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Let Chud run the show. He can probably manage the game better than Romeo.
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Let Chud run the show. He can probably manage the game better than Romeo.
As a fan of Batman, I like your username, off topic but whatever. I'm still fuming.
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I know I'll catch flack from certain "know it alls" for being knee-jerk, but dammit, I know when I'm right and I know when I'm wrong...I'm right here. Romeo's gotta go.
I'm a "know it all".
You're a knee jerk.
#gmstrong
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Firing him now doesn't do anything for the team.
I agree. I am over him but i'm not a fan of sending teams into a mess in the middle of the season.
Ruining QB's since 1999.
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I am over him but i'm not a fan of sending teams into a mess in the middle of the season.
Neither was RAC when he didn't want to change OC's mid-season.
#gmstrong
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he lost me the 1st 2 games of the year, most notably pittsburgh. as chris palmer said infamously" Its a runaway train."
Da, Romeo, and Braylon MUST GO.
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It's not all that hard to believe when you consider that pur DL currently resembles a MASH unit.
I also have to ask ..... where was all of this anger toward the defense and Romeo last week when the exact same thing happened?
Micah 6:8; He has shown you, O mortal, what is good. And what does the Lord require of you? To act justly and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God.
John 14:19 Jesus said: Because I live, you also will live.
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What exactly did Romeo do wrong last night...
What coaching decision lead to our loss?
I actually thought that RAC did a decent job last night.. One questionable call maybe... but beyond that,, he did a decent job.
It's kind of a double edged sword here,, but if you wanna find a culprit for last nights game,, they you have your choice of our defense allowing two big plays or KW2 with three bad plays..
I'd say that KW2 at least did some good things.. over 100 yards,, two TD's and a couple other clutch receptions. So I'm more inclined to give him a pass for the two mistakes and one missed catch I saw him make...
You might want to consider giving Chud a smack on the wrist for not having a Jamal Lewis in the backfield when Quinn threw that pass to KW2 that he whiffed at. It might have made the D play more honest.. with only Wright in the backfield and 4th and 1, the D knew it was a pass coming...
So what excuse does the D have? Far as I can tell,, none..
What I'm more concerned about is our LB's in General and a horrible mistake made by either Pool or Jones (don't remember which it was that seemed out of position for that 90+ yard TD by Denver).
You are not going to convince me that they aren't coached to watch for that.. so it must have just been a blown play.. so is that coaching or just a bad move by a player? I say the player blew it.
Our CB's got beat a couple of times,, I guess that happens to the best of them.. Ours are still young and have more potential to grow.
So how is this the fault of RAC last night?
If you wanna blame a coach,, you might want to consider Mel Tucker.... But again, I'm pretty sure that coaching is good, but execution on a couple of plays left much to be desired.
Others have pointed out in the past how much they wish RAC would just go away.. and they've all given reasons .. Generally, I've stayed the course, but even I recently have had thoughts that maybe he isn't what is needed to go forward from here.
But last night,, I don't think that RAC did anything completely out there to cause anyone to choose this game as the straw that broke the camels back..
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
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I'd lay some on Sean Jones, too. Twice in the last two games we get torched on a long pass play because he didn't provide the deep cover like he should have. Twice in the last two weeks he failed on a run (against Balt he moved out of the runner's way on the goal line and didn't challenge the TD, last night on 4th and 1 he hits the runner in the backfield and humps his leg as he gets carried for a 1st down).
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Firing him now doesn't do anything for the team.
I agree. If we didn't do it several weeks ago, might as well ride it out now.
I am fine with that because I know the guy is done. Now it is simply a question of is savage going with him and who is going to be the next HC??
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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It's not a question of that actually, not just yet.....good showings by the new QB throughout the remainder of the season could very well mean the only changes we see in the offseason are player changes.
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That was kinda what I was thinking... but in the end,, its win or go..
I'm hoping that we can win out,, but if the team keeps collapsing in the 4th quarter,, that's just not going to happen..
Ultimately, if the team plays well through 3 quarters,, and then flops in the 4th,, to me that's probably as much a coaching issue as anything else. JMO however...
I said over the summer that if we go 9 or 10 wins this season, then you could look at last year as real and not an anomoly. Right now, those prophets that said we had 10 wins last season because of a weak schedule are looking more and more correct. and in that case,, it's probably time for RAC to go.
