|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
My problem is with the concept, which leads to weak minded fools doing such things as the ones we've been discussing.
Well Christianity,or religion, did not make them weak minded fools, the fact that they are weak minded fools is what led them to make the misguided decision they made. A comparison would be the weak minded fools of Islam who are misguided to what the true meaning of Jihad is. Idiots are idiots no matter what religion they are,or are not.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
Well Christianity,or religion, did not make them weak minded fools, the fact that they are weak minded fools is what led them to make the misguided decision they made. A comparison would be the weak minded fools of Islam who are misguided to what the true meaning of Jihad is. Idiots are idiots no matter what religion they are,or are not.
One could argue that being weak minded fools is what led them to religion in the first place... 
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248 |
Quote:
Perfect?...Christ broke the law, and committed a sin(completely debatable) when he destroyed a church..although it was for a good reason! One I agree with to this day.
Whu?? 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
I'll make this simple. Quote:
All in all, christians pass a lot of judgement on other people
Reads alot different than..
Quote:
All in all, there are christians pass a lot of judgement on other people
Not much different than.
"All in All, poor folks are lazy and unwilling to do anything to improve their life."
Is different than
"All in all, there are poor folks that are lazy and unwilling to do anything to improve their life."
Do you see what a couple words can do to the meaning and intent.
Christians do alot of good in the world to, but I don't take credit for it, I didn't go to Ethiopia and feed the starving children, or travel to New Orleans and help flood victims, but I also don't want to take any blame because some nut job drowns their children because "god" told him to.
None of this stereotyping will end itself, until someone starts to separate. I try very hard to put those extra descriptive words in my posts as to not include everyone of a particular group. And I have seen many others that also try.
Now how do we spread that and get everyone to start realizing that just because you can be connected to a certain group/sect that you are still and individual and should be treated as one, and not as part of the whole group because one member of that group did something.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
Quote:
Perfect?...Christ broke the law, and committed a sin(completely debatable) when he destroyed a church..although it was for a good reason! One I agree with to this day.
Whu??
What didn't you get?
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248 |
I don't remember Christ destroying a church. Then again, I don't really Bible study either ... so it might of been buried in one of those odd chapters.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
I'll make this even simpler
I'm not a fan of religion, no matter what name it goes under!
Fair enough...no need to nitpick christians, "there are some" as loony as "some" muslims, and so on and so forth.
It just seems like if the discussion was about muslims or whatever, there wouldn't be all this debate. JMO
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
Only thing I can think of is this.
"Jesus entered the Temple area and drove out all who were buying
and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers
and the benches of those selling doves. 'It is written,' he said
to them, 'My house will be called a house of prayer but you are
making it a den of robbers.'" (Matthew 21:12-13)
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
the destroyed part was an exaggeration, that's why I said it was debatable whether he committed a sin...after all he did act a fool in the house of god!
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
Quote:
......It just seems like if the discussion was about muslims or whatever, there wouldn't be all this debate. JMO.....
Partially right, I wouldn't be as adamant on getting my point across, mainly because I am not Muslim and can't speak for them, but from an "all inclusive" stand point, I would probably post once that you can't place all "Muslim's" in the radical category.
But then, I had a good friend who was Muslim when I was growing up, and they were some of the most kind, giving folks I had ever met.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
My point is that I'm not focused on bad-mouthing christians. I don't agree with the concept of religion, and more specifically, the personification of "god". I think that very concept leads people to do some very odd things.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 14,248 |
One could argue that the lack of God causes others to do some very bad things as well.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,825
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 30,825 |
That's what I was thinking as well. I'm no Bible scholar, but I can't think off the top of my head of any other situation.
That's not quite the same as "destroying a church", though.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
One could argue that the lack of God causes others to do some very bad things as well.
No argument from me, but I would clarify that god is love, and people who do these bad things have no love in their life, because if they did (generally speaking), evil thoughts and intents probably wouldn't enter their mind...and if they did, they would stay long enough to become deeds.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
the destroyed part was an exaggeration, that's why I said it was debatable whether he committed a sin...after all he did act a fool in the house of god!
Yeah but those were Jews, so who cares? 
Disclaimer: THIS WAS JOKE IN RESPONSE TO NDU'S POST SEVERAL POSTS UP THAT SAID WE WOULD NOT CARE IF THIS THREAD WAS ABOUT MUSLIMS
Last edited by kingodawg; 04/01/08 02:02 PM.
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
Not everyone that claims to be a Christian, even attempts to live a Christian life.
It's an easy label to claim, but a very difficult one to live.
What separates them, is how much they try to live according to the rules God set forth, and how they react when they have broken a rule.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
You're not understanding where I'm coming from...you're still focusing solely on christianity.
I'm not.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
You're not understanding where I'm coming from...you're still focusing solely on christianity.
I'm not.
