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The worst part is now we have to watch Riverdance make his goofy faces.
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Make Perez the closer...he has the icewater veins for it.
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Legend
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now we get to see what a real closer looks like
<><
#gmstrong
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I know, I HATE Papelbon, he looks like a retard when he makes those faces.
Find what you love and let it kill you.
-Charles Bukowski
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Also, I'm pretty sure there are more Bosox fans than Tribe fans there. Sure sounds like it, at least.
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Quote:
I know, I HATE Papelbon, he looks like a retard when he makes those faces.
He's a hell of pitcher - can't dance worth a damn though
<><
#gmstrong
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Who are the free agent closers this coming year? 
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Borowski is painful to watch at the least. He flat out doesn't have closer stuff. I have zero confidence when he enters a game with less than 3 runs to spare. He has to go. I can't even imagine myself, if the Tribe makes it to the Series, watching JoBo trying to save a game 7.
![[Linked Image from img339.imageshack.us]](http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/4044/changerd3.jpg) Eric "Easy E" Wright and KW2- Bringing the attitude back to Browns football
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Is ANYONE going to try and defend him now?
I'll try. 
As bad as Borowski has pitched, does he put himself in? The coaching staff needs to wise up and see that he's not best suited as a closer.
I know it's early in the season, put getting a game or two now doesn't hurt. Especially with Detroit playing as poorly as they have... They posted 11 runs on the Twins tonight. 
I want the Cleveland Browns to be my pallbearers so they can let me down for the last time.
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I know it's freaking pathetic, when Grady struckout there was a cheer and I had to do sort of a doubletake because I didn't believe I heard it.
Screw Papalbon, if Cabrera was an excellent hitter and it was down the middle, that would be out of the damn ballpark.
Find what you love and let it kill you.
-Charles Bukowski
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All Pro
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Screw Papalbon,
I'd take Papalbon in a heartbeat over Joe Blow a save Borowski.
 
I can't stand to watch or listen to games with him on the mound, yet for some godawful reason I can't turn the damn thing off either.
Born and breed with OSU, App. State alumni, but bleed orange and brown.
Go ARMY......Beat Navy!!!!!!
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oioioioi
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The thing about Borowski is, you know he's going to let a guy or two get on base, but the majority of the time he gets the outs. In this case, he was facing a part of the lineup where he couldn't afford to let any of the first three up to get on. You absolutely have to get scrubs like Lugo and Crisp out, and Pedroia had a bad night at the plate. Allow just one of them on, and you're facing Big Papi, Manny, and Youk, which is probably the most lethal back-to-back-to-back combo in baseball. Basically, if one of the first three guys got on base, you know the Red Sox were going to put up a few runs. Borowski never should've been put in. Should've been Perez.
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Well, that's my problem. As a closer, you shouldn't really be putting ANYONE on. And, a true closer can shut down the game no matter who is up. Look at what Papelbon did. We have 1-2-3 in the order, and he strikes out 2 and gets Hafner out (albeit on a long fly ball, but it's still an out). And he's throwing in the mid-to-upper 90s. Borowski's throwing, what, batting practice?
I've said it before and I'll say it again. The guy is Quincy Morgan. Every time he touches the ball, it's an adventure.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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Dang Papelbon is a stud, he blew Grady away. Borowski needs to be gone, off the team, he's done. This is gonna be a very tough loss to rebound from, Jake pitched so well, too many soxx fans. Plus the whole ALCS stuff. Ouch! 
Last edited by BrownsFanZ; 04/14/08 10:59 PM.
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It's dawned on me over the past while now how much I have grown to hate the Red Sox. I like probably everyone else used to pull for them when the Indians weren't involved in any way. It wasn't that I even remotely liked the Red Sox it's just that one, I hated the Yankee's worse and two, Boston fans whine more than any other in sports. I figured a Red Sox win would stick it to the Yankees while at the same time putting an end to the woe is us, whine and cheese, bellyaching, attitude that most Red Sox fans displayed. Seriously Boston fans complained about a CURSE? At least one of their teams was always good. It was either the Celtics winning championships or the Patriots winning super-bowls but still they complained. But anyways I digress, now I think I might dislike them more than the Yankees, there I said it.
