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I haven't read all the recent posts, so maybe this has been touched on...if so, sorry for presenting the same thought.
One other reason the decision may have been made at this time is because DA has played pretty good ball the last 4-5 games.
Last night in the pregame they were talking about how in the last several games DA had 7-8 TDs...only 1 pick and a rating around 90.
Those are numbers you can trade.
If the desire was to go with Quinn...either as a test the remainder of the season, or forever more....DA is sitting pretty good from a value standpoint. People know we have Quinn and know that sooner or later we were going to have to play him.
DA's potential trade value(or even Quinns for that matter) may have factored in the decision.
Just a thought.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong ![[Linked Image]](http://www.dawgtalkers.net/uploads/small-gator-chomp.gif)
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I agree.. I think it had something to do with trade value for DA, I also think it had something to do with it not appearing to be a knee jerk reaction... he hasn't played bad but he hasn't played particularly great... I see a lot of what can we get for DA threads, but my bigger question is.. who can we get to replace him? We are going to need a back-up... and not a 3rd round rookie draft pick.. we need a vet... maybe we could get Trent Dilfer.. 
yebat' Putin
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When it was crunch time, the rookie stopped playing loose, like most rookie's do. So the move didn't produce the end-effect that it was supposed to do.
Ya know he fared no better than a experienced DA ...WHO HAS tightened up in lesser situations...but your brilliant up and coming OC called pass in almost every short down situation..including toward the end..
WHY?
Why not take the pressure off him..run Lewis and get the first down..and why not call someone else's number EXCEPT K2?
Sorry but Winslow failed on the final play..pass just whizzzed through his hands..he CHOKED when the going got tuff..
Last edited by Attack Dawg; 11/07/08 02:54 PM.
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Quote:
It isn't about the mindset. There isn't a coach out there who's playing just to play
What he says in the lockerroom is one thing. What he says to the media is something else all-together.
Afterall, if being totally honest to the media is never a problem, then this entire situation with the QB's would be a non-story, wouldn't it. 
Let me give you an example, just to drive my point home man.
Did Crennel guarantee a victory? No. Did he say we were going to beat them? Yes. Here's what happens when you give the media an opening like that. This is from the MileHighReport:
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Romeo Crennel Guarantees Browns Victory Over Broncos
milehighreport.com
Now don't think for a moment that the players in the Donks lockerroom haven't been fed that statement over and over and over and over again. Teams are ALWAYS looking for a way to motivate their players, and Crennel just did that.
THAT'S why you don't say such a thing.
I still don't think that affects the games like other people think it does.
Our boys went out and put up points, with a cushy 13 point lead in the second half. The defense fell apart once again, which had nothing to do with RAC's comments.
The only time I can see a comment like that having an affect on a team is like when Anthony Smith made his comments, and the Patriots specifically targeted him, burning him badly on deep throws.
![[Linked Image from pic18.picturetrail.com]](http://pic18.picturetrail.com/VOL905/3216203/6567769/349897772.jpg) "The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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Would you agree that there are 11 guys on the O and 11 guys on the D?
That's missing the point.
Don't digress from the decision!!!!!!!
We made the switch because Crennel felt Quinn could do what Anderson couldn't over the past month. Despite playing pretty well, Anderson was considered to be a guy that choked in the 4th, so Quinn was inserted.
Don't deviate from the thread's topic, which is the CHOICE of inserting Quinn over Anderson.
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But RAC made a move he felt would improve the QB position for the long haul. Nothing more and nothing less.
Wrong, Pit, wrong. He made the decision for the HERE AND NOW, and he said exactly that.
AGAIN, don't confuse the intent of the move. It wasn't to get Quinn needed experience for the future. That's a poritive biproduct. The move was to be able to finish the game because the preception, right or wrong, was that the other guy couldn't do it. We didn't get the win, so the decision was a failure.
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I think he played pretty well. Not great, but pretty well. He had a handfull of errant throws. But overall, pretty accurate and consistant. Definatly a solid foundation that appears you can build on.
I would agree, though we don't know what he's made of because he didn't throw anything longer than 15-yards away from where he released the ball. Real defenses will eat that noise for lunch, and I think more people realize it than I initially believed.
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And all this has shown is that they are not afraid to make the tough choices. At the beginning of last year? That was something that I didn't see, but I'm seeing it now. That's growth and progress.
How you can twist that into what you have?
Because it was a WIN NOW move, and we didn't.
If RAC doesn't accept that Anderson played well enough to keep his job because he couldn't bail out the defense, then RAC's decision to bench him has to be judged a failure because Quinn couldn't do it either. It doesn't matter how well he played until that last drive, because it didn't matter how well Anderson played on before his last drive.
If it's fair for Anderson, it's fair for Quinn. RAC made the decision, and it failed.
As I'd said, I didn't like the decision because it put a rookie who'd never taken a meaningful NFL snap and thrust him into the starting lineup....on a short week, no less  On that last drive, Quinn was clearly not loose. He locked up under the pressure. He rolled out when he didn't need to, then threw a short pass to a wide-open Wright directly into the dirt. That isn't knocking Quinn's performance, but it also doesn't change the fact that he tightened up. Why? Because he's green. I talked about this before the game, and unfortunately, Quinn showed exactly that.
