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On surface it looks like it's just one bitter kid..but there are other linemen also leaving along with mallett who was supposed to be the starter going into this year....Hey MEEchigan fans..please shed some light on this...what is going on? are ppl in Michigan worried that RR already has a image prb with his prg? or is this all just BS? Boren considering OSU after departing Michigan Thursday, March 27, 2008 3:21 AM By Tim May THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH One week after beating out Michigan for top quarterback prospect Terrelle Pryor, Ohio State found itself in the running yesterday for Michigan lineman Justin Boren, who announced he's leaving the Wolverines. Boren, a Pickerington North graduate who started for the Wolverines as a sophomore last season, released a statement in which he criticized the atmosphere under new coach Rich Rodriguez. Boren's father, Mike, a former Michigan captain and linebacker, supported his son's decision. "Ohio State would be a good fit for Justin, and that's why he's not at Michigan anymore, because Michigan is not the right fit for him," said Mike Boren, who played under Bo Schembechler in the early 1980s. "I have not talked to Ohio State and I'm not sure about their situation. … But would he go to Ohio State? Yes. The only two schools he seriously considered three years ago were Ohio State and Michigan, and he almost went to Ohio State even then." One thing seems certain. Justin Boren isn't going to play for Michigan anymore. Consider his prepared statement: "I regret leaving behind my (Michigan) friends and teammates, but I need to stand up for what I know is right. "I wore the winged helmet with pride, whether we won or lost, whether things were going well or times were tough. Michigan football was a family, built on mutual respect and support for each other from Coach (Lloyd) Carr on down. We knew it took the entire family, a team effort, and we all worked together.
"I have great trouble accepting that those family values have eroded in just a few months. That same helmet, that I was raised on and proudly claimed for the last two years, now brings a completely different emotion to me, one that interferes with practicing and playing my best and mentally preparing for what is required. …
"I wish my teammates the best and will always be proud to have been a part of Michigan football over the past two years."
Rodriguez was terse in his reaction, much as he was when quarterback Ryan Mallett -- who was projected to be the starter before Carr retired -- transferred to Arkansas.
"I only talk about the guys who play for Michigan," Rodriguez told The Detroit News.
Two other offensive linemen, Alex Mitchell and Jeremy Ciulla, also have left the program.Boren plans to finish the semester at Michigan. By transferring, he would have to sit out the 2008 season but would have two years of eligibility remaining. If he transfers to Ohio State, he would not be eligible for a scholarship under Big Ten rules. The Buckeyes are recruiting his younger brother Zach, an outside linebacker at Pickerington North who will be a senior this fall. "Three years ago, if I had seen in a crystal ball that the whole coaching staff was going to change halfway through his career, I would have never let Justin go to Michigan. I would have told him to go to Ohio State," Mike Boren said. "I'm disappointed and I'm hurt because my wife and I both graduated from the University of Michigan. I didn't want this to happen; it's the last thing I wanted to happen. "But, basically, the bottom line is you have to look out for your kid and what is best for him." http://dispatch.com/live/content/footbal...98.html?sid=101
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I'm concerned about the yelling and screaming of foul language that has been intimated in the other thread (about Pryor). While it understandably goes on in the game of football, it is not necessary. If it is what drove Justin over the cliff, then perhaps RR and staff need to take a look at themselves.
I know I chewed out a lot of Marines in my day, and was always very, very careful about using foul language.
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Will michigan reach a bowl game? If they do its because of their D. Their offense has been ripped to shreds.
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I'm concerned about the yelling and screaming of foul language that has been intimated in the other thread (about Pryor). While it understandably goes on in the game of football, it is not necessary. If it is what drove Justin over the cliff, then perhaps RR and staff need to take a look at themselves.
I know I chewed out a lot of Marines in my day, and was always very, very careful about using foul language.
I don't see where the language would have anything to do with it. Anymore, you walk into a middle school classroom and hear just about any word you want to imagine. Listen to music for 5 minutes and you can most of the time hear the same thing. I could understand maybe the yelling and screaming got to him. Some people can handle it and some can't. If players can't, then they should move onto a situation that better suits them.
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Michigan did have an image problem......one that included a bunch of soft, slow, lazy players. RR is puling weeds. While it can be an ugly process at times, it's what Michigan desperately needs/needed. The program has been on a downward arc for 7 years now and it's not going to magically turn back up without a swift kick.