I CAN"T STAND all of the "Red Sox" fans. It might be the biggest bandwagon in sports. It seems that everyone at least likes the Red Sox. On top of that they have pretty much become the Yankees. It used to be the Evil Empire vs. the Red Sox, annual favorite vs. cursed underdog. Now the Red Sox spend money with the Yankees. They spend Billions of millions just to NEGOTIATE with pitchers. They bring in aging veterens and pay them boatloads. They have become what they once despised. At least the Yankees will always be the Yankees. The Sox just get continuously more annoying.
Eric "Easy E" Wright and KW2- Bringing the attitude back to Browns football
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I would also like to chime in and state that Borowski is awful. A lot of us said it last year and had his number of saves thrown at us.. well you can't play with fire forever. He got away with it a lot last year and I don't see him EVER having a year close to that again. Even the announcer said it, when Borowski comes on the mound the hitters feel confident they can get a couple guys on and have a chance... when real closers (like Papelbon) come on, you just hope for the best... There isn't a team in the AL that fears Borowski coming on in the 9th, not one.
I have every confidence that Fausto and CC will get it together, I have every confidence that the offense will come around.. I have every confidence that Borowski will easily lead the AL in blown saves if he is our closer all year...
yebat' Putin
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I've pretty much got to agree with everything you just said.
Born and breed with OSU, App. State alumni, but bleed orange and brown.
Go ARMY......Beat Navy!!!!!!
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Well, that's my problem. As a closer, you shouldn't really be putting ANYONE on. And, a true closer can shut down the game no matter who is up. Look at what Papelbon did. We have 1-2-3 in the order, and he strikes out 2 and gets Hafner out (albeit on a long fly ball, but it's still an out). And he's throwing in the mid-to-upper 90s. Borowski's throwing, what, batting practice?
I've said it before and I'll say it again. The guy is Quincy Morgan. Every time he touches the ball, it's an adventure.
Not saying its right (because I don't think it is), just that thats how it is at this point.
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WOW! Last thing I heard on the radio, we were winning going into the 8th. I went to check ESPN to see if we won and I honestly thought to myself, "Joe Blow probably blew it." I feel sick to my stomach. He has looked downright AWFUL this year (not to say he was good last year). I'll be at the game tomorrow night. Hopefully we'll get a complete game from Byrd and Joe Blow can keep his sorry )*&$)(*@#$ in the pen. 
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Its easy to see like you said, he got lucky last year. His ERA was crazy high for a closer. Hitters aren't afraid of him at all, plus theres no way our players have any confidence in him.
They guy has average stuff at best, his fastball never hits above 88, plus his control is iffy, you can't walk people in the 9th. But his control gets him behind hitters, then he has to throw his lousy fastball and he gets hammered.
Call up someone from AAA ,and move Raffy to the closer role. Sadly i'm afraid this isn't the last we've seen of Joe Blow trying to save games.
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Why is this guy getting a paycheck?
Is ANYONE going to try and defend him now?
I am sick and tired of hearing "All he does is save games. Look at his save numbers from last year" blah friken blah blah DAMN IT!!! 
Even when he does save a game he puts people on and never overpowers batters like a closer is SUPPOSED to do He gets bailed out ALL the time and how many saves were him going into the 9th with 3 or 4 runs and we win by 1? They need to wake the hell up and demote this guy. I remember when I heard he was going to be the closer this year and the radio announcer's first words were he was solid. Look at the numbers. Cleveland fans need to lay off b/c he will get the job done, yadda yadda yadda
sigh.
Our honor defend, we will fight to the end, for OHIO! GO BUCKS!
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Not to change the subject, did anyone see David Delluci's pathetic arm display on the Lugo double? The Tribe can send him wherever they send Joe Blow.
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I would also like to chime in and state that Borowski is awful. A lot of us said it last year and had his number of saves thrown at us.. well you can't play with fire forever. He got away with it a lot last year and I don't see him EVER having a year close to that again. Even the announcer said it, when Borowski comes on the mound the hitters feel confident they can get a couple guys on and have a chance... when real closers (like Papelbon) come on, you just hope for the best... There isn't a team in the AL that fears Borowski coming on in the 9th, not one.
