DawgTalkers.net Forums DawgTalk Pure Football Forum Indecision on QBs will haunt Browns for years (article)

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Indecision on quarterbacks will haunt Browns for years to come
By Mike Florio - SportingNews
13 hours, 48 minutes ago

Buzz Up PrintIn April 2007, the Cleveland Browns pulled off one of the all-time great draft-day coups. First, they opted to select left tackle Joe Thomas with the third overall pick, passing on the chance to draft Ohio native Brady Quinn.

Then, once the Miami Dolphins passed on Quinn at No. 9, sparking a slide through the teens, the Browns found themselves with an opportunity to trade back into the first round to get Quinn.

The price was steep. The Browns gave up a high second-round pick in 2007 and their 2008 first-round selection. But they emerged from the draft with two players who were poised to become franchise cornerstones.

Quinn held out during training camp long enough to keep him from being the Week One backup to Charlie Frye. And so when the coaching staff yanked Frye from the first game of the 2007 season, Derek Anderson—not Quinn—got the call.

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With everyone assuming that Anderson was keeping the job warm until Quinn was ready to play, Anderson didn’t have the same pressure that most starting quarterbacks experience. It widely was believed that, as to Anderson’s removal from the lineup, it wasn’t a question of “if” but “when.”

Without the pressure of holding a job that no one thought he would keep, Anderson thrived. But with a playoff berth on the line in late December, Anderson felt the pressure.

And he crumbled.

Facing a bad Cincinnati Bengals defense, Anderson threw four interceptions. Thus, the reward for a 10-6 season was a January free from football.

The Browns were right to ride Anderson’s hot hand last season, but the moment for courageous decision-making came after the season. They were in position to recover the first-round pick they gave up for Quinn, and possibly more, by slapping Anderson with the highest restricted free agency tender and then trading him.

The only problem? G.M. Phil Savage was afraid. He feared that Quinn might not develop into a solid starter, that Anderson would develop into a star elsewhere, and that Savage would look foolish for picking the wrong man.

And so Savage tried to have it both ways. By giving Anderson a three-year deal, Savage could delay the moment at which he had to make a final decision.

Clearly, Savage should have gotten what he could for Anderson, and entrusted the job to the guy about whom he thought highly enough to give up a first-round and a second-round pick.

I know, I know. It’s easy to come to that conclusion with the benefit of hindsight. But the evidence was there to support a belief that, once Anderson had something to lose as the full-time starter with the big contract, he might be a more skittish. Apart from the fact that it’s common sense, the fact that Anderson collapsed in a game on which a playoff berth was riding should have provided Savage with a strong clue as to how Anderson might play with Quinn peering over Anderson’s shoulder.

Savage made the situation even worse by resisting a change to Quinn once it became obvious in September that Anderson wasn’t nearly as good in 2008 as he was a year earlier. But Savage had no choice; if the team had yanked Anderson a couple of games into the season, Savage would have looked foolish for paying him all that money.

So now that Quinn shows that he can play at the NFL level (the Browns’ defense can’t say the same thing), Savage is in a no-win situation. As the 3-6 Browns attempt to pull themselves back into playoff contention, their decision to wait so long to make the change will cause fans to think about what might have been if Anderson had been benched sooner—or, even better, if he’d been sold to the highest bidder in March.

The potential consequences of the decision to keep Anderson might extend well beyond this season. If the Browns can’t get to the playoffs, another year will pass without this young team getting experience in January. And that will make it even harder for the Browns to be successful once they bust through the regular-season ceiling and start playing playoff football.

Moreover, the Browns are without another young player or two whom they would have drafted if they’d traded Anderson for picks. Think about a guy like Felix Jones sharing touches with Jamal Lewis. Or Chris Johnson. All things considered, then, Savage’s fear of making the wrong decision caused him to make the wrong decision—and the franchise could be feeling the effects of it for years to come.

Mike Florio writes and edits ProFootballTalk.com and writes two columns a week for Sporting News.