But FF already said he can only speak for Christians. What he is saying though could apply to any religion.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,803
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,803 |
Quote:
the destroyed part was an exaggeration, that's why I said it was debatable whether he committed a sin...after all he did act a fool in the house of god!
I believe you may wish to re-think this position.
Jesus is "the Son of God". Therefore, it was "his Fathers House". He cast out those who were acting improperly "in His Fathers House". Much as you would if someone was in your parents home to protect it.
I mean if you want to "speak about what's in the Bible", maybe you should first understand the context in which it was written. It's most helpfull.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
Sorry didn't realized we changed subjects.. Quote:
Who has time to dice christians into different sects...bottom line, you're all still christians, and you have to take the good with the bad...just like me being black (this is for you king), I have to take the negative stories about my people along with the good ones. However, just because there are some bad black people, doesn't mean that we're all bad, but it doesn't change us from all being black.......
.....All in all, christians pass a lot of judgement on other people, but run and hide when it's time to take at their own ideologies and actions. It's almost like the world is just supposed to accept christianity as the only true religion...oh wait...that's what missionaries are for
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
And I'm not really trying to nitpick you, I'm just bored and this is the only thread with any activity. 
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
Quote:
the destroyed part was an exaggeration, that's why I said it was debatable whether he committed a sin...after all he did act a fool in the house of god!
I believe you may wish to re-think this position.
Jesus is "the Son of God". Therefore, it was "his Fathers House". He cast out those who were acting improperly "in His Fathers House". Much as you would if someone was in your parents home to protect it.
I mean if you want to "speak about what's in the Bible", maybe you should first understand the context in which it was written. It's most helpfull.
That only applies if you believe he was the son of god...so I'm more than capable of what was written in bible, and it's context. Doesn't change the fact that what he did was more than likely against the law. Also doesn't change the fact that I agreed with what he did, and somebody needs to do it again today.
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
Only thing I can think of is this.
"Jesus entered the Temple area and drove out all who were buying
and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers
and the benches of those selling doves. 'It is written,' he said
to them, 'My house will be called a house of prayer but you are
making it a den of robbers.'" (Matthew 21:12-13)
Some have taken this passage to justify war, to cast out those of different beliefs and faiths. Very much againt the teachings of Jesus.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
And I'm not really trying to nitpick you, I'm just bored and this is the only thread with any activity.
 Same here!
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 563
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 563 |
Quote:
What the guy above me said
KING
Well then maybe you're a real Christian. You don't generalize and judge homesexuals, transvesites, muslims, immigrants, women, arab militias, terrorists. You're the exception then.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
Quote:
What the guy above me said
KING
Well then maybe you're a real Christian. You don't generalize and judge homesexuals, transvesites, muslims, immigrants, women, arab militias, terrorists. You're the exception then.
What part of " no Christian is perfect" do you not understand?? I am not without sin, as nobody on this earth is. Sure I do things that are unChristianlike, everyone does, everyone sins. It is impossible for anyone to be the perfect Christian, there has only ever been one of those.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
What the guy above me said
KING
Well then maybe you're a real Christian. You don't generalize and judge homesexuals, transvesites, muslims, immigrants, women, arab militias, terrorists. You're the exception then.
What part of " no Christian is perfect" do you not understand?? I am not without sin, as nobody on this earth is. Sure I do things that are unChristianlike, everyone does, everyone sins. It is impossible for anyone to be the perfect Christian, there has only ever been one of those.
KING
If that's the case, then you shouldn't be willing to pass legislation from a moral standpoint, or be so generally gung ho about war (not you specifically)
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,803
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,803 |
Quote:
Quote:
What the guy above me said
KING
Well then maybe you're a real Christian. You don't generalize and judge homesexuals, transvesites, muslims, immigrants, women, arab militias, terrorists. You're the exception then.
There's more than one of us out here!
You see, that book they all read tells me that, it's not my place to Judge. That's for God to do, not me.
It also tell me that if I have sinned, then I should not cast stones at others.
I take those things pretty seriously.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,803
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 74,803 |
Quote:
If that's the case, then you shouldn't be willing to pass legislation from a moral standpoint, or be so generally gung ho about war (not you specifically)
I consider myself a Christian and I agree with you 100%!
I am an Independant voter, and don't tell anybody, but I even know DEMOCRATS that are Christians! They too agree with you on these issues!
But let's keep it our little secret.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
#gmstrong
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015
Legend
|
|
Legend
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 15,015 |
I don't and I don't agree with much of what the conservatives believe. I believe government should be run on the basis of what is best for it's people, while moral views may be considered that decision, they should not be the reason for that decision.
And no law should be enacted purely on the basis of moral values, as we live in a free religion nation, and that includes those that do not believe in religion, and therefore you cannot force your moral values upon those that do not share them.
Now with that said, in some cases, things could be put up for vote, and majority rules. And by vote I mean by the people, not the politicians who are easily persuaded by special interest groups. And for a national law to be enacted, it would require a quorum of voters, as well as a majority vote.