I have every confidence that Fausto and CC will get it together, I have every confidence that the offense will come around.. I have every confidence that Borowski will easily lead the AL in blown saves if he is our closer all year...
I am too pissed to even get into this right now, but you pretty much hit it all on the head DC. I can't believe I am even saying this, but the only positive is that this happens now so we can get either Kobayashi, Julio, or Mastny in the role by mid May.....
This is professional sports, and as the saying goes, you are either part of the problem, or part of the solution...
Joe is a nice guy and all, but he just does not have the physical tools to be pitching at this level....
I heart winning
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Joe is a nice guy and all, but he just does not have the physical tools to be pitching at this level....
Exactly. Last year some guys on here took defending him to a very personal level. I have nothing against the guy, I'm sure he's a great guy and I'm sure he's doing everything he can with what he has.... problem is, what he has isn't enough. I can go find 100 college pitchers TOMORROW that have mediocre stuff and can throw it 85 mph...
Not to mention, right now he is lacking the single biggest thing a closer needs... CONFIDENCE.
yebat' Putin
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Why didn't the Indians resign Kenny Lofton? The amount of energy he brings to the club is HUGE
Cleveland Browns, Space Browns ![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/iVP5Po2.png)
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I'd just like to re-affirm that I was never "one of those guys that defended Borowski".  In fact, I think it was me who coined the phrase "Joe Blow". I did however defend Shapiro for signing him ... the only two other suggestions I heard for closers the last few off-seasons were Trevor Hoffman and Eric Gagne ... and both of their current teams would probably trade them for Joe Blow, straight up. What we really need to do is watch a team like St. Louis. If the Cards can't get into the playoff picture, a guylike Isringhausen might become available. In the meantime, I say we go with one of the Raffy's at close ... just anybody but Joe. 
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I know it's early but we do have to be looking at another option for a closer, Joe just ant getting it done, many, many things went his way last eyar and well this year they ant, not panicing but one can easily see when something just ant working, joes got nothing on his pitches....Sorry Joe but times up...
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This may sound like a radical option, but how about Adam Miller?
He's been on the shelf so much he may not just have starter endurance, which, if his mental toughness is there, would make him a perfect closer because he has the wicked stuff a closer would need.
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I dont think its a bad idea at all, I think its something they should look into, but you have to be careful, we saw how the Carmona as a closer thing worked out.
Eat it Phil...
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Looks like the old HGH must have worn off for JoeBo? If the body isn't recovering in time to get the fastball higher than 75-82 mph there's a problem with his recovery. Either that or he's injured. I tend to believe the former before the latter though.
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That's why I put it under the "radical idea" category.
That said, I think Carmona would shine as a closer now...he gained a lot of mental toughness last season, especially in the playoffs. Of course, since he's in the rotation, I wouldn't want that now.
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This may sound like a radical option, but how about Adam Miller?
Who is the closer in buffalo ?
I know they dont say your the closer in AAA so you will be a closer in the bigs, but it's something to look at and see, and what about this Koyanchi guy we signed from Japan, wasnt he a closer over there, yes things are diffrent, but sometimes ya dont know what ya got until ya try it,
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Looks like the old HGH must have worn off for JoeBo? If the body isn't recovering in time to get the fastball higher than 75-82 mph there's a problem with his recovery. Either that or he's injured. I tend to believe the former before the latter though.
Yeah, I'd have to agree that Borowski was obviously juicing (given how steep of a drop off there's been on his velocity the past two years). He just doesn't have anything left at all. A guy just doesn't lose 3-4 MPH on his fastball from year to year. He's gone from 89 to 85 to 83. If that doesn't raise a red flag I don't know what does.
Joe had a decent run but it's time to move on.
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Quote:
Quote:
This may sound like a radical option, but how about Adam Miller?
Who is the closer in buffalo ?