#GMSTRONG
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Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Firing him now doesn't do anything for the team.
J/K
Fireing RAC.....I agree end of season, dosent do anybody any good to fire mid season.
Now If we fire him and replace him with a coach who has no previous winning experiance as a NFL head coach, I'm all for leaving him in place, I'm tired of hot young college coachs, (Butch Davis) or experianced cordinators (Palmer, RAC) if we cant get Cowher or Jeff fisher than I say leave RAC be.
I'm scared of Savages connection with Oklahoma & Stoops connection with North East Ohio. If RAC is fired & Cowher dosent take the job look for Stoops to be hired or Iowa's coach Frientz (SP)
Maybe it's not the coachs fault but the players problems,
Maybe we should take a page from our ememies Pittsburgh, when things got tuff they didnt fire cowher, they replaced the players.  I know the coach is responcible for the players, yes but the players are also responcible for themselves, we could argue all day on who's & whats.
I do think RAC is soft and dosent bench or stick a foot up a premodona's behind enought, but I also think the players should know how to prepare and work. it's both..
Last edited by ClayM57; 11/07/08 09:36 AM.
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I do think RAC is soft and dosent bench or stick a foot up a premodona's behind enought, but I also think the players should know how to prepare and work. it's both..
You know, I hear that comment a lot about RAC being soft.. and I'm not sure if it's accurate.. I mean, look at him on the sidelines and I can see how he gets the soft label..
But we don't know what goes on behind the scenes in the locker room or behind closed doors at practice..
So it may,, I SAY MAY, be an inaccurate characterazation..
#GMSTRONG
“Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.”
Daniel Patrick Moynahan
"Alternative facts hurt us all. Think before you blindly believe."
Damanshot
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Firing him now doesn't do anything for the team.
That's the problem. Firing him now won't do anything for the team but at the same time, he needs to go. His team flat out doesn't show up to play in the fourth quarter. I want RAC gone at the end of the year but honestly, if we had any assistant that I thought was ready to head coach at this level, I'd pull the trigger already. I just think that for as bad as we are with RAC, we'd be worse without him this year. I'm torn.
We're... we're good?
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It's not a question of that actually, not just yet.....good showings by the new QB throughout the remainder of the season could very well mean the only changes we see in the offseason are player changes.
I concede that.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I don't care if we have no one qualified to run the ship right now...fire him.
I've had it.
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This season is now about develpoing Quinn.
Firing RAC now only creates bigger issues, and an unstable team...it doesnt help anything except satisfy the fans need for blood.
I know the frustration is high...but wait until the season is over. It accomplishes nothing to fire RAC...nothing...it only hurts this team.
When the season is over, and we can see who is availble...then lets look into it.
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Dont get to hungry for blood,
RAC will be back next year, Why Lerner & Savage are trying to build stability within the organization.
Quinn develpment is at stake and what new coach is gonna wanna come in with restrictions on the offense, Your the new head coach but Chud stays & runs the offense. New coach hands off, now that will earn him respect,
Savage wont put Quinn next year in a new system.
I dont see us changing anything except personnel on the DEF. side,
Like it or not RAC has one more year
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Uh...why not fire the entire defensive staff and Romeo and keep Chud and the offensive staff if that is your worry?
See the Ravens and Redskins that kept on their defensive staff and brought on new HCs and offensive staffs.
Now, we need a HC that will grill Chud when he doesn't get the ball to the playmakers enough, but Chud overall seems to be pretty imaginative in his schemes...
"May the Schwartz be with you"
#gmstrong
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Uh...why not fire the entire defensive staff and Romeo and keep Chud and the offensive staff if that is your worry?
Just wanted to add a diffrent view to the conversation, many questions need to be addressed and there a thousands of diffrent senarios that could play out.
but addressing what you said I agree, but doing that might point even more to Phil grabbing Stoops away from Oklahoma, or another college coach which i'm deeply scared about, i dont see a coach like Cowler being told he has to keep Chud, Cowler wont come here if his hands are tied in any way.
maybe we just go Def. and Savage tells RAC if you stay but Def. we need to run a 4-3 and these coachs go and these stay ?
