DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Tailgate Forum Help form the IT guys....

Hello all...I have a dilema & would like some input/advice from those of you in the IT field.

I have been trying to make a career change for the last three years, but as some of you know, that can be difficult.

My passion & hobby is computers & this is the field I would like to turn into a career.

I am fairly well versed in Windows XP & had the opportunity to actually mentor (part time) with an MCSE certified tech for about 3 months on setting up & deploying networks for small businesses with Windows Server 2003. He was training me to come aboard as a full time employee.

This situation ended when I had to take a new job & the hours required forced me to stop the training....gotta pay the bills.

Anyways, I still want to pursue this career field, but unfortunately, I'm going to have to do it on my own...at my own pace. I have had a bad expierience with one online school that was forcing me to take alot of English & other non- related courses...I felt that I was just throwing my money away.

The long & short of it is, I need guidance.
It seems like there are a million courses & exam study guides that I could take or buy to get my MCSA certification(I'm told this is where to start) but no real definitive answers on which are the best to take.

So my question to you is this:

I would like to study & obtain my MCSA certification on my own...either through the purchase of study guides & or e-learning. Then paying for & taking the exams.

I am interested in setting up & maintaining business networks...what exams do I need to take & what courses do you recommend to prepare me to do so?

Please Help!!


BTW...I will be posting this on a couple other sites...sorry if you read this more than once!

found this info

seems to show just what you need...i would check your local community college to see if they have any classes..at least there you can talk to a counciler...



microsoft mcsa

Only problem with the Microsoft Certification programs, is that the certificate only looks good on paper. It doesn't mean anything.

What I mean is, I know alot of guys with all those certifications, and when it comes to troubleshooting, they only have the book smarts.

ie: the PC wont turn on. They will dismantle the things trying to find a bad part, when all they had to do was plug in the power cord. Common sense is lacking.

I'm not saying all certified guys are like that but a good percentage are. There is nothing better than experience. Like a 40 year mechanic can hear what your troubles are as your pulling up to the station, the certified guy hooks it up to a diagnostic machine and waits for an answer.

As for training, I basically learn as I go along...If we have a need here for something I do some research and learn it. Advantage of working for a small company. I also buy alot of books on subjects and download demo software that I load on a demo machine and play with to learn more complicated things.

well, I took the O.J.T. and self-taught approach... but then again, I spent almost all of 2006 unemployed and am now working as a Programmer instead of being in I.T. where I have almost a decade of experience (gotta go where the work is).

I am NOT a believer in certifications at all, I think it's a crappy neverending cycle that vendors get you on as a secondary revenue stream. The flip side is that HR Managers seem to love them. To me however, do NOT study just to pass the tests....actually learn what it is that is being taught and the reasons behind it. If you do that, you won't have to study for the tests because you will actually KNOW the information.

If you want into IT, my advice on Step 1 is to get yourself a a Domain setup at home, perhaps even a multi-domain Forest, and start playing around. If you can't get your hands on that many machines (or the electric bill dictates that you can't run that many), then get one really solid machine and run VMWare so you can set up bunches of virtual machines, then combine them into a domain/forest. Th two-fold effect here is you learn Win2k3 enterprise networking, but also you learn about virtualization which is one of the bigger hot items recently.

Finally, start teaching yourself Linux immediately, and Linux in the Windows enterprise to be exact. Between Windows, VMWare & Linux... you will have covered the bulk of the things folks are looking for.

As a long time Head Hunter that has probably placed 100's of people in roles like you want, I can tell you this,, Nothing,,,and I mean nothing beats experience.. All the certs in the world will not get you where you want to go.. all those certs do is get you in the door so that you can prove yourself to be worthy of the Certs in the first place..

It's a crazy sorta catch-22 I'm sorry to report.

So you ask, what now? Ok, I have three suggestions for you.

Only one of them will get you into the Business systems you want.. The other two will get you experience and pay you at the same time.

1. Circuit City has a new service called Firedog... I believe you can check them out at Firedog.com. You can also go to any Circuit City store,,, I believe they now have a kiosk at each store..

2. Best Buy has the Geek Squad. Again, I believe it's Geeksquad.com but I'm not sure. They pretty much do the same type of things that Firedog does but to get hired is a little tougher than at Firedog... That will most likely change.

Neither of these first two will get you into Business systems much.. The occasional guy like me might come along where I have my own website and run a small business out of my home. But mostly it's guys that surf the web and get a virus and need help, or people that get new equipment and need help setting it up or basic repairs etc etc...

The thrid option is for you to look in the phone book in your area and search out system integrators or system consultanting firms.. Those are the places that might haver what you need.

Places like Acendex. over in Beachwood ohio might take a chance on you depending on how you interview in person..