I know they dont say your the closer in AAA so you will be a closer in the bigs, but it's something to look at and see, and what about this Koyanchi guy we signed from Japan, wasnt he a closer over there, yes things are diffrent, but sometimes ya dont know what ya got until ya try it,
It's Ric Bauer. A 6'6'' righty who has 2 saves thus far and an ERA of 0.00 in 4 appearances. Has 5 SO's in 4 innings and an opposing BA of .154.
Seems like it's worth a shot based on his numbers. The only issue with him is that he's 31. He had a good year in the bigs for Texas in 2006 but struggled last year in the minors. He'd be a stop gap for now.
Lewis seems like the most likely option if we're going to turn to a current player on the roster.
It's a little unfortunate that LHP Tony Sipp got hurt at the end of last year. Given his live arm and his very good stuff, he could have potentially been an option this year at closer. He was really our only major league closing prospect in the minors and naturally, he needed Tommy John at the end of last year.
He has some nasty stuff....good velocity (in to the mid 90's) with his fastball and a very hard, biting slider. I just hope he can recover from his surgery and return to form because this kid could really be special. Hopefully his career isn't done as he is only 24. Baseball America ranked him as the #2 closer prospect in all the minors and then he throws out his elbow the following year.
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I like the Miller idea, but he's still a few weeks away. Honestly, I'd look at Jensen Lewis first. He's got a decent fastball, good movement and good deception in his delivery. I don't want to mess up the Raffys setting up unless we absolutely have to.
For whoever asked, the closer at Buffalo has been Rick Bauer. He's not really a contender for that spot that will open up in the bullpen. You'll be looking at Edward Mujica (not likely), Scott Elarton, Reid Santos or (much more likely) Tom Mastny.
[color:"green"] "World domination has encountered a momentary setback. Please talk amongst yourselves." Get Fuzzy[/color]
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j/c
Can I just ask why they took out Perez? The guy threw, what, 3 pitches and struck the guy out? Sometimes I just don't get this blind reliance on a guy as a "closer", especially someone as inconsistent (or at least consistently inconsistent) as Borowski. I've never understood that unless you have a guy who is just plain a shutdown closer (Eckersley, Quisenberry, Gagne in the day).
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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ESPN Article "I just felt like I had nothing, like I was throwing through water," Borowski said. "It's like I'm stuck in one gear. I had no extra gear. Not only that, I couldn't locate. What hurts is the guys played a great game except the one guy out there at the end." Indians manager Eric Wedge is worried about Borowski. "The ball just wasn't coming out of his hand like we've seen it," Wedge said. "I'm going to have to talk to him and see how he feels." Wedge said he has no immediate plans to replace Borowski unless there's a reason he must. "Before I go down that road," Wedge said, "out of respect to him, I want to talk to him."It was another bitter loss for the Indians, who were one win from a trip to the World Series last fall when they collapsed. They lost once at home before being trounced twice in the shadow of the Green Monster. Cleveland was outscored 23-4 in Games 6 and 7 by the Red Sox, who went on to sweep Colorado for their second title in four years. Travis Hafner had two RBIs and Victor Martinez added three hits and an RBI for the Indians. Two walks by Boston starter Jon Lester set up a two-run fifth that put Cleveland ahead 4-1 I agree somewhat with Wedge, but if tonight the Tribe is up 4-3 going into the 9th. No way in hell should Joe Blow go out there, go to talk to him, but at the same time he must immedately be taken off the closer roler.
Put Raffy Betancourt in there now, I think Jensen Lewis can develop into a nice closer eventually.
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Out of curiosity, for all those that want to move bentancourt to closer, who prey tell do you bring in with 1 out and the bases loaded in the top of the seventh with Ortiz and Manny due up?
Your best relief pitcher should come in when he is needed, not when the inning number tells you so.
Crowded elevators smell different to short people...
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Legend
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Why not still bring in Betancourt and let him pitch a couple innings if he's got the stuff? Why only have one closer? Bring in Betancourt one game, Perez the next, Lewis the next, etc, especially if the Raffys pitch like they did last year. It drove me nuts when they would pitch great and then be pulled the next inning for no apparent reason, especially for Borowski.
I am unfamiliar with this feeling of optimism
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