As for Boren......any player that is granted their outright release, without ANY resistance from the coach or university and then immediately proceeds to flap his gums is addition by subtraction in my opinion. Boren probably got a reality check from the coaching staff and didn't like it all that much. If it's too tough, move along because there's surely someone else who will work harder then you will.
Nothing anyone will or should lose any sleep over. No one said becoming bigger, faster, tougher and stronger was easy.
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http://www.mlive.com/wolverines/index.ssf/2008/03/rodriguez_my_players_and_my_co.html#commentsRodriguez: Michigan's players and coaches are my familyby Jim Carty | The Ann Arbor News Thursday March 27, 2008, 3:41 PM University of Michigan football coach Rich Rodriguez spoke passionately Thursday afternoon about his commitment to his players and strong disappointment with a suggestion the program's values have eroded since former coach Lloyd Carr retired in January. Sophomore guard Justin Boren, Michigan's most experienced offensive lineman and the son of former Wolverine Mike Boren, issued a statement Wednesday that said he had left the team because of the decline in "family values" since Rodriguez replaced Carr as coach. Rodriguez would not discuss Boren's situation specifically, but said any claims that he, or his coaches, have compromised Michigan's values are simply wrong. "Anybody who would make any comment about our values is way off-base," the coach told The News via phone Thursday. "The people who know the staff, who know what we're putting together here will tell you just the opposite as far as what's been reported. ... My players and my coaches are my family. They're coached that way. "But we're not going to apologize for being demanding. We told that to the players. We also told them our job is to take them some place they can't take themselves, on the field and off the field, and I think the majority of our players understand that."Rodriguez acknowledged that the styles and approaches of some coaches on his staff may differ from previous Michigan coaches, but believed that would be expected in a coaching change. He stressed that his coaches treat Michigan's players with respect inside and outside of practice, and have throughout a 20-year coaching career that's stretched from West Virginia to tiny Salem College. "I'm going to coach every player like I was coaching my own son," Rodriguez said. "That to me is the biggest testament. If my son was here, I'm planning on coaching him the very same way. "I think sometimes players take things personally, but we tell them not to take it personally when we're trying to coach you. They have to adapt. Sometimes players get close to a position coach and if he's not there, there's a transition period. But our track record as far as treating players right and having a great level of mutual respect has always been there. This is not my first rodeo, and I think if you went back and asked the majority of guys about their experience playing in our program, they'd feel pretty good about it." For more on this topic, see Friday's edition of The Ann Arbor News.
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The program has been on a downward arc for 7 years now and it's not going to magically turn back up without a swift kick.
Nothing anyone will or should lose any sleep over. No one said becoming bigger, faster, tougher and stronger was easy.
Well said.
If RR wins at Michigan he will be given free reign to do what he wants. If he loses one of the the first things that will be pointed to when he is fired is the fact that he didnt do things the Michigan way. For better or worse the wolverines have done well by those standards. Much better in fact than what RR has done at WVU. Time will tell.
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I hate to hear stories like this. I hope UM and the players who leave eventually find the balance that they need. As for RR, either one of two things is gonna happen:
1. The hiring of Rich Rodriguez eventually goes down as a bad mistake.
OR
2. Rich Rodriguez's coaching style eventually gets accepted by Michigan's current players and future recruits, and he goes on to have a successful tenure at Michigan.
Anybody know of any other college FB coaching changes that have caused player attrition?
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Anybody know of any other college FB coaching changes that have caused player attrition?
I think its more than just a simple coaching change, its a completely different style of football from what the current kids were recruited there for.
I think its natural and im sure to some degree it happens a lot with coaching changes, being the Michigan Wolverines though, it gets a lot more press.
Eat it Phil...
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I agree. Not only is Michigan dealing with a coaching change, but they are dealing with a totally different offensive system. Attrition, especially in this case, is certain.
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Anybody know of any other college FB coaching changes that have caused player attrition?
Muni, I can't find the article but I read a piece where RR talked about attrition being part of the process when installing the spread offense and the S&C program he has used. He said his first year at WVU, they only carried 70 players on the regular season roster and had 16 total players leave.
Having only 3 players drop after the first few months has actually been incredibly low compared to the other times he's made the transition.
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It all seems perfectly normal to me. I don't know why the media is trying to make this a bigger issue than it is.
Don't get me wrong, I hate Michigan, but, I don't think that UM's football program is going to go into some sort of "dark age" like the Browns did under Butch Davis' lead. As a matter of fact, if I had to bet on it, I would bet that eventually RR is going to lead Michigan to prominence. From what I have seen, there is no way to consistently stop his offense.