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Interesting take. I suppose it makes sense. Kind of a bummer

Not to be the "I told you so guy" but I was screaming this to the heavens all last offseason. I wanted to get what we could for da, say goodbye and with those picks draft a LB and CB (if the Cowboys truly were going to use their low 1st and 3rd to get da and trade him to Miami for one higher 1st rounder).

And to those who wanted da around this year as a starter or backup, we could have just signed him to a 1-year tender and let him walk for nothing after this season. If he played awesome and we would commit the world for him to stay, it would be worth the risk to see if he truly was the real deal. Now, we have to worry about trading him for value, which he has none. I suppose we could still dump his contract before the bonus hits next March....but then we'd have a cap hit from his signing bonus.

Stupid move by Phil.

trying like the dog to get in an "I told you so". That is what this world has come to. If Anderson were traded to the boys and then, traded over to the dolphins, then he goes on to have a pro bowl year and resurect the phins, with 30 TD's......The other half would have chimmed in, "the Browns are idiots for trading away a 25 year old Pro Bowl QB, for an unproven 22 year old."

If you just understand that somebody will get to say "I told you so" no matter what happens, then you don't have to worry with these articles.

I Like the Browns.

Florio is dead on the money. I said the exact same thing last year - that we were going to regret being indecisive and not trading DA in the off-season. Now we're seeing it as cold hard reality and Savage, who could have gotten a king's ransom for DA last year, is going to have to bust his butt to right the ship... again.

For the record I was not talking about you, in my I told you so post. We were posting at the same time i guess.

The media, just cracks me up. I call this "I told you so" journalism. Wiat around and see what happens, then say I told you so. Ha Ha. I just try and keep in mind that is anothe rside waiting around for thier chance to throw it around. But I had not even read your post when I posted...I was more attacking the media.

What happens if DA a 25 year old QB has another pro bowl year after we trade him?

I like the Browns.

you guys wouldnt be any fun in Vagas....

sometimes ya gotta take a chance, sometimes it works sometimes it dosent.

Look around the leauge at the starting QB...DA does have a pretty desent value, maybe not a 1st & 3rd, but we traded the down grading of draft picks from last year to this year for 8 regular season games of proof or assurance DA wasnt it and Brady is ready. Now maybe well end up with a 2nd & 4th still not bad for a guy we picked up off a practice squad or waiver wire.

I agree with you, I am not even getting into all the DA...good...bad...Brady...INT/s...bad routes...ect. All thats been WELL documented on other threads. My point is just that these writers sit around and see what happens then one side or the other (and there is always another side to the i told you so game) says "I told you that would happen...those browns are idiots."

Aye... a quality LB would look a helluva lot better here right now than DA, that's for damned sure.

Ok,, you wanna talk stupid,.,,

Think about it,, Quinn threw what, 8 passes in a meaningless game last season and he had a very good game last night.. showed a lot of skill and talent..

And this STUPID reporter thinks that that's all it takes to show he's the one.. As it turns out, I agree that Quinn appears to be the one.. But in Savages shoes,, I don't think I give up a Pro Bowl QB for an Unknown...

Nope,, I have no regrets about keeping DA this year.... I'm not even sure I'd give him up at all at this point. We don't have to..

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Nope,, I have no regrets about keeping DA this year.... I'm not even sure I'd give him up at all at this point. We don't have to..

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I agree, I think it's something we have to sit back and see where were at at the end of the season, where we draft, who might be availible in not only the draft but in FA. I dont have a problem sitting on DA for another year, we know what we have, ya never know what your gonna get in a drafted player...I.E. Craig Powell, Junkins....

All it would take is for Quinn to get hurt and without a good back-up there goes next season, (I.E. See 2008 Dallas Cowboys )

And no dont even say Dorsey can do just as good as DA was doing....we all know Dorsey is here for his brain not his arm.

There were about two dozen people who strongly felt this way, including you me and others.