Just another perspective of our situation.
Miranalli from Detroit might be available at the end of the season as a def. cordinator ? He did a pretty good job in Tampa....just a thought.
Last edited by ClayM57; 11/07/08 01:40 PM.
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Let Chud run the show. He can probably manage the game better than Romeo.
Chud is a little green for one, and I question some of that man's decisions as well.
Firing Romeo mid-season will do nothing to help this team out.
![[Linked Image from pic18.picturetrail.com]](http://pic18.picturetrail.com/VOL905/3216203/6567769/349897772.jpg) "The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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Fire Romeo at the end of the year, not now.
However, It's not early to start on some of these coaches on defense. Start with the linebackers coach and work your way down the list.
you had a good run Hank.
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Firing RAC mid-season serves no useful purpose. Our season is over and it's all about next year. Start laying the ground work early and build a freakin' defense. Also I wouldn't worry too much about Stoops taking the job. He's got a sweet gig in Oklahoma and there's not much reason for him to leave it.
#GMSTRONG
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Fair enough.
I'm actually just as worried about us going after a team-controlling presence like Cowher as I would be a college coach like Stoops. I think both would be a mistake.
I don't think Savage has done a horrible job in his time here. I would argue that he has done a pretty good job. He has missed on a couple of draft picks (cough, Wimbley), but everyone does. I like how he has focused on fixing positions and gone out and got it done (OL and CB in 07...DL in 08). Also, he has a real knack for finding some late round gems (McDonald and Hall stick out the most).
So, I'd prefer to keep Phil. I also think Chud has shown promise and could nurture Quinn, so it would be nice to keep Chud.
That means getting a HC that wouldn't mind that...some here say they don't want a "rookie" HC, but the recent ones in the NFL have acquitted themselves well (Tomlin, Harbaugh, M. Smith, Sparano). My personal choice is Schwartz (Browns ties, coached under Belicheck and Fisher, great at getting the most out of a defense), but I am sure there are others as well.
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Savage wont put Quinn next year in a new system.
This isn't RAC's system. It's CHUD's system. Firing RAC doesn't mean starting from scratch. It simply means firing RAC.
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Like it or not RAC has one more year
I'll tell you why I don't believe that.
If we don't fire RAC, everyone will be on pins and needles going into the season. If we get out of the gates slow for reasons that aren't even in his control (such as injuries.....sound familiar?) the pressure to dump him will be huge, and once you fire a HC, you simply don't win with the interim guy.
I think there'll be too many negative feelings to keep him if we continue to play like this. Players, fans, and the media will have lost faith in him, even if the FO doesn't. Players will play tight, so the risk of buckling is huge.
I think the odds of him surviving into next year aren't very good.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Savage wont put Quinn next year in a new system.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This isn't RAC's system. It's CHUD's system. Firing RAC doesn't mean starting from scratch. It simply means firing RAC.
Very true, My point was that keeping Chud will limit who we bring in as the head coach. and I say that pointing to the name everybody is calling for Cowler, Do you think cowler would want to become our head coach knowing Chud and this system comes with the job. I'm not sure I dont know, just tossing it out thier.
I'm kinda looking at it diffrent people might get one thing they want, RAC being fired, but they shouldnt than expect the other thing hiring of Cowler, I dont know if those two things work without cleaing the entire house, To me Cowler wants control and he wants to say who is where. just my point.
now a college coach such as Stoops, (I'm just using him as an example becuase of Phils love for underachiving sooners, ) might go along with keeping chud & his system as to get a NFL head coaching job, now Iowa's coach Frintz might be in the running also, but do we wanna take the College coaching route again, the last one didnt work out to well,
And if we do this, wouldnt it be point to Phil looking for a defensive minded coach, no point bringing in a Offensive brain only to tell him hands off the offense it's Chuds. so does that fit Stoops or Frantz or who is outr thier to fit that Bill, Cowler ? 
just a few Questions.
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Very true, My point was that keeping Chud will limit who we bring in as the head coach. and I say that pointing to the name everybody is calling for Cowler, Do you think cowler would want to become our head coach knowing Chud and this system comes with the job. I'm not sure I dont know, just tossing it out thier.