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See thats the thing...it's expected for some players to leave when a new coach takes over with his guys....and that is what i was thinking till this boren guy went off in the media....but good to know first hand what the team up north's fans think...and i did not see that article by RR so that also helps....  hope yall bring your A game in 09  we all kno who got 08 wrapped up
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we all kno who got 08 wrapped up
I REALLY hope our boys don't think this.... because that's when you lose...
<><
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Your right Jay. There is NO EXCUSE to lose to michigan EVER!!!! If we lose to michigan I consider it a failed season.
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I'm sick of you being so realistic all the time..how about you let the players worry about that and be a fan?!..Enjoy what is Tress owing michigan right now....anyways lets stop talking about this before the refs think of it as us talking smack and bans us or deletes this thread...
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lmao... sorry... I hate SCUM as much as anyone... but that game always scares me...
and true... no need for smack talk...
<><
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Esp. smack talk b/w 2 Buckeye fans,,talk about LAME! Anyways, I feel sorry in a way for this kid. It's obvious he was sold on Carr and his program and the ideals it brought and now this tool comes in. I mean coaches come and go all the time and it does suck for the kids that didn't see the maize n blue, scarlet n grey, but the coaches as the reason for going there and then have that taken away. Ohh well, it will be nice to see him and his lil bro on the sacred ground that is Ohio Stadium! O-H!
Our honor defend, we will fight to the end, for OHIO! GO BUCKS!
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"Anybody who would make any comment about our values is way off-base," ... My players and my coaches are my family.
"I'm going to coach every player like I was coaching my own son," Rodriguez said. "That to me is the biggest testament. If my son was here, I'm planning on coaching him the very same way.
Not to pick on RR he's not alone but I find it amusing when coaches talk like this.They are doing a job for cripes sake. He coaches those who pay him the most. What he values is a large contract. Not that theres anything wrong with that but whats with the family BS? I find it absolutely amazing a university shells out millions to bring in a coach and before his first game he waxes poetic about family and people buy into it. I could see a long time coach saying stuff like that or even if he had been an alum but a hired gun coach? Give me a break.
Hey Rich! What about your family at WVU? Are you a dead beat dad? Are they sueing you for child support? 
BTW as far as the kid goes I'm sorry he lost his scholarship but the employer brought in new management he didn't care for. He chose to leave..Happens all the time, didn't work out, just one of those things. Probably good preparation for life. It's not really the end of the world.
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"I'm going to coach every player like I was coaching my own son," Rodriguez said. "That to me is the biggest testament. If my son was here, I'm planning on coaching him the very same way.
Sorry.........BS Meter is flashing!
Are you saying you abandoned all your "sons" in West Virginia. This guy is a phony. Beware Michigan! As I said somewhere else........I love beating Michigan, but like the Steelers, I have always respected their program.
This guy............I think he is a snake.
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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"I'm going to coach every player like I was coaching my own son," Rodriguez said. "That to me is the biggest testament. If my son was here, I'm planning on coaching him the very same way.
Sorry.........BS Meter is flashing!
Are you saying you abandoned all your "sons" in West Virginia. This guy is a phony. Beware Michigan! As I said somewhere else........I love beating Michigan, but like the Steelers, I have always respected their program.
This guy............I think he is a snake.
I love how people keep saying he "abandoned" his team at WVU. Did Tressel "abandon" his team at Youngstown St. when he left? No, they both took better jobs when they got to the opportunity. Why is that such a bad thing?
And before it is brought up, and I know it would be, WVU wouldn't let him coach in the Bowl game, that wasn't his decision. I understand why they didn't let him, but still doesn't change that.
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Reallly? WVU didn't let him? i did not know that....that explains it then...that was the only reason i thought low of him....i completely understand a coach leaving after season is over...but it rubbed me the wrong way that he didn't coach in his bowl game....i guess if the reason for that is that WVU didn't let him(which makes no sense to me what so ever) then it's a diff story
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"I'm going to coach every player like I was coaching my own son," Rodriguez said. "That to me is the biggest testament. If my son was here, I'm planning on coaching him the very same way.
Sorry.........BS Meter is flashing!
Are you saying you abandoned all your "sons" in West Virginia. This guy is a phony. Beware Michigan! As I said somewhere else........I love beating Michigan, but like the Steelers, I have always respected their program.
This guy............I think he is a snake.
I love how people keep saying he "abandoned" his team at WVU. Did Tressel "abandon" his team at Youngstown St. when he left? No, they both took better jobs when they got to the opportunity. Why is that such a bad thing?