There are also people on this board that are terribly prone to analysis by paralysis. It doesn't take 26 starts to make a decision. And for some people even that isn't enough.

There's nothing knee jerk or stOOpid about seeing the talent level out there every Sunday last year, the teams that we were playing, then to evaluate the QB play from there.

I'll contend that Savage was SCARED to make the wrong decision. This 3 year deal was not prudent. The first and third picks were great! All it takes is one team. Savage rushed and paid more two hours into midnight because of the threat of Jerry Jones signing a deal then swinging another trade.

I was shacking my head then, I was shaking my head the last 8 months, and now after Brady confirmed what I have seen....just...I don't know how to put it...I feel bad for the Browns organization.

they can still get something for DA. lots of teams are going to be looking to upgrade and if there's still people here who think he should be playing, some of those GM's will believe in him too.

anderson earned the opportunity to make up for his bad game in cincy. he had another very reasonable chance to lead the team into the postseason. it didn't work out. he might very well develop into the guy on another team.

i don't get why people should pile onto RAC and savage over the handling of this. its not knee jerk and too early, and it wasn't bungled or otherwise handled cowardly in the offseason. they did it right and now we are moving on. there are reasons to pick on these two but qb isn't one of them.

Just one LB?
I want 4 ..I'm sick of this same ole crap..none of them are worth starting here in my book..
Oh while Phil is at it..get a impact corner..and since we're there..Sean Jones is getting tired also.

Who brought those LB's,that shouldn't be starting,here?

Are we getting close to the end with Jones? I think one thing this staff does well is not overpay for guys, and the Browns may not want him back at his asking price. But if he stays at a reasonable price, I've got to imagine his starting job would be in jeopardy if we could bring in some competition.

I was never as high on him as some on here were, but he has steadily regressed over the last few years and has been a major disappointment recently even in my eyes.

Close to the line, the kid can get it done, but anything that happens from the linebackers on back is just beyond him.

We should just consider asking him to bulk up and switch to ILB.

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Accuracy on 10-yard throws is something even Dorsey could do.

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Too bad it wasn't something Anderson could do

It's linebackers similar to what some other teams have ... you know, QUALITY.

It all sounds good.....but it is a opinion piece based on half the story.

Grab the few shreds that add up and let them tug at the gut.

The blow up game he mentions wasn't as much of a blow up when you consider 50mph winds and a gameplan that seemed to assume sunny and mild with no wind.

You forget the joker factor of no matter how you add it up, Anderson had a great year by any historical standard.

Then, assume the picks are gone and Anderson has zero trade value at this point.

Do all of that.....yep, you end up with a article like the one above.

Peen.. it is also hindsight but some of us were calling for Quinn to get a few games last year.. yes I understand that we were in it until the final weeks but... since we failed to make the playoffs anyway... imagine if Quinn has posted a few performances late last year, like he did last night... think the outcome would have been different?

And I disagree that Anderson has zero trade value.. there are quite a few teams looking for a quality starter...

I understand people were calling for Quinn last year....but dad-gum-it man...you are a reasonable guy...Anderson had a real good year. People focus on this or that....but you look in the books, he had a damn good year.

That is the joker I talked about.

From day 1 people were assuming Quinn would get in at some point....game 2....no...game 6....no....game 12....no.

Why???....DA was getting it done and we were winning.

Go figure....that screwed up the plans......heck....Savage probably thought DA would screw up and Quinn would get in by game 5.

Quinn is finally here.....I have no problem with that at all.....I always assumed he would get his shot......but Anderson did a darn good job for a kid who was supposed to get cut a year ago and frankly, I find it sickening how a guy like that is so vilified and a guy like Couch was held up on the pulpit for so darn long.


Just a rant my friend....I hope Brady plays here for 15 years and has to get fitted for toe rings.

I am totally confused by the Browns dink and dunk offense with Quinn. If it was Dorsey, I could understand,

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This is where my 1-year tender option would come into play.