Making the "tough decisions" only work when they work. This one didn't. We benched an improving, veteran QB with our playoff hopes on the line for a kid who'd never taken a meaningful snap. When it was crunch time, the move failed. So RAC failed.
Now, let me refresh your memory with some of my own quotes, as that will answer some of your questions that you posed to me:
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The fans and the media have differing opinions on when and/or if it was time to put in Quinn, but what the vast majority know, at least the smart ones, is that it took a team effort to get here, and it's going to take a team turnaround to fix it. When this season started out like crap, it was everyone's fault. When we turned it around and went 3-1, it was a team revival. Our offense was emerging, and we lose a close game. So what should we do? Bench the quarterback!
I can't believe I'm agreeing with the media here, but we look stOOpid right now, and Crennel even worse for his comments.
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What I've SAID is that we have a very slim shot at the playoffs, and that it's my opinion that Anderson gives us a better chance than Quinn right now, simply because of his experience. My belief stems from how he's played over the last month. Furthermore, it's ALWAYS been my stance that the moment we're out of playoff contention, we need to bench Anderson and start Quinn.
I've also said that it's been a team effort to get us to this point, and it'll take a team effort to bring us out of where we're at. Changing the QB isn't going to fix the teams problems. It's simply a grasp in the dark that reeks of desperation.
It was a gamble. The gamble didn't get us a win because Quinn got squirly when he could have won t e game. Nobody can fault a rookie QB for that. You blame the guy that put him in that position to begin with.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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There are those that felt this was premature..however he showed he can handle things..
I dare say DA would have done better, as he showed in making comebacks he leaves a lot to be desired.
If the defense had done it's part there's no need for any comeback..
But I still say the playcalling and Winslow whiffing at the fourth down pass was the main culprit..
I don't have a real problem with Rac inserting Quinn..What I'm getting fed up is his puppy the defense.
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If the defense had done it's part there's no need for any comeback..
If the defense had done it's part, there's no need for the decision this week.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Why are you more angry at the decision after the game when he showed he can play?
If he stunk up the joint I could see you being more upset, but he didn't..would you still be mad if the Browns had won?
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If Quinn had not gotten tight at the end, and had gone on to win the game, I'd be happy because the gamble would have paid off.
But what-if isn't reality.
I didn't like the move because RAC put a green QB into a potential position to have to win the game without the benefit of experience when we still had a shot at the playoffs, on a short week no less. Unfortunately, he was asked to win the game, and he tightened up.
THAT'S why I didn't like the move.
The move either came a month too late, or a week too early. The only legit reason to put Quinn in was to set him up to succeed against a Division-I defense. Otherwise, you don't put him in over a veteran who's been improving with the season on the line. You do it the following week if you lose.
Get it?
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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Only thing I get is your emotions right now..which are lost on me because I'm actually ticked at the defense..not the decision.
Seems to me you keep ignoring the possiblity that had DA been in that very situation the same end result could have happened..actually has been before with him.
Got that?
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Naaa .... if we were looking at trade value ..... we would have let him play against the Donks ... then benched him ...
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Quote:
Seems to me you keep ignoring the possiblity that had DA been in that very situation the same end result could have happened..actually has been before with him.
Got that?
I'm dealing with reality, not possiblity.
Reality was we threw a green QB into a situation where he may have been asked to win the game. When that happened, he clearly tightened up and we didn't win.
Nobody can say Anderson would have won that game, but he had the experience which probably would have kept him from tightening up.
That's why I thought it was a bad decision. Not because of how Quinn played. Not because the defense crapped like it did the last month. Not because it was Derek Anderson. Simply because we thrust a rookie QB into the spotlight, forcing him to play like a vet at the end, which he didn't. We can talk about Winslow's drop all we want, but we can also talk about the rollout that wasn't necessary, and the dirt-ball he threw to a wide-open Wright. If...If..If....doesn't matter. We benched a veteran, improving QB for a green rook. That rook locked up, we lost the game, RAC wears the horns.
Now's the time for anyone to get in their shots. I've made my points and said my peace.
***Gordon, I really didn't think you could be this stOOpid, but you exceeded my expectations. Wussy.
Manziel, see Josh Gordon. Dumbass.***
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You really sound silly. Quinn played a great game. KW2 catches that 4th down pass the drive goes on.
I know you really really really want to be right on this one buttrying really really really hard is not going to get you there.
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The move either came a month too late, or a week too early.
the timing couldn't be better. now quinn and the coaching staff have 9 days of evaluation and practice, with this game film to look at.
without this start quinn goes into a hostile environment under the brightest lights in the regular season without anything to build on. chud can call a better game having seen what bq already has done well. consequently we will see a much more open offensive game. should anyways.
as for DA, he needed to lead the team into the playoffs to be the guy. saying we still had a shot was like saying the rays were going to win after going 1-3 in the series. yea....they COULD have, but logic tells you the chances were slim. to have benched him earlier than that would have meant he didn't get a truly fair chance to accomplish that goal.
after baltimore we did not expect to make the playoffs. therefore it was time for quinn short week and all.
