said I found nothing what he said to be racist because the US of KKK is slightly racist, but not to the extreme. He is simply showing his frustration with how America treats its people and how it treats its black americans. When it comes to his comments on America and the government I pretty much agree with him. I know he was a supporter of Farrakhan (sp?) and I do not agree with that, but I do agree with the principle of what Rev Wright said about America. I'm not saying I am in full agreement with Rev Wright and would probably disagree with him on a larger number of issues but from most of what I've heard or read I agree with the principle of what he is saying. It's easy to sit back and judge Rev Wright for what can be considered racist/controversial, but I think too many people are not trying to place themselves in the position of a large portion of black america. I think it's easy to understand why many black americans would feel this way.
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Extremely accurate?
Wow...that is unbelievable. I won't waste any bandwidth with a further response on that topic.
If America were a person, I would see a dramatically different person than you would.
America makes it very easy to be her friend...when a country is not her friend, I tend to believe our government moreso than their government.
I have plenty of issues with my government...but I'll stand by them before the government of anywhere else on the planet.
I find it very believeable. America has been very hypocritical and simply wrong in many of its actions for a long time. I said before I love living in America and wouldn't want to live anywhere else (except maybe Canada) but I disagree on a lot of what America does. The issues Rev Wright brought up are very true realities regardless of how many people want to dismiss it because they do not want to hear it.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,563
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,563 |
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Everyone has a crazy uncle or two in their background. Obama has his and his is named Rev. Jeremiah Wright.
Difference is you can't choose your crazy uncle... and typically if you're a sane human being you don't go to your crazy uncle for advice...
one of my favorite churches that I've ever been to is a predominantly black church, so that stuff never bothered me... but some of the things that this 'preacher' has said is just ridiculous...
<><
#gmstrong
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 6,370
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If America were a person, I would see a dramatically different person than you would.
America makes it very easy to be her friend...when a country is not her friend, I tend to believe our government moreso than their government.
I have plenty of issues with my government...but I'll stand by them before the government of anywhere else on the planet.
Word.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 998
All Pro
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All Pro
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 998 |
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If America were a person, I would see a dramatically different person than you would.
America makes it very easy to be her friend...when a country is not her friend, I tend to believe our government moreso than their government.
I have plenty of issues with my government...but I'll stand by them before the government of anywhere else on the planet.
I don't think anyone is saying that other governments are better than ours, or that they would choose another over ours.
But blindly accepting ones government actions and policies without questioning it is simply un-American. Remember, the foundation of our country was made by those who questioned and disagreed with their current government. Being able to question, disagree, and change government is the reason America has prospered the way it has. We the people are those who have the ability to alter our government, and the first step is disagreeing and not blindly following and accepting.
Wise words spoken by sages
From SkyTel to BlackBerry pagers
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,571
Hall of Famer
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Quote:
Quote:
If America were a person, I would see a dramatically different person than you would.
America makes it very easy to be her friend...when a country is not her friend, I tend to believe our government moreso than their government.
I have plenty of issues with my government...but I'll stand by them before the government of anywhere else on the planet.
Word.
i fail to understand the handle then
~Lyuokdea
"When a foreigner resides among you in your land, do not mistreat them. The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God." Leviticus 19:33-34
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,861
Hall of Famer
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Well, this should quiet down the rumours that Obama is a Muslim.
I think this is one of the things that supports separation of church and state. Wrights comments were unacceptable, and I do not understand the rational behind them.
It would not be the first time that a preacher made outlandish comments.
Obama was just waiting for this to occur. He knew it was going to happen, essentially stated as much, and he responded in a appropriate matter. I saw tidbits of this Wright character and of the church back in December. It was out there in content, not video at the time. Obama cannot be held accountable for the actions of another.
There is nothing in Obama's actions that would suggest that he holds similar views.
Welcome back, Joe, we missed you!…. That did not age well.
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 998
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There is nothing in Obama's actions that would suggest that he holds similar views.
Are you serious? His middle name is Hussein, just like Saddam!
Wise words spoken by sages
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Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Will Obama's minister be his
undoing???
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