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I don't follow all the tricks with the contracts and such.. but didn't DA sign a contract for 3 years and isn't there a bonus due in March... and if that's the case.. if I have that right,, isn't this about the same as a one year tender in that if they chose to trade him they can or if they chose not to pay the bonus then he's free to go..

Isn't that kinda the same thing?

Just a thought on Jones..he maybe playing hurt..I susect s as I heard he had swelling in his knee..but he is often a bit late on his coverage...as he seems to be cemented in run first, pass second..
He has been late in dropping down in his area..the TE's just come straight down and sit in a 15-20 yard seam..

...and if Brady Quinn wasnt as ready in week 1 as he was in week 9, or maybe he gets injured, then the Browns could have Ken Dorsey starting at QB. Even at the time I wouldnt have minded getting a couple picks for DA, but its way too easy after the fact, to say what could have happened. Say the Browns drafted Felix Jones and he gets injured in week 1 for the season, the writer could have wrote how Felix Jones was a bust and Savage was a fool for not going into the season with 2 capable QBs, and the one that went to the Pro Bowl. He then could have wrote that Savage isnt a loyal person to the teams QB/leader that suprised the NFL to go 10-6 and to the Pro Bowl.

That was one of two mistakes I saw from Chud on Thursday.

1. No deep throws off of play action. Those safeties were creeping on first down..Quinn can really sell the play action...BE can go get the long ball....

Gotta call a studder go on play action at least once or twice and we didn't.

2. Not nearly enough sprint outs, bootlegs and other ways to get Quinn on the move. I don't know if people who've only followed Quinn since he got to Cleveland know this but the kids is an elite NFL athlete. He can really move. Not like Steve Young or Michael Vick but the kid can really run. Combine that with his size at 235lbs and the guy is dangerous.

Would have loved a run option sprint out on 3rd or 4th down on that final drive. Quinn...rolling out...can take on a LBer for a yard or two. He's as fast as most NFL LBers and almost the same size.

This is one of the most short sighted articles I have ever had the pleasure of reading. Now as you read my rebuttal keep in mind that I am one of Savages harshest critics.

Before we get into DA and Quinn we need to take a look around the league at where the NFL stands as far as the QB position. Well the state of affairs for the NFL quarterback is horrible. There is a mass shortage of QBs in this league. There isn't enough starting caliber QBs and there are even less decent backups.

As bad as DA has been, he is still better than half the league and most of those ahead of him are players that have one foot in retirement. The fact that we have 2 NFL caliber QBs to choose from is a blessing so few teams will ever have and most would love to have either guy even DA who we have replaced.

Savage made the RIGHT decision to keep DA on virtually every level. First off, is anyone sure anyone would have truly given up a first and third for Derek or was it a GM pimping up the guy he just signed.

Secondly DA has shown enough to have some desperate GM or coach going man with that arm all he needs is a little tweaking. It wont be a first and third but we will get a pick for Derek. I expect a 2nd or 3rd round pick in this years draft which is gonna be similar in quality to the Winslow draft.

Also lets not forget Quinn was able to be groomed the right way. I dont think sitting hurt him at all and helped him in more ways than we will ever know. He was able to work on mechanics, work on command of the offense and grow in the locker as a team leader. Team leader is the key here. He was a leader when he stepped onto the field against the Broncos.

Quinn held the players confidence and also their respect when he was out there. Does that happen if Anderson is dumped? Maybe but maybe not. Lets remember DA took a team that was 31 or 32 in everyone preseason power rating and won 10 games. He was a pro bowl quarterback. He helped put several more Browns in the probowl.

This situation was allowed to play out before everyone's eyes. No one is going damn DA didnt get a chance. A few think he didnt play bad enough to get benched but that is also why someone will call about DA. There is still a great deal of intrigue every time someone throws on that Giants tape.

We got our franchise QB and a great LEADER. We still have some intrigue value in DA during a quarterback shortage not only in the NFL but in the college QB that is coming up.

Savage made the right decision. Right now what would Dallas give up for a talented backup .