JMHO hope to see a better game in buffalo!
A man is not old until regrets take the place of dreams.
John Barrymore
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It seems to me that your anger (or disappointment) is pointed directly at Romeo and not Quinn. Your assesment of the end of the game is not something that I am prepared tp comment on yet, but it sure sounds like you are not blaming Quinn. You are not saying that DA would have made the difference, just the decision making process of RAC is very flawed.
Is that the correct assesment of your opinion?
It was a gamble to throw him into a game that we should have been able to win, especially since he gave Quinn only one day to work on timing.
I personally thought it was time to make the change at halftime of the Washington game. We were still in the hunt, so I assume that is why RAC decided not to make the change. Our hopes at the playoffs was not yet gone yesterday, so I would assume DA would have had one more week.
All I will say about Quinn is I think he had a very good first game.
#gmstrong
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The reality really is regardless whether you feel Quinn choked at crunch time , DA could have too..and we have 23 games to go by..we've seen him choke in big games..
So I'm not upset with his performance..like I said Winslow had the ball and whiffed it..thats on him..pass was there..he catches it, drive stays alive.
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I'm dealing with reality, not possiblity.
So in your reality, was or was not DA our franchise QB of the future?
If not, you're making a HUGE issue out of the timing of it rather than the actual change itself.
I too felt it was odd timing. But if in fact they did not see DA as our future, whether it was last month, this week, next week or next year, the outcome ends up the same regardless.
So to that end, I simply don't see the actual timing of it as that critical of a factor in the grand scheme of things.
I was one of the sooner than later guys. But I felt it was a must in order for this team to move forward. We had to know where we stood at QB. And it looks like we'll get to find out.
I do find your "nothing over 15 yards and D's will eat that up" a bit funny though.
Are you suggesting he should have forced balls to a double covered BE? Or should he have taken what their D was giving?
And are you suggesting that he doesn't have the arm to throw longer? I really think you're must smarter than to suggest such silliness..............
JMHO
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I do find your "nothing over 15 yards and D's will eat that up" a bit funny though.
Are you suggesting he should have forced balls to a double covered BE? Or should he have taken what their D was giving?
And are you suggesting that he doesn't have the arm to throw longer? I really think you're must smarter than to suggest such silliness..............
Or you wait a second and a half longer for the deep route to come open and risk a sack, passing up the guy running wide open 8-10 yards downfield.. 
yebat' Putin
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Naaa .... if we were looking at trade value ..... we would have let him play against the Donks ... then benched him ...
Maybe so....and I considered that, but ruled that out for a couple of reasons.
First...and this isn't to diminish anything the kid did last night...he looked good my man....but the Broncos was a pretty favorable match-up for us. It was a good game to get the kid in to feel the speed and get over the first game starting jitters. That had to be a pretty exciting moment for him...and excitement doesn't always play out well in football.
Second.....if DA did play and played well..maybe even really well....like Cutler numbers last night....how do you bench a guy on that?? You would look like a idiot....and rightly so.....no player is going to want to come here to play.
And.....he could have flopped...the crowd could have booed.....and you can figure out the rest.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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I just can't get on board with that ... cuase we were still in the playoff hunt ... and to do that would mean we gave up in a back handed way ... I just can't get my arms around that one ...
I believe we were looking for a spark . no more ... no less ...
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Maybe so....or some of all of the above.
If everybody had like minds, we would never learn. GM Strong
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cuase we were still in the playoff hunt
DA is erratic and inconsistant. To suggest we had ANY realistic expectations at a playoff run with DA at QB is a pipe dream.
Intoducing for The Cleveland Browns, Quarterback Deshawn "The Predator" Watson. He will also be the one to choose your next head coach.
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I just can't get on board with that ... cuase we were still in the playoff hunt ... and to do that would mean we gave up in a back handed way ... I just can't get my arms around that one ...
I believe we were looking for a spark . no more ... no less ...
Maybe we should put Brady back there at safety, because the defense is what needs the spark right now.
I know what the offense is capable of when the calls are right, and the execution is there. The defense looked as though they may be turning the corner, then took like 32 steps back.
"The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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Naaaa ... I'd rather move DA back there .... I know BQ has more mobility and is quicker and built better .... but I think BQ will be a much better QB ... maybe short term though ... 
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Definitely.  Quinn did provide a spark. The crowd was 100% behind him at CBS, and the offense for the most part looked good. The running game started to slow down a lot in the 4th quarter, though. I really don't know what to do with this defense, though. Guys are WIDE open in the middle of the field. Wide open. And there's no pressure on the QB. A guy like Cutler absolutely can not have 6 -7 seconds in a pocket to throw. That's absurd. I mean, I do know what we do need on this defense, but that can't happen until next year. Right now, I don't know how to work with what we have right now, because nothing seems to work right.
"The Browns' defense is kicking mucho dupa."
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