And before it is brought up, and I know it would be, WVU wouldn't let him coach in the Bowl game, that wasn't his decision. I understand why they didn't let him, but still doesn't change that.
Classic apples and oranges.  There were Youngstown State fans clapping and high-fiving because they were elated for Tressel as he made his move,....didn't see that in West Virginia.
Yes, moving up the natural chain from 1-AA YSU to Ohio State is the same as a lateral move from WVa to Michigan. Gimme a break.
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I love how people keep saying he "abandoned" his team at WVU. Did Tressel "abandon" his team at Youngstown St. when he left? No, they both took better jobs when they got to the opportunity. Why is that such a bad thing?
There's nothing wrong with leaving one program to go to another one... however, there's a way to do it... as far as Tressel is concerned, as far as I know he was upfront with the guys at YSU.... he consistently stated that the only job that he would leave YSU for would be OSU... which he did...
RR left WVU and told a HIGH SCHOOL RECRUIT before he told his own players... I'm sorry, but that shows zero loyalty to your players... IMO the first people who should know should be the team... it should have been the guys who committed to RR... as stated above, I can't stand the guy and don't care for him much as a person, but he can coach...
<><
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a lateral move from WVa to Michigan.
Nice try, next your going to tell me that the AP isn't a recognized national champion. 
Eat it Phil...
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Yes, moving up the natural chain from 1-AA YSU to Ohio State is the same as a lateral move from WVa to Michigan. Gimme a break.
A lateral move? You give me a break.  Untill RR got there, they hadn't won a conference championship since 1993! LOL. And that was the only one they had won in the last 30 years. 
Remind me again how many national titles WVU has won? How many wins? Their overall winning percentage? How many conference championships? How many all-americans? How many NFL draft picks? Hall of Fame players?
Saying WVU to Michigan is a lateral move is like saying going from Kirstie Alley to Giselle Bundchen is a bit of a step up. Seriously, I think I've now heard it all.
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RR left WVU and told a HIGH SCHOOL RECRUIT before he told his own players... I'm sorry, but that shows zero loyalty to your players... IMO the first people who should know should be the team... it should have been the guys who committed to RR... as stated above, I can't stand the guy and don't care for him much as a person, but he can coach...
Jay, I think you got some bad info or maybe misinterpreted something you read. Pryor was told an hour before it was officially announced to the MEDIA. The WVU players already knew before Rodriguez spoke to Pryor. RR told them the night/evening before at a team meeting (Saturday) and then Pryor on Sunday morning, before he was officially introduced to the media as the head coach.
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I love how people keep saying he "abandoned" his team at WVU. Did Tressel "abandon" his team at Youngstown St. when he left? No, they both took better jobs when they got to the opportunity. Why is that such a bad thing?
You love it? *L*
RR is the one who made the "son" comment. It seems a tad hypocritical after he just left his "sons" at another school.
If he wanted to leave for a better job, fine. But don't blow smoke up our asses by comparing your players to your "sons."
"What lies behind us and what lies before us are small matters compared to what lies within us."
--Ralph Waldo Emerson
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Reallly? WVU didn't let him? i did not know that....that explains it then...that was the only reason i thought low of him....i completely understand a coach leaving after season is over...but it rubbed me the wrong way that he didn't coach in his bowl game....i guess if the reason for that is that WVU didn't let him(which makes no sense to me what so ever) then it's a diff story
I think their position on it was that if he was going to be coaching somewhere else next season, why not just make the transition sooner rather than later. It was also a sort of on field interview for Stewart, their now head coach. I can completely understand them on the situation, but Rodriguez didn't abandon his team like I have heard some people on here state.
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Everybody on this board is like a "son" to me. In the spirit of my own dear daddy I'd like to politely remind each and everyone of you the rent is 50 bucks a week due ASAP. Really pulls at the old heart strings doesn't it? Any truth to the rumor Hail to the Victors will be replaced by We Are Family? They probably forgot who Victor was anyway.
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Yes, moving up the natural chain from 1-AA YSU to Ohio State is the same as a lateral move from WVa to Michigan. Gimme a break.
A lateral move? You give me a break. Untill RR got there, they hadn't won a conference championship since 1993! LOL. And that was the only one they had won in the last 30 years.
Remind me again how many national titles WVU has won? How many wins? Their overall winning percentage? How many conference championships? How many all-americans? How many NFL draft picks? Hall of Fame players?
Saying WVU to Michigan is a lateral move is like saying going from Kirstie Alley to Giselle Bundchen is a bit of a step up. Seriously, I think I've now heard it all.