If that doesn't get people off their lazy butts to vote, I don't know what would.
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
Quote:
If that's the case, then you shouldn't be willing to pass legislation from a moral standpoint, or be so generally gung ho about war (not you specifically)
I consider myself a Christian and I agree with you 100%!
I am an Independant voter, and don't tell anybody, but I even know DEMOCRATS that are Christians! They too agree with you on these issues!
But let's keep it our little secret.
mums the word! 
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
[ or be so generally gung ho about war (not you specifically)
Also are Christians generally gung ho about the war? Just because some idiot in power who procalims himself to be a good Chrisitian decided it was a good idea does not mean the majority of Christians are gung ho about the war.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
Quote:
[ or be so generally gung ho about war (not you specifically)
Also are Christians generally gung ho about the war? Just because some idiot in power who procalims himself to be a good Chrisitian decided it was a good idea does not mean the majority of Christians are gung ho about the war.
KING
In all honestly, how do you think christianity spread so far, so fast. It wasn't through prayer!
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 563
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 563 |
Quote:
What part of " no Christian is perfect" do you not understand?? I am not without sin, as nobody on this earth is. Sure I do things that are unChristianlike, everyone does, everyone sins. It is impossible for anyone to be the perfect Christian, there has only ever been one of those.
KING
I understand that part. No person is perfect. My point is that many people who call themselves Christians feel they are correct to judge those groups I mentioned. It is one thing to judge, acknowledge your sin, and work to correct yourself. It is another entirely to judge, and feel justified in doing so, and then try to convince others you are right.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
[ or be so generally gung ho about war (not you specifically)
Also are Christians generally gung ho about the war? Just because some idiot in power who procalims himself to be a good Chrisitian decided it was a good idea does not mean the majority of Christians are gung ho about the war.
KING
In all honestly, how do you think christianity spread so far, so fast. It wasn't through prayer!
Yeah I am well aware of what leaders(not just Christian) have done in the name of religion,it goes against the ideals of Jesus.
On another side how do you explain the huge growth of Christianity in Africa in recent years? It certainly hasnt been through war, it has been through missionary outreach.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
Quote:
What part of " no Christian is perfect" do you not understand?? I am not without sin, as nobody on this earth is. Sure I do things that are unChristianlike, everyone does, everyone sins. It is impossible for anyone to be the perfect Christian, there has only ever been one of those.
KING
I understand that part. No person is perfect. My point is that many people who call themselves Christians feel they are correct to judge those groups I mentioned. It is one thing to judge, acknowledge your sin, and work to correct yourself. It is another entirely to judge, and feel justified in doing so, and then try to convince others you are right.
OK and we have established those people are wrong, they are comitting sins, so what is your point??
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283
Dawg Talker
|
|
Dawg Talker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,283 |
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
[ or be so generally gung ho about war (not you specifically)
Also are Christians generally gung ho about the war? Just because some idiot in power who procalims himself to be a good Chrisitian decided it was a good idea does not mean the majority of Christians are gung ho about the war.
KING
In all honestly, how do you think christianity spread so far, so fast. It wasn't through prayer!
Yeah I am well aware of what leaders(not just Christian) have done in the name of religion,it goes against the ideals of Jesus.
On another side how do you explain the huge growth of Christianity in Africa in recent years? It certainly hasnt been through war, it has been through missionary outreach.
KING
I have my own thoughts about missionaries, but I won't mention them here. I think a lot of it has to do with the nutjobs in Islam have wrecked havoc in Africa and people are looking for another option
"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good" Thomas Paine
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 563
All Pro
|
|
All Pro
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 563 |
Quote:
On another side how do you explain the huge growth of Christianity in Africa in recent years? It certainly hasnt been through war, it has been through missionary outreach.
KING
The missionaries often bring food, and help build infrastructure, and sometimes, are the only way for kids to get an education. Not saying that Christianity isn't attractive to them, but it isn't just the call of Jesus that makes them convert. I think if I went over to those places and helped them without asking for pay, making their lives better, and telling them that the message of love was from the deity Big Bird, they'd be Big Bird worshipers.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349
Hall of Famer
|
|
Hall of Famer
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,349 |
Quote:
I have my own thoughts about missionaries, but I won't mention them here. I think a lot of it has to do with the nutjobs in Islam have wrecked havoc in Africa and people are looking for another option
Yep, and their have been Christian nutjobs who have wreeked havoc too. People on either side have taken what their scriptures say and interpreted them in way to justify their lust for war and dominance.Jihad does not mean "holy war" as some have tried to claim it does, Jihad means the inner struggle against your personal desires and sins to lead life in a godly way.
KING
You may be in the drivers seat but God is holding the map. #GMSTRONG
|
|
|
DawgTalkers.net
Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Parent Choose Prayer Over Medical
Help; 11-Year Old Dies
|
|