More important than just just Chud, it's been widely reported that Cowher wants full control. That means Lerner would have to fire Sherer, Tucker, Chud, Crennel, and Savage.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Quote:
Quote:
Very true, My point was that keeping Chud will limit who we bring in as the head coach. and I say that pointing to the name everybody is calling for Cowler, Do you think cowler would want to become our head coach knowing Chud and this system comes with the job. I'm not sure I dont know, just tossing it out thier.
More important than just just Chud, it's been widely reported that Cowher wants full control. That means Lerner would have to fire Sherer, Tucker, Chud, Crennel, and Savage.
No, it means Cowher would have the choice to keep who he wants. That might or might not be the end to all these guys.
#gmstrong
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Gruden back to college with the Tennessee Vols
Cowler to Tampa Bay ?
Ford fires everybody even hot dog vendors employeed with the Lions and Cowler is given full 100% power over everything.
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The only one of those I want to keep is savage....
I think those saying savage has done a bad job are completely off. Compare the talent of this team to the talent we had 3 years ago. It's not even close.
2 years ago our biggest problem was OL. Fixed.
Last year our biggest problem was DL. Fixed.
You can't change a team with as little talent as we had in 1 year. That everybody thought we were going to be the breakout team this year speaks to how well savage has done on paper getting this team ready to play.
In my view, the GM is basically repsponsible for how good a team looks on paper. And the Coach is responsible for turning paper into wins. Obviously, the GM needs to get talent that works together well, and find diamonds in the rough, which may not be reported in the media. But Savage has done both of those.
~Lyuokdea
~Lyuokdea
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NRTU Lyk.
Gettin' ready for work and listening to ESPN........James Walker was on there expressing his belief that this represents the beginning of the end for Crennel. Back-to-back, double-digit leads in the 4th quarter end up as losses.........benching players, especially the QB...........he thinks it's almost over for Crennel, and his thoughts mirror my own, as I've allready stated.
Assuming Crennel gets the ax at some point, Savage will get his own HC, then his butt will be on the line.
Some do think that Savage could be fired with Crennel. I don't see it happening. Not only was Crennel not Savage's choice, his coaches weren't either. History shows most GM's get to fire a HC before they themselves lose their job. While many things Savage has done are in question, many of them aren't. For every bad decision there's a good one, and that alone will buy him time, and the ability to pick his next HC.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Look how long Detroit kept Millan. 
We don't have to agree with each other, to respect each others opinion.
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History shows most GM's get to fire a HC before they themselves lose their job.
Seriously, why don't you just make this your sig. That way instead of typing it in every post, it will already be there. 
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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History shows most GM's get to fire a HC before they themselves lose their job.
History also shows that the Cleveland Browns organization lacks leadership and is prone to startling knee-jerk decisions.
For the most part I agree with you...and I think it handcuffs us somewhat. If Savage survives, I think Chud survives, so long as he doesn't become a sacrificial interim. I don't know about Tucker, but as is we'd be looking for a HC to work under a GM and alongside an OC...no Cowher-calibur coaches or are going to sniff that gig. I don't know if we go with a rookie HC again either...or a college guy. Which leaves the failed but intriguing fired HC.
But like I said...with this org. I think anything could happen. Savage getting canned would surprise me...but it would be par for the course.
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History also shows that the Cleveland Browns organization lacks leadership and is prone to startling knee-jerk decisions.
I guess if you define four years and no playoff appearances as knee jerk.
LOL - The Rish will be upset with this news as well. KS just doesn't prioritize winning...
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I wouldn't mind seeing another dose of Coach Schottenheimer. Don't know how much control he would demand though. He didn't leave on the same terms Cowher did though.
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Quote:
Quote:
History also shows that the Cleveland Browns organization lacks leadership and is prone to startling knee-jerk decisions.
I guess if you define four years and no playoff appearances as knee jerk.
I think the Quinn start was knee-jerk...not the idea of starting him, but how that decision was reached. The same goes for the Collins situation, and the Winslow suspension and the pulling of Frye...most of our decisions tend to be rash. Again, not the decisions themselves, but how they came to be.
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Is Mariuchi a possibility? I won't hold a bad stint in Detroit against anyone...especially under Millen.
And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul.
- John Muir
#GMSTRONG
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