And what the hell does that mean about WVU vs. Michigan RIGHT NOW? Absolute zilch. What have you done for me lately? WVU has done more lately than Michigan has.
RR could have stayed at WVU and built a dynasty and been heralded as one of the greatest...instead the negativity surrounding his move to Michigan hasn't helped his cause.
And I think he's gonna find it much harder to recruit against Tressel than it was in what was then a stripped down Big East...the Pryor saga speaks volumes. They went all in on him and lost.
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Wow, if Michigan's defense was as half as good as you guys defending RR is, you might have something someday.
You bash Tressel, I give retort that the move from YSU-OSU is NOT the same, so I am idiot whose opinion is meaningless. This board blows. Goodbye.
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And before it is brought up, and I know it would be, WVU wouldn't let him coach in the Bowl game, that wasn't his decision. I understand why they didn't let him, but still doesn't change that.
I guess next the Michigan spinmasters will tell us WV told RR he could HAVE the recruiting files he stole errrrr took with him.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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And before it is brought up, and I know it would be, WVU wouldn't let him coach in the Bowl game, that wasn't his decision. I understand why they didn't let him, but still doesn't change that.
I guess next the Michigan spinmasters will tell us WV told RR he could HAVE the recruiting files he stole errrrr took with him.
KING
You prove that he stole anything and I'll admit what ever you want about it. How many people do you know of that, while in the process of stealing something, would leave the office door open and not try to hide the fact that he is there. WVU made these allegations and had zero evidence to back it up. They also accused him of shredding player files, yet those same files were on their computers.
Also, I didn't spin anything when it came to the Bowl game. That is a fact. Nice try though.
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[You prove that he stole anything and I'll admit what ever you want about it.
Can you prove it didnt happen? Whether he did or not doesnt really matter, the fact that he was accused raises image problem issues. Hey OJ was found not guilty too, was his image tarnished?? So WV made it up?? Ok, they must really dislike the guy to make some serious accusations like that So you go ahead and keep thinking a man with serious character questions is the next coming of Bo Schembechler.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Joined: Apr 2007
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Legend
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Legend
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 17,284 |
Ooorah dont worry about it.Even though Michigan has the unstoppable spread offense!!!
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,513
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,513 |
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RR left WVU and told a HIGH SCHOOL RECRUIT before he told his own players... I'm sorry, but that shows zero loyalty to your players... IMO the first people who should know should be the team... it should have been the guys who committed to RR... as stated above, I can't stand the guy and don't care for him much as a person, but he can coach...
Jay, I think you got some bad info or maybe misinterpreted something you read. Pryor was told an hour before it was officially announced to the MEDIA. The WVU players already knew before Rodriguez spoke to Pryor. RR told them the night/evening before at a team meeting (Saturday) and then Pryor on Sunday morning, before he was officially introduced to the media as the head coach.
Thats not what I remember reading and seeing on ESPN.... but if I'm wrong then I apologize...
<><
#gmstrong
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
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Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
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Ooorah dont worry about it.Even though Michigan has the unstoppable spread offense!!!
Do I detect a hint of sarcasm??
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 17,284
Legend
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Legend
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 17,284 |
Crap howd you know? 
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,986
Dawg Talker
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Dawg Talker
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 1,986 |
Quote:
Quote:
[You prove that he stole anything and I'll admit what ever you want about it.
Can you prove it didnt happen? Whether he did or not doesnt really matter, the fact that he was accused raises image problem issues. Hey OJ was found not guilty too, was his image tarnished?? So WV made it up?? Ok, they must really dislike the guy to make some serious accusations like that So you go ahead and keep thinking a man with serious character questions is the next coming of Bo Schembechler.
KING
Last time I checked, people are innocent until proven guilty, so I don't need to prove anything. Yeah, it tarnishes his reputation to people who blindly follow anything that comes out, even when it has zero evidence to back it up. It could have happened, and if it did and is proven, then yes, I will be concerned with his character, but when WVU keeps sending out accusations it can't prove while on the verge of a $4 million lawsuit, I feel I have a reason to be suspicious of their crediblity.
I also never said anything remotely close to saying he is the next coming of Schembechler. I feel Rodriguez is a good coach, and until there is evidence that he has character issues, I will believe that he has good character too. It is you and a few other OSU fans that grab at every possible thing to point out how horrible his character is when you don't have a shred of evidence towards any of it.
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DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Michigan has a image problem on
their hands?
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