Couple of things to think about...

Appearence counts: If you get hired, you will be in front of a customer... so neatness counts

Communication skills Count: I don't think I need to tell you why do I <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Knowledge counts: What do you have experience with? XP, WIn98, Small networks, wireless communicaton, etc etc..

If you get the intervews and you know the basics, and you are neat and clean and can talk about what you know, someone will give you a shot and proving it..

Good luck!

Thanks for your answers!!

As far as experience goes...I am above average with XP & have setup 2 small networks (WS2k3) on my own...nothing elaborate 1 server 2-4 clients.
I have just started studying & understanding DHCP & IP addresses & how they pertain to a network...but this is as far as I have gotten.

As far as work experience goes, once I study & pass the exams & am confident enough in my abilities could I use the 6 months I spent setting up a few small networks (the largest involved about 25 clients & a server) with the gentleman who was mentoring me (He does own his own IT company) ?

I also maintain the network at my current employer. Granted...there is no IT department at my current job, but I did help setup up the network (only 3 clients & a server) & help maintain it . Could this be counted as experience?


Thx for your help!!!

Certs: Most look at it as study to get the cert. IMO, the way to look at it is get the cert because i studied. Look at what you want to do, and study and learn. It just so happens that these certs cover a lot of the material that you will study. I had the knowledge, might as well pass the test. For the most part, they are a good guideline of what to study to get into a certain area. Problem is 1. they are designed for profit. Get a cert and you can go someplace and say your Microsoft certified, Cisco certified etc. That turns into free advertising for Microsoft, Cisco etc.

The problem is they look great to HR people, but alot of people do get the cert but don't know a thing. This applies to the lower level certs that you will be looking at. Higher ones like CCIE or some of the security ones you need to know your stuff. The Linux Red Hat certs I heard are pretty tough as well.

If you feel you can do the job, apply for it. The experience requirements on most job postings are crap anyway(ie Must have 5-7 years of .net excperience 1 year after .net was released). Go after what you feel you can do. However, if you hit the experience barrier, you may have to take a step back in order to go forward. I looked for a job for 2 years after college. In the end I had to settle for a help desk job. But if all goes well, byt the end of the year I should be on my way.

Good luck in your career move. VMware will be huge. Being able to experiment without harming your main system is great.

Ouch - a programmer isn't IT. Sounds like all the hardware guys I work with who think we don't do anything <img src="/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Agreed!

Good call on that. VMWare is going to be huge (it already is in a lot of places). Where I am consulting at now (I'm not in IT, cause I'm a programmer <img src="/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> ) whenever I need a new server, they just setup a new VMWare one. Pretty slick stuff - I run VMWare on my laptop to simulate multi-system enviroments as well. The really cool thing is that the VMWare server version is free, so you can learn it for next to nothing.

I have the resources to set up about 3-4 computers at my house...but I like the idea of a virtual machine....I am assuming that you mean VMServer...correct?

Will the free download work? I am assuming that the VirtualCenter for VMware Server would be for instructors to deploy & manage multiple virtual machines in a training environment, is this correct?

Tell me about it <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />
I've been a network/IT type guy since the days of ThinNet & BNC connectors... I've built workgroups with Win 3.11 on multi-user DOS platforms using dumb terminals & run my own win2k3 AD domain here at home with my own Exch2k3 mail server,hehe.... but now I'm working with .NET, PowerBuilder, Perl & more... gotta go where the work is <img src="/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />.


before I took this current gig programming I did a contract job for a company on the east side doing a SAN installation work for the purpose of virtualizing about 280 servers... friggin HUGE project.

Of course, like any project that size, upper mgmt. had no real concept of what they signed off on so when the real $$ started getting spent they shut it down to re-evaluate their needs. <img src="/images/graemlins/rolleyes1.gif" alt="" />

Anyway, that's where I started playing a bit with VMWare and started getting wind of how huge it's becoming. It seems *everyone* wants to build SANs and virtualize their environments now.

Getting VMWare free, and then getting a copy of RedHat for free.... instant Linux environment ... add in a 180-day eval copy of Win2k3 Server and you're off & running. <img src="/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif" alt="" />


p.s. Another *must* have for the network guy is Routing, and Cisco Routing in particular.

The reason that virtualization is so big now is resources. Most machines sit around and do nothing most of the time.

if you have an intelligent hypervisor, you can host hundreds of virutal machines on one physical system. It also saves you tons floor space and cooling costs.

a buddy of mine works at a very large company that has hundreds of linux VMs running on a mainframe now. the mainframe has already paid for itself

somebody else has already mentioned the ease of setup. you basically pull a machine off a template and start it up.

virutalization is where it's at <img src="/images/graemlins/thumbsup.gif